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Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 01:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am in the middle of a new PC build and while I wait on parts I decided to run an experiment. I tossed a Crucial M4 into my PS3 slim and I must say the improvement is surprising. Texture pop is gone. Quick select is fluid. Neocom is snappy. And something I didn't expect - stuttering is dramatically decreased. I haven't had enough time for an exhaustive review, but the results so far are more dramatic than anticipated.
It seems DUST is just creaking against the technologically ancient PS3 limitations. Optimization will help, but it makes me wonder how much better it will be when the PS4 eventually lands. Food for thought. |
Buzzwords
Deadly Blue Dots
RISE of LEGION
416
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Posted - 2012.08.27 01:15:00 -
[2] - Quote
this is just a hard drive upgrade right? i've been thinking about getting mine upgraded too since i'm starting to have to delete old stuff to install new stuff... if it's a significant performance benefit that might put me over the top.... |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 01:18:00 -
[3] - Quote
Buzzwords wrote:this is just a hard drive upgrade right? i've been thinking about getting mine upgraded too since i'm starting to have to delete old stuff to install new stuff... if it's a significant performance benefit that might put me over the top....
As long as you know exactly the limitations of what it will improve you won't be disappointed. I consistently get better visuals since the high res textures are always loaded in instantly. I have no lag getting in and out of vehicles and no black on spawn. The gains are going to be incredibly game specific, but it looks like DUST is one of those that benefits by a great deal. |
Saiibot
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
142
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Posted - 2012.08.27 01:19:00 -
[4] - Quote
SSDs work in the ps3? |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 01:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Saiibot wrote:SSDs work in the ps3?
You only get the advantage of the seek times. The read/write speeds are gimped by the archaic SATA 1 protocol. |
Greiskind
Anonymous Killers Mercenary Corporation
28
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Posted - 2012.08.27 01:48:00 -
[6] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:Saiibot wrote:SSDs work in the ps3? You only get the advantage of the seek times. The read/write speeds are gimped by the archaic SATA 1 protocol.
Sure would be nice if we could build our own PS3 with modern bits. (Waiting on parts for a new PC build myself.) I wonder how much trouble I would get in by hacking something like that together? |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 01:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Greiskind wrote:Noc Tempre wrote:Saiibot wrote:SSDs work in the ps3? You only get the advantage of the seek times. The read/write speeds are gimped by the archaic SATA 1 protocol. Sure would be nice if we could build our own PS3 with modern bits. (Waiting on parts for a new PC build myself.) I wonder how much trouble I would get in by hacking something like that together?
I hope you have a masters in EE or comp sci. You would need to modify closed source firmware and introduce faster connections without breaking all the timers and voltages. And after all that SONY would hardware ban you if they found out. |
Icy Tiger
496
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Posted - 2012.08.27 02:39:00 -
[8] - Quote
Is there any improvement with crashes and bugs? If yes, then those can be narrowed down to hard drive issues. |
TiMeSpLiT--TeR
Planetary Response Organisation
Test Friends Please Ignore
326
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Posted - 2012.08.27 02:54:00 -
[9] - Quote
Let us know if you are still having issues like INVALID LOADOUT. I think, that's the main issue right now in DUST. |
Horus Calling
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
31
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Posted - 2012.08.27 03:36:00 -
[10] - Quote
yeah I popped in a seagate hybrid drive. works great. |
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Ayures II
33
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Posted - 2012.08.27 04:03:00 -
[11] - Quote
Horus Calling wrote:yeah I popped in a seagate hybrid drive. works great.
I'd never heard of those before... My wallet does not appreciate this. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 04:27:00 -
[12] - Quote
It doesn't help with the Invalid bugs. Sorry, no dice there. But I experience way less stutter. Apparently most of the "lag" and "ghosting" was somehow related. Can't promise more overall stability since they pushed a recent patch that supposedly fixed that. |
Stile451
Red Star.
76
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Posted - 2012.08.27 05:04:00 -
[13] - Quote
I was contemplating this earlier today - good to know that it works.
The patch seems to have worked as well. |
Talaryes
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
8
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Posted - 2012.08.27 05:05:00 -
[14] - Quote
To the OP: What is your SSD capacity? And besides performance of Dust, did it improve any other aspect of PS3 operations?
Thanks, this is an intriguing idea will definitely want to know more. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 05:14:00 -
[15] - Quote
Talaryes wrote:To the OP: What is your SSD capacity? And besides performance of Dust, did it improve any other aspect of PS3 operations?
Thanks, this is an intriguing idea will definitely want to know more.
It's 64 GB, so enough for a few games. Good for me. Useless for some. The general operation of the system is snappier. Load and boot times are mildly improved. I don't have the ability to make a video, but the general result is snappier transitions. Dust has a crapton of menus and load shifting, so it removes the rim lag. I haven't tried many other games, but if it is disc based I anticipate zero difference. |
Mobius Wyvern
BetaMax.
1216
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Posted - 2012.08.27 05:18:00 -
[16] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:I am in the middle of a new PC build and while I wait on parts I decided to run an experiment. I tossed a Crucial M4 into my PS3 slim and I must say the improvement is surprising. Texture pop is gone. Quick select is fluid. Neocom is snappy. And something I didn't expect - stuttering is dramatically decreased. I haven't had enough time for an exhaustive review, but the results so far are more dramatic than anticipated.
It seems DUST is just creaking against the technologically ancient PS3 limitations. Optimization will help, but it makes me wonder how much better it will be when the PS4 eventually lands. Food for thought.
Huh, I'll have to try this. |
Shiro Mokuzan
220
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Posted - 2012.08.27 08:18:00 -
[17] - Quote
For games that are entirely on the hard drive, like DUST, it probably will help significantly. Normally the Blu-ray drive is the bottleneck in load times. |
Rex Pluto
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2012.08.27 08:39:00 -
[18] - Quote
I got a 512Gb M4 SSD ;-) And i have no problems with DUST 514, most games i can fully install stutters less and loads a bit quicker... |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 09:07:00 -
[19] - Quote
Rex Pluto wrote:I got a 512Gb M4 SSD ;-) And i have no problems with DUST 514, most games i can fully install stutters less and loads a bit quicker...
At least with 60 I don't feel so bad wasting the drive potential. I'm so impressed I might just leave it in an order a different/another one for my PC. Tripling the cost of the PS3 when it is limited to SATA 1 speeds though... where do I get your job and salary?  |
Dewie Cheecham
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
677
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Posted - 2012.08.27 09:11:00 -
[20] - Quote
Saiibot wrote:SSDs work in the ps3?
Any 2.5" HDD/SDD will work, just be mindful of the height. I can't recall the specifics, but of the various standard heights out there, the tallest won't fit. I think it's the 1/6" high ones and taller that you have to avoid.
The OP surprises me though. The PS3 is supposed to be a SATA1 device. That means that even a 7200RPM drive is faster. The only time I think the SSD will win is if the game uses a very large number of very small files. Seek times would be lower. |
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Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 09:18:00 -
[21] - Quote
Dewie Cheecham wrote:Saiibot wrote:SSDs work in the ps3? Any 2.5" HDD/SDD will work, just be mindful of the height. I can't recall the specifics, but of the various standard heights out there, the tallest won't fit. I think it's the 1/6" high ones and taller that you have to avoid. The OP surprises me though. The PS3 is supposed to be a SATA1 device. That means that even a 7200RPM drive is faster. The only time I think the SSD will win is if the game uses a very large number of very small files. Seek times would be lower.
The PS3 is a SATA1 device. The benefit of the SSD over a 7200 drive in this case is 100% the seek time. It can fetch something spaced in another block or sector at the same speed as the next bit (give or take some truly inconsequential times in the nano or smaller range). No spin up time. Granted, the game can be optimized by caching in anticipation, but the limit of the PS3 means it cannot hold the overview and the battlefield in RAM at the same time. There is zero in game transition lag. From opening up orbitals to jumping in a vehicles, it is just smoother. I consider it a vaunted preview of the post-optimization state. |
Wakko03
Better Hide R Die
134
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Posted - 2012.08.27 09:22:00 -
[22] - Quote
yeah, you just got to make sure to research any update to the firmware for the HDD, before you put it in the ps3.
And there was 1 game that gave me grief because of the hybrid I have in my ps3, armored core 5's audio was wonky, the cut-scene background ambient sounds and music would only work upon fresh install of the game data file. When I contacted the game's live tech text chat help they said it was because of my hybrid. |
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
459
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Posted - 2012.08.27 09:25:00 -
[23] - Quote
Digital Foundry made an article about on SSD on PS3.
Read their conclusions since they are to be trusted.
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Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 09:27:00 -
[24] - Quote
Wakko03 wrote:yeah, you just got to make sure to research any update to the firmware for the HDD, before you put it in the ps3.
And there was 1 game that gave me grief because of the hybrid I have in my ps3, armored core 5's audio was wonky, the cut-scene background ambient sounds and music would only work upon fresh install of the game data file. When I contacted the game's live tech text chat help they said it was because of my hybrid.
I'm iffy about hybrids because they have to pick what to cache, essentially extending the ram with algorithms designed for windows loading times on a platform that aggressively optimizes around the limitations of slow disk speeds. At least with SSD there is no middleware to add an extra layer of bugs. OTOH, I have become an SSD evangelist after one night only, but have heard good things about hybrids so I only talk from feelings and not experience on that front.
Templar Two wrote:Digital Foundry made an article about on SSD on PS3.
Read their conclusions since they are to be trusted.
It's basically reiterating the same points. It's incredibly game dependent on performance gain, and I can report that DUST, for me at least, gained a lot. I don't have trouble with the communication and biomass complexes anymore. For the record, this link http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-can-ssd-upgrades-boost-ps3-performance goes into better detail of how in game performance can see a dramatic effect, beyond just load times. I'll definitely update if I run into any bugs, or if I run into a lot less as well. |
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
459
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Posted - 2012.08.27 12:23:00 -
[25] - Quote
^^^
That is exactly the article I was talking about.
The key point in the article is this anyway: Quote: "there may well be some performance improvements, but not enough to justify the expense. Upgrade your laptop with an SSD and that's where you'll really find value" |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
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Posted - 2012.08.27 13:58:00 -
[26] - Quote
Templar Two wrote:^^^ That is exactly the article I was talking about. The key point in the article is this anyway: Quote: "there may well be some performance improvements, but not enough to justify the expense. Upgrade your laptop with an SSD and that's where you'll really find value"
I would say that is the least key line. Look at the facts and judge for your own situation. |
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
459
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Posted - 2012.08.27 14:04:00 -
[27] - Quote
Quote:The PlayStation 3 can't access ultra-fast SSD speeds. The PS3 can't stream data quickly enough by virtue of the fact that data needs to be buffered, and RAM is a finite resource on console. The PS3 obviously doesn't support TRIM either. It's in the 0.1ms access time that the SSD wins out, and that's effectively a standard on all makes. |
Noc Tempre
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1170
|
Posted - 2012.08.27 14:21:00 -
[28] - Quote
Templar Two wrote:Quote:The PlayStation 3 can't access ultra-fast SSD speeds. The PS3 can't stream data quickly enough by virtue of the fact that data needs to be buffered, and RAM is a finite resource on console. The PS3 obviously doesn't support TRIM either. It's in the 0.1ms access time that the SSD wins out, and that's effectively a standard on all makes.
Not sure what the point you are trying to make. There is a big gain in a small number of circumstances. In some games, including DUST, that circumstance is so frequent it could be considered a significant improvement. Especially when you consider the likely hours spent on an MMO. At $1/GB and falling every day, why try and make declarations? For me it could be hours saved a month on top of the more pleasant experience. Is that worth less space and "wasting " the drive potential? I haven't decided yet, but it is certainly not something to be dismissed outright. Case by case YMMV. |
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
459
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Posted - 2012.08.27 14:45:00 -
[29] - Quote
"There is a big gain in a small number of circumstances"
This is exactly why DF says: "it's not enough to justify the expense".
Also why spend $100+ for a free to play FPS like Dust?!
Better save those money for the PS4 than spend them now on the PS3 for just few titles.
SSD (as DF says) "In the here and now, SSDs remain an expensive luxury, but they clearly represent the way forward for console technology - if not now, then definitely for next-gen machines."
Also you are judging the improvements on a partial/incomplete code which means that the results you are getting NOW definitely will not be the same you get in the final game.
Not to mention that Dust 514 qualitative inferior to many FPS on PS3, both in therms of performance & video quality, so a SSD can make it run/look better because there's far less to do than on a title such as Killzone 3. |
Finn Kempers
BetaMax.
222
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Posted - 2012.08.27 14:47:00 -
[30] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:Saiibot wrote:SSDs work in the ps3? You only get the advantage of the seek times. The read/write speeds are gimped by the archaic SATA 1 protocol.
Oh wow SATA 1 is ancient O.O |
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