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Can DUST Get a CSM and/or have the right to Vote?

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[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:08:00 - [1] - Quote For those who do not know what I'm talking about, get in the know and click HERE Can a game of FPS player collectively organize enough to have its own CSM? If not: Can or should a DUST Merc have the right to Vote on this coming election? Your thoughts and would you run? TCD ZionShad Other Post on this Topic HERE
[Veteran_Tony Calif] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:10:00 - [2] - Quote No. Pure duster here. EvE universe should be dealt with by EvE players until the Dust "community" actually becomes a community.
[Veteran_VOUYER] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:15:00 - [3] - Quote As Dust is a F2P model i don't see any need for a CSM at this time seeing as the CSM was created mostly as PR cleanup after the T20 incident with BoB back in the old days
[Veteran_Rhapsodyy] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:17:00 - [4] - Quote No they should not be able to vote in the next election. As the above poster mentions, the dust community actually needs to become a community first off for one. In good time im sure Dust will have its own version of the CSM or some sort of representation. Also remember that all the current CSM members have been given beta keys and im pretty sure most of them have played at least a bit. So they are not clueless about Dust. But yeah, all in good time.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:17:00 - [5] - Quote Tony Calif wrote: No. Pure duster here. EvE universe should be dealt with by EvE players until the Dust "community" actually becomes a community. Just a no point: What if an EVE player runs under a DUST driven docet this election? Dosen't matter if it be pro or con.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:25:00 - [6] - Quote VOUYER wrote: As Dust is a F2P model i don't see any need for a CSM at this time seeing as the CSM was created mostly as PR cleanup after the T20 incident with BoB back in the old days CSM now works as a voice from the players to the DEVs and helps communicate game related problems and ideas. How would this be different for someone from DUST doing the same thing?
[Veteran_Mavado V Noriega] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:40:00 - [7] - Quote like others said when DUST actually becomes a community sure and we can appoint some REASONABLE ppl to discuss with the devs but that should only be about DUST mechanics and not EVE-DUST link, personally think EVE players should handle that side more or maybe a double session with the 2 CSMs but i dont see both sides agreeing too much especially if the DUST CSM is made up of only pure DUSTERS
[Veteran_Ryan Raithwall] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:48:00 - [8] - Quote Dust rules by Fang and Club. Want a council? Okey come over here.... clubs them :V
[Veteran_Cobalt Lavitz] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 15:53:00 - [9] - Quote Due to the integration with the EVE universe dust will hold inherent places on the CSM simply because the CSMs have a very high likely hood of playing dust. Additionally, powerblocks and charismatic leaders will continue to rise to the CSM because they will have legions of their own mercs in dust and eve. I don't see much point in worrying about the dust representation in New Eden, as they will most likely be able to run in the CSM elections much like any other New Eden resident.
[Veteran_Dao Ferret] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 16:26:00 - [10] - Quote Use the Search Luke ... https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=144817#post144817 Never mind ... didn't realize you'd added a link already.

[Veteran_Dao Ferret] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 16:38:00 - [11] - Quote Mavado V Noriega wrote: like others said when DUST actually becomes a community sure and we can appoint some REASONABLE ppl to discuss with the devs but that should only be about DUST mechanics and not EVE-DUST link, personally think EVE players should handle that side more or maybe a double session with the 2 CSMs but i dont see both sides agreeing too much especially if the DUST CSM is made up of only pure DUSTERS Hey, some of us pure Dusters (so far), can be pretty reasonable, and try to come up with workable ideas. Much as I hate to say it, I at least understand where the vocal EVE people are coming from. EVE is a VERY established universe, with a community that has been going strong for around a decade or so. They're worried about how DUST will fit into EVE. If it tanks, it could negatively effect the game they have a whole heck of a lot more invested in (purely in terms of time, let alone the fact that EVE actually has a monthly subscription). Most "pure Dusters" know very little about how EVE works, but a tremendous amount about FPSs in general. They want a good FPS. The EVE community wants a good Integrated game. Good FPS is secondary. This is where most of the conflict comes in. Personally I think: - the FPS people need to take a step back and realize that the EVE people just want the game to integrate into their world "right" (whatever right is). - the EVE people need to take a step back and realize that if DUST doesn't attract (and keep) enough players, then even if it has a loyal following, it might not be able to continue, and may therefore "set back" CCPs plans for furthering New Eden. - both sides need to remember that ultimately (I think) we all want this game to succeed. In order for it to do that, it has to be a good FPS (which I think it will be), with innovation and fun (which will come as we ramp up the assets we get to play with in our sandbox), and it ALSO has to integrate into the New Eden universe in order to exist. I'd suggest if/when we do get representation, either they should be DUST players who have at least played a few months of EVE to understand where THEY are coming from, or it should be a separate group (hopefully with some people who've played EVE who can help handle "joint sessions").
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 17:05:00 - [12] - Quote Dao Ferret wrote: [quote=Mavado V Noriega]like others said when DUST actually becomes a community sure and we can appoint some REASONABLE ppl to discuss with the devs but that should only be about DUST mechanics and not EVE-DUST link, personally think EVE players ........... Great Points Dao, we do first off need a solid FPS to both attract new players and then keep them, but with the three day down time we should as a community organize and plan for the future. Then we could someday have our own rep. I've posted the link to this blog about what day 1 might be like in another post and waiting to see if more is added to it. Check it out at HERE
[Veteran_John Surratt] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 17:18:00 - [13] - Quote Dao Ferret wrote: ] Hey, some of us pure Dusters (so far), can be pretty reasonable, and try to come up with workable ideas. Much as I hate to say it, I at least understand where the vocal EVE people are coming from. Only fly in the ointment is that there is work going on with the CSM White Paper which is basically the CSM's constution. . . so until that gets settled things are still up in the air as to the CSM itself. Now on the other hand, the people on the CSM right now have some pretty bright people on there. Seleene is a former Dev himself and Trebor own his owns business, wrote computer games way back in the day, and even chewed out by Steve Jobs one time. Funny story that. Involves chocolate chip cookies. Kelduum is the head of that glorious collection of carebears that is EVE Uni. The rest I don't know as well but the majority are null/FW/W-space players. CCP made noises about the possibility adding DUST representation, but I think they just want to get the game made first. Perhaps the CSM can stop begin a unicameral body and have two houses, or, DUST specific seats could be added. CCP was talking about DUST being there at the next Fanfest, which is the big ten year mark. I am guessing eventually it (New Eden) will all be under one big tent. The vampire players can go LARP in ATL.
[Veteran_Glen Duval] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 17:44:00 - [14] - Quote Tony Calif wrote: No. Pure duster here. EvE universe should be dealt with by EvE players until the Dust "community" actually becomes a community. I have to agree with this guy here. Even upon launch, the game will primarily consist of lone wolves who only want to pad their K/D scoreboard while mixed in with a limited number of Eve players who are only getting started with organizing high-sec corps like Eve-University and R-v-B Alliance. Until unity and control is achieved through the collective action of the many players, the CSM should be off limits to DUST. Once everything settles and the economy and sovereignty mechanics have been ironed out in Dust, then we should consider letting DUST be represented. However, given that the CSM can only be voted by Eve players with active "paying" subscriptions in order to avoid mitigate voter fraud, more than likely the person(s) to represent Dust will be an Eve player with a Dust account.
[Veteran_Dao Ferret] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 17:49:00 - [15] - Quote Thanks for the link. I skimmed it a bit (probably plan on reading it more in depth later). There are a few major issues (I think) that would come into conflict between the CSM and DUST, mostly in the Candidate and Voting eligibility (which I know we touched on in the previous thread). Outside of that, seems like a well written and thought out Whitepaper. I agree with CCP though. First launch the game and get it rolling. Till there is a game, and a community behind it, CSM is overkill (yeah, I know we all think/hope/believe there will be a community, but until that happens ...). Until we see how they interact, I would suspect that a Bicameral body with joint sessions (full or subcommittee) covering interaction (when/if thats needed) would probably be the best way to represent their constituency. Either way there is going to be concern that one side or the other isn't being represented (although with separate houses you are practically guaranteeing a certain level of distrust among some of the constituency). That is all much more complicated than I imagine it currently is. From a "simplicity" perspective. A certain number of Representatives specifically representing DUST would probably suffice, but we'd have to determine their election/eligibility requirements, and integrate them into the CSM process, something that doesn't REALLY need to start until the game has been around for a bit. Sorry ... think too much. Will stop using big words now. Feel nap calling. Edit: ATL is a lovely place, and some of those Vampire players are rather cute. ... don't knock em till you've seen em. Does that mean I might be able to run into some of the CCP people @ DragonCon this year?
[Veteran_Iron Wolf] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 18:13:00 - [16] - Quote maybe have the vote cost aurum and you get a special item for your trouble for voting.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 19:04:00 - [17] - Quote Iron Wolf wrote: maybe have the vote cost aurum and you get a special item for your trouble for voting. I myself wouldn't mind this if and when this takes place. There will however be people who will not want to spend money but still want to vote. If it is like the AUR items where you can buy them and sell them to people for ISK then I would see that lessen the argument.
[Veteran_J Marshall] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 19:10:00 - [18] - Quote Heh. Used to be if you wanted the devs to hear something. You pinged one of them on IRC. CCPs customer relations went downhill after Kieron left and they locked down dev posting on the forums. From what I can tell DUST wont be nearly has political or meta gamed has eve so their is alot less complexity to be overseen. You just arent going to get the same emergent gameplay from a game like this. That said, and this being an early beta.. They could do several things to improve integration with eve and overall depth of the game. Lots more module options..really everything feels the same now with very little variation in what works well overall. Also, we should work twards being occupants of the eve-universe. If this is going to truly live up to CCP dreams for the project its got to be more than Eve players feeding their dust alts work. TL;DR: If this is going to work they had better do the integration right and make drop suits feel less cookie cutered...for starters.
[Veteran_Fivetimes Infinity] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 19:11:00 - [19] - Quote I'd be interested in seeing how the Dust community develops first. Will the majority of people in Dust involved with EVE corps in any serious way really have no EVE presence at all themselves? I think it is very likely that the broader Dust player base might not have an EVE account, but I think the people who really get involved with the mercenary company side of things may well either become EVE players or be existing EVE players who also play Dust on the side. In other words, there may be no need for a Dust CSM vote because the more involved Dust players may not be distinct from EVE players. The Dust community may well simply merge with the EVE community.
[Veteran_Dao Ferret] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 19:20:00 - [20] - Quote Zion Shad wrote: Iron Wolf wrote: maybe have the vote cost aurum and you get a special item for your trouble for voting. I myself wouldn't mind this if and when this takes place. There will however be people who will not want to spend money but still want to vote. If it is like the AUR items where you can buy them and sell them to people for ISK then I would see that lessen the argument. Thats an interesting idea, but I'd actually be against it. It would be too easy to set up fake accounts on the PS3, load them with money, and then stuff the ballot box. Granted you're still paying for the Vote, but I think a straight up "An account has to have been active for X days, and has to have purchased Y AUR in its lifetime" should be sufficient (I assume CCP keeps track of how much AUR any given account has purchased). Set the threshold low, but force the people who want to have a say in the future of the Free game, to at least pony up a little $$$ to help support it. Not sure if they should have to have bought X AUR every year (to put them on par with EVE players who pay/month, $$$ or PLEX), or if it should be a Lifetime credit (you bought $20 worth of AUR once, okay, you get to vote forever more), but they SHOULD have to put up something. If they don't want to support the FREE game with a SMALL real money, then I hope they enjoy it, and I certainly want them to play and be involved, but they shouldn't have a say in an elected body like this. Alternatively, if you want, and if DUST has its own elected body, separate from EVE, you could, I suppose reserve one or two seats for "free" players, while the rest of the body is elected from those who paid some AUR over the course of the game. This would let the free players still have a say and a voice, but would put the majority of the voice into the hands of those willing to help support the game.

[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 19:46:00 - [21] - Quote Dao Ferret wrote: Zion Shad wrote: Iron Wolf wrote: maybe have the vote cost aurum and you get a special item for your trouble for voting. I myself wouldn't mind this if and when this takes place. There will however be people who will not want to spend money but still want to vote. If it is like the AUR items where you can buy them and sell them to people for ISK then I would see that lessen the argument. Thats an interesting idea, but I'd actually be against it. It would be too easy to set up fake accounts on the PS3, load them with money, and then stuff the ballot box. Granted you're still paying for the Vote, but I think a straight up "An account has to have been active for X days, and has to have purchased Y AUR in its lifetime" should be sufficient (I assume CCP keeps track of how much AUR any given account has purchased). Agree
[Veteran_John Surratt] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 20:18:00 - [22] - Quote Dao Ferret wrote: Thanks for the link. I skimmed it a bit (probably plan on reading it more in depth later). There are a few major issues (I think) that would come into conflict between the CSM and DUST, mostly in the Candidate and Voting eligibility (which I know we touched on in the previous thread). Outside of that, seems like a well written and thought out Whitepaper. I agree with CCP though. First launch the game and get it rolling. Till there is a game, and a community behind it, CSM is overkill (yeah, I know we all think/hope/believe there will be a community, but until that happens ...). Until we see how they interact, I would suspect that a Bicameral body with joint sessions (full or subcommittee) covering interaction (when/if thats needed) would probably be the best way to represent their constituency. Either way there is going to be concern that one side or the other isn't being represented (although with separate houses you are practically guaranteeing a certain level of distrust among some of the constituency). That is all much more complicated than I imagine it currently is. From a "simplicity" perspective. A certain number of Representatives specifically representing DUST would probably suffice, but we'd have to determine their election/eligibility requirements, and integrate them into the CSM process, something that doesn't REALLY need to start until the game has been around for a bit. Sorry ... think too much. Will stop using big words now. Feel nap calling. Edit: ATL is a lovely place, and some of those Vampire players are rather cute. ... don't knock em till you've seen em. Does that mean I might be able to run into some of the CCP people @ DragonCon this year? I was spitballing in the dark, just based off what i've read/heard/watched. That white paper was the subject of some debate at the recent summit. Distrust between two houses would be very EVE, more likely there will be seats. I could see DUST CSM "alts" eventually to start who can sit in on the meeting via interwebs like that alts do now. CCP ATL (White Wolf) has been at Dragoncon for years. Some of the ATL WoD people worked on EVE stuff after the Jita riots/Monoclegate but they are likely deep into WoD stuffs again. Have to check Dragoncon's website. Nothing against attractive women (and there are alot @Dragoncon), just LARPers. Especially when hey are outside your door a 4am.
[Veteran_Dao Ferret] 0	Posted - 2012.06.24 20:27:00 - [23] - Quote John Surratt wrote: Dao Ferret wrote: Thanks for the link. I skimmed it a bit (probably plan on reading it more in depth later). There are a few major issues (I think) that would come into conflict between the CSM and DUST, mostly in the Candidate and Voting eligibility (which I know we touched on in the previous thread). Outside of that, seems like a well written and thought out Whitepaper. I agree with CCP though. First launch the game and get it rolling. Till there is a game, and a community behind it, CSM is overkill (yeah, I know we all think/hope/believe there will be a community, but until that happens ...). Until we see how they interact, I would suspect that a Bicameral body with joint sessions (full or subcommittee) covering interaction (when/if thats needed) would probably be the best way to represent their constituency. Either way there is going to be concern that one side or the other isn't being represented (although with separate houses you are practically guaranteeing a certain level of distrust among some of the constituency). That is all much more complicated than I imagine it currently is. From a "simplicity" perspective. A certain number of Representatives specifically representing DUST would probably suffice, but we'd have to determine their election/eligibility requirements, and integrate them into the CSM process, something that doesn't REALLY need to start until the game has been around for a bit. Sorry ... think too much. Will stop using big words now. Feel nap calling. Edit: ATL is a lovely place, and some of those Vampire players are rather cute. ... don't knock em till you've seen em. Does that mean I might be able to run into some of the CCP people @ DragonCon this year? I was spitballing in the dark, just based off what i've read/heard/watched. That white paper was the subject of some debate at the recent summit. Distrust between two houses would be very EVE, more likely there will be seats. I could see DUST CSM "alts" eventually to start who can sit in on the meeting via interwebs like that alts do now. CCP ATL (White Wolf) has been at Dragoncon for years. Some of the ATL WoD people worked on EVE stuff after the Jita riots/Monoclegate but they are likely deep into WoD stuffs again. Have to check Dragoncon's website. Nothing against attractive women (and there are alot @Dragoncon), just LARPers. Especially when hey are outside your door a 4am. Go to one of the overflow hotels. They tend to be quieter than the main ones. (not to derail the thread), but yeah, I can see where that would be a problem.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.07.13 03:55:00 - [24] - Quote This post had a lot of smart replys, so I thought it would be a good time to bump
RolyatDerTeufel D3ath D3alers RISE of LEGION 1648	Posted - 2012.07.13 04:01:00 - [25] - Quote CSM just for dust? never. CSM grow in numbers for the new addition to the universe? Sure, i'd think they would deffinitly do it.
[Veteran_John Surratt] 0	Posted - 2012.07.13 05:09:00 - [26] - Quote This Sorry Roylat, couldn't resist. . .
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.07.13 06:23:00 - [27] - Quote John Surratt wrote: This Sorry Roylat, couldn't resist. . . Love it
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.07.13 06:25:00 - [28] - Quote RolyatDerTeufel wrote: CSM just for dust? never. CSM grow in numbers for the new addition to the universe? Sure, i'd think they would deffinitly do it. Would like to hear your thoughts father on this Rolyat. "Never" is a bold statement. Could you explain more
daniel philp Algintal Core Gallente Federation 158	Posted - 2012.07.13 06:43:00 - [29] - Quote I think some dust players should have a spot because were all sharing the same worlds and space. We need new fresh faces in this game to push it forward.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.07.13 17:04:00 - [30] - Quote daniel philp wrote: I think some dust players should have a spot because were all sharing the same worlds and space. We need new fresh faces in this game to push it forward. Good point. DUST should be a topic we push on CSM candidates even if we will not have one of our own. This is because of the fact we will be sharing the space and we will have a large amount of players. I see it as if we organize enough as a whole community, then we could bring in our own rep to the table.

Furrow33 21	Posted - 2012.07.13 19:36:00 - [31] - Quote I see it happening for sure doooown the road. But whoever it is will have to be very knowledgable on more than just dust.
Nu11u5 Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 73	Posted - 2012.07.13 20:48:00 - [32] - Quote I'm sure we will see CMS candidates run with Dust as part of their platforms once the game is released. If it's later seen that Dust needs reserved seats or its own body of representatives than that can be dealt with when the time comes, and will probably be the established CSM itself making the change. I don't see why anything needs to be changed so soon. If you want Dust to be represented on the CSM contact an existing member - they usually have out of game contact methods was well as in Eve. Or, run in next year's election.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.07.18 20:30:00 - [33] - Quote It would take a lot of organizing on our part to get numbers to push something like this, but even if we went through all that trouble to get a candidate it's all for nothing if we can't vote for them.
Heinrich Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous Late Night Alliance 142	Posted - 2012.07.19 16:34:00 - [34] - Quote I just thought Zion and the rest of you would be happy to know that several of us on the current CSM do play Dust regularly, and are monitoring it's progress closely, especially with regards to the EVE integration. (I should clarify that I'm definitely interested in making sure Dust is a quality game on its own right, I know full well many of you won't / shouldn't have to play EVE to enjoy Dust 514.) We're already under NDA for all of the Dust 514 project as well as EVE, (not the don't-talk-about-beta NDA, I'm talking about the NDA that lets us talk with the developers about their future plans, release dates, etc.) We recently concluded our 1st summit in Iceland, and there was an entire session at the summit dedicated to talking about Dust 514. Even the half of the CSM that doesn't travel to Iceland got to participate, via the new teleconferencing technology that we pushed CCP to set up for us. It was pretty cool to sit here in Seattle and simultaneously talk with the CSM members in Iceland and Brandon Laurino, in Shanghai. The minutes from this summit have been finalized and are undergoing their last review before release, so you all will have a chance to see what we've been discussing with CCP. I'll be sure to drop a link once it's published. All that to say, at least for the coming year until next March, Dust will be represented by the current CSM. The CSM's work with Dust is still just beginning, CCP Shanghai and CCP Iceland are very different organizations, and while we have extensive contact with the Iceland group we're still working on bringing more of the Shanghai team into our private forums and the daily Skype chats that we use to work on EVE. So in the mean time, the ability for the CSM to influence Dust 514's development is a little hampered by our limited communication, but we're making progress slowly but surely. Zion, in your other thread on the same topic (tsk tsk!) you mentioned some form of live "Discussions" you were part of, that were covered by NDA? I've been playing the game and perusing the forums here and there, but I'm still feeling out the "dust community" whose identity is still clearly emerging. Is this like a podcast or radio thing? If there's a way to do some kind of Q&A in a secure, easy-to-access environment where all of you that aren't EVE players can ask questions about the CSM and how it all works, I'd be happy to set aside some time.
Ventis Gant Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 37	Posted - 2012.07.19 17:39:00 - [35] - Quote Forums Veteran wrote: Zion Shad wrote: Iron Wolf wrote: maybe have the vote cost aurum and you get a special item for your trouble for voting. I myself wouldn't mind this if and when this takes place. There will however be people who will not want to spend money but still want to vote. If it is like the AUR items where you can buy them and sell them to people for ISK then I would see that lessen the argument. Thats an interesting idea, but I'd actually be against it. It would be too easy to set up fake accounts on the PS3, load them with money, and then stuff the ballot box. Granted you're still paying for the Vote, but I think a straight up "An account has to have been active for X days, and has to have purchased Y AUR in its lifetime" should be sufficient (I assume CCP keeps track of how much AUR any given account has purchased). I agree...X amount of Aurum purchased in, say, the 30 days leading up to the vote would make an account eligible to vote, which is pretty much how it works in EvE (account must have been active and paid up for so many days before the vote). As far as "vote buying", this is considered a perfectly legitimate practice in EvE. You get one vote per paying account that meets the age guidlines, so this would seem to be fair for DUST players to do as well. With the average subscription price for a US player of Eve being around $15, then around that value of aurum having been purchased within X days before the election should get a vote. On another note, in EvE, you have the option of buying PLEX with isk, and keeping an active account this way. You can vote on these accounts as well, even though you personally paid no cash for them. Assuming that you can buy aurum packs on the open market with isk (which most of us expect to eventually be able to do), then activating X ammount of Aurum from these packs in the days leading up to the election should also allow that account to vote. I agree, though, that we need time to actually form a community before we need a CSM, or representation on EvE's CSM.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.07.22 20:19:00 - [36] - Quote There are multiple ways around weeding out fake voters and I've posted this before and will do again. It is easy for CCP working with Sony to determine how long an account has been active without involving Aur items. I am not against this idea, just stating it can be done. This is going off the knowledge that is given to us through logging in this forum. We go through a Playstation log in screen so CCP knows who has full beta access. By this CCP could also make a program that allows voting to anyone who has been a part of DUST for say four months. Who should vote is not an issue. It's uniting enough DUST Mercs to push a DUST Candidate through and then seek the opportunity to Vote.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.08.04 23:34:00 - [37] - Quote Now that everyone has heard about the last CSM Meeting, its time to Bump again
Arceus Evoxazon Hikahotaru 119	Posted - 2012.08.04 23:55:00 - [38] - Quote Key word: mercenary. I don't think that includes the right to choose.
Arceus Evoxazon Hikahotaru 119	Posted - 2012.08.04 23:58:00 - [39] - Quote Not to say this means we shouldn't have a say. Even as a vote, i don't believe that should really apply, but having a lobby? Entirely plausible. To get our voices heard and have a liaison into the Universal endeavors I see as entirely legitimate.
[Veteran_Zion Shad] 0	Posted - 2012.08.05 00:40:00 - [40] - Quote Now it was rumored on Podside podcast by one of the hosts that Hilmar of CCP gave mention to a DUST CSM while on Alliance tournament 10. It was said that not only would DUST get it, they may receive their own counsel that would meet around the same as EVEGÇÖs CSM to organize a signal meet as well as their separate meets. Not sure how true this is, but it would be nice to have a DEV chime in. This statment can be found at Podside on iTunes Quote: UAxDEATH: OK, so when can we run for DUST CSM? (Laughter) CCP Jian: We haven't sorted that part out yet. CSM meeting minutes (page 69) Its being thought of at lest so it's not out of the running. You would have to search the AT10 footage on Youtube to find Hilmar coverage (so I been told)

Devil Biff Imperfects Negative-Feedback 55	Posted - 2012.08.06 09:49:00 - [41] - Quote As with all in the thread, I believe our voice -áshould be heard as well. However, I believe that dust is in too much of a raw form to have a CSM member right now. We have to rely on current members to speak for us. And it's nice to see some of them playing. I do believe we do not see enough of them. It may benefit CSM members to take a dust advisor, someone that plays the game regularly. That way they can ask this person questions and dig deeper into integration. For me the integration is key right now. Market integration, cross game comms, and -ácorp/grouping as well. The other stuff like OB is in the hands of CCP and what they want to make of it. Thanks to-áHeinrich Jagerblitzen for posting. Ur marked for death now. Hehe. J/k. Kinda.-á
Zion Shad ZionTCD Legacy Rising 1620	Posted - 2012.08.08 07:55:00 - [42] - Quote Devil Biff wrote: As with all in the thread, I believe our voice -áshould be heard as well. However, I believe that dust is in too much of a raw form to have a CSM member right now. We have to rely on current members to speak for us. And it's nice to see some of them playing. I do believe we do not see enough of them. It may benefit CSM members to take a dust advisor, someone that plays the game regularly. That way they can ask this person questions and dig deeper into integration. For me the integration is key right now. Market integration, cross game comms, and -ácorp/grouping as well. The other stuff like OB is in the hands of CCP and what they want to make of it. Thanks to-áHeinrich Jagerblitzen for posting. Ur marked for death now. Hehe. J/k. Kinda.-á Great post. I agree that the beta is to early a point to be electing a DUST Candidate, but I do think it is a good time to maybe get things in the works for the future of a candidacy
Lord Crases PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 19	Posted - 2012.08.08 08:53:00 - [43] - Quote I think what I would be worried about is if there is a dust chair he would become the 'token dust bunnies' at the table but at the same time I do not feel that Dust514 deserves its own council. You can see my point.
Zion Shad ZionTCD Legacy Rising 1620	Posted - 2012.08.08 19:53:00 - [44] - Quote Lord Crases wrote: ... but at the same time I do not feel that Dust514 deserves its own council. You can see my point. How come? There will be many aspects to the game beside just fighting. To name a few: 1- Corporation and Alliances 2- PI (Planetary Interaction) 3- Botting (Rouge Drone battling) 4- DUST/EVE Interaction 5- DUST/EVE Integration 6- District ownership 7- Planetary ownership 8- Arms Manufacturing 9- Ship and Vehicle Manufacturing (War barge down to LAVs and so on) 10- E-Sports 11- The list just goes on.... To me this task can not be handled by one.


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