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Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
   |
Posted - 2012.08.04 21:06:00 -
[1] - Quote
Baal Roo wrote:Well let me try to express the basic premise behind "slow movement = tactical".
If I'm trying to communicate with my team, the moment speed needs to be slow enough that the information given will correlate with the actual in-game situation long enough to be relevant to the people communicating. If movement speeds get too fast, you end up in a situation where by the time the information gets communicated, it's already wrong. If the enemy can run from A to B faster than a person can say "they are headed from A to B" then the game becomes a Halo style arena shooter. If I can't say "there's a tank headed out of their back spawn location on it's way to C" before a tank can make that trek, then what's the point in relating the info in the first place?
The people, such as myself, who WANT a slower pace are hoping for a series of set pieces where there is enough time to report positions and react to them in unison, rather than a game where DOING is quicker than SAYING. We want a pace where moving from position to position has consequence in terms of committed resources. As it stands currently, if the enemy team hacks all three consoles at once, I can already run from A, to B, to C and stop ALL THREE virus uploads before they finish. There's no tactical element there because the speed of movement vs. The size of the engagement area are mismatched for tactical play.
I would suggest you wait until the maps are five square kilometers. If I estimates are right the plateau map is a little more than 1500 meters maybe at most I would say 2000 meters. I personally think speed is okay but it could get a bit faster and be better. In the end this game will be what CCP wants it to be, I think they may have slowed down the movement in order to.try to nail down the hit detection issues but that is just my rather uneducated guess. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.04 22:06:00 -
[2] - Quote
Regis Mark V wrote:Bones1182 wrote:Baal Roo wrote:Well let me try to express the basic premise behind "slow movement = tactical".
If I'm trying to communicate with my team, the moment speed needs to be slow enough that the information given will correlate with the actual in-game situation long enough to be relevant to the people communicating. If movement speeds get too fast, you end up in a situation where by the time the information gets communicated, it's already wrong. If the enemy can run from A to B faster than a person can say "they are headed from A to B" then the game becomes a Halo style arena shooter. If I can't say "there's a tank headed out of their back spawn location on it's way to C" before a tank can make that trek, then what's the point in relating the info in the first place?
The people, such as myself, who WANT a slower pace are hoping for a series of set pieces where there is enough time to report positions and react to them in unison, rather than a game where DOING is quicker than SAYING. We want a pace where moving from position to position has consequence in terms of committed resources. As it stands currently, if the enemy team hacks all three consoles at once, I can already run from A, to B, to C and stop ALL THREE virus uploads before they finish. There's no tactical element there because the speed of movement vs. The size of the engagement area are mismatched for tactical play. I would suggest you wait until the maps are five square kilometers. If I estimates are right the plateau map is a little more than 1500 meters maybe at most I would say 2000 meters. I personally think speed is okay but it could get a bit faster and be better. In the end this game will be what CCP wants it to be, I think they may have slowed down the movement in order to.try to nail down the hit detection issues but that is just my rather uneducated guess. Wanting to slow the movement speed down so that you can communicate better is a joke IMO. If you're on defense the map already does half the work for you because you already know where the enemy is coming from. Once you take the objectives on offense you are now playing defense because you don't want the enemy to take back the objectives like I said you shouldn't need a full paragraph to say the enemy is head to B from north, south, east, or west!
My point was actually directed at baal roo. Your response doesn't address anything I said.
I am not for or against an increase in speed. Yes I know that is not really the purpose of this thread.
Tactics can and should be executed at any speed.
BTW tactical communications should take no longer than 3-5 seconds per burst of info.
As a veteran of the U.S. Army and two tours in Iraq I am very well aware of proper combat coms.
Larger maps which is confirmed(sorry my phone doesn't like to post links) will allow for more time to spot, report and engage the enemies regardless of movement speed.
As I said it wouldn't bother me in the least if they increased the speed a little bit I just don't think it should be some huge increase. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.05 00:00:00 -
[3] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I recently got voice. Some commands I share with my two gunners.
Gunners, Foot mobiles
Gunners, Dropship
Gunners, Forge Gun
Get em.
Missile Launch!
Gunners, Tank
Gunners, LAV
Gunners, Obective (A, B, C)
Gunners, Sniper
Gunners, Drop Link
Gunners, Nanohive
Good Kill
Good Effect
Bail Bail Bail
Evading
Cover Fire
Open Up, Let them have it.
Capture (A,B,C,Structure)
Hostile(s) Location / Number / Type
Gunners, Eyes up
Drop off
Pickup?
Those are pretty good just remember when calling out targets using clock direction and a rough estimate on distance can be extremely helpful.
Of course right now that probably won't help too much right given that random likely wont know or care about clock directions if they even have coms. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.05 00:29:00 -
[4] - Quote
@Regis
I thought you might be but your response just kinda threw me off a bit. I just realised that it have to do with your use of !. It can change the tone when reading.
To others while I too feel that circle strafing looks silly and makes you an easy target for a tank or other splash damage weapons, I believe the devs have stated in an interview somewhere ( my phone sucks at posting links) that a scout suit is supposed to run circles around a heavy in order to kill him. Two assaults spinning around in the open probably shouldn't happen quite so often.
I will reiterate for others the slow down in movement speeds may have been for them to isolate and fix hit detection issues and therefore only temporary, so don't get used to it. Of course I could completely off base as I have not heard or seen anything from.the devs on this. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.05 11:32:00 -
[5] - Quote
Gameplay>Realism that being said something do need to feel real or at least believable. So simply running in circles in the middle of open ground, at least when there is a tank on the field, should be considered at the least a risky decision.
Realism up to a certain point is necessary or we might as go play the original Doom where don't even really have to aim.
Things like a weapons effective range and kick need to feel somewhat believable not entirely real because mostly these guns shoot hot plasma or other things that we don't have today. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.05 11:55:00 -
[6] - Quote
Regis Mark V wrote:Bones1182 wrote:Gameplay>Realism that being said something do need to feel real or at least believable. So simply running in circles in the middle of open ground, at least when there is a tank on the field, should be considered at the least a risky decision.
Realism up to a certain point is necessary or we might as go play the original Doom where don't even really have to aim.
Things like a weapons effective range and kick need to feel somewhat believable not entirely real because mostly these guns shoot hot plasma or other things that we don't have today. ^This I don't get who would think stagnant hold the line battles would be fun but circle strafing will make the gameplay a little to arcade like. Not asking for that at all but I don't want the latter either. Also if you go by the dev blogs they want us to be circle strafing killing machines. Remember the video welcome to New Eden part 2... They said we are reckless and we don't care if that's the mentality they want us clone soldiers to have then maybe we do need strafing to an extent. You can't be very reckless moving like a snail... But then again moving that slow in the open is kind of reckless in its own right.
Very true.
This game is supposed to be about risk vs. reward. If you want to take the risk and have two assaults suits doing a waltz out in open ground you better hope there isn't any tanks or dropships nearby. It's pretty easy to kill somone with splash damage when they are running in circles. I f you don't care or are just running a cheap fit then it still works for you.
The devs have stated that a scout should be able circle strafe around a heavy in order to kill him, regardless of overall movement spped the difference between those two should allow a scout to run around a heavy fast enough to not die at least most of the time. If not everyone would just wear heavy suits and that would be even more boring. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.05 12:44:00 -
[7] - Quote
I would say that I would be fine in either case but this isn't my thread.
I think that a little bit more speed wouldn't hurt but I am fine with it at this time.
I still think that the current speed may have something to do with the devs trying to fix hit detection. Perhaps the slowed everything down to make it easier to hit so that they could get the numbers they need to get it right but I don't really know. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.08.05 12:47:00 -
[8] - Quote
More options are always a good thing. |
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