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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 31 post(s) |
Songs of Seraphim
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Posted - 2015.05.27 22:12:00 -
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True Adamance wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:I mean something to consider... The old slayer logis were problematic because they had so much HP from bonuses. It stands to reason that Rattati wanted to avoid this issue by buffing speed instead of HP in order to bring up survivability while avoiding huge buffer like we used to have.
While I agree with that statement it seems illogical to have logistics players advancing faster than your assault units. I don't see a need to differentiate their speeds. Asssault dropsuits are primarily aggression and weapons focused while logistics are support and equipment focused. Logi players shouldn't want to be outrunning their team mates, on the other hand, assaults should want to be in the enemy teams face all the time. Why not instead buff Logistics speed up to that of Assaults so that they get what they want however do not drag down another class to do it.
This.
I read through all the comments and suggestions before I began posting, but I thought of this idea halfway through.
It is better to have the medium suits in a linear fashion, whilst reducing the Minmatar Assault speed and buffing the speed of the Amarr Scout, Minmatar Logistics, and Amarr Logistics.
Assaults are in a good place at the moment, and shouldn't get nerfed, I believe. Rather, the Logistics class should be in line with the Assault class while the Commando's receive their movement and speed buffs -- while the Caldari Commando should get a Shield Regen/Depleted buff.
We want Logis to be mobile enough to move from place to place since they'll be reviving, repping, and supporting. Currently they're sluggish, but if they're matched with the movement and sprint speeds of the Assault, they should be in a viable place.
The whole concept of the second graph where the suits are brick tanked are null. There may be outliers where some people actually do it, but its seldom -- or I just personally don't see it -- as there are just better things to do than stacking plates or extenders. Assaults (mostly) refrain from using vanilla plates to keep their speed. Reactives and Ferroscale are the way to go these days on all suits but Sentinels.
In addition to keeping the Logistics and Assaults similar, with similar slot layouts, but differentiate between the roles: The Logi should have better eWar capabilities and better regen than the Assault counterpart. As well as a tad lower CPU/PG on the Logi but higher fitting capability on the suit itself. This way it would be an intermediate between Scout eWar and Assault offensive capabilities.
I may be missing something since I'm getting ready to play a gig today, so I might update it a bit when the ideas return.
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Songs of Seraphim
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Posted - 2015.05.28 06:14:00 -
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CCP Rattati wrote:Latest update is;
Medium (Logistics and Assault)
Speed changes as in OP
Sprint changes,
Logis from 1.4 to 1.3 modifier, means they have the same sprint speed as they do now
Assault from 1.4 to 1.5, means they retain current sprint
Balance stamina pool and stamina regen to cover similar ground over time, sprinting/walking vs constantly running, nerf Min Assault coverage.
Any shield regen is off the table for this round, must keep focus on mobility vs ehp.
8 H/L slots at all tiers
4 EQ (unless traded)
1 LW
1 G
0 Sidearm (unless traded)
= 14 slots
CPU for all factions
STD/ADV/PRO 170/260/385
PG for all factions
STD/ADV/PRO 30/45/67
Fitting bonus to EQ approx 10% per level
All EQ must be fitted at all tiers
Amarr retains sidearm for EQ slot
Still don't know what to do with CA sidearm or EQ
Commandos
Same speed as proposed in OP
1 additional slot at H/L = 8 total
Layout to align with sentinel (AM most lows, CA most highs)
same slots for all tiers
5% fitting bonus to LW to normalize PG/CPU against Sentinels
CPU for all factions
STD/ADV/PRO 140/200/285
PG for all factions
STD/ADV/PRO 26/37/51
I reiterate, lose the 4th low slot for a 4th equipment slot.
And make CPU/PG adjustments for the Caldari/Amarr respectively.
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Songs of Seraphim
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Posted - 2015.05.28 19:33:00 -
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el OPERATOR wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:
...
SlayerLogis aren't coming back like you think, never were.
Question about that set of figures that does finally appear on page 17, are those cpu/pg values proposed the final values? Pre-skills values? And 10% fitting on eq, that is also in addition to existing logi bonuses, correct? Are eq load costs going to be modified at all? Are those eq bonuses going to be flat or racially varied? I've kept up on the logistics/support thread and recognize much of this stemming from there so definitley see the progress but the last 20 pages is resteering us into overall wash territory at risk of nerfs.
Give CalLogi the sidearm. Buff the speeds, and most of the rest of the base stats. Don't swap for other existing, end of the day logis are still combat gimped relative to ALL other combat frames by virtue of (even after buffs) still significantly lower hp, no weapon bonuses and fitting limits. If theres an issue with Assault bonuses and their utility handle that like it is- a separate issue . End point is EVERY other frame has received a healthy round of buffing to keep pace with the last year and a half of meta-shifts except Logis. We got armor regen returned, sort of, but otherwise we're still living the penalties of an unrepeatable era. We need some small buffing tweaks and thats it. Small. But we need buffing.
Except actual Caldari Logistics would PREFER a FOURTH EQUIPMENT slot rather than the 4th low slot or sidearm.
I have my Caldari Assault for the damn sidearm. -.-
Again, I'm all for the buffing of Commando and Logistic roles, but not at the expense of the Assault role.
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Songs of Seraphim
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Posted - 2015.05.28 20:04:00 -
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el OPERATOR wrote:Songs of Seraphim wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:
...
SlayerLogis aren't coming back like you think, never were.
Question about that set of figures that does finally appear on page 17, are those cpu/pg values proposed the final values? Pre-skills values? And 10% fitting on eq, that is also in addition to existing logi bonuses, correct? Are eq load costs going to be modified at all? Are those eq bonuses going to be flat or racially varied? I've kept up on the logistics/support thread and recognize much of this stemming from there so definitley see the progress but the last 20 pages is resteering us into overall wash territory at risk of nerfs.
Give CalLogi the sidearm. Buff the speeds, and most of the rest of the base stats. Don't swap for other existing, end of the day logis are still combat gimped relative to ALL other combat frames by virtue of (even after buffs) still significantly lower hp, no weapon bonuses and fitting limits. If theres an issue with Assault bonuses and their utility handle that like it is- a separate issue . End point is EVERY other frame has received a healthy round of buffing to keep pace with the last year and a half of meta-shifts except Logis. We got armor regen returned, sort of, but otherwise we're still living the penalties of an unrepeatable era. We need some small buffing tweaks and thats it. Small. But we need buffing.
Except actual Caldari Logistics would PREFER a FOURTH EQUIPMENT slot rather than the 4th low slot or sidearm.
I have my Caldari Assault for the damn sidearm. -.- Again, I'm all for the buffing of Commando and Logistic roles, but not at the expense of the Assault role. Thanks, I run CalLogi every day, have for a loong time now. NEXT IN LINE!!!
Then you should see the need for that additional equipment slot, rather than a sidearm (which would most likely be a Bolt Pistol at that).
Unless you're pushing your own agenda.
And here I believed you'd be a tad more constructive. Oh well.
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Songs of Seraphim
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Posted - 2015.05.28 20:30:00 -
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el OPERATOR wrote:
Nope, the bolt pistol and I aren't friends.
Sidearm> extra hives or unbonused eq. for the Cal.
Want my agenda? Go read the 80-90 page Logistics/Support thread.
Sidearm isn't as beneficial to a support role than Uplinks or Scanners.
Even without a bonus to the equipment, it's beneficial to have as a support role.
Not even the Gallente Logi uses more than 2 of its own EQ.
And I have been keeping up with Cross' thread up until page 74 or so.
Please, please keep it constructive because I'm all but losing respect for you I gained in that thread.
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Songs of Seraphim
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Posted - 2015.05.28 21:05:00 -
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el OPERATOR wrote:Songs of Seraphim wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:
Nope, the bolt pistol and I aren't friends.
Sidearm> extra hives or unbonused eq. for the Cal.
Want my agenda? Go read the 80-90 page Logistics/Support thread.
Sidearm isn't as beneficial to a support role than Uplinks or Scanners. Even without a bonus to the equipment, it's beneficial to have as a support role. Not even the Gallente Logi uses more than 2 of its own EQ. And I have been keeping up with Cross' thread up until page 74 or so. Please, please keep it constructive because I'm all but losing respect for you I gained in that thread. Constructive for whom, exactly? The ******* crying about hypotheticals that won't materalise? Or the ******* who insist Logis only play one way? Or the ******* crafting spreadsheets and graphs that undo the 74 pages you did read and the other 20 behind them so that, if for no other reason, they can sneak in their own new buffs along the way. The balance is done. After page 17 in here, when the rest of the idea was put forward, the critisism and undermining should have STOPPED. But instead theres just page after page of theorycrapted garbage. I'm in the support thread being constructive. I'm in here passing out all the STFU I can serve. NewsFlash: I run GalLogi every day too and guess what? Its entire slotset is scanners. Thatd be more than 2.
And now you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.
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