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Could the AR's Poor Performance just be due to the Iron Sights?

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Juno Tristan Obscure Reference 602	Posted - 2015.05.11 09:36:00 - [1] - Quote and more importantly, is Rattati willing to change it? ADS Ramming Revenge! Plasma Cannon Rampage
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8597	Posted - 2015.05.11 09:48:00 - [2] - Quote Juno Tristan wrote: and more importantly, is Rattati willing to change it? Iron sights aren't the problem or the ACR and ARR as well as the asscram (wait I forgot, I never paid attention to which sight the asscram uses) would be crappy too. IMHO the ARR has the worst itiron sights in the game. The problem with the assault rifle boils down to the fact that it has the worst range, and no longer benefits from being the most destructive as it's consolation prize. Honestly I am of the opinion that the rifles need to be normalozed (to a point) with a strict range-to-damage ratio. There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
abdullah muzaffar Random Gunz Rise Of Legion. 582	Posted - 2015.05.11 09:57:00 - [3] - Quote ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. IJR took my soul. RIP 20/3/15 5:14
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8597	Posted - 2015.05.11 09:59:00 - [4] - Quote abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
abdullah muzaffar Random Gunz Rise Of Legion. 582	Posted - 2015.05.11 10:14:00 - [5] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. Yeah, but you do come across a lot of heavies in cqc, which is why clipsize can be increased without making it op. I mean, AR is mostly what i use, after i gave up on crs with their poor performance in laggy situations. IJR took my soul. RIP 20/3/15 5:14
Sleepy Shadow Qualified Scrub 358	Posted - 2015.05.11 10:41:00 - [6] - Quote I donGÇÖt have issues with the sights on the AR; I have issue with it being outperformed by other rifles in CQC. =ƒÿ¦
Melchiah ARANeAE The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 598	Posted - 2015.05.11 11:06:00 - [7] - Quote It's not the iron sights as when it's hip fired (even on a Gal ass with max sharpshooter skill) it's outperformed by any other rifle on any other suit. It just needs a straight DPS increase . We want cake and tea.
Fluffy Exterminatus Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 26	Posted - 2015.05.11 11:53:00 - [8] - Quote use tac or burst ARs. the scr is crap at the range it is supposed to go out to cause its scoop has ****** zoom (2X maybe) while RR TAC AR and CR have better scopes so are better at range despite less dps. Blood flows. Death comes. War rages (Verified/Certified and Insured by Djinn Kujo and KingThunderBlueballs)
Cat Merc Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 16572	Posted - 2015.05.11 12:38:00 - [9] - Quote AR vs ARR, 60m. Who wins? ARR will win 100% of the time, because at that range AR deals pathetic damage, while ARR still deals near 100% damage. In 5m-10m, who wins? It's up to player skill. The advantage that Duvolle provides over an Ishukone is marginal, and will rarely decide the outcome of a battle. See where the problem is? If you want the AR to be competitive, it should absolutely dominate all other rifles in CQC, like all other rifles absolutely dominate it at other ranges. "Breakin, PS3's and PS4's can't mate. They're incompatible. Unlike Apache's and Cappuccino machines." - *Cat wisdom*
Cat Merc Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 16572	Posted - 2015.05.11 12:39:00 - [10] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. Umm, stop playing against scrubs maybe? Good luck landing all of the shots when your enemy is a Minmatar Assault high on mountain dew. "Breakin, PS3's and PS4's can't mate. They're incompatible. Unlike Apache's and Cappuccino machines." - *Cat wisdom*

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8605	Posted - 2015.05.11 12:47:00 - [11] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. Umm, stop playing against scrubs maybe? Good luck landing all of the shots when your enemy is a Minmatar Assault high on mountain dew. HEY just because you're bitter about the fact I schooled you in my quafe minassault suit... There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
PLAYSTTION Corrosive Synergy Rise Of Legion. 1370	Posted - 2015.05.11 12:48:00 - [12] - Quote It is just outmatched. clip size is fine but very other gun has been improved while leaving it in the dust. The CR is VERY powerful against everything at all ranges but very long. The RR is fine but still more powerful than AR and the Scrambler, well you already know. Gassault Galogi Galsent `Open Beta Vet - 43 mil sp Director of Corrosive Synergy`
Cat Merc Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 16573	Posted - 2015.05.11 13:12:00 - [13] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. Umm, stop playing against scrubs maybe? Good luck landing all of the shots when your enemy is a Minmatar Assault high on mountain dew. HEY just because you're bitter about the fact I schooled you in my quafe minassault suit... I don't think cheating by firing 3 seconds before you were supposed to, and still ending up with like 10 armor left, counts as schooling :P "Breakin, PS3's and PS4's can't mate. They're incompatible. Unlike Apache's and Cappuccino machines." - *Cat wisdom*
Mahal Daj Mahal Tactical Enterprises 154	Posted - 2015.05.11 13:21:00 - [14] - Quote perhaps, in the vein of the scrambler rifle's two modes (semi-auto, and charge); the assault (plasma) rifle could have two modes: 1) Normal AR: Low Damage, High ROF = The close-in brawler we all know and love 2) Plasma AR: High Damage, Low ROF = tweaks to increase damage, but slow projectile speed to make it an orb-thrower NOTE: This would not affect the variants of the AR: Breach, Burst, Tactical NOTE: This would function as a fire-mode like: sinlge-shot, 3-round burst, full-auto Alternatively, you could slightly increase (+35%?) the headshot multiplier so that it can be more effective at range against stationary targets, while only adding a marginal advantage in CQC. See my Post on Crashes: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2413361#post2413361
thor424 Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 168	Posted - 2015.05.11 13:26:00 - [15] - Quote As long as I'm within range I feel like I can win unless it's a really tanked out armor suit. I have so many fights where the dude escapes after I empty my clip with a smidge of armor left on the enemy. Depending on his position I can finish of with a sidearm, but switching back to AR and reloading really hurts your chances with the next enemy. If I'm in a really good position with some nanohives I can keep people from rushing too hard with locus nades, but often times I'm catching fire from multiple directions from guys that are out of my range. It seems like I'm very good when my team is controlling the high ground and I'm not dealing with range weapons. Thor's Emporium
Mahal Daj Mahal Tactical Enterprises 154	Posted - 2015.05.11 13:29:00 - [16] - Quote Juno Tristan wrote: and more importantly, is Rattati willing to change it? He changed the Small Blaster Turret See my Post on Crashes: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2413361#post2413361
Mejt0 Dead Man's Game RUST415 1366	Posted - 2015.05.11 14:10:00 - [17] - Quote Reason why AR is useless is very simple. Every rifle has the same/almost the same DPS. But its range is terrible. The worst out of every other rifle. Caldari Loyalist thecreaturehub fan
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8608	Posted - 2015.05.11 14:12:00 - [18] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. Umm, stop playing against scrubs maybe? Good luck landing all of the shots when your enemy is a Minmatar Assault high on mountain dew. HEY just because you're bitter about the fact I schooled you in my quafe minassault suit... I don't think cheating by firing 3 seconds before you were supposed to, and still ending up with like 10 armor left, counts as schooling :P Gotta compensate for lag SOMEHOW... There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 10646	Posted - 2015.05.11 14:15:00 - [19] - Quote I like how its pretty obvious what the problem is and we suggested a normalzation of range for items in the same variant a LONG time ago. It's like asking what 2 x 2 is and not knowing while at the same time having a calculator in your face with your phone in your pocket. Sgt Kirk's Gallente Propaganda Youtube Channel
Admiral AJ Chadwick Chemical Renegades Inc. New Eden's Heros 7	Posted - 2015.05.11 14:20:00 - [20] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. I agree, I'm Maxxed in AR's and I've no Problem, not even with the Milita, I can run down Heavys pretty damn quickly too. with my Ar, (when I'm not dead ofcourse xD) I can normally get 2-3 kills a clip (if they're Scout / assault) and 1 Heavy kill. it's pretty damn easy, people just have no Idea how to use the AR I mean, i run a Caldari Assault (Built like a tank) and Sacrificing the Bonuses for RR's I use an AR, and in Ambush, I can normally run 20+ kills with between 0-4 deaths. I really don't see what people see wrong with it? if I had a Range Improvement, I'd slaughter more.. and Alot of people wouldn't like that... *CHEMICAL RENEGADES INC. : CEO* *NEW EDEN'S HEROES' : FOUNDING MEMBER*

VALCORE72 Vengeance Unbound RUST415 303	Posted - 2015.05.11 15:41:00 - [21] - Quote aim assist is better on the combat rifle , scrambler and the rails. maybe up it a point or 2
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8620	Posted - 2015.05.11 15:47:00 - [22] - Quote VALCORE72 wrote: aim assist is better on the combat rifle , scrambler and the rails. maybe up it a point or 2 This doesn't solve the problem. There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
Jaran Vilktar CORP SIX KING 205	Posted - 2015.05.11 15:53:00 - [23] - Quote Out of all the weapons in this game, the AR is the weapon I've been using for the longest amount of time and I've never even once thought that the Iron Sights were the cause for the weapon to be UP. Rather, it's a good thing that it has Iron Sights, the AR doesn't have enough range compared to other weapons to make effective use of a scope IMO. The real problem is that, as others have said, it gets outperformed by just about every other rifle in the game at CQC which is where it's supposed to excel at and since it's a shield based weapon trying to compete with the current armor meta it's always going to feel sluggish when it starts hitting armor. The AR isn't really meant for long range like other rifles so it's normal that it gets beaten at range, it's the fact that it loses at cqc that makes it UP. I can't believe I did it. 514 Logins
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 9594	Posted - 2015.05.11 17:12:00 - [24] - Quote Jaran Vilktar wrote: ... I've never even once thought that the Iron Sights were the cause for the weapon to be UP. Rather, it's a good thing that it has Iron Sights, the AR doesn't have enough range compared to other weapons to make effective use of a scope IMO. The real problem is that, as others have said, it gets outperformed by just about every other rifle in the game at CQC which is where it's supposed to excel at and since it's a shield based weapon trying to compete with the current armor meta it's always going to feel sluggish when it starts hitting armor. The AR isn't really meant for long range like other rifles so it's normal that it gets beaten at range, it's the fact that it loses at cqc that makes it UP. Agreed on all points. How to fix (my two cents): * Increase the effectiveness of AR in CQC * Decrease the effectiveness of other rifles in CQC * Decrease the effectiveness of Armor ^ and/or Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2747	Posted - 2015.05.11 17:17:00 - [25] - Quote In this case the simplest, logical, most immersive and lore-based solutions all come to the same conclusion: increase short-range damage. PSN: RationalSpark
Reign Omega T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K 1503	Posted - 2015.05.11 17:22:00 - [26] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: ^Agree. RR sacrifices too liitle dps for what is essentially double the range, while the scr somehow excels in everything except clipsize. CR is reaally good against armor, useless against amsents and shield tanks. AR iron sight is fine Just needs mooooaaaar clipsize and a tiny buff to range. I have to disagree. If you can't kill 2-3 buttheads with a 72 round assault rifle the problem isn't magazine, it's you. Came in here with a constructive post about the AR. Sees buttheads. Giggles. Leaves. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
Mejt0 Dead Man's Game RUST415 1372	Posted - 2015.05.11 17:32:00 - [27] - Quote There's a better way to improve AR. Don't just buff its base dmg. Too simple and would get dmg across its whole range. Rather than that, AR should get bonus damage when shooting an enemy within x meters. Like if within 0-25m (just an example) you would have higher efficiency (for example, 10-15% buffer). Caldari Loyalist thecreaturehub fan
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 9594	Posted - 2015.05.11 17:49:00 - [28] - Quote Mejt0 wrote: There's a better way to improve AR. Don't just buff its base dmg. Too simple and would get dmg across its whole range. Rather than that, AR should get bonus damage when shooting an enemy within x meters. Like if within 0-25m (just an example) you would have higher efficiency (for example, 10-15% buffer). Could also increase RoF then offset damage-at-range by tuning ADS handling. Sidenote: Does anyone know why the GEK is outselling all else at the moment? http://dust.thang.dk/market_tryhardinator.php Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Scheneighnay McBob And the ButtPirates 6542	Posted - 2015.05.11 18:07:00 - [29] - Quote Assault and laser rifles used to have realistic futuristicy camera-sights, but now only the HMG has it. Funny, since that puts the minmatar ahead of the gallente and amarr for technology. Some details can be ignored
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8636	Posted - 2015.05.11 18:09:00 - [30] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Mejt0 wrote: There's a better way to improve AR. Don't just buff its base dmg. Too simple and would get dmg across its whole range. Rather than that, AR should get bonus damage when shooting an enemy within x meters. Like if within 0-25m (just an example) you would have higher efficiency (for example, 10-15% buffer). Could also increase RoF then offset damage-at-range by tuning ADS handling. Sidenote: Does anyone know why the GEK is outselling all else at the moment? http://dust.thang.dk/market_tryhardinator.php I personally think we could kill two birds with one stone and normalize rifles. this would eliminate the shield imbalance and settle the plasma rifle at the same time. Bluntly there's too much variation and inconsistency between the weapon variants and their respective racial variants for a major balance to do anything other than make a featured FOTM every time balance gets touched. Right now the Scrambler was buffed to compete in a primarily armor meta. because this was not accompanied by a buff to shields it created greater problems. We really need to get a handle on this stuff. There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!



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