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Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
626
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 09:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
So, here I am, just recently fully qualified on everything needed to fit and use a CalAss ck.0, and occasionally using it to just get the feel of it, if you know what I mean.
Finally got the courage to start running it for real, not just when I felt "safe" that the enemy was redlined or otherwise incapacitated. And got one-shot by a shotty scout.
I remember conversations here, and in particular one thread where someone said that if I ran a standard Caldari shield fit I'd be one-shot by shotguns. Well, they're right, of course and I actually pretty much knew that. But it just irks me to use armour. I've got the hang of fitting shield fits that have excellent shield recharge, but of course I couldn't do that if I used armour.
I've been killed by Balac's and Frame's and most of them, if not all, have at least 300HP of armour. Clearly these fits are not using shield regs, and perhaps shield regs are pointless anyway, if you have shields of 600+HP.
So these fits have something approaching 1000HP, 600+ shield and 300+ armour. I've had an attempt to build something like it and managed to get close to 1000HP. If I use reactives, I can get 300+ and some decent repair rate. Ferroscale is even better and doesn't have the speed nerf but also no repair rate increase.
Then there is the issue of damage mods. People have said they use up to four. Presumably, that means they use armour to get a decent tank. I've tried that too, and managed to get about 600HP, half and half shield and armour. I've had people say that armour shouldn't be used on CalAss suits because it weighs them down too much but if they have 1000HP between shield and armour is that really a problem?
I really don't want to use armour on these suits. I find the whole fast recharge shield thing quite elegant. But what am I to do other than dual tank to avoid being one-shot? Or is that even a real problem - perhaps it's normal to get one-shot by a shotty scout occasionally. For me it seems to be getting monotonous. I'd rather find a way to avoid it if I could. |
jade gamester
Vengeance Unbound RUST415
459
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 10:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
Alena Asakura wrote:So, here I am, just recently fully qualified on everything needed to fit and use a CalAss ck.0, and occasionally using it to just get the feel of it, if you know what I mean.
Finally got the courage to start running it for real, not just when I felt "safe" that the enemy was redlined or otherwise incapacitated. And got one-shot by a shotty scout.
I remember conversations here, and in particular one thread where someone said that if I ran a standard Caldari shield fit I'd be one-shot by shotguns. Well, they're right, of course and I actually pretty much knew that. But it just irks me to use armour. I've got the hang of fitting shield fits that have excellent shield recharge, but of course I couldn't do that if I used armour.
I've been killed by Balac's and Frame's and most of them, if not all, have at least 300HP of armour. Clearly these fits are not using shield regs, and perhaps shield regs are pointless anyway, if you have shields of 600+HP.
So these fits have something approaching 1000HP, 600+ shield and 300+ armour. I've had an attempt to build something like it and managed to get close to 1000HP. If I use reactives, I can get 300+ and some decent repair rate. Ferroscale is even better and doesn't have the speed nerf but also no repair rate increase.
Then there is the issue of damage mods. People have said they use up to four. Presumably, that means they use armour to get a decent tank. I've tried that too, and managed to get about 600HP, half and half shield and armour. I've had people say that armour shouldn't be used on CalAss suits because it weighs them down too much but if they have 1000HP between shield and armour is that really a problem?
I really don't want to use armour on these suits. I find the whole fast recharge shield thing quite elegant. But what am I to do other than dual tank to avoid being one-shot? Or is that even a real problem - perhaps it's normal to get one-shot by a shotty scout occasionally. For me it seems to be getting monotonous. I'd rather find a way to avoid it if I could. My ck.o assault fit is:
3x shield extenders 2x rechargers 1x regulator 2x reactives Isukone Arr Breach smg M1 grenade Hives
I have just under 600 shield and just under 400 armour. Perfect range fit but extremely effective against heavies as for scouts... that's impossible to make a fit just against them as most scouts will come from behind anyway. Your best option is to be aware of scouts and if you get shotgunned to either switch the suit or get some scans on the go. That's just how this game goes as you well know i don't have to explain that hahha.
An example here is my recent antics with my python... I'll fly in and instantly 4 av are attacking me, I can't do anything. So then I have to bash out the heavy.
On another note shotguns have a 2 shot glitch. So when it looks like 1 shot but they fire 2. That instant kills my heavies.
The only counter is to find a spot that decreases flanking opportunity or to change your reactives to regulators and use a scanner while hoping the don't use alot of damps. Hope this helps
Will the real vu please stand up o7
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Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
626
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 11:29:00 -
[3] - Quote
jade gamester wrote:Alena Asakura wrote:So, here I am, just recently fully qualified on everything needed to fit and use a CalAss ck.0, and occasionally using it to just get the feel of it, if you know what I mean.
Finally got the courage to start running it for real, not just when I felt "safe" that the enemy was redlined or otherwise incapacitated. And got one-shot by a shotty scout.
I remember conversations here, and in particular one thread where someone said that if I ran a standard Caldari shield fit I'd be one-shot by shotguns. Well, they're right, of course and I actually pretty much knew that. But it just irks me to use armour. I've got the hang of fitting shield fits that have excellent shield recharge, but of course I couldn't do that if I used armour.
I've been killed by Balac's and Frame's and most of them, if not all, have at least 300HP of armour. Clearly these fits are not using shield regs, and perhaps shield regs are pointless anyway, if you have shields of 600+HP.
So these fits have something approaching 1000HP, 600+ shield and 300+ armour. I've had an attempt to build something like it and managed to get close to 1000HP. If I use reactives, I can get 300+ and some decent repair rate. Ferroscale is even better and doesn't have the speed nerf but also no repair rate increase.
Then there is the issue of damage mods. People have said they use up to four. Presumably, that means they use armour to get a decent tank. I've tried that too, and managed to get about 600HP, half and half shield and armour. I've had people say that armour shouldn't be used on CalAss suits because it weighs them down too much but if they have 1000HP between shield and armour is that really a problem?
I really don't want to use armour on these suits. I find the whole fast recharge shield thing quite elegant. But what am I to do other than dual tank to avoid being one-shot? Or is that even a real problem - perhaps it's normal to get one-shot by a shotty scout occasionally. For me it seems to be getting monotonous. I'd rather find a way to avoid it if I could. My ck.o assault fit is: 3x shield extenders 2x rechargers 1x regulator 2x reactives Isukone Arr Breach smg M1 grenade Hives I have just under 600 shield and just under 400 armour. Perfect range fit but extremely effective against heavies as for scouts... that's impossible to make a fit just against them as most scouts will come from behind anyway. Your best option is to be aware of scouts and if you get shotgunned to either switch the suit or get some scans on the go. That's just how this game goes as you well know i don't have to explain that hahha. An example here is my recent antics with my python... I'll fly in and instantly 4 av are attacking me, I can't do anything. So then I have to bash out the heavy. On another note shotguns have a 2 shot glitch. So when it looks like 1 shot but they fire 2. That instant kills my heavies. The only counter is to find a spot that decreases flanking opportunity or to change your reactives to regulators and use a scanner while hoping the don't use alot of damps. Hope this helps Yes, it does help, thanks. It gives me quite a few ideas.
The thing that instantly occurred to me is that you have practically all shield modules in your high slots. I've had people tell me that I should have damage mods, which I figured would decrease TTK, but also decrease TTD. Given my main problem seems to be not having the tank to deal with the unexpected, perhaps having the high slots totally dedicated to shield is the way to go. I know from past experience that I can get around 600 shield, even more if I use four extenders, or three extenders and two rechargers will give me just under 600 (like you) and really fast recharge - I can get recharge to about 120HP/s that way.
The reactives are the way I think I would go. They do have a speed penalty, but they also have a good repair rate increase. I've seen ferroscale recommended for the speed, but without an increase in repair rate, that would just take a few hits into armour and it would be gone.
I have to ask, what's the point of the single regulator? I use three and get my recharge delay near 1s, depleted recharge delay around 0.7s. That's the point of regulators, I would have thought. When you're getting hit in a battle you can't wait for 2-3s for your shields to begin recharging, unless you have good armour, in which case you don't need regulators....
Sort of circular logic there. I would think my best options are to use one less regulator and one more reactive for each damage mod I use instead of an extender. Without damage mods, I would need a good tank, and with them, I would need more armour to compensate.
Caldari shield tanks work really well on ships in space - you can kite well clear of the enemy range, and lob long range missiles at them all day, unless of course, they're a stealth bomber.... In Dust it doesn't work quite like that - shotties can appear at your elbow without warning. Yes, you're right, there's no way to avoid the shotties in the game - I actually have a really good record of hearing them uncloak and their weapons click, and usually have turned to fire at them by the time they're firing at me, but I don't have a good record of taking them out in the backwards running battle that ensues....
Thanks for the tips, I'll see what I can do with them. |
Lightning35 Delta514
Federation Marines 62
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 13:19:00 -
[4] - Quote
What can I say?
Caldari isn't meant for close quarters.
Stick to a rail.
CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company
Gallente Loyalist - Quafe
Gk.0s/Gv.0s - 63m SP
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YUUKI TERUMI
ZEN KILL Society
271
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 13:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Alena Asakura wrote:So, here I am, just recently fully qualified on everything needed to fit and use a CalAss ck.0, and occasionally using it to just get the feel of it, if you know what I mean.
Finally got the courage to start running it for real, not just when I felt "safe" that the enemy was redlined or otherwise incapacitated. And got one-shot by a shotty scout.
I remember conversations here, and in particular one thread where someone said that if I ran a standard Caldari shield fit I'd be one-shot by shotguns. Well, they're right, of course and I actually pretty much knew that. But it just irks me to use armour. I've got the hang of fitting shield fits that have excellent shield recharge, but of course I couldn't do that if I used armour.
I've been killed by Balac's and Frame's and most of them, if not all, have at least 300HP of armour. Clearly these fits are not using shield regs, and perhaps shield regs are pointless anyway, if you have shields of 600+HP.
So these fits have something approaching 1000HP, 600+ shield and 300+ armour. I've had an attempt to build something like it and managed to get close to 1000HP. If I use reactives, I can get 300+ and some decent repair rate. Ferroscale is even better and doesn't have the speed nerf but also no repair rate increase.
Then there is the issue of damage mods. People have said they use up to four. Presumably, that means they use armour to get a decent tank. I've tried that too, and managed to get about 600HP, half and half shield and armour. I've had people say that armour shouldn't be used on CalAss suits because it weighs them down too much but if they have 1000HP between shield and armour is that really a problem?
I really don't want to use armour on these suits. I find the whole fast recharge shield thing quite elegant. But what am I to do other than dual tank to avoid being one-shot? Or is that even a real problem - perhaps it's normal to get one-shot by a shotty scout occasionally. For me it seems to be getting monotonous. I'd rather find a way to avoid it if I could. Caldari medium frame ck.0 ftw: Isukone arr Breach SMG Core nades X3 hive Creodron flux active scanner 2x Complex Shield Extenders Krin's modified dam mod Complex modified dam mod Enhanced armor rep 2x Complex Ferroscale Plates
D3LTA Blitzkrieg II, Zaria, all 0.H, Andrea & Extacy, Vit4l, magic, Danja, breniss, jp guys, A. Rose, Hoopy. Thankyouall
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Radiant Pancake3
Y.A.M.A.H
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 14:25:00 -
[6] - Quote
Alena Asakura wrote:So, here I am, just recently fully qualified on everything needed to fit and use a CalAss ck.0, and occasionally using it to just get the feel of it, if you know what I mean.
Finally got the courage to start running it for real, not just when I felt "safe" that the enemy was redlined or otherwise incapacitated. And got one-shot by a shotty scout.
I remember conversations here, and in particular one thread where someone said that if I ran a standard Caldari shield fit I'd be one-shot by shotguns. Well, they're right, of course and I actually pretty much knew that. But it just irks me to use armour. I've got the hang of fitting shield fits that have excellent shield recharge, but of course I couldn't do that if I used armour.
I've been killed by Balac's and Frame's and most of them, if not all, have at least 300HP of armour. Clearly these fits are not using shield regs, and perhaps shield regs are pointless anyway, if you have shields of 600+HP.
So these fits have something approaching 1000HP, 600+ shield and 300+ armour. I've had an attempt to build something like it and managed to get close to 1000HP. If I use reactives, I can get 300+ and some decent repair rate. Ferroscale is even better and doesn't have the speed nerf but also no repair rate increase.
Then there is the issue of damage mods. People have said they use up to four. Presumably, that means they use armour to get a decent tank. I've tried that too, and managed to get about 600HP, half and half shield and armour. I've had people say that armour shouldn't be used on CalAss suits because it weighs them down too much but if they have 1000HP between shield and armour is that really a problem?
I really don't want to use armour on these suits. I find the whole fast recharge shield thing quite elegant. But what am I to do other than dual tank to avoid being one-shot? Or is that even a real problem - perhaps it's normal to get one-shot by a shotty scout occasionally. For me it seems to be getting monotonous. I'd rather find a way to avoid it if I could.
I can see where you are getting to, but before I respecced out CalAss, I used all shields no armor... I think my fit was All Shield extenders then all regulators... with a Bolt Pistol and an ARR. I survived pretty well in all my encounters. Once I got the hang of surviving with shields (Hit and run and using range to my advanatage) I then would slowly switch them out with maybe 1 or 2 damage mods or maybe put on a kincat or two on... Also, A CalAss with 3 Myos is amazing... especially if you put on a Cardio Reg for more jumps... I think my best with that fit is 25/2?
I have a Fan!
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Radiant Pancake3
Y.A.M.A.H
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 14:27:00 -
[7] - Quote
Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:What can I say?
Caldari isn't meant for close quarters.
Stick to a rail.
A scout sneaking up on you is CQC, but it's also unexpected, and if I know Alena from seeing her on the battlefield she probably wasn't in CQC.
I have a Fan!
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Shamarskii Simon
The Hundred Acre Hood
848
|
Posted - 2016.03.06 18:08:00 -
[8] - Quote
I'll tell you my reasoning for behind my fit---->
I don't mean to sound like a teacher but calAss is not made for CQC... Unless... You built it for CQC
2 types of CQC fits work... High recharge (i call these 'burst n bait' builds) or high sHP builds (3+ extends... )
Personally, when i see armor tanked CalAss, i think it's a build that's trying to get all ranges "okay" and avoid awkward surprises w/ pure eHP. For some, it's their cal Special fit. My ranged fits have 1 reactive or rep by default. 2 regs are a must imho. But if I armor tank... I can stand up to a few but... Over time, I'll fail.
Anyway, I'll get to the point. calAss is not made for CQC... But you can build a BEAST of a CQC calAss... As long as cover is nearby, it'll be super effective. W/ cover nearby, burst builds are king. Get shot, hide. You have exceptional recovery! 100+ sHP/s is a goal.... Especially if my delay is around 1.2 seconds... less than 1 depleted. I rather that over tanked builds because I can bounce between fights w/ ease, rather than have my first one easy, but be weaker the further down the line I go. In the case of the obviously better CQC shotty... I just need you to stop shooting once... Waste time jumping or something.. I could get back 200+ sHP. I don't get that chance w/ hp builds... I won't have the "burst of sHP"
The thing is... My fit has low eHP... Imagine a 450 sHP ck.0 in the open field... Not really a good idea lol.. I better be staying indoors or around a ton of objects.. I gotta sacrifice something no?
So choose... Reach my max HP quicker, but have low eHP; or have high max HP, but recover slowly. I chose high recovery.
My fit:
Ishu ARR Kaal Magsex Whatever grenade.
2 enhanced energizers 1 comp recharger 2 comp extends
3 comp regs
462 sHP (i think, I'm not near mi ps3... And well.. I use my C/1 fit more) @ 130+ sHP/s
194 aHP.
2/3 shot by a shotgun.... But if i can get away for just enough time for recharge, ill be able to take more shots. Bait tank cause low eHP... You think you got me as soon as you come around the corner, but I'll be near max sHP again.
Each build is specific to your cause... TBH, i think you were just caught w/ the wrong fit in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Potential Pilot Proposal? Yes!
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Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
627
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 00:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:What can I say?
Caldari isn't meant for close quarters.
Stick to a rail.
Yep. I know that, and I largely try to stay at range of my targets. The problem I have is with shotty scouts (same as fast frigates in EvE) that get inside my range either unseen or before I can take them out and one-shot me.
There's very little I can do about these other than to try to take them down running backwards - they're always fast than me anyway, running backwards even more so. I can't let them get within shotgun range, which is surprisingly quite decent, or I'm gone.
I've had a lot of success with this tactic, but also some failure - if I don't see them in time, they're within range and take me out with one shot. It's funny though to see some try to hit me from outside their range firing shot after shot at me instead of sprinting to within range, all the while I'm pumping magsec charges into them.
Even funnier is knifers who actually try to knife me from outside even shotgun range.... |
Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
627
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 00:37:00 -
[10] - Quote
YUUKI TERUMI wrote: Caldari medium frame ck.0 ftw: Isukone arr Breach SMG Core nades X3 hive Creodron flux active scanner 2x Complex Shield Extenders Krin's modified dam mod Complex modified dam mod Enhanced armor rep 2x Complex Ferroscale Plates
Hi, YUUKI! I think you killed me the other day... :)
Interesting setup. Most of it seems pretty reasonable. I use the Kaala MAGSEC instead of your Breach SMG. I'm a little surprised by the scanner. On a medium frame that second equipment slot does help I guess.
No recharger so you're stuck with what 40HP/s? I suppose that's enough if you are armour repped.
Something I've wondered about - where do you get the Krin's? I've seen this time and again but I never see it available on the market, or even how to get it through trade.
I don't know how they get into the game in the first place, but I imagine they are salvage from FW or PC? I have a lot of suits and gear salvaged from CFW but I don't trust trade, so I haven't traded it for anything else. CCP's lack of diligence (probably deliberate) in not setting up secure trade in Dust is deplorable.
So I was right about the Ferroscale. They don't weigh you down and since you armour rep them, you have decent regen as well. Nice, thanks for the tips.
Looking forward to letting you kill me again soon. :) |
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
22
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 00:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
Radiant Pancake3 wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:What can I say?
Caldari isn't meant for close quarters.
Stick to a rail.
A scout sneaking up on you is CQC, but it's also unexpected, and if I know Alena from seeing her on the battlefield she probably wasn't in CQC.
I wouldn't say that.
Harpies (Caldari Assault Frigates) in EVE are nasty little ships and if I recall correctly people were using massed Blaster Harpies to do massive DPS at close range.
Waves that dye the land gold.
Blessed breath to nurture life in a land of wheat.
A path the Sef descend drawn in ash.
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Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
627
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 01:10:00 -
[12] - Quote
Radiant Pancake3 wrote:I can see where you are getting to, but before I respecced out CalAss, I used all shields no armor... I think my fit was All Shield extenders then all regulators... with a Bolt Pistol and an ARR. I survived pretty well in all my encounters. Once I got the hang of surviving with shields (Hit and run and using range to my advanatage) I then would slowly switch them out with maybe 1 or 2 damage mods or maybe put on a kincat or two on... Also, A CalAss with 3 Myos is amazing... especially if you put on a Cardio Reg for more jumps... I think my best with that fit is 25/2? Yes, this is exactly what I've wanted to achieve. I come from a Caldari background in EvE and in EvE you NEVER dual tank. If you are shield tanked you need ALL your resources for maintaining that tank so you can't afford to waste any on what will be an inherently inferior armour setup.
In Dust it's not that different. Everything you put into armour, takes away from your shields. And just like in Dust there are people who dual tank their suits, even some who armour tank a Caldari suit. Even that isn't without precedent. There's a rather vicious armour tanked version of the Caldari Scorpion ewar battleship in EvE. So it's done on occasion, but only when it's appropriate and never dual tanked.
So it is, that I see all these armour fitted Caldari suits and wonder what I'm missing. They clearly work or people wouldn't do it. Is this another of CCP's pandering (caving) to the masses and "adjusting" the game to suit? Armour tanking a Caldari ship would never work, but armour tanking a Caldari suit does? Or is this just armour-oriented people using Caldari suits the only way they know how?...
As for your specific fit, yes, I've tried this, but I thought the point of damage mods was to lower TTK, so you aren't in the fight for as long. More shields does however make for a more survivable fight.
People don't seem to like shield regs. I know how they work, similar to damage mods - the first one has the most effect - for me it lowers the shield depleted recharge delay by about a second. The second one only another half second. So by most people's thinking, there's no point in using either more than one damage mod or more than one shield reg. In EvE we have exactly the same thing with damage mods - the first one does the most "damage" so to speak, but fill your low slots (in EvE it's the low slots - go figure) with damage mods, and it all adds up. You can't do that with a shield fit in Dust without compromising shields. Likewise you can't stack shield regs without compromising an armour setup, but the recharge delays if you do are phenomenal. I get mine down to just over a second and under a second for the depleted delay.
Also people tend to think in just size of tank. I'm accustomed to people thinking that upwards of 800-1000HP is a reasonable tank for an Assault. But with shields it's different - the aim with shields is to have a big enough shield to take a single massive hit (shotgun?) and a fast enough recharge to be able to be back in the fight in seconds. So 400-600HP is not unreasonable for shields, as long as there's minimal delay and massive recharge.
I've been in fights where I've been hit hard, ducked behind a corner, and had full shields again in seconds, come out from the corner and because they're still sitting with damaged armour, I can take them out on the second go.
But then I've been one-shot by shotguns which is the whole point of this thread. Shield fits are not huge tanks - they're powerful and they have really good resilience, but they don't have the HP to deal with a shotgun. The only way to deal with a shotgun is to avoid them getting inside their range of you. All my tactics to date have that in mind.
You mentioned your ARR. I usually run with a Kaala RR and Kaala MAGSEC. I don't like the bolt pistol (the Kaala is awesome) because its recharge is really abysmal. When CCP nerfed the ROF they really basicly made it a useless weapon, other than surprise one-shot kills a few feet from the head of a sniper you've found as a scout.
My feeling is that the ARR doesn't have the range, nor the sights for that matter, of the RR, but at closer range is more deadly. Were I to use the Ishukone ARR and the Kaala MAGSEC, I think that might be a lethal combination, certainly better for dealing with shotty scouts that get too close.... I might try that. I'm used to my Gal alt using a GEK AR and MAGSEC for her closer range battles. The ARR isn't too different from the AR other than a bit of kick, and the Ishukone is deadly.
Thanks for restoring my faith in Caldari shields. I'm sure they aren't what they should be in Dust, but the fact you can still run full shield fits is refreshing. |
Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
627
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 01:14:00 -
[13] - Quote
Radiant Pancake3 wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:What can I say?
Caldari isn't meant for close quarters.
Stick to a rail.
A scout sneaking up on you is CQC, but it's also unexpected, and if I know Alena from seeing her on the battlefield she probably wasn't in CQC. Yep! That's right - I tend to find range and stay there. I don't like getting too close to the action because I like to have time to take careful aim. Probably a throwback to my sniper days, but I still think you achieve more through aiming than you do through just firing in people's general directions. :)
That said, I do carry a Kaala MAGSEC for those occasions when I find myself too close to the action. It works rather well, usually. Dancing around a heavy while they try to hit you and taking down their armour with a MAGSEC is scary but fun. :) |
Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
627
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 01:27:00 -
[14] - Quote
Shamarskii Simon wrote:I'll tell you my reasoning for behind my fit---->
I don't mean to sound like a teacher but calAss is not made for CQC... Unless... You built it for CQC
2 types of CQC fits work... High recharge (i call these 'burst n bait' builds) or high sHP builds (3+ extends... )
Personally, when i see armor tanked CalAss, i think it's a build that's trying to get all ranges "okay" and avoid awkward surprises w/ pure eHP. For some, it's their cal Special fit. My ranged fits have 1 reactive or rep by default. 2 regs are a must imho. But if I armor tank... I can stand up to a few but... Over time, I'll fail.
Anyway, I'll get to the point. calAss is not made for CQC... But you can build a BEAST of a CQC calAss... As long as cover is nearby, it'll be super effective. W/ cover nearby, burst builds are king. Get shot, hide. You have exceptional recovery! 100+ sHP/s is a goal.... Especially if my delay is around 1.2 seconds... less than 1 depleted. I rather that over tanked builds because I can bounce between fights w/ ease, rather than have my first one easy, but be weaker the further down the line I go. In the case of the obviously better CQC shotty... I just need you to stop shooting once... Waste time jumping or something.. I could get back 200+ sHP. I don't get that chance w/ hp builds... I won't have the "burst of sHP"
The thing is... My fit has low eHP... Imagine a 450 sHP ck.0 in the open field... Not really a good idea lol.. I better be staying indoors or around a ton of objects.. I gotta sacrifice something no?
So choose... Reach my max HP quicker, but have low eHP; or have high max HP, but recover slowly. I chose high recovery.
My fit:
Ishu ARR Kaal Magsex Whatever grenade.
2 enhanced energizers 1 comp recharger 2 comp extends
3 comp regs
462 sHP (i think, I'm not near mi ps3... And well.. I use my C/1 fit more) @ 130+ sHP/s
194 aHP.
2/3 shot by a shotgun.... But if i can get away for just enough time for recharge, ill be able to take more shots. Bait tank cause low eHP... You think you got me as soon as you come around the corner, but I'll be near max sHP again.
Each build is specific to your cause... TBH, i think you were just caught w/ the wrong fit in the wrong place at the wrong time. Yes, to that last statement. I'd only just respawned and there was a shotty in my face. Nice when I'm trying to get used to a new fit... :)
Your reasoning is extremely close to mine. I also favour smaller tanks but faster recharge. I tend to only fit two complex energisers and that usually gets me close to 100HP/s. I might have to try swapping out one of the extenders for another recharger, but yeah I get your point.
So you also use the ARR/MAGSEC combination. I've used the IshARR/KaalaMAGSEC combo as well as the standard KaalaRR/KaalaMAGSEC. My reasoning with the all Kaala combo was that the RR was for range, the MAGSEC was for closer encounters. But I've found that the MAGSEC isn't quite good enough by itself. When I use the ARR, I can burn the clip and then quick switch to the MAGSEC and finish the job. The RR isn't good enough at closer range for that to work. The ARR is also far better than the RR for hipfiring, which I try to avoid, but is necessary from time to time.
Yes, getting back to your last point I have a habit of getting caught in the wrong place at the wrong time, usually because I've used a droplink someone else placed in a stupid spot, or reds are camping a CRU. Either way, it's not my choice, and I try to avoid those situations. As Radiant has said, I tend not to get into CQC, but I have to try to deal with it if it occurs... |
jordy mack
WarRavens Imperium Eden
1
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 01:28:00 -
[15] - Quote
i have been running a proximity scanner on my cal assault, very helpfull. its surprising how many scouts i catch over 27db. and even if i dont scan them i know when they are around me and i can put my back to the wall.
Less QQ more PewPew
|
Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
627
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 01:31:00 -
[16] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Radiant Pancake3 wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:What can I say?
Caldari isn't meant for close quarters.
Stick to a rail.
A scout sneaking up on you is CQC, but it's also unexpected, and if I know Alena from seeing her on the battlefield she probably wasn't in CQC. I wouldn't say that. Harpies (Caldari Assault Frigates) in EVE are nasty little ships and if I recall correctly people were using massed Blaster Harpies to do massive DPS at close range. Yep! Been there, done that. :)
The thing about fast frigates, is they are powerful, especially Assault Frigates, which is Harpies and Hawks. If they get within range of you, there's not much you can do about it but pray.
Also, if you're being the Harpy - using ARR is better than using RR, for closer range encounters. |
Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
627
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 01:38:00 -
[17] - Quote
jordy mack wrote:i have been running a proximity scanner on my cal assault, very helpfull. its surprising how many scouts i catch over 27db. and even if i dont scan them i know when they are around me and i can put my back to the wall. I have a couple of speed scout fits that come in at 30db, so I know that they must be out there. Caldari scouts only have two low slots so if you're going to speed tank them, you have no ability to profile dampen them. I reserve this for my fastest fits - dual kincats in low. All my other fits are dampened, except for a Hawk fit I have with BPO kincat and BPO cardio. I don't care if I die in that fit - it doesn't cost me anything but a clone. ;) |
Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game Preatoriani
2
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 12:13:00 -
[18] - Quote
This is one of the most effective fits in the game:
Cal Assault 2x enhanced shield energizers 3x complex shield extenders 2x complex shield regulators 1x complex kinetic catalyser Ishikone assault rail rifle TY-5 breach scrambler pistol core locus grenades creodron flux active scanner
It will stuggle against anti shield weapons up close (AR, ScR, SG). It will get two shot by shotguns. Lasers are an issue as well.
The kincat is the key. It allows you to control engagments in your favour. Preferably at range, but the combo of fast regen and speed allows for good hit and run when needed. Switch to the pistol vs shield targets. If you go up against another Cal assault with a rail rifle at close range, your scrambler pistol will annihilate them. As a relatively rare weapon, you don't have to worry much about them doing the same to you.
Vs scouts using shotguns, all the usual ways of combatting them work. Again, the kincat is a massive help to you. Your general mobility makes you a much less likely and more difficult target for scouts. Stay in a group, keep and eye on your flanks, cover your teamates, listen for sounds of scout attacks. If a scout with a shotgun manages to get within good shotgun range, decloaked, without being spotted, yes you will be dead. However, not only should this be rare, but you can rest assured that they will die a lot trying this, even if they succeed, whilst you can repawn and merrilly continue making a significant contribution to your team.
If you expect never to die, you are playing the wrong game. If you find yourself in a battle where you get killed over and over by a shotgun scout, change to something with more speed or more armour and a good short range weapon. Counter play. You will now be more vulnerable to rail rifles.
By the way, the scanner is there to scan the enemy team, not their scouts. Unless you are a Gal logi with a focussed scanner, trying to scan scouts is pointless and unnecessary. |
Lightning35 Delta514
Federation Marines 62
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 12:23:00 -
[19] - Quote
Alena Asakura wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:What can I say?
Caldari isn't meant for close quarters.
Stick to a rail.
Yep. I know that, and I largely try to stay at range of my targets. The problem I have is with shotty scouts (same as fast frigates in EvE) that get inside my range either unseen or before I can take them out and one-shot me. There's very little I can do about these other than to try to take them down running backwards - they're always faster than me anyway, running backwards even more so. I can't let them get within shotgun range, which is surprisingly quite decent, or I'm gone. I've had a lot of success with this tactic, but also some failure - if I don't see them in time, they're within range and take me out with one shot. It's funny though to see some try to hit me from outside their range firing shot after shot at me instead of sprinting to within range, all the while I'm pumping MAGSEC charges into them. Even funnier is knifers who actually try to knife me from outside even shotgun range....
And that exactly is a scouts advantage, stealth and deadly. There isn't much to be done except try to look around more often, and have some scanner logis.
They have to get close to you in the first place so you have a better advantage and chance to kill then should you spot them or pick them up on a scanner.
It's the scouts specific role.
CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company
Gallente Loyalist - Quafe
Gk.0s/Gv.0s - 63m SP
|
Lightning35 Delta514
Federation Marines 62
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 12:43:00 -
[20] - Quote
The best advise would be the following l- -stick to your role and weapon range, rails and snipers, calass -use your suit to its advantages, stack extenders, rechargers, and regulators only -you are better fully specialized Gordon ask than to have a bit of everything -play to your advantage, fight from long range, don't get close, plasma and lasers will melt you -avoid your disadvantages, stay near something be that could help you invade you are challenged to your weaknesses -remember, your enemy also has weaknesses, challenge the to theirs
Example using myself- galass
Advantages- fast, armor tanked, high rep, high damage at cqc Disadvantages- low stamina, weak at long ranges, slow total regen
I usually fight by running to the enemy to get in range, taking as much cover as possible and using my speed to surprise. I try to avoid open areas because they set me up to die.
My weaknesses are your advantages and my strengths are your weakness
No one race is invincible.
CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company
Gallente Loyalist - Quafe
Gk.0s/Gv.0s - 63m SP
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DozersMouse XIII
Fatal Absolution Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
1
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 18:55:00 -
[21] - Quote
Buy balac ck.0 and get the best of both worlds
Mine has 144.14 shield rep per sec with 632 shield
20.25 armor rep with 359 armor
Don't need regulation because it's a balac ck.0
I like running AR/SMG combo so I got a balac gar and Cala Core locus, k2 nano, 100% needle.
Aurum plated booty pistol
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Lightning35 Delta514
Federation Marines 62
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 19:34:00 -
[22] - Quote
DozersMouse XIII wrote:Buy balac ck.0 and get the best of both worlds
Mine has 144.14 shield rep per sec with 632 shield
20.25 armor rep with 359 armor
Don't need regulation because it's a balac ck.0
I like running AR/SMG combo so I got a balac gar and Cala Core locus, k2 nano, 100% needle.
*breach shotty to the head*
I've taken out 700 armor amarr assaults with one allotek breach Shotty. Goodbye balac
CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company
Gallente Loyalist - Quafe
Gk.0s/Gv.0s - 63m SP
|
DozersMouse XIII
Fatal Absolution Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
1
|
Posted - 2016.03.07 19:50:00 -
[23] - Quote
Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:DozersMouse XIII wrote:Buy balac ck.0 and get the best of both worlds
Mine has 144.14 shield rep per sec with 632 shield
20.25 armor rep with 359 armor
Don't need regulation because it's a balac ck.0
I like running AR/SMG combo so I got a balac gar and Cala Core locus, k2 nano, 100% needle. *breach shotty to the head* I've taken out 700 armor amarr assaults with one allotek breach Shotty. Goodbye balac You would have to get close to my head first
Aurum plated booty pistol
|
Lightning35 Delta514
Federation Marines 62
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.08 00:04:00 -
[24] - Quote
DozersMouse XIII wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:DozersMouse XIII wrote:Buy balac ck.0 and get the best of both worlds
Mine has 144.14 shield rep per sec with 632 shield
20.25 armor rep with 359 armor
Don't need regulation because it's a balac ck.0
I like running AR/SMG combo so I got a balac gar and Cala Core locus, k2 nano, 100% needle. *breach shotty to the head* I've taken out 700 armor amarr assaults with one allotek breach Shotty. Goodbye balac You would have to get close to my head first
Really not a hard task.... At 400+ armor, 9.09 sprint speed, and 23.25 reps per second, the galass is a monster. Add 2 Krins and complex precision and I can see all but scouts and 1-2 shot all but the tankiest heavies, 1 headshot for almost also suits too.
Pair that with a thukker grenade and smg and you don't even have to get too close, 1k+ damage in about 3 seconds is more than enough. And as the last resort, you have your trusty sidearm to wreck.
CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company
Gallente Loyalist - Quafe
Gk.0s/Gv.0s - 63m SP
|
Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
631
|
Posted - 2016.03.08 00:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
Varoth Drac wrote:This is one of the most effective fits in the game:
Cal Assault 2x enhanced shield energizers 3x complex shield extenders 2x complex shield regulators 1x complex kinetic catalyser Ishikone assault rail rifle TY-5 breach scrambler pistol core locus grenades creodron flux active scanner
It will stuggle against anti shield weapons up close (AR, ScR, SG). It will get two shot by shotguns. Lasers are an issue as well.
The kincat is the key. It allows you to control engagments in your favour. Preferably at range, but the combo of fast regen and speed allows for good hit and run when needed. Switch to the pistol vs shield targets. If you go up against another Cal assault with a rail rifle at close range, your scrambler pistol will annihilate them. As a relatively rare weapon, you don't have to worry much about them doing the same to you.
Vs scouts using shotguns, all the usual ways of combatting them work. Again, the kincat is a massive help to you. Your general mobility makes you a much less likely and more difficult target for scouts. Stay in a group, keep and eye on your flanks, cover your teamates, listen for sounds of scout attacks. If a scout with a shotgun manages to get within good shotgun range, decloaked, without being spotted, yes you will be dead. However, not only should this be rare, but you can rest assured that they will die a lot trying this, even if they succeed, whilst you can repawn and merrilly continue making a significant contribution to your team.
If you expect never to die, you are playing the wrong game. If you find yourself in a battle where you get killed over and over by a shotgun scout, change to something with more speed or more armour and a good short range weapon. Counter play. You will now be more vulnerable to rail rifles.
By the way, the scanner is there to scan the enemy team, not their scouts. Unless you are a Gal logi with a focussed scanner, trying to scan scouts is pointless and unnecessary. Thanks for the tips. Yes, I expect to die. In fact I fight best when in BPO fits where I expect to die and don't care about the expense, because there isn't any. For some reason, even in fairly cheep fits my conservatism gets in the way, but in BPOs I just dive in.
My biggest problem in this game is finding a group to stay with. I tend to solo, and when I do, I usually find myself in teams with no squads, courtesy of the deplorable matchmaking. When I do find a group to stick with, I tend to switch to logi but still fairly active with an ARR. When not with a group I tend to scout. So assault is a bit of an unknown to me. I have found myself very confused by all the different fits, some high damage, others high tank, some fast regen others slow. I'm still sorting through it all to try to find the best options for me.
But yes, I can well understand the kincat. I have a Rasetsu BPO fit that uses a MLT BPO kincat and even that is refreshingly fast. I'll have a go at putting one on my CalAss ck.0. |
Alena Asakura
Caldari Logistics Reserve
631
|
Posted - 2016.03.08 01:00:00 -
[26] - Quote
DozersMouse XIII wrote:Buy balac ck.0 and get the best of both worlds
Mine has 144.14 shield rep per sec with 632 shield
20.25 armor rep with 359 armor
Don't need regulation because it's a balac ck.0
I like running AR/SMG combo so I got a balac gar and Cala Core locus, k2 nano, 100% needle. I did wonder about the Balac. I only have three of them and I don't know where they came from. Battlefield salvage is my guess. Where can I buy them? They don't seem to be in the market. |
Radiant Pancake3
Y.A.M.A.H
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.08 01:03:00 -
[27] - Quote
Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:DozersMouse XIII wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:DozersMouse XIII wrote:Buy balac ck.0 and get the best of both worlds
Mine has 144.14 shield rep per sec with 632 shield
20.25 armor rep with 359 armor
Don't need regulation because it's a balac ck.0
I like running AR/SMG combo so I got a balac gar and Cala Core locus, k2 nano, 100% needle. *breach shotty to the head* I've taken out 700 armor amarr assaults with one allotek breach Shotty. Goodbye balac You would have to get close to my head first Really not a hard task.... At 400+ armor, 9.09 sprint speed, and 23.25 reps per second, the galass is a monster. Add 2 Krins and complex precision and I can see all but scouts and 1-2 shot all but the tankiest heavies, 1 headshot for almost also suits too. Pair that with a thukker grenade and smg and you don't even have to get too close, 1k+ damage in about 3 seconds is more than enough. And as the last resort, you have your trusty sidearm to wreck. But Doz has Myos... so by the time you get close he'll be in the air...
I have a Fan!
|
Lightning35 Delta514
Federation Marines 62
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.08 01:04:00 -
[28] - Quote
Radiant Pancake3 wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:DozersMouse XIII wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:DozersMouse XIII wrote:Buy balac ck.0 and get the best of both worlds
Mine has 144.14 shield rep per sec with 632 shield
20.25 armor rep with 359 armor
Don't need regulation because it's a balac ck.0
I like running AR/SMG combo so I got a balac gar and Cala Core locus, k2 nano, 100% needle. *breach shotty to the head* I've taken out 700 armor amarr assaults with one allotek breach Shotty. Goodbye balac You would have to get close to my head first Really not a hard task.... At 400+ armor, 9.09 sprint speed, and 23.25 reps per second, the galass is a monster. Add 2 Krins and complex precision and I can see all but scouts and 1-2 shot all but the tankiest heavies, 1 headshot for almost also suits too. Pair that with a thukker grenade and smg and you don't even have to get too close, 1k+ damage in about 3 seconds is more than enough. And as the last resort, you have your trusty sidearm to wreck. But Doz has Myos... so by the time you get close he'll be in the air...
-_____-
As long as there's no MD or PLC, I'll be fine.
CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company
Gallente Loyalist - Quafe
Gk.0s/Gv.0s - 63m SP
|
Radiant Pancake3
Y.A.M.A.H
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.08 01:07:00 -
[29] - Quote
Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:
-_____-
As long as there's no MD or PLC, I'll be fine.
You really are full of yourself aren't you.
I have a Fan!
|
Lightning35 Delta514
Federation Marines 62
4
|
Posted - 2016.03.08 03:12:00 -
[30] - Quote
Radiant Pancake3 wrote:Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:
-_____-
As long as there's no MD or PLC, I'll be fine.
You really are full of yourself aren't you.
.... Yeah...... I'm full of my heart, guts, lungs, blood, bones, etc, etc, QUAFE, etc, etc.
I really am full of my self.
CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company
Gallente Loyalist - Quafe
Gk.0s/Gv.0s - 63m SP
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