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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
I-Shayz-I
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5442
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Posted - 2015.04.29 10:09:00 -
[1] - Quote
Since previous attempts at trying to improve logistics have FAILED MISERABLY because our community can't agree on anything, we shall try once more with logic, reasoning, and some freaking common sense.
Before you reply, note that this thread is NOT about fitting bonuses, logistics balance, equipment balance, debates over sidearms, shield repair tools, movement speed, dropsuit colors, officer dropsuits, what you ate for dinner last night, etc.
Here's the proposal:
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Step 1
All racial suits will have the same number of slots at each tier. Slots can be either High, Low, Equipment, or Sidearm
STD: 7 slots
ADV: 9 slots
PRO: 12 slots
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Step 2
Racial slot layouts for High/Low slots will follow the Assaults EXACTLY. NO EXCEPTIONS
Caldari: 3/1 | 4/2 | 5/3
Minmatar: 2/2 | 3/3 | 4/4
Gallente: 1/3 | 2/4 | 3/5
Amarr: 1/3 | 2/4 | 3/5
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Step 3
Fitting space will be slightly skewed up and down for each race according to the same rough percentage increases/decreases that Assaults have
The current base CPU/PG for Logistics are:
STD - 195/39
ADV - 273/55
PRO - 390/78
Guideline:
Caldari: Highest CPU, Lowest PG
Minmatar: Higher CPU, Lower PG
Gallente: Lower CPU, Higher PG
Amarr: Lowest CPU, Highest PG
Calculated numbers:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByYUjq_P9RY0LVZlYndVbFVSSlE/view?usp=sharing
(note, these are not final, but are a very very good idea of what logistics fitting space should look like for each race)
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Step 4
This is the hardest part. We, as a community, need to agree on two things:
1. Amarr logi gets a sidearm at each tier, but sacrifices one equipment slot at each tier to maintain the same number of total slots
2. What to do about the 4th low slot of the Caldari Logi, since we are sticking to the Assault layouts with NO EXCEPTIONS
Number 2 is very simple. Here are your options:
-Caldari Logi gets a 4th equipment, just like the Minmatar and Gallente suits
-Caldari Logi gets a sidearm at each tier in place of one equipment slot, just like the Amarr suit
There is no other option for number 1. Please do not suggest other options in this thread. Either you agree or you disagree. This is mainly to ensure that the Amarr has something unique to offer compared to the Gallente (since both have the same slot layouts)
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This is my ideal course of action.
The current progression is **** and we all know it. My idea isn't completely perfect, it's not going to make every last one of you happy and I understand that.
But can we please, PLEASE, agree that the current slot layouts, fitting numbers, and overall progression is the absolute worst for logistics? At least give it a chance and don't sidetrack this again.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5446
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Posted - 2015.04.29 11:45:00 -
[2] - Quote
Rattati said specifically that the next thing after fixing the problems with hotfix echo was to swap the logi and assault speeds, then possibly look at progression.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5459
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Posted - 2015.04.30 01:07:00 -
[3] - Quote
Thokk Nightshade wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:As a callogi. Yes, would love 4th equipment (and more bandwidth???).
Agree 100%. However, as you said, Bandwidth would have to come up. Right now, the only thing that can legitimately go into the 4th low is for bandwidth because, without, even at proto you can't put better than mostly standard and advanced mods. Get rid of that ridiculous 4th low, give us our 4th equipment (even if it is just at proto), and enough bandwidth to actually put some proto stuff on it.
If we went the equipment route, Caldari Logi would also have 3 equipment at standard.
not to mention the 4th high slot at advanced, and a third high slot at standard.
Thus making it similar to the minmatar and Gillette equipment progression.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5459
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Posted - 2015.04.30 01:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
Nocturnal Soul wrote:I'd rather have an 4th equipment on the Amarr logi instead of the 5th low slot but this is better than what we currently have.
Thank you for understanding ^^
While I wouldn't mind having a variation of the suit like that, you have to make sure that Amarr always has the most amount of low slots on their suit.
5 low slots is mandatory, but I can see a debate for a 2/5/4 layout instead of 3/5/3
Although, I still think there needs to be an uniqueness factor between the Gallente and Amarr, which is my main reason for keeping the 3 equipment.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5461
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Posted - 2015.04.30 01:45:00 -
[5] - Quote
RedBleach LeSanglant wrote:If we go side arm route (amarr and Cal) make sure they have 3EQ at STD. I know its off, but 2 eq is not a logi, it is a gimped scout.
This is a valid point, but the only way I can maintain 3 equipment at both std and adv is to remove a high Slot from the Amarr At each tier...which I really don't want to do.
I am personally more in favor of giving the Caldari Logi 3 equipment slots at std and adv, rather than a sidearm, as this would be a third logi that has a large amount of equipment slots.
Like I said, think of the sidearm slot as an equipment. You support players not with standard equipment, but with extra firepower.
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As for the other players who have mentioned not wanting to use assault progression..what do you think about the current slot layouts of Minmatar and Gallente at proto? They have the same layouts as the assaults, so why shouldn't the progression from std and adv also be moved over? Heck, the minmatar one that everyone loves has the exact same progression as the assault and no one is complaining about that.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5469
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Posted - 2015.04.30 19:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
Please don't turn this thread into a debate about logi hp.
Like he said, that's a completely irrelevant discussion.
COMMON SENSE AND LOGIC would determine that swapping the movement speeds makes the low hp base fine as is.
I do think that base stamina should be reduced to make logistics have quick bursts of movement speed to get into/out of a situation quickly, rather than letting them run around at top speed all the time...another way to balance the change, and make cardiac regulators a relevant low slot choice.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5586
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Posted - 2015.05.12 14:39:00 -
[7] - Quote
Bump
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I-Shayz-I
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5
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Posted - 2015.05.27 21:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Bump again because CCP Rattati made a logistics progression thread.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5
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Posted - 2015.05.31 05:37:00 -
[9] - Quote
HOLY PERFECTION wrote:Why is minmitar pg 3 lower than it is now. ??
Because the CPU is increased?
I based these numbers on how the Assaults are, with Cal and Min having more CPU, and Gal and Amarr having more PG
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5
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Posted - 2015.05.31 21:10:00 -
[10] - Quote
HOLY PERFECTION wrote:I-Shayz-I wrote:HOLY PERFECTION wrote:Why is minmitar pg 3 lower than it is now. ??
Because the CPU is increased? I based these numbers on how the Assaults are, with Cal and Min having more CPU, and Gal and Amarr having more PG yes, but im a MK.0 core 5 level 5 and still BARELY make it. i have no pg left to spare. So why take away so much. Its not an assault its a logi, just adjust speeds and boom fixed. Mabye a bit beefier because its suppose to be a medium suit. No but an assault gets 1200 ehp, i get 600 ehp. Son of a *****
Okay in math terms...
I took the base Proto numbers of logistics (390 CPU, 78 PG), and went 1 standard deviation out from them in each direction to get Minmatar and Gellente values. Two standard deviations is the Caldari and Amarr numbers.
The assaults have less total fitting space, but each race has a small amount more/less CPU/PG. I just translated that to the logistics to make each suit more racially diverse...just as pretty much every other suit in the game already is.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5
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Posted - 2015.06.06 11:55:00 -
[11] - Quote
Songs of Seraphim wrote:
I'm all for the Min Logi having slightly more CPU with slightly less PG, but not far from the "standard".
This is my proposal exactly.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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I-Shayz-I
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5
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Posted - 2015.06.06 18:55:00 -
[12] - Quote
Blueprint For Murder wrote:Seems like a waste of time and resources idk why you guys get in such an uproar over progression of a suit considering once your suit is maxed it no longer matters?
Are you just trying to min max logi at a low sp progression?
Whats the point?
Uh
The fact that Gallente has a 0/2 slot layout at standard is absolute bullshit.
No one should be forced to run minmatar just because their own preferred race has a ****** slot progression. Unless you're a vet like me you are stuck in that standard suit until you get enough sp to unlock advanced...which both have one less slot than minmatar.
On top of that, Caldari desperately needs to be tweaked with some more CPU. Then you might as well account for all races and nudge fitting space around a bit to form more racial diversity.
7162 wp with a Repair Tool!
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