Sunday morning just prior to downtime I received a hate mail from a teammate following a winning ambush. Something along the lines of "You should try to win the battle instead of useless point collecting, I see no good in you".
The reason... I dunno maybe because I finished third overall in the range of 1200-1300 WP and going 0/2? The two players above and at least one below me (maybe two) had double digit kills with single digit deaths. Something like 15/6, 14/3/ etc.
So, let me get this right. You would rather I go 3/12-14-16 with maybe 8 assists in an ambush instead of keeping the team in the fight with 3 second drop uplinks and a proto rep tool, picking up down teammates with a proto Nanite Injector, and keeping them supplied with ammunition and in good health with proto triage nanohives?
Thanks for your input. I'll keep that in mind next time I'm standing over your proto dropsuit with officer weapons watching you bleed out. I mean after all, heaven forbid YOU should contribute to my USELESS point gathering.

the hypocrite and spelling errors are strong with this one...

If that logi has his gun out and is stealing kills from you he is not repping you to keep you alive therefore id take the logi that is doing his job and running the 3 r's at least not running around trying to kill people.

Secondly I'd take the ******* and mute him that's what we used to do with champeen dillon when he was squadded with us. He might be an ******* but at least he can be a distraction for me to run behind the enemy and hack the point while they're dealing with him.

I don't think any metric can be used to really assess someone's skill in this game. Most people seem to run in squads which will make them appear to be a lot better than they really are.

So because it isn't a useful stat on its own we should just remove it?

This is a fixed player count lobby shooter, and being able to kill your opponent counts more than most other things. Some people may not like that, but it is a pretty hard fact. There are exceptions, but those prove the rule rather than negate it.

In any scenario where you have two identical logis, the one who can slay better is the one you want in your PC team, because they are better than the guy who can only rep or slap down hives.

K/D is not the be all end all of stats, but it does matter. People who say it doesn't are ignorant of the game rules.

No I would not disagree in a situation like that.

This is a slightly different scenario though. I was running solo that morning before any corp mates were online and playing. I wanted to get a few matches in before downtime.

This mail came from someone I didn't know. Not even sure if I did or did not do something for him. In my opinion he was probably upset because I took "his" third place spot without getting as many or more kills than him. But I don't know that for sure, just conjecture at this point.

I didn't take the time to look and see where he finished in the standings. This match ended about 15 minutes before the top of the hour and the start of downtime (6:00 AM I my case) and I wanted to get another ambush going before I ran out of time.

the hypocrite and spelling errors are strong with this one...

If that logi has his gun out and is stealing kills from you he is not repping you to keep you alive therefore id take the logi that is doing his job and running the 3 r's at least not running around trying to kill people.

Secondly I'd take the ******* and mute him that's what we used to do with champeen dillon when he was squadded with us. He might be an ******* but at least he can be a distraction for me to run behind the enemy and hack the point while they're dealing with him.

Press Attache is our resident delusional narcissist. He's read some gaming articles by developers so he knows better than everyone how the game should be played and how we should play it. If we don't play by his standards, we are scrubs to him. He'll basically come in to any post trying to spout his opinion as if he's god.

Get over self Press Attache. You're annoying.

I'm not saying it should be thrown out, but it should be taken into consideration with other metrics to gauge true player efficiency... Yes, eliminating the enemy is a big part of team success, but it isn't the only part...

This isn't a new concept; I've personally been campaigning for better metrics in shooters for probably a decade (and over the years some games have started to dabble in them a little)...The problem is proper implementation would require a metric shitload of mathematical analysis, debate, and millions of lines of new code, and at present game developers don't have the budget, manpower, or time to adopt them...

Having a conversation about your mindset makes me a narcissist?

Stating that killing matters in a First Person Shooter makes me delusional?

Please continues to use words that you cannot define.

KDR is something tryhards strive for in this game. Yes killing is important, however helping the team achieve victory by not killing and being support is just as important if not more.

You are delusional to think that KDR is the end all and be all stat in this game. I don't judge someones skill in this game ny KDR, but teamwork.

Also you are an annoying prick who is always full of himself. Go back to stroking your epeen.

In post #16 and #24 I say it is not the be all end all stat.

That you then try and say that I am saying it is all that matters shows a blatant disregard for what I have actually typed. That is a shameful tactic in a debate.

That you say killing is important shows that you actually agree with my point, but because you don't like me you want to imagine I said something else so that you could make your attempt at a counter argument. To a point I did not make.

Its funny, you said yesterday that a scrub was someone who lied.

Guess what you just did with this post, you intentionally misrepresented what I said in order to throw an insult out.

That would be lying, so enjoy being a scrub, by your own mistaken definition.

Whats funny is that the corp ad in your sig lists a K/D standard for being on your PC team. I guess K/D matters to certain people above you.

How does it feel to make yourself out to be an ass because you can't refute my arguments?

So instead of trying to calmly discuss any of my points, you publicly insult me and accuse me of not liking you. As well as put down the corp I am apart of. You also carry on like a disgruntled 12 year old.

Like I said in the other thread, put your epeen away, no one wants to see it.

What points?

You agreed with me that killing matters. Nothing to discuss.

You claimed that not killing matters more(which is kind of odd, because not killing actually doesn't help)

Everyone plays support. If support was a non killing role logis wouldn't have guns. So your point isn't even a point.

I didn't put down your corp, just pointed out they have a K/D requirement. How that is an insult only you know.

I didn't insult you, because I don't think you are a scrub. However, as YOU defined scrub as a liar, and you lied about what I said, YOU CALLED YOURSELF A SCRUB, I just pointed it out. Not my fault that you define a scrub be behaviour that you then later choose to engage in.

And clearly you don't like me, because you have lied about what I say, and then called me at various times an annoying prick and a loser.

You talk sh*t, you get hit. That's how the world works. You don't like it, keep my name out of your mouth.

Logis have guns to defend themselves not to kill. The point of a logistics role is to support the team and be a force multiplier and not a slayer. Slayer logis are a cancer in the game.i know this first hand as I spent the first 8 months of playing this game as a logi.

A logi that has a kdr of less than 1 can still be better than a slayer with a kdr above 2 depending on how they act as a support. There have been matches where I have gone 44/3 because I had a logi with me that went 0/4 with ocer 4000 wp. That logi kept the team alive with reps, kept them stocked with ammo kept uplinks active and revived people. Had he spent his time trying to kill, the team would of suffered greatly. So again to restate my point: Killing is not important if you are a support role.

Saying that all roles can be support is not true. A sentinel cannot be a support role due to their lack of equipment and the fact that they are made to be point defense slayers. A commando and an assault can provide scans, uplinks and hives, however running with a reptool on those suits is a waste as they are mainly slayer roles. Therefore their equipment must be geared to help their efficacy with killing. Scouts are Scouts, meant to infiltrate and assassinate. Running support items on them is again meaningless.

Also it is known that even with a kdr restriction for a PC team, logis have lower restrictions when it comes to kdr. This has been true since the beginning.

This is not related to the argument I made.

Posts 15, 16 and 24 contain my essential thesis, please read those and quote them to construct your counter arguments.

If you want to have a debate about the importance of teamwork, or at what weight you should assign your logis in a team composition, that should be another thread.

The crux of my argument in this thread was that K/D matters in a lobby based shooter with a limited player count, and that although there are exceptions, they prove the rule rather than negate it. Your argument in the quoted post above has very little to do with that, and in some places veers wildly off topic.

However, I will address what you termed as your point:

Killing is not important if you are in a support role.

First I would say that you should check post #26, as I listed a response to that point already. Killing does matter for support roles, because there will be times when they are the last one alive, and if they cannot eliminate the threat, the squad goes back to square one, but if they can, they can then get their needle out and bring the squad back up at the point of contact.

So even though killing is not their primary function, their ability to kill does matter. Consider the hypothetical from post 26, and ask yourself who would you rather have in your squad, the logi who can't shoot or the one who can.

You lack reading comprehension.

OK, and you lack the proper fundamentals of debate.

You have not disproved my thesis in any way shape or form.

That you started your post of with an insult shows you have an inherent lack of civility and refuse to debate in good faith.

Instead of addressing any of the points I have raised, instead of referring to anything I have said, you merely restated your mistaken case.

At no point did I refer to slaying in any of my reference posts, so you are attempting to divert the argument to a totally different topic.

Your summation proves that we are not talking about the same topic, and that you cannot even address what is a simple thesis is rather funny.

That you then wonder why I get argumentative with people like you confounds me.

You should go and sign up for a high school debate class, it would do you a world of good, and save me from having to try to educate you in how to form an argument, and especially a counter argument.

I bet when people are talking about the relative strength of representative democracy you stand up and shout "But I think pancakes make the best breakfast!" and expect them to nod in solemn agreement as if you contributed.

Okay I'm done. You really are just a 12 year old.

Yet another dumb blueberry who thinks "slaying" is the only thing that can be done in this game. Go Logi Go.

I call you those things because you are acting like it. Now we actually do have a poibt to discuss but there is not point as you are acting like a little kid throwing his toys out of the cot. Now lets put away your childish ways and discuss. Maybe you can change my opinion of you.

Logis have guns to defend themselves not to kill. The point of a logistics role is to support the team and be a force multiplier and not a slayer. Slayer logis are a cancer in the game.i know this first hand as I spent the first 8 months of playing this game as a logi.

A logi that has a kdr of less than 1 can still be better than a slayer with a kdr above 2 depending on how they act as a support. There have been matches where I have gone 44/3 because I had a logi with me that went 0/4 with ocer 4000 wp. That logi kept the team alive with reps, kept them stocked with ammo kept uplinks active and revived people. Had he spent his time trying to kill, the team would of suffered greatly. So again to restate my point: Killing is not important if you are a support role.

Saying that all roles can be support is not true. A sentinel cannot be a support role due to their lack of equipment and the fact that they are made to be point defense slayers. A commando and an assault can provide scans, uplinks and hives, however running with a reptool on those suits is a waste as they are mainly slayer roles. Therefore their equipment must be geared to help their efficacy with killing. Scouts are Scouts, meant to infiltrate and assassinate. Running support items on them is again meaningless.

Also it is known that even with a kdr restriction for a PC team, logis have lower restrictions when it comes to kdr. This has been true since the beginning.

Just stop trying to reason with someone who understands nothing. I for one will just ignore any post he makes from now on as I have deemed it stupid to do otherwise and I expect you to follow me in this crusade to not give narcissists what they want. Don't pay him no mind as you said and now we should follow in the holyness of disregarding anything he says.

Press you claim you're not a hypocrite yet every turn your calling people scrubs and insulting them all the while your criticizing them for doing the same. You have a god complex and this post proves it. Now im not saying it's bad to have a god complex but when im being a hypocrite I'll admit it or if im wrong I'll admit it. Yes I did insult your spelling and am not sorry for it and when I said your being a hypocrite ... Guess what im a hypocrite too but hey I admitted it you seem to have a problem admitting when your wrong and (just like the bible) you contradict yourself at every turn yet still say that you've been speaking in a straight line and when we try to call you on it you say that were reading wrong and refer to earlier posts which contradict your statements. I might act like im god but at least I'll admit it I might be wrong but at least I'll admit it I might be a hypocrite but at least I'll admit it... Admit when you're wrong and get over it everyone is wrong at some point and this game would benefit more from removal of kd than it would otherwise and while you hide in your tank all day you won't admit it cause your kd is the only thing that seems to matter to you.

Sunday morning just prior to downtime I received a hate mail from a teammate following a winning ambush. Something along the lines of "You should try to win the battle instead of useless point collecting, I see no good in you".
The reason... I dunno maybe because I finished third overall in the range of 1200-1300 WP and going 0/2? The two players above and at least one below me (maybe two) had double digit kills with single digit deaths. Something like 15/6, 14/3/ etc.
So, let me get this right. You would rather I go 3/12-14-16 with maybe 8 assists in an ambush instead of keeping the team in the fight with 3 second drop uplinks and a proto rep tool, picking up down teammates with a proto Nanite Injector, and keeping them supplied with ammunition and in good health with proto triage nanohives?
Thanks for your input. I'll keep that in mind next time I'm standing over your proto dropsuit with officer weapons watching you bleed out. I mean after all, heaven forbid YOU should contribute to my USELESS point gathering.

Some people only understand kills and not overall strategy.

PRO TIP: Fluxes will terminate friendly clones. Remember this when their proto suit goes down and you are standing over them with a needle.