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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
52
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Posted - 2015.04.29 00:10:00 -
[1] - Quote
Mark my words.
This will change Dust for the better more than any single thing we've seen since Uprising 1.0.
I f'n love you Rattati. No h0mo.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
53
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Posted - 2015.04.29 00:22:00 -
[2] - Quote
You guys work out the numbers, I'll be rubbing one out in the corner.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
54
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Posted - 2015.04.29 01:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Drogan Reeth wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:Varoth Drac wrote:What's wrong with sharing ISK based on warpoints rather than kills? Otherwise it's unfair on people who contribute without focus on killing. Isn't that the whole point of the warpoint system?
Otherwise I like the idea. Especially getting back a portion of loss if you win. It seems refunding loss is a much better idea overall, and I agree contribution should be measured in WP. However, it is a shooty killy gamed, and someone who destroys proto suits and tanks, still only gets 50WP. That reminds me of the good idea of boosted WP if using a weaker suit, that would serve a similar purpose. I think the main point has been nailed a few times in this topic. It's the losing side that needs more incentives to keep playing after they are already losing. NOT the winning side. As such you need to add things to reward the losers for trying. Not the winners for winning more.
Proper incentives drive behavior.
Perhaps this will drive people to squad up and put up with the extra 14 seconds between battles waiting for the squad leader to deploy. Hmmm, should I squad up and go balls out for the win or continue to roll solo and stay poor? ---Note, plenty of players will still be able to piggyback wins.
If you want to be rewarded for losing go play PC, lol.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
54
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Posted - 2015.04.29 01:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Drogan Reeth wrote:thor424 wrote:Drogan Reeth wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:Varoth Drac wrote:What's wrong with sharing ISK based on warpoints rather than kills? Otherwise it's unfair on people who contribute without focus on killing. Isn't that the whole point of the warpoint system?
Otherwise I like the idea. Especially getting back a portion of loss if you win. It seems refunding loss is a much better idea overall, and I agree contribution should be measured in WP. However, it is a shooty killy gamed, and someone who destroys proto suits and tanks, still only gets 50WP. That reminds me of the good idea of boosted WP if using a weaker suit, that would serve a similar purpose. I think the main point has been nailed a few times in this topic. It's the losing side that needs more incentives to keep playing after they are already losing. NOT the winning side. As such you need to add things to reward the losers for trying. Not the winners for winning more. Proper incentives drive behavior. Perhaps this will drive people to squad up and put up with the extra 14 seconds between battles waiting for the squad leader to deploy. Hmmm, should I squad up and go balls out for the win or continue to roll solo and stay poor? ---Note, plenty of players will still be able to piggyback wins. If you want to be rewarded for losing go play PC, lol. Do you not see that people stop trying after their team is losing even by as much as 5 clone kills? But sure go ahead and implement some changes that go against human nature and see what it does. If you don't reward trying when lossing, then everyone will stop trying when they are losing, because they know they don't get the rewards anyways. So why risk the extra isk loss? Unless you can answer that nothing will change.
I do get your point, I'm just excited. Then use the same payout formula but add a bonus for winning.
In the veteran bracket many people never start fighting if they see names that mean they'll have to try or they leave battle.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
54
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Posted - 2015.04.29 01:18:00 -
[5] - Quote
^doesnt play Dust
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
54
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Posted - 2015.04.29 02:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
Drogan Reeth wrote:thor424 wrote:
I do get your point, I'm just excited. Then use the same payout formula but add a bonus for winning.
In the veteran bracket many people never start fighting if they see names that mean they'll have to try or they leave battle.
Ya, I am too, and i'll gladly take the extra payout for winning, however it won't have any impact on trying to make the losing side try harder. Which is the point of the proposed change. I'll still run my apex suits when our team has no chance to win, and risk nothing. Why would that change from what's been proposed?
There's nothing that'll change the behavior of people like you. But most humans have competitive nature and realize they turned on a video game.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
56
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Posted - 2015.04.29 17:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Drogan Reeth wrote:thor424 wrote:Drogan Reeth wrote:thor424 wrote:
I do get your point, I'm just excited. Then use the same payout formula but add a bonus for winning.
In the veteran bracket many people never start fighting if they see names that mean they'll have to try or they leave battle.
Ya, I am too, and i'll gladly take the extra payout for winning, however it won't have any impact on trying to make the losing side try harder. Which is the point of the proposed change. I'll still run my apex suits when our team has no chance to win, and risk nothing. Why would that change from what's been proposed? There's nothing that'll change the behavior of people like you. But most humans have competitive nature and realize they turned on a video game. People like me? People who want to maximize profit and minimize loss? You mean smart ppl? FYI: That's what the whole point of the game is. Risk vs Reward. If they didn't want ppl to take into account maximizing profits, suits wouldn't cost anything, you'd be able to run proto soon as you skill for it free of cost indefinably. And they have created that mechanic beautifully, now they sit around wondering, why the mechanic they created that's doing exactly what one would expect, making ppl risk less in more dangerous situations.... is working as intended? The discussion at hand is how to increase people's willingness to risk more, when on the losing side instead of giving up. And the way to do that? Reward it! Reward being on the losing side and trying hard. Don't reward the winning side more, because that won't change anything, it will just encourage more of the same.
It's not working as intended. The crappy payouts were meant to encourage people to spend AUR. The payouts are so bad that most of the time losing more than 4 ADV suits leads to a net loss.
Buffing payouts for both sides is a good idea, but there should still be bonus for winning.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
94
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Posted - 2015.05.02 02:03:00 -
[8] - Quote
DJINN Jecture wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:Dear players,
we have been thinking long and hard about a way to make winning battles lucrative, and maybe throwing caution to the wind to do so.
What do you think of two (or both) ways of increasing your reward.
This bonus reward would only be for the winner, loser would get the normal payout
Winner reward would be normal current payout + x% of own personal losses + y% of personally inflicted losses
x and y to be decided
I don't see an easy exploit to this system and it would mean that you would commit proto to claim the battle, instead of hunkering back in starter loadouts. Day 1 > everyone spamming pro gear some losers some winners Day 3> Isk rich still spamming pro gear as they do currently, Isk poor players only using bpos as they want sp and don't want to pay cash to go head to head with pro players already making enough isk to support their spam habit getting payouts far larger than what they had before Day 15> Everyone goes back to COD/BF/whatever other shooters they like except the players who still have some isk Day 42> Dust ported to PC and changed from what we know now to whatever the Legion prototype (that hasn't been broken like this hopefully) is on PC and doing well with an influx of 15,000+ players day 1, hundreds of thousands to follow. Please rethink this.
I think you should rethink what you wrote. It doesn't make sense.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
141
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Posted - 2015.05.06 17:57:00 -
[9] - Quote
Where are we at on this?
I'm close to calling it and taking an extended break from Dust.
Thor's Emporium
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thor424
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
145
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Posted - 2015.05.07 00:39:00 -
[10] - Quote
Forced Death wrote:when you commit to proto with an organized squad, you are just going to help benefit protostompers and fund them further and increase the isk disparity between vets and new players
That's what they say, but it's sort of like the dumbass argument that raising the minimum wage is a bad idea.
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