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Count- -Crotchula
283
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Posted - 2015.08.14 21:25:00 -
[1] - Quote
just read an old thread where this was said
"there appears to be ZERO incentive in this game to armor tank
You have to go for shields. Shields trump everything. Armor tanking isn't even an option for ground troops.
shields are better, and always have been better."
It's a bit strange to think that shields were better once upon a time. |
Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
12
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Posted - 2015.08.14 21:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Apocalyptic Destroyerr
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
916
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Posted - 2015.08.14 21:30:00 -
[3] - Quote
You're talking way back when in Beta. That's probably why the Rat is so scared to buff Shields IMO.
Use it ----> Abuse It ----> Nerf !!!
a¦á_a¦á
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn
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General Mosquito
Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback
283
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Posted - 2015.08.14 21:48:00 -
[4] - Quote
That was before the scrambler rifle.
In closed beta it was shields all the way.
The Attorney General - Mr. Hybrid Vayu
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Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.08.14 21:48:00 -
[5] - Quote
Apocalyptic Destroyerr wrote:You're talking way back when in Beta. That's probably why the Rat is so scared to buff Shields IMO. You don't have to go as far as beta. When the game was released shields were far superior. Armour got buffed, shields not so much.
I don't believe shields are much worse than armour. A few tweaks would improve balance. I suggest buffing energisers and rechargers and implementing a shield rep tool (+hives). Maybe add heavy shield extenders, equivalent to plates, with higher hp values but more regen penalties. These would be designed for heavies who can look to logis to remotely regen their shields. |
Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game
1
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Posted - 2015.08.14 21:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
General Mosquito wrote:That was before the scrambler rifle.
In closed beta it was shields all the way. Nope, shields were OP at the same time the scrambler rifle was around. I can't remember if the heat reduction skill existed or not though. But regardless, ARs were king, there were no anti-armour rail or combat rifles. |
LT SHANKS
You In The Nutz
6
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Posted - 2015.08.14 22:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
Before Reactives and Ferroscales came out and before armour received their insane HP buffs, shields were the preferred choice of tank.
I believe Shields were OP until around November of 2013. Might have been a little earlier, but we were already into Uprising before armour took over. I'd have to say they fell short once CalLogis began to lose their slaying potential. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
10
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Posted - 2015.08.15 18:54:00 -
[8] - Quote
LT SHANKS wrote:Before Reactives and Ferroscales came out and before armour received their insane HP buffs, shields were the preferred choice of tank.
I believe Shields were OP until around November of 2013. Might have been a little earlier, but we were already into Uprising before armour took over. I'd have to say they fell short once CalLogis began to lose their slaying potential. Shields were nerfed at the same time as armor was buffed.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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Aeon Amadi
Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback
12
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Posted - 2015.08.15 20:35:00 -
[9] - Quote
Things were -WAY- different back in the day though.
We didn't have Reactive/Ferroscale plates, which meant you -had- to use the vanilla plates that carried a 3%, 5%, and 10% reduction to movement speed penalty respectively. Turn speed was also based on suit and mass so the heavier you were, the slower your turn speed. Suits -DID NOT- have innate armor repair so you were forced to assign at least one or more repair modules.
A complete absence of hit detection meant that more mobility was better overall as you could out-strafe someone's aim because of the difficulty in actually getting the crosshair on them. Just as well, there wasn't a great deal of suits to select from. Caldari Assault was shield based, primarily, but everything else was armor based save for the Amarr Sentinel Type-2 which had an even spread of Shield and Armor HP, basically.
When Uprising hit, the suit bonuses were all kind of screwy. ALL Assaults had a shield recharge bonus, which was worthless for the Amarr and Gallente. ALL Logistics has a built in 5hp/armor repair per second, which while useful for armor tankers was -far- more useful for Shield Tankers who had a higher PG/CPU than their assault counterparts and better slot layouts. Further more, the Caldari Logi actually had a bonus to Shield Extenders, if memory serves, so it could tank like a pro.
This thread by Arkena Wyrnspire was pretty much -THE- consolidated thread as to why Armor sucked back in the day. But yes, if you wanted to be a pro-player you basically had to run shields back in the day.
Aeon Amadi for CPM 2
Design A SKIN 2
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Aeon Amadi
Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback
12
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Posted - 2015.08.15 20:36:00 -
[10] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:LT SHANKS wrote:Before Reactives and Ferroscales came out and before armour received their insane HP buffs, shields were the preferred choice of tank.
I believe Shields were OP until around November of 2013. Might have been a little earlier, but we were already into Uprising before armour took over. I'd have to say they fell short once CalLogis began to lose their slaying potential. Shields were nerfed at the same time as armor was buffed.
Apart from shield extenders getting a penalty to shield recharge delay, how were shields nerfed...?
Aeon Amadi for CPM 2
Design A SKIN 2
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
12
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Posted - 2015.08.15 21:22:00 -
[11] - Quote
Poking around the patch notes ...
Uprising 1.4
* Adjusted Armor Plate attributes - HP bonus of 85/110/135 (Basic/Enhanced/Complex) and speed penalties of 2%/3%/5% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 93.5/121/148.5) * Adjusted Ferroscale Plate attributes - HP bonus of 35/50/75 (with full skill bonuses this equates to 38.5/55/82.5) * Adjusted Reactive Plate attributes - HP bonus of 25/40/60 and speed penalties of 0%/1%/1% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 27.5/44/66)
Uprising 1.7
* Added shield extender 3% penalty - stacking slows down the depleted shield recharge delay.
HF Alpha
Tanking Modules Armor GÇóWe want to reduce the stacking of plates by normalizing pg and cpu a little bit, and also increasing the speed penalty a bit. GÇóWe also want to make repair modules a little more useful so weGÇÿre increasing repair rates by a small amount. GÇóWe also want to make reactive and ferroscale plates more attractive by reducing the PG /CPU requirements so people will use them instead of basic armor plates when they want to maintain some speed.
Shields GÇóThe CPM and community has been vocal on not changing multiple ehp modules at a time. As such we will not be making any changes to shield tanking until the next hotfix. This also gives us a chance to examine new data from rebalanced armor modules.
HF Bravo
In Hotfix Bravo we took a closer look at Shield Tanking, and improved nearly all Shield Modules generously across the board. We wanted to make them true alternatives to Armor Modules and hope that we will see more Shield Tankers on the battlefield from now on.
HF Delta
We are buffing Logistics in a big way by changing the Nanite Injector to heal Shields as well. Now those prototype needles are sounding great, right?
Energizers, Rechargers and Regulators are all getting a CPU reduction, combined with Projectile damage profile, we believe this will make shield tanking considerably more viable.
Warlords 1.1.3
Shield Recharge Currently if you are running for cover and small arms fire keeps "plinking" away your health, you can't regenerate shields.
We will be adding a shield interruption threshold, much like vehicles have, to all Dropsuits. Damage less than that number will not interrupt shield recharge. This should be a big buff for shield users, and something that has been commonly requested in the past so I am happy to see it in-game.
Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Aeon Amadi
Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback
12
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Posted - 2015.08.16 00:45:00 -
[12] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Poking around the patch notes ...
Uprising 1.4
* Adjusted Armor Plate attributes - HP bonus of 85/110/135 (Basic/Enhanced/Complex) and speed penalties of 2%/3%/5% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 93.5/121/148.5) * Adjusted Ferroscale Plate attributes - HP bonus of 35/50/75 (with full skill bonuses this equates to 38.5/55/82.5) * Adjusted Reactive Plate attributes - HP bonus of 25/40/60 and speed penalties of 0%/1%/1% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 27.5/44/66)
Uprising 1.7
* Added shield extender 3% penalty - stacking slows down the depleted shield recharge delay.
HF Alpha
Tanking Modules Armor GÇóWe want to reduce the stacking of plates by normalizing pg and cpu a little bit, and also increasing the speed penalty a bit. GÇóWe also want to make repair modules a little more useful so weGÇÿre increasing repair rates by a small amount. GÇóWe also want to make reactive and ferroscale plates more attractive by reducing the PG /CPU requirements so people will use them instead of basic armor plates when they want to maintain some speed.
Shields GÇóThe CPM and community has been vocal on not changing multiple ehp modules at a time. As such we will not be making any changes to shield tanking until the next hotfix. This also gives us a chance to examine new data from rebalanced armor modules.
HF Bravo
In Hotfix Bravo we took a closer look at Shield Tanking, and improved nearly all Shield Modules generously across the board. We wanted to make them true alternatives to Armor Modules and hope that we will see more Shield Tankers on the battlefield from now on.
HF Delta
We are buffing Logistics in a big way by changing the Nanite Injector to heal Shields as well. Now those prototype needles are sounding great, right?
Energizers, Rechargers and Regulators are all getting a CPU reduction, combined with Projectile damage profile, we believe this will make shield tanking considerably more viable.
Warlords 1.1.3
Shield Recharge Currently if you are running for cover and small arms fire keeps "plinking" away your health, you can't regenerate shields.
We will be adding a shield interruption threshold, much like vehicles have, to all Dropsuits. Damage less than that number will not interrupt shield recharge. This should be a big buff for shield users, and something that has been commonly requested in the past so I am happy to see it in-game.
Think we need to kill the shield depleted shield recharge delay penalty on Shield Extenders and give Regulators an additional benefit of increasing shield "plinking" damage threshold. I'm hesitant to give shields more buffer because I personally would like to see a distinction between the two tanking styles with Armor being more about buffer and shields being more about recharge, but to do that we need to emphasize the latter a bit more.
Aeon Amadi for CPM 2
Design A SKIN 2
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Radiant Pancake3
Destinys Immortals Rise Of Legion.
702
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Posted - 2015.08.16 00:48:00 -
[13] - Quote
I've been using the Basic Cal assault recently... and i've been kicking a$$ in it... I've also noticed a bug where if you stop charging right at it being full charged with an ARR it shoots without recoil... I get hit markers so i'm assuming it does damage as well but I have never tested it...
Hopes up 4 Logi vehicles
Join Logi Heaven! Chat: "Triage Ward"
Min Loyalist
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Louis Domi
Louis Domi's Super Happy Fun Time
1
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Posted - 2015.08.16 01:01:00 -
[14] - Quote
Back near uprising 1.4(?) I think Major buffs to armor were made, Nerfs to shields. Also there was a time when the AR was OP as hell(Tac AR in particular)
Bring back old flying LAVs
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Louis Domi
Louis Domi's Super Happy Fun Time
1
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Posted - 2015.08.16 01:03:00 -
[15] - Quote
Louis Domi wrote:Back near uprising 1.4(?) I think Major buffs to armor were made, Nerfs to shields. Also there was a time when the AR was OP as hell(Tac AR in particular)
Its too bad lol Back then I was actually really into Armor... and then when they changed it up I got into shields...
Bring back old flying LAVs
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Joel II X
Bacon with a bottle of Quafe
8
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Posted - 2015.08.16 01:19:00 -
[16] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Poking around the patch notes ...
Uprising 1.4
* Adjusted Armor Plate attributes - HP bonus of 85/110/135 (Basic/Enhanced/Complex) and speed penalties of 2%/3%/5% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 93.5/121/148.5) * Adjusted Ferroscale Plate attributes - HP bonus of 35/50/75 (with full skill bonuses this equates to 38.5/55/82.5) * Adjusted Reactive Plate attributes - HP bonus of 25/40/60 and speed penalties of 0%/1%/1% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 27.5/44/66)
Uprising 1.7
* Added shield extender 3% penalty - stacking slows down the depleted shield recharge delay.
HF Alpha
Tanking Modules Armor GÇóWe want to reduce the stacking of plates by normalizing pg and cpu a little bit, and also increasing the speed penalty a bit. GÇóWe also want to make repair modules a little more useful so weGÇÿre increasing repair rates by a small amount. GÇóWe also want to make reactive and ferroscale plates more attractive by reducing the PG /CPU requirements so people will use them instead of basic armor plates when they want to maintain some speed.
Shields GÇóThe CPM and community has been vocal on not changing multiple ehp modules at a time. As such we will not be making any changes to shield tanking until the next hotfix. This also gives us a chance to examine new data from rebalanced armor modules.
HF Bravo
In Hotfix Bravo we took a closer look at Shield Tanking, and improved nearly all Shield Modules generously across the board. We wanted to make them true alternatives to Armor Modules and hope that we will see more Shield Tankers on the battlefield from now on.
HF Delta
We are buffing Logistics in a big way by changing the Nanite Injector to heal Shields as well. Now those prototype needles are sounding great, right?
Energizers, Rechargers and Regulators are all getting a CPU reduction, combined with Projectile damage profile, we believe this will make shield tanking considerably more viable.
Warlords 1.1.3
Shield Recharge Currently if you are running for cover and small arms fire keeps "plinking" away your health, you can't regenerate shields.
We will be adding a shield interruption threshold, much like vehicles have, to all Dropsuits. Damage less than that number will not interrupt shield recharge. This should be a big buff for shield users, and something that has been commonly requested in the past so I am happy to see it in-game.
Think we need to kill the shield depleted shield recharge delay penalty on Shield Extenders and give Regulators an additional benefit of increasing shield "plinking" damage threshold. I'm hesitant to give shields more buffer because I personally would like to see a distinction between the two tanking styles with Armor being more about buffer and shields being more about recharge, but to do that we need to emphasize the latter a bit more. I agree. Instead of Extenders having a depleted delay penalty, have them give a profile penalty. You know, just like EvE.
Scouts United
Gk.0s & Quafes all day.
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Aeon Amadi
Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback
12
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Posted - 2015.08.16 11:31:00 -
[17] - Quote
Louis Domi wrote:Back near uprising 1.4(?) I think Major buffs to armor were made, Nerfs to shields. Also there was a time when the AR was OP as hell(Tac AR in particular)
Again, what nerfs?
Aeon Amadi for CPM 2
Design A SKIN 2
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
12
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Posted - 2015.08.16 12:50:00 -
[18] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Poking around the patch notes ...
Uprising 1.4
* Adjusted Armor Plate attributes - HP bonus of 85/110/135 (Basic/Enhanced/Complex) and speed penalties of 2%/3%/5% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 93.5/121/148.5) * Adjusted Ferroscale Plate attributes - HP bonus of 35/50/75 (with full skill bonuses this equates to 38.5/55/82.5) * Adjusted Reactive Plate attributes - HP bonus of 25/40/60 and speed penalties of 0%/1%/1% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 27.5/44/66)
Uprising 1.7
* Added shield extender 3% penalty - stacking slows down the depleted shield recharge delay.
HF Alpha
Tanking Modules Armor GÇóWe want to reduce the stacking of plates by normalizing pg and cpu a little bit, and also increasing the speed penalty a bit. GÇóWe also want to make repair modules a little more useful so weGÇÿre increasing repair rates by a small amount. GÇóWe also want to make reactive and ferroscale plates more attractive by reducing the PG /CPU requirements so people will use them instead of basic armor plates when they want to maintain some speed.
Shields GÇóThe CPM and community has been vocal on not changing multiple ehp modules at a time. As such we will not be making any changes to shield tanking until the next hotfix. This also gives us a chance to examine new data from rebalanced armor modules.
HF Bravo
In Hotfix Bravo we took a closer look at Shield Tanking, and improved nearly all Shield Modules generously across the board. We wanted to make them true alternatives to Armor Modules and hope that we will see more Shield Tankers on the battlefield from now on.
HF Delta
We are buffing Logistics in a big way by changing the Nanite Injector to heal Shields as well. Now those prototype needles are sounding great, right?
Energizers, Rechargers and Regulators are all getting a CPU reduction, combined with Projectile damage profile, we believe this will make shield tanking considerably more viable.
Warlords 1.1.3
Shield Recharge Currently if you are running for cover and small arms fire keeps "plinking" away your health, you can't regenerate shields.
We will be adding a shield interruption threshold, much like vehicles have, to all Dropsuits. Damage less than that number will not interrupt shield recharge. This should be a big buff for shield users, and something that has been commonly requested in the past so I am happy to see it in-game.
Think we need to kill the shield depleted shield recharge delay penalty on Shield Extenders and give Regulators an additional benefit of increasing shield "plinking" damage threshold. I'm hesitant to give shields more buffer because I personally would like to see a distinction between the two tanking styles with Armor being more about buffer and shields being more about recharge, but to do that we need to emphasize the latter a bit more.
That might work. Only concerns are (1) the possibility of too many buffs at once and (2) the possibility of dual tanking outperforming all else. Another option could be to bring armor down a notch by repealing an earlier buff or perhaps increasing fitting requirements. Could also consider a very narrow nerf/buff combination, such as a slight increase to armor fitting req'ts and a sly hit decrease on shield fitting req'ts.
Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
12
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Posted - 2015.08.16 12:52:00 -
[19] - Quote
Joel II X wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Poking around the patch notes ...
Uprising 1.4
* Adjusted Armor Plate attributes - HP bonus of 85/110/135 (Basic/Enhanced/Complex) and speed penalties of 2%/3%/5% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 93.5/121/148.5) * Adjusted Ferroscale Plate attributes - HP bonus of 35/50/75 (with full skill bonuses this equates to 38.5/55/82.5) * Adjusted Reactive Plate attributes - HP bonus of 25/40/60 and speed penalties of 0%/1%/1% (with full skill bonuses this equates to 27.5/44/66)
Uprising 1.7
* Added shield extender 3% penalty - stacking slows down the depleted shield recharge delay.
HF Alpha
Tanking Modules Armor GÇóWe want to reduce the stacking of plates by normalizing pg and cpu a little bit, and also increasing the speed penalty a bit. GÇóWe also want to make repair modules a little more useful so weGÇÿre increasing repair rates by a small amount. GÇóWe also want to make reactive and ferroscale plates more attractive by reducing the PG /CPU requirements so people will use them instead of basic armor plates when they want to maintain some speed.
Shields GÇóThe CPM and community has been vocal on not changing multiple ehp modules at a time. As such we will not be making any changes to shield tanking until the next hotfix. This also gives us a chance to examine new data from rebalanced armor modules.
HF Bravo
In Hotfix Bravo we took a closer look at Shield Tanking, and improved nearly all Shield Modules generously across the board. We wanted to make them true alternatives to Armor Modules and hope that we will see more Shield Tankers on the battlefield from now on.
HF Delta
We are buffing Logistics in a big way by changing the Nanite Injector to heal Shields as well. Now those prototype needles are sounding great, right?
Energizers, Rechargers and Regulators are all getting a CPU reduction, combined with Projectile damage profile, we believe this will make shield tanking considerably more viable.
Warlords 1.1.3
Shield Recharge Currently if you are running for cover and small arms fire keeps "plinking" away your health, you can't regenerate shields.
We will be adding a shield interruption threshold, much like vehicles have, to all Dropsuits. Damage less than that number will not interrupt shield recharge. This should be a big buff for shield users, and something that has been commonly requested in the past so I am happy to see it in-game.
Think we need to kill the shield depleted shield recharge delay penalty on Shield Extenders and give Regulators an additional benefit of increasing shield "plinking" damage threshold. I'm hesitant to give shields more buffer because I personally would like to see a distinction between the two tanking styles with Armor being more about buffer and shields being more about recharge, but to do that we need to emphasize the latter a bit more. I agree. Instead of Extenders having a depleted delay penalty, have them give a profile penalty. You know, just like EvE.
Would create a new balance issues. The first that comes to my mind is how hard this would shaft the MinScout.
Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Michael-J-Fox Richards
Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation
423
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Posted - 2015.08.16 12:59:00 -
[20] - Quote
now this is a story all about how... yada yada dust got flip turned upside down etc etc... take a moment, sit right there
you get the idea
anime is for people who dont know what sex smells like
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