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Logic for the SP nonwipe/reset

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lDocHollidayl Imperfects Negative-Feedback 171	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:03:00 - [1] - Quote Forgive the wall. I think it is necessary. I am thinking the lower level players here do not quite understand the game. I mean no insult. I am trying to understand why anyone would want a wipe? After they really understand the game it makes little sense. -Facts... with every build player count is less. despite the fact the pool of players is larger. They just choose not to play. I am not blaming this on wiping but you must admit after putting in 30-40 hours of leveling up just to have it wiped sucks. Many will play and say, "that was nice,now back to ___________". -Resets do not make things even like you think. (only for the first day or so) I have 50 hours available to me to play a week. You do not. I will have a higher level for the same reason as I currently do now. Not because I am better, only because I play more. #1. If I have 20 million points and you have 5 million what is the real difference? The main difference is all my passive skills are full. I will also have multiple weapon categories full. I may have AR full, SMG full, and swarm launchers full. I may also have vehicles with bells and whistles. In a game when I vs. you I can only use one at a time...there is no gap the many player think exists. #2. Once one has their proto desired suit and weapon choice at proto you are fairly equal. My level in vehicles do not save me when I fight you one on one. My proto type swarms and proto forge also do not because we are fighting with our AR's. In a sense we are equal. One on one I may win because I carry 25% (passive) more shields. But if you get the drop on me you'll win, if you came with a friend you'll win. #3. Once one has the "kit" they like they play with it and earn points to put elsewhere. These elsewhere points is where they experiment and enjoy different aspects. They always have and will use thier "kit" when really playing and trying to kill players. No one takes their tier 1 sniper and says, "forget the proto assault suit and assault rifles I want to snipe now". They play their proto and when they have earned the proto snipe...then they use the proto snipe. #4. In straight truth letting everyone have everything is the level playing field. Everyone starts with 100 million SP. Now that is even. All logic gets tossed out the window if the game mechanics require a wipe for function. But there is no excuse not to give the players their SP back...kinda like MAG' respec system.
lDocHollidayl Imperfects Negative-Feedback 171	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:07:00 - [2] - Quote Short version. Do not force me to go to community college and take all BS and filler classes every time the game is improved. I earned my degree. If I need to change majors I can...but that does not mean go back to community college...my credits are still good should be able to change majors painlessly.
Laurent Cazaderon Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 1155	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:08:00 - [3] - Quote You're forgetting one major point. It's a beta..... And sometimes they don't have a choice. Also, when changing stats on standard weapons and equipment , you need to have those tested. If people keep their SP\ISk why would they ? Wipes have a good reason to happen. And it's fine. And so you're prepared. this one wont be the last.
V Shadow DUST University Ivy League 34	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:10:00 - [4] - Quote in before "beta" edit too late
VigSniper101 204	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:13:00 - [5] - Quote lDocHollidayl wrote: Short version. Do not force me to go to community college and take all BS and filler classes every time the game is improved. I earned my degree. If I need to change majors I can...but that does not mean go back to community college...my credits are still good should be able to change majors painlessly. Your not being forced...you choose to Beta test. And thats what were doing...were not leveling, were not making characters...were testing. All Betas have wipes, why would this be different? I look at wipes usually due to a major update, which can require different testing of skills, items, etc for that build....at various levels. One slight change to a build can have many unknown problems....if we just continue on at the level we at, we'd have little idea if it had broken those lower level skills and items. I do like the idea of a Respec system, but only in the full game, for a LOT of ISK.
theschizogenious KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 167	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:31:00 - [6] - Quote why would you respec for isk? your not selling your items your dropping the skills with wich to use them.
VigSniper101 204	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:37:00 - [7] - Quote theschizogenious wrote: why would you respec for isk? your not selling your items your dropping the skills with wich to use them. Any game lve played that had a Respec system, had some sought of cost with it to stop it being abused. Considering you'd be basically rewriting your DNA/Memories, l'd assume that's quite a medical operation to be performed. So unless we have Medical Insurance, ld say we would have to pay.
lDocHollidayl Imperfects Negative-Feedback 171	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:45:00 - [8] - Quote Beta away totally understand...but can I get some SP? No one is testing the low level stuff because they skill past it. (for the most part) The lack of SP just creates the grinding game imo.
PEEEEEEETREEEEEEEEEEEEEE Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 781	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:49:00 - [9] - Quote V Shadow wrote: in before "beta" edit too late YOU FAIL!!
TEBOW BAGGINS FIREFLY ATLANTIS ENTERPRISES UNLIMITED TACNET 549	Posted - 2012.08.03 13:59:00 - [10] - Quote Especially sux getting wiped and forced to play with... more randoms.

KingBlade82 Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 56	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:00:00 - [11] - Quote VigSniper101 wrote: theschizogenious wrote: why would you respec for isk? your not selling your items your dropping the skills with wich to use them. Any game lve played that had a Respec system, had some sought of cost with it to stop it being abused. Considering you'd be basically rewriting your DNA/Memories, l'd assume that's quite a medical operation to be performed. So unless we have Medical Insurance, ld say we would have to pay. It would be an elective sergery so ud have to pay out of ur own pocket (assuming eve has this if they dont we wont) :P but i understand what u mean OP but u really have to understand that we r testing not playing i spend a few hours each week to check weapons,explore map,use the different classes and i leave and dont come back until next weekend i report my findings on the game and post in others topics if it is being discussed dont stay attached to it because this isnt the full game when the game comes out in 2012 sometime u can spend all the hours u want and not wrry but just accept this as a test
Chihiro Itto 66	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:06:00 - [12] - Quote If we're earning SP/ISK at four times the normal rate as is rumoured it can't make any sense - from a testing point of view, which is where we are - to have people continuing to get insanely large amounts of SP. All you would be testing then is how the game plays after 6-12 months or later. Plus of course it means new players are going to be butchered even worse than usual with all the protos running around. If a point wipe does happen within the beta it might be the perfect time for PS Plus subscribers to join in on a new build (and perhaps not be gacked eight ways from sunday when they do). That should help with player numbers. Your 4th point doesn't make any sense - the game can and will never be a level playing field, but at least if everyone gets wiped you can see how the game will develop from the start. Overall I understand some of your points, but your argument seems to boil down to you aren't happy about potentially losing your SP/ISK. I sympathise, I'm not crazy about it either, but it's going to be lost anyway at some point so why get attached to it?
Pavel Monfreid 29	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:08:00 - [13] - Quote I'm guessing that not only are they testing weapon dynamics they are testing character progression as well. It makes sense to me when we are gaining 4x SP every fight. I've been using the extra character slots to start characters to help me effeciently get to where I want to be quicker. In the last month the devs should have been able to see how fresh players can compete with a 4-6 month old character, and it should allow them to tweak the SP gains accordingly.
Mr Funless Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 191	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:15:00 - [14] - Quote I'm sad to say this is a valid topic to use the "it's a beta" phrase. Your precious SP will be wiped when the game is released anyway.
Mr TamiyaCowboy Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 121	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:21:00 - [15] - Quote All up for a SP / ISK / ITEMS reset about time we had a true fair playing field the winners here will be us eve players, we already have our skill set plans inplace those that camped for SP will now need to find a new way. those struggling, get an even keel. those running around in proto suits , HAHAHA !!!! your suits belong to us. the reason : CCP is going to what has been whispered around, connect DUST 514 to SISI ( an eve online test server, a living breathing beast) hence for ccp to do this a total reset is required, the clean code injected to sisi and the nodes/network switches engaged. if they DO NOT wipe/reset, there could be clashes with the dust code (E3), this inturn would hit SISI, eve players would riot. ccp would have to reboot sisi and run crash logs. the reset is required man up and accept this is CCP's way of doing things right with minimal fuss
vermacht Doe 93	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:25:00 - [16] - Quote Mr TamiyaCowboy wrote: All up for a SP / ISK / ITEMS reset about time we had a true fair playing field the winners here will be us eve players, we already have our skill set plans inplace those that camped for SP will now need to find a new way. those struggling, get an even keel. those running around in proto suits , HAHAHA !!!! your suits belong to us (Someone needs to go back to eve^) if you came to the beta late to bad.
Kaeralli Sturmovos KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 117	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:28:00 - [17] - Quote short response: if you were in last build nobody had problems with the skills for the most part. the second we got enough SP to upgrade certain skills this build we had bugs, this is why the new code and visuals will cause other unforseen problems within the build, the previous build bugs seem to have carried over, but there were some interesting new ones. changes in the game WILL bring new problems, hence a wipe. my only grudge is that ALL THE MAPS NEED TO BE OPENED that we have previously played on to really test for bugs nobody has tested how current build handles biomass/comms in skirmish.
Mr TamiyaCowboy Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 121	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:31:00 - [18] - Quote vermacht Doe wrote: Mr TamiyaCowboy wrote: All up for a SP / ISK / ITEMS reset about time we had a true fair playing field the winners here will be us eve players, we already have our skill set plans inplace those that camped for SP will now need to find a new way. those struggling, get an even keel. those running around in proto suits , HAHAHA !!!! your suits belong to us (Someone needs to go back to eve^) if you came to the beta late to bad. been here seven years and counting lol, and i am in eve. i was not late i was laying in hospital having a heart attack and then a heart op, so i did not have a chance to partake early thanks. -EVE- DUST 514 says on the tin
vermacht Doe 93	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:34:00 - [19] - Quote Mr TamiyaCowboy wrote: vermacht Doe wrote: Mr TamiyaCowboy wrote: All up for a SP / ISK / ITEMS reset about time we had a true fair playing field the winners here will be us eve players, we already have our skill set plans inplace those that camped for SP will now need to find a new way. those struggling, get an even keel. those running around in proto suits , HAHAHA !!!! your suits belong to us (Someone needs to go back to eve^) if you came to the beta late to bad. been here seven years and counting lol, and i am in eve. i was not late i was laying in hospital having a heart attack and then a heart op, so i did not have a chance to partake early thanks. -EVE- DUST 514 says on the tin Eve as in the name of the game not the new eden universe
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2283	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:42:00 - [20] - Quote Laurent Cazaderon wrote: You're forgetting one major point. It's a beta..... And sometimes they don't have a choice. Also, when changing stats on standard weapons and equipment , you need to have those tested. If people keep their SP\ISk why would they ? Wipes have a good reason to happen. And it's fine. And so you're prepared. this one wont be the last. TBQH to put it bluntly..........the beta is boring. #1 reason the player counts keep gettin lower and lower u improve like 2 things and like 5 new exploits show up and u wipe stuff for that? seems like not alot of proper planning went into place when doin this beta or u would think they would of known they would be "forced" to wipe stuff with each build and looked for a way to avoid that, or why not just give ppl back the points they had when u wipe? with the rewards we been gettin for these events ppl cannot tell me its not possible to give peeps back their points My playtime from last build to this one has dropped like about 50% i was soo happy when i 1st got in, game seemed fun and had alot of potential........ppl QQ'd.......new build drops.......game gets more casual/noob friendly just like EVERY other game + 1 map + no party system = why bother with the stress to RE-GRIND all that over when u were already grinding for a specific item/suit etc to test this the 2nd build ive been grinding for the logistics suit and apparently prob wont get it again to test because of another wipe and tbh the only good logi suit is the Proto one, the standard and advanced are jokes imho, too slow (still shouldnt be as fast or faster than assaults but a speed boost is welcomed) and still squishy and again no party system so no point tryin to revive ppl when they bleed out and no point tryin to rep ppl when they not insync with u PS: if im playin lolbf3 on ps3 more than YOUR game then u know YOUR game is bad or something very wrong with it cuz i hate lolBF3

vermacht Doe 93	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:47:00 - [21] - Quote Mavado V Noriega wrote: Laurent Cazaderon wrote: You're forgetting one major point. It's a beta..... And sometimes they don't have a choice. Also, when changing stats on standard weapons and equipment , you need to have those tested. If people keep their SP\ISk why would they ? Wipes have a good reason to happen. And it's fine. And so you're prepared. this one wont be the last. TBQH to put it bluntly..........the beta is boring. #1 reason the player counts keep gettin lower and lower u improve like 2 things and like 5 new exploits show up and u wipe stuff for that? seems like not alot of proper planning went into place when doin this beta or u would think they would of known they would be "forced" to wipe stuff with each build and looked for a way to avoid that, or why not just give ppl back the points they had when u wipe? with the rewards we been gettin for these events ppl cannot tell me its not possible to give peeps back their points My playtime from last build to this one has dropped like about 50% i was soo happy when i 1st got in, game seemed fun and had alot of potential........ppl QQ'd.......new build drops.......game gets more casual/noob friendly just like EVERY other game + 1 map + no party system = why bother with the stress to RE-GRIND all that over when u were already grinding for a specific item/suit etc to test this the 2nd build ive been grinding for the logistics suit and apparently prob wont get it again to test because of another wipe and tbh the only good logi suit is the Proto one, the standard and advanced are jokes imho, too slow (still shouldnt be as fast or faster than assaults but a speed boost is welcomed) and still squishy and again no party system so no point tryin to revive ppl when they bleed out and no point tryin to rep ppl when they not insync with u PS: if im playin lolbf3 on ps3 more than YOUR game then u know YOUR game is bad or something very wrong with it cuz i hate lolBF3 If you hate bf3 why do you have it and why is it your go to game when you get tired of another
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2283	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:47:00 - [22] - Quote Chihiro Itto wrote: If we're earning SP/ISK at four times the normal rate as is rumoured it can't make any sense - from a testing point of view, which is where we are - to have people continuing to get insanely large amounts of SP. All you would be testing then is how the game plays after 6-12 months or later. Plus of course it means new players are going to be butchered even worse than usual with all the protos running around. If a point wipe does happen within the beta it might be the perfect time for PS Plus subscribers to join in on a new build (and perhaps not be gacked eight ways from sunday when they do). That should help with player numbers. Your 4th point doesn't make any sense - the game can and will never be a level playing field, but at least if everyone gets wiped you can see how the game will develop from the start. Overall I understand some of your points, but your argument seems to boil down to you aren't happy about potentially losing your SP/ISK. I sympathise, I'm not crazy about it either, but it's going to be lost anyway at some point so why get attached to it? NO NO NO worst thing CCP is doing right now is letting a bunch of randoms in to "test" with these weekend passes ppl judge the game based on what they see , console peeps dont know the full extent of a closed beta or acknowledge the "work in progress" we are accustomed to open betas basically demos being passed off as betas showing a pretty much retail version of the game and when u have ppl with that mindset coming into this stage its BAD , word of mouth does alot of damage i have stopped giving ppl weekend passes because they tell me "the game is crap, this game sucks, has potential but no party system and too boring" these are turn offs CCP should stop inviting all these randoms till they have something GOOD and POLISHED to show off
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2283	Posted - 2012.08.03 14:51:00 - [23] - Quote vermacht Doe wrote: Mavado V Noriega wrote: Laurent Cazaderon wrote: You're forgetting one major point. It's a beta..... And sometimes they don't have a choice. Also, when changing stats on standard weapons and equipment , you need to have those tested. If people keep their SP\ISk why would they ? Wipes have a good reason to happen. And it's fine. And so you're prepared. this one wont be the last. TBQH to put it bluntly..........the beta is boring. #1 reason the player counts keep gettin lower and lower u improve like 2 things and like 5 new exploits show up and u wipe stuff for that? seems like not alot of proper planning went into place when doin this beta or u would think they would of known they would be "forced" to wipe stuff with each build and looked for a way to avoid that, or why not just give ppl back the points they had when u wipe? with the rewards we been gettin for these events ppl cannot tell me its not possible to give peeps back their points My playtime from last build to this one has dropped like about 50% i was soo happy when i 1st got in, game seemed fun and had alot of potential........ppl QQ'd.......new build drops.......game gets more casual/noob friendly just like EVERY other game + 1 map + no party system = why bother with the stress to RE-GRIND all that over when u were already grinding for a specific item/suit etc to test this the 2nd build ive been grinding for the logistics suit and apparently prob wont get it again to test because of another wipe and tbh the only good logi suit is the Proto one, the standard and advanced are jokes imho, too slow (still shouldnt be as fast or faster than assaults but a speed boost is welcomed) and still squishy and again no party system so no point tryin to revive ppl when they bleed out and no point tryin to rep ppl when they not insync with u PS: if im playin lolbf3 on ps3 more than YOUR game then u know YOUR game is bad or something very wrong with it cuz i hate lolBF3 If you hate bf3 why do you have it and why is it your go to game when you get tired of another bf3 is our official clan game, as clan leader i play it whether i like it or not, i mainly still play it for clan matches im not tired of DUST, DUST is just boring and catering to casuals in this build strafe speed was one of the best things last build, nerfed cuz ppl QQ'd and couldnt hit ** (ppl still complaining they cant hit ** with the nonexistant strafe now ) CS:GO will be our next game as a filler for dust but prob might end up being our main along with other clans as well if DUST fails and with the wrong steps CCP taking its heading down the failboat route atm
Kaeralli Sturmovos KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 117	Posted - 2012.08.03 15:07:00 - [24] - Quote Mavado V Noriega wrote: vermacht Doe wrote: Mavado V Noriega wrote: Laurent Cazaderon wrote: You're forgetting one major point. It's a beta..... And sometimes they don't have a choice. Also, when changing stats on standard weapons and equipment , you need to have those tested. If people keep their SP\ISk why would they ? Wipes have a good reason to happen. And it's fine. And so you're prepared. this one wont be the last. TBQH to put it bluntly..........the beta is boring. #1 reason the player counts keep gettin lower and lower u improve like 2 things and like 5 new exploits show up and u wipe stuff for that? seems like not alot of proper planning went into place when doin this beta or u would think they would of known they would be "forced" to wipe stuff with each build and looked for a way to avoid that, or why not just give ppl back the points they had when u wipe? with the rewards we been gettin for these events ppl cannot tell me its not possible to give peeps back their points My playtime from last build to this one has dropped like about 50% i was soo happy when i 1st got in, game seemed fun and had alot of potential........ppl QQ'd.......new build drops.......game gets more casual/noob friendly just like EVERY other game + 1 map + no party system = why bother with the stress to RE-GRIND all that over when u were already grinding for a specific item/suit etc to test this the 2nd build ive been grinding for the logistics suit and apparently prob wont get it again to test because of another wipe and tbh the only good logi suit is the Proto one, the standard and advanced are jokes imho, too slow (still shouldnt be as fast or faster than assaults but a speed boost is welcomed) and still squishy and again no party system so no point tryin to revive ppl when they bleed out and no point tryin to rep ppl when they not insync with u PS: if im playin lolbf3 on ps3 more than YOUR game then u know YOUR game is bad or something very wrong with it cuz i hate lolBF3 If you hate bf3 why do you have it and why is it your go to game when you get tired of another bf3 is our official clan game, as clan leader i play it whether i like it or not, i mainly still play it for clan matches im not tired of DUST, DUST is just boring and catering to casuals in this build strafe speed was one of the best things last build, nerfed cuz ppl QQ'd and couldnt hit ** (ppl still complaining they cant hit with the nonexistant strafe now ) CS:GO will be our next game as a filler for dust but prob might end up being our main along with other clans as well if DUST fails and with the wrong steps CCP taking its heading down the failboat route atm for all the things ive read about you numbs and the ** i hear from my crew you really DO say alot of BS, especially when ppl brag that your more an "intelectual" then an e-peen stroking try hard but it more looks like the opposite... this disapoints me.
lDocHollidayl Imperfects Negative-Feedback 171	Posted - 2012.08.03 15:39:00 - [25] - Quote Point 4 was for the many that thought wiping is a great way to even playing field..I agree it is not...if you read my post.
Kaeralli Sturmovos KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 117	Posted - 2012.08.03 15:53:00 - [26] - Quote lDocHollidayl wrote: Point 4 was for the many that thought wiping is a great way to even playing field..I agree it is not...if you read my post. it does even the field because those nubs that spent their SP on dumb things now have a free respec button and a chance to better themselves. its just a natural bug removal fine tunes the build they are on that we will see closer to launch
Average Joe81 57	Posted - 2012.08.03 16:32:00 - [27] - Quote i thought they said there wouldn't be any more wipes
MofaceKilla Algintal Core Gallente Federation 138	Posted - 2012.08.03 17:54:00 - [28] - Quote I agree with you Doc but the wipe is not to "level the playing field", as stated in this thread.... https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=29385&find=unread Sorry to not copy the convo to here but my phone won't let me. P.s. we played a few rounds yesterday (Smittyco, Jteezy and I talked to you about Tritan) hope to see you over there if your still interested... Www.tritan-industries.enjin.com
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:22:00 - [29] - Quote Mr TamiyaCowboy wrote: All up for a SP / ISK / ITEMS reset about time we had a true fair playing field the winners here will be us eve players, we already have our skill set plans inplace those that camped for SP will now need to find a new way. those struggling, get an even keel. those running around in proto suits , HAHAHA !!!! your suits belong to us. the reason : CCP is going to what has been whispered around, connect DUST 514 to SISI ( an eve online test server, a living breathing beast) hence for ccp to do this a total reset is required, the clean code injected to sisi and the nodes/network switches engaged. if they DO NOT wipe/reset, there could be clashes with the dust code (E3), this inturn would hit SISI, eve players would riot. ccp would have to reboot sisi and run crash logs. the reset is required man up and accept this is CCP's way of doing things right with minimal fuss As a proto suit operator of now 2 suits. I will have this to say... I honestly kill alot more people in milita gear.
Mr TamiyaCowboy Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 121	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:32:00 - [30] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Mr TamiyaCowboy wrote: All up for a SP / ISK / ITEMS reset about time we had a true fair playing field the winners here will be us eve players, we already have our skill set plans inplace those that camped for SP will now need to find a new way. those struggling, get an even keel. those running around in proto suits , HAHAHA !!!! your suits belong to us. the reason : CCP is going to what has been whispered around, connect DUST 514 to SISI ( an eve online test server, a living breathing beast) hence for ccp to do this a total reset is required, the clean code injected to sisi and the nodes/network switches engaged. if they DO NOT wipe/reset, there could be clashes with the dust code (E3), this inturn would hit SISI, eve players would riot. ccp would have to reboot sisi and run crash logs. the reset is required man up and accept this is CCP's way of doing things right with minimal fuss As a proto suit operator of now 2 suits. I will have this to say... I honestly kill alot more people in milita gear. best suit i found Assault I quick takes some damage ( could do with more slots for tanking) i can say the death counter works well , death works well, shooting blind works as intended, suits am puzzled with i expected each race to have , scout, pilot, heavy,command etc etc. not this nasty mix and match. i wanted armor tanking gallente assault , blasters to, in your face nasty gallente blasters

Chihiro Itto 66	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:32:00 - [31] - Quote Mavado V Noriega wrote: NO NO NO worst thing CCP is doing right now is letting a bunch of randoms in to "test" with these weekend passes ppl judge the game based on what they see , console peeps dont know the full extent of a closed beta or acknowledge the "work in progress" we are accustomed to open betas basically demos being passed off as betas showing a pretty much retail version of the game and when u have ppl with that mindset coming into this stage its BAD , word of mouth does alot of damage i have stopped giving ppl weekend passes because they tell me "the game is crap, this game sucks, has potential but no party system and too boring" these are turn offs CCP should stop inviting all these randoms till they have something GOOD and POLISHED to show off ...which would be at the point of the new build arriving, presumably at the same point as the wipe and server switch happens, making it at least better and more polished when new players arrived. Capisce? You have a point about new players, but the alternative is... what? Would you prefer the beta stays populated by a couple of hundred players a night until launch? I'm not convinced that will represent a proper test of the game, which is the point of a beta, right? None of this relates to your point about SP however, which sounds moot anyway; there may be multiple reasons why a wipe is necessary, most of which we can only speculate on, but ultimately if CCP think it's required then that's what is going to happen. If it makes the game better and more polished in the long run then that's a win.
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:39:00 - [32] - Quote My personal opinion: Starting at 0 is a waste of time. Give us enough SP to get decent skills in one item before we even enter the battlefield. I would personally suggest 2M SP plus any bonus SP accumulated throughout the beta. So most of us should start with 4M unspent SP, if not more. Then we can burn through alts and quickly test a multitude of things. Having to skill one profile up to do everything is incredibly time intensive and not practical for a majority of the testers.
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:40:00 - [33] - Quote I say no wipe we need to simulate the discourse of an aged player base vs newer players
Kira Lannister Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 711	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:42:00 - [34] - Quote Honesty the true skill is how you move your thumbs and fingers! They can never take that away from us!
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:45:00 - [35] - Quote Kira Lannister wrote: Honesty the true skill is how you move your thumbs and fingers! They can never take that away from us! Agreed, but certain playstyles are downright impossible until a certain SP threshold.
Sojuro Ryo Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 189	Posted - 2012.08.03 18:55:00 - [36] - Quote They already stated the reason is because they are moving everything to the Eve Sisi server. For those that do not know, Sisi is Eve's test server.
RolyatDerTeufel D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION 1648	Posted - 2012.08.03 19:02:00 - [37] - Quote Laurent Cazaderon wrote: You're forgetting one major point. It's a beta..... And sometimes they don't have a choice. Also, when changing stats on standard weapons and equipment , you need to have those tested. If people keep their SP\ISk why would they ? Wipes have a good reason to happen. And it's fine. And so you're prepared. this one wont be the last. Right after Caz posted this great point someone had to cry about "beta" Honestly if people choose not to login and play that's on them. After a wipe is perfect time to play. First day of this build, we went from militia gear to seeing proto AR's within first 12 hours of constant play. Are those people here to play or here to test development?
Vane KoS Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 30	Posted - 2012.08.03 19:19:00 - [38] - Quote Laurent Cazaderon wrote: You're forgetting one major point. It's a beta..... And sometimes they don't have a choice. Also, when changing stats on standard weapons and equipment , you need to have those tested. If people keep their SP\ISk why would they ? Wipes have a good reason to happen. And it's fine. And so you're prepared. this one wont be the last. QFT
Tech Ohm Eaven L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 401	Posted - 2012.08.03 22:21:00 - [39] - Quote lDocHollidayl wrote: Beta away totally understand...but can I get some SP? No one is testing the low level stuff because they skill past it. (for the most part) The lack of SP just creates the grinding game imo. Liar. In case I was unclear. Bullshit!! All I do is run around in low level stuff i.e. militia dropsuits/mods militia forge gun/basic forge gun with the only semi good weapon being a SIDEARM. And most of the time if its 1 v 1 I get to kill and sometimes even 1 v2 or 3 and I still get to say nice creodon ar there buddy enjoy the respawn. Yes I do die when someones in full proto or if theres two of them versus me. Crosscoms are fun when I hear someone upset that they lost a protosuit to a guy in militia. Bring on! the resets!!!
Kyy Seiska Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 188	Posted - 2012.08.03 22:34:00 - [40] - Quote I don't any Sp/skill wipe is necessary until the game enters open beta. having to grind back to the top will just hinder the closed beta testing. But when the game actually goes open beta where everyone who wants to play can just download the client and play, then all the SP should be wiped. If not, newbies will form some sort of hate club against beta testers who are constantly blasting their brains to the wall with prototype gear of awesomeness. Vanity items and maybe some other "LOOK AT ME I WAS IN DA BETAH" items are fine as reward, but nothing else isn't really needed.

Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.08.03 22:39:00 - [41] - Quote Well next patch changes some huge things. KBM. Grouping. Orbital strikes (or at least the feasibility due to Sisi). I'm OK with a reset, but I see no point starting at 0 SP. That hinders the testing process by delaying real testing to 10 game hours in.
Sandromin Hes Sand Mercenary Corps Inc. 204	Posted - 2012.08.03 22:54:00 - [42] - Quote every time a new build comes out, they tend to tweak everything from the last build, and introduce it in the new build... they need people to test and retest and test new things and etc etc etc.
lDocHollidayl Imperfects Negative-Feedback 171	Posted - 2012.08.04 01:21:00 - [43] - Quote Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: lDocHollidayl wrote: Beta away totally understand...but can I get some SP? No one is testing the low level stuff because they skill past it. (for the most part) The lack of SP just creates the grinding game imo. Liar. In case I was unclear. Bullshit!! All I do is run around in low level stuff i.e. militia dropsuits/mods militia forge gun/basic forge gun with the only semi good weapon being a SIDEARM. And most of the time if its 1 v 1 I get to kill and sometimes even 1 v2 or 3 and I still get to say nice creodon ar there buddy enjoy the respawn. Yes I do die when someones in full proto or if theres two of them versus me. Crosscoms are fun when I hear someone upset that they lost a protosuit to a guy in militia. Bring on! the resets!!! Can not believe I am responding...lol. I bet you kill tanks too? You do not kill protos with your militia gear. I have never seen you and I could not find on leader boards. But please...go away. The only way you will kill a proto is when they spawn and leave the room to answer the phone. Let the grown ups talk. I know we need updates...just give me some SP back.
MUDMASTEI2 Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 135	Posted - 2012.08.04 01:26:00 - [44] - Quote I told you in your last thread, the game will die because people's first experience will be being smashed by high leveled players.
Tech Ohm Eaven L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 401	Posted - 2012.08.04 06:29:00 - [45] - Quote lDocHollidayl wrote: Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: lDocHollidayl wrote: Beta away totally understand...but can I get some SP? No one is testing the low level stuff because they skill past it. (for the most part) The lack of SP just creates the grinding game imo. Liar. In case I was unclear. Bullshit!! All I do is run around in low level stuff i.e. militia dropsuits/mods militia forge gun/basic forge gun with the only semi good weapon being a SIDEARM. And most of the time if its 1 v 1 I get to kill and sometimes even 1 v2 or 3 and I still get to say nice creodon ar there buddy enjoy the respawn. Yes I do die when someones in full proto or if theres two of them versus me. Crosscoms are fun when I hear someone upset that they lost a protosuit to a guy in militia. Bring on! the resets!!! Can not believe I am responding...lol. I bet you kill tanks too? You do not kill protos with your militia gear. I have never seen you and I could not find on leader boards. But please...go away. The only way you will kill a proto is when they spawn and leave the room to answer the phone. Let the grown ups talk. You sound like the Doc Holliday from PPH in MAG that I killed with a sidearm?? Anywho pick a time and server. aiptekfanboy PSN tag. Update me and two other forge gunners just killed three sagaris tanks in one match. L5 skilled sidearms in a militia suit will kill a proto in CQC. I know we need updates...just give me some SP back.
Tech Ohm Eaven L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 401	Posted - 2012.08.04 06:32:00 - [46] - Quote MUDMASTEI2 wrote: I told you in your last thread, the game will die because people's first experience will be being smashed by high leveled players. Until they learn that some SP into a few skills gets the KDR from .09 to .95 and rising??
MUDMASTEI2 Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 135	Posted - 2012.08.04 06:48:00 - [47] - Quote Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: MUDMASTEI2 wrote: I told you in your last thread, the game will die because people's first experience will be being smashed by high leveled players. Until they learn that some SP into a few skills gets the KDR from .09 to .95 and rising?? No, they will quit immediately.
Crimson MoonV Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 658	Posted - 2012.08.04 07:27:00 - [48] - Quote MUDMASTEI2 wrote: Tech Ohm Eaven wrote: MUDMASTEI2 wrote: I told you in your last thread, the game will die because people's first experience will be being smashed by high leveled players. Until they learn that some SP into a few skills gets the KDR from .09 to .95 and rising?? No, they will quit immediately. Sad but true. I imagine there will be a few smashed controllers once new players start putting an entire clip into a proto heavy, just to get looked at and sneezed on. Release will be an epic lol.


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