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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Thokk Nightshade
Montana Militia
808
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Posted - 2015.04.30 00:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
MINA Longstrike wrote:As a callogi. Yes, would love 4th equipment (and more bandwidth???).
Agree 100%. However, as you said, Bandwidth would have to come up. Right now, the only thing that can legitimately go into the 4th low is for bandwidth because, without, even at proto you can't put better than mostly standard and advanced mods. Get rid of that ridiculous 4th low, give us our 4th equipment (even if it is just at proto), and enough bandwidth to actually put some proto stuff on it.
Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
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Thokk Nightshade
Montana Militia
810
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Posted - 2015.04.30 22:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
I-Shayz-I wrote:Thokk Nightshade wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:As a callogi. Yes, would love 4th equipment (and more bandwidth???).
Agree 100%. However, as you said, Bandwidth would have to come up. Right now, the only thing that can legitimately go into the 4th low is for bandwidth because, without, even at proto you can't put better than mostly standard and advanced mods. Get rid of that ridiculous 4th low, give us our 4th equipment (even if it is just at proto), and enough bandwidth to actually put some proto stuff on it. If we went the equipment route, Caldari Logi would also have 3 equipment at standard. not to mention the 4th high slot at advanced, and a third high slot at standard. Thus making it similar to the minmatar and Gillette equipment progression.
I would be totally OK with this. I run strictly Adv. right now anyways (due to the aforementioned horrible CPU on the proto suit and lack of 4th equip slot to incentivize) and the 3 equipment slots seem fine. Bumping the Standard to 3 equipment may be a bit excessive for a Std. suit but I understand the reason behind it. The extra High slots are fine because I can pack on more shields for survivability.
I just feel at Proto it should have the same equipment slots as the other Logis who don't have a sidearm. A 4th equipment slot would allow me to carry Nanite injectors and rep tools along with uplinks and hives. I can literally be a full blown support movement. As it stands right now I have to give up 1 of the 4 at proto and trying to decide which to leave off is agrevating.
On a different note, I agree with you that the sidearm is equal to an equipment slot. Let the Amarr keep the side arm in lieu of the extra equip slot and everything balances out.
Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
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Thokk Nightshade
Montana Militia
810
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Posted - 2015.05.01 00:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
el OPERATOR wrote:
At the end of the day the slots are fine, some simple buffing across the board and the Cal getting a sidearm has the job done.
The problem is most (at least the ones I have talked to, not complete by any means) don't WANT a sidearm. We want bandwidth and a 4th equipment slot at Proto. There are some outliers I know, but for the most part we all would prefer a 4th equipment slot over a sidearm.
Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
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Thokk Nightshade
Montana Militia
810
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Posted - 2015.05.01 00:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
el OPERATOR wrote:Thokk Nightshade wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:
At the end of the day the slots are fine, some simple buffing across the board and the Cal getting a sidearm has the job done.
The problem is most (at least the ones I have talked to, not complete by any means) don't WANT a sidearm. We want bandwidth and a 4th equipment slot at Proto. There are some outliers I know, but for the most part we all would prefer a 4th equipment slot over a sidearm. I'd bet everybody wants more bandwidth, us the most. The sidearm vs. eq slots seems 50/50 from my very non-scientific survey. Based on the bonusing as well as the **** we get for our Amarr sidearm going the sidearm route opens some of the utility as well as balances (sorry Shay, he asked) the class a bit overall, taking some of the wth out when ppl who don't understand combat logistics look at it.
Yeah, the opinions are varied. Maybe it is just the group I talk to vs. you. Either way, you are bringing up valid points. I can normally at least go a 1.0 KDR with my Cal Logi (without putting damage mods in the highs) and back before I knew what I was doing I would deck out damage mods in the highs and rock out so I get the concept of combat logistics. I just know my preference would be more of a full support role so I can do all 4 things really necessary of a Logi. Let people come into the fight, resupply their ammo, bring them back to life, and heal them back up to keep fighting. At a proto level, since the Min and Gal both have 4 equip ( correct? I have never ran either), I would like to have that option as well and let the Amarr keep their niche as the only logi w/ a sidearm.
The balance issue is valid, I will give you that.
Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
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Thokk Nightshade
Montana Militia
819
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Posted - 2015.05.01 22:25:00 -
[5] - Quote
hold that wrote:when they fix the amount carried to the proto hives cal logis will be able to carry 6 to 8 proto rep and ammo hives. they do not need another equipment slot. i'm starting to think the people who are complaining are only those maxed in one logi, that feel they should be able to do the job of all four logis in one.
Since when is Proto the basis for balancing? Gal an Min Logi can do the exact same thing I am suggesting. But, because at proto a Cal Logi gets more hives, we are asking for too much? If I was a Gal or Min logi, I would be doing the exact thing I am suggesting for Cal. Uplink, Nanohive, Needle, Rep tool. The 4 cornerstones of the logi. Why, at proto, should I need different suits and loadouts to accomplish that.? The reason I never use my proto logi is because I don't have the 4th slot (and the bandwidth gimp is ridiculous on it).
One of two things needs to happen, and I don't see any other way around it. We either need a 4th equipment slot (my personal preference) or a sidearm (not what I want to see but it is something). The only suit without one of the two at Proto is a ripoff, and number of Nanohives carried is not a viable reason.
Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
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Thokk Nightshade
Montana Militia
819
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Posted - 2015.05.01 23:22:00 -
[6] - Quote
RedBleach LeSanglant wrote:hold that wrote:RedBleach LeSanglant wrote:If we go side arm route (amarr and Cal) make sure they have 3EQ at STD. I know its off, but 2 eq is not a logi, it is a gimped scout. how is it a gimp scout? if you are proto in your respective suits and running the items you get bonuses for. I will try to explain as best I can. At the STD level the Amarr logi and the STD scout slot counts are the same. Same 2H/2L/2 EQ and a sidearm. The specialty of a logi is the equipment it can bring into play to benefit other team members. But when another class has just as much equipment slots, is faster, better regeneration, etc. we get into role bleed where ultimately the STD scout, or Logi Light, excels more than the logi itself. Meaning it is tactically better to run a scout more than the Amarr logi (bonuses included) at the STD level. Until the Logi reaches the 3EQ threshold there are simply better logis that aren't even in the same class. And my emphasis is that IFF the community must choose that both the CAL and AMARR logis have sidearms there must also be an exception in slot counts to allow each logi to begin with 3 EQ. Less than that and it is not a logi. This would make the suits outliers from the norm, again. Though I don't know how the community will proceed, nor how the CPM and Rattati will work the solution, but the lines between classes must be clear and adding a 2nd EQ slot to the scout class (ancient history - not debating the merits or suggesting changes to the class) it also negated the logi suits that just have 2 EQ to start out with. What was once their defining characteristic - more than 1 EQ slot since the dawn of Dust - was nullified. Seeking to define the roles of the logistics class again is that they are the only class that can bring in more equipment than any other class. And right now that is not true. Such changes must be reviewed and debated. My position is that I Prefer the logi with the sidearm, and I COULD live without it. But whatever is done Slot progression must be equalized and the STD logi must have 3 EQ. OR there is no reason to run a STD logi. The ADV tier and Proto tier are then the only choices for certain races if that is not done. Each tier should remain true to the class and true to the balance of the game - limiting role bleed, defining classes, and reflecting each races strengths and weaknesses as much as possible in the current iteration of this EVE fps.
I was completely OK with the 2 EQ at standard for Logis until I read this. Very comprehensive and thought out. Personally, I only run Adv. because of the 3rd EQ slot. When you mention the fact that Scouts can have the same amount of equipment, with bonuses, it completely eliminates the Logi. It makes the Standard suit invalid and nothing more than an SP dump until you reach Advanced, where it gains it's advantage.
Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
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