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Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
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Posted - 2012.08.06 19:19:00 -
[1] - Quote
(After reading through this I have come to the conclusion that Doc, Bonney, Carlos and Proto are likely the 4 worst players in the game and need to put more hours into the beta and go to a target range and practice shooting.)
In a more serious note, I just would like to state that IMO, yes a scout is intended to be faster and sneaky and that speed is his greatest advantage. But like others have said, a scout should not feel confident when going into a gun fight. I have played as a heavy and have had scouts stand and fight me straight up while I am wielding a HMG and they have an AR. Granted I probably suck at aiming, it says a lot about the class of scouts in general when a majority of people playing as a scout are not afraid of anything. I would argue that this lack of fear is not from the scouts great skill but the lack of ability for others to accurately hit them and their shots register damage. |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.06 22:10:00 -
[2] - Quote
Dante Daedrik wrote:Maximus Stryker wrote: But like others have said, a scout should not feel confident when going into a gun fight. I have played as a heavy and have had scouts stand and fight me straight up while I am wielding a HMG and they have an AR. >>Implying I should engage your heavy at Mid-Range rather than Close while maneuvering around you to take advantage of slow turn speed.Edit: I use Boundless Breach SMG, not AR Also, Ambush Scouts need that fearlessness in order to cause chaos/panic/confusion. I've played plenty of matches where I've thrown a grenade into the surrounding area of an objective, run up a hill, and long jumped into the area where I then proceed to run around gaining bearings of where enemies are located and using the environment to flank them or catch the advantage. Without the fearlessness we wouldnt be able to cause that confusion/chaos to take advantage of, especially when engaging multiple targets.
Obviously moving around me at a close distance is your best bet, my implication was that I thought even though this is the best tactic for a scout up close to a heavy, i would have thought it be more of a last resort rather than a full on charge at the heavy... |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.07 15:40:00 -
[3] - Quote
Just so we are clear, am I correct in my assumption that the issue we are discussing is that it appears when a scout suit moves in a specific way ("zig zag" "twitch straffe" ect.) that somehow the game is not registering damage on the scout suit...? We believe this is the case because we can see that our reticle/cross hair is on the player an as we are firing but we can also see the damage displayed not lowering (the bars over the player that display their armor and shield).
Can I further assume that most of us are not complaining that the scout is "too small" or "too fast" ...rather as previously stated, that the game appears to not be registering hits accurately.
Furthermore, a separate concern is, is CCP knowingly and intentionally creating the game with the scout not registering damage in the above mentioned ways because that is their vision for the game. |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.07 16:14:00 -
[4] - Quote
Impressive tables, truly. Can you explain how he is calculating the DPS row? It is the fifth row from the bottom? What does DPS stand for in this table?
Am I doing something wrong for the Ishukone Assault Submachine gun:
Damage 33.6
1052.6 rounds per minute = 17.54333333333333 rounds per second (1052.6/60)
Damage per second by my guess should therefore be 17.543 rounds times 33.6 damage = 589.445 damage per second
However, in the chart, it has the DPS at 392.1
I am confused, and not good at math... |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.07 16:38:00 -
[5] - Quote
STB-stlcarlos989 EV wrote:With Weaponry 5 (15% boost) and SMG Operation 5 (25% SMG boost) and AR Proficiency 5 (15% AR Boost)
DPS: Duvolle AR > Ishukone Assault SMG > Boundless Breach SMG > Creodron Breach AR
Duvolle AR: 36 damage, 750 RPM, 30% damage increase, DPS = 585
Ishukone Assault SMG: 24 damage, 1000 RPM, 40% damage increase, DPS = 560
Boundless Breach SMG: 40.8, 534.8 RPM, 40% damage increase, DPS = 509
Creodron Breach AR: 57.6 damage, 401.1 RPM, 30% damage increase, DPS = 501
Those are the actual DPS with max damage increasing skills and NO damage mods.
Effective range goes as follows
Creodron Breach AR > Duvolle AR > Boundless Breach SMG > Ishukone Assault SMG
Carlos, if the RPM is 1052.6 like it says in the chart, than the Ishukone does about 589 DPS. However, the chart could be wrong and the Ishukone may only fire 1000 RPM in which case you would be correct in that its DPS is 560. |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.07 17:08:00 -
[6] - Quote
lDocHollidayl wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2004nrHxa0&feature=related
Proto scouts currently can dodge this and I am hoping it is not game design. Strafe all you want but you will be hit.
que 31 seconds. LOL Pretty sure Neo himself couldn't dodge that... |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 14:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
I also feel ARs are fine |
Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 18:02:00 -
[8] - Quote
Hobos-N-Guns wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:STB-stlcarlos989 EV wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:-Sigh- Heavies and Machine-guns and now Scouts and their Submachine Guns... Can't you people just accept the fact that there is **** in this game designed to kill you?
They even said at Fanfest that if a Scout suit gets close enough to move around you that you're ****** because you won't be able to turn fast enough - that is what they do. They are there to act as hit-and-run specialists. This "character model isn't big enough" bullshit honestly needs to stop right here and now.
Honestly, you people don't know how to adapt to a battlefield. We're about to enter a new build and you ******* -FINALLY- realized that tanks don't go away unless they're killed - so you all went Anti-Vehicle. Now, whenever you're faced with heavy Anti-vehicle on the opposition, you don't know how to go back to Infantry and bring the fight to them. You just spawn in more vehicles and die a lot saying that the Swarm Launcher/Forge Gun is over-powered.
YOU DIE. LEARN THIS ALREADY. ACCEPT IT. ADAPT AND SURVIVE.
Jesus christ - you know, I don't have any issues with this game. I get killed, I look back and learn what I did wrong and evolve on that. I used to run Scout suits frequently and for the past three weeks I've run Logistics - Scouts don't bother me. I aim, I fire, they die. They get too close, I die. That's the nature of this game. I highly doubt CCP intended for them to be able to DODGE BULLETS. Really? Are you so sure? The Scout suit's base movement speed: 5.6 meters/sec. Sprint Speed: 7.8 meters/sec. Compared to the Assault suit's with 5 meters/sec and 7 meters/sec. This is called Speed Tanking - they fit Kinetic Catalyzers so they can sprint -faster- and invest all of the skill points you would invest in shields/armor skills into their Endurance/Mobility/Vigor. They are doing exactly what they were designed for - you're just dying because you can't grasp that it's not just an HP Bar and point-shoot style gaming. Armor. Shield. Speed. Electronic Warfare. The four main types of combat in Eve Online. If you go Speed, you can control combat range. When you control combat range - no matter how dangerous or powerful the opposition is they are at your mercy. They're powered by servo-motors, their suit is a mechanized war machine that allows them to move faster. This is science fiction - not modern combat. I'll say it again: The reason you are dying is because they invested in a combat style that is meant to counter yours. Find something to counter theirs. If you think Hit Detection is such a ***** than start using a Mass Driver. Best arguments yet!!! In Eve, speed tanking is called a nano ship and it works with the same principle, give up armor for speed. The answer to that problem is varied but the results are the same. Tackler with webs and scram and the other ships blow it up. Or use smart bombs which is a real scary suprise just before your ship blows up with your pod right behind it. And if none of this works and they do increase size of scouts then RankRancid has the solution: All for this as long as when they increase the size, all characters get increases. So increase hit box by 1.5 increase assault and heavy by 1.5. Don't make it easier to hit me without making it easier for me to hit you. That would just be stupid.
We are all on the same page here, right? ...that we are not arguing scouts are too fast/have too much speed/are too small/need to a nerf......rather we are simply pointing out that at certain times, when fighting a scout, our cross hair dot turns red and we appear to be hitting the scout but no damage is registering.
(Not trying to beat a dead horse I swear)
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Maximus Stryker
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
393
|
Posted - 2012.08.08 19:54:00 -
[9] - Quote
Blunt Smkr wrote:This Thread is a joke scouts are fine its hit detection that needs to be fixd. i've been a scout since i got in this beta an i almost regreat it sometimes just cause scouts die so easily its almost sad. An now u guys say nerf them cause u cant hit them when they get close lol. I've gone up against alot of scouts an do notice its really hard to hit them but once u land a few shots there pretty much dead. The only problem i have is the hit detection is just so bad. Try usin a pistol or single shot gun an u really notice the terrible hit detection u have to lead shots so much. There is no wonder why scouts are so hard to hit when they strafe cause u cant aim at were the scout is but were he is going to be an when there moving that fast its really hard. But once hit detection is fixd ur probably not going to need to lead ur shots so much making it easier to hit them cause u dont have to guess as much. So really people need to stop bitching bout scouts an just wait until hit detection is fixd then if there still a problem u can *****
You did read my previous post, correct...?
In case you missed it:
We are all on the same page here, right? ...that we are not arguing scouts are too fast/have too much speed/are too small/need to a nerf......rather we are simply pointing out that at certain times, when fighting a scout, our cross hair dot turns red and we appear to be hitting the scout but no damage is registering.
(Not trying to beat a dead horse I swear) |
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