DUST Search - Breach mass driver a viable AV choice

Fox Gaden wrote:

Breakin Stuff wrote:

Pokey Dravon wrote:

Even with a heat building increase, existing LR damage output would likely be extremely overpowered compared to existing AV.

I can't facepalm hard enough whenever this idea comes up.

A Laser Rifle AV weapon would work great if the heat buildup was on the target rather than on the weapon. Then CCP would just have to set it so that you had to keep the beam on the target for 2 seconds before it built to AV level damage. (With a longer time before overhead of the weapon.)

- Any weapon would kill Infantry in 2 seconds on target anyway, so not OP against Infantry.
- It is easier to keep a beam on a large target such as a HAV or Dropship (or parked/stuck LAV) so still effective against vehicles.
- Would have to have heat dissipate slowly, so that slipping off target for a fraction of a second does not reset heat.

Unfortunately this is probably not easy to implement, as it requires a debuff on the target. Its a shame though. I think if this mechanic could be made to work a lot could be done with it.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Boot Booter Titans of Phoenix 1249	Posted - 2015.04.05 18:21:00 - [1] - Quote Two part. Can we please make the breach mass driver a viable AV choice. At least make it 100% effective against vehicles and then we can adjust the damage later. Secondly if this happened we could give the Caldari commando the swarm launcher like it's supposed to and make the min commando a mass driving monster. Ps. I love my min commando more than the next guy but I think the bonus to the swarm is lore bogus.
Mad Syringe ReDust Inc. 811	Posted - 2015.04.05 18:48:00 - [2] - Quote I think the bonus for the minmando makes total sense, but the calmando should get a lockon time reduction, because he is cal and his suit systems boost the lockon...
TooMany Names AlreadyTaken Going for the gold 1065	Posted - 2015.04.05 19:02:00 - [3] - Quote I want the same thing done for the Breach Flaylock, as it's pretty useless right now. Found my favorite DJ - ATB
Kierkegaard Soren Corrosive Synergy Rise Of Legion. 737	Posted - 2015.04.05 19:34:00 - [4] - Quote Breach MD becomes Minnie light AV option. Swarm launcher has its damage profile changed to hybrid/rail, and becomes Caldari light AV option. Laser rifle gains breach variant: same dps, but 100% efficiency against vehicles, but heats up faster. Amarr AV option. Gallente keep the PLC, obviously. Racial parity for AV achieved. Yay. Dedicated Commando. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1929	Posted - 2015.04.05 19:34:00 - [5] - Quote 100% damage to vehicles .. from a weapon that deals over 500 HP's of damage with 18 rounds , 5% damage increase from the warbarge , 10% from the commando bonus and another 15% against armor from the weapon it's self and that doesn't sound OP against vehicles ? Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed . #PubsShouldBeRandomPlayers
Boot Booter Titans of Phoenix 1249	Posted - 2015.04.05 19:38:00 - [6] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: 100% damage to vehicles .. from a weapon that deals over 500 HP's of damage with 18 rounds , 5% damage increase from the warbarge , 10% from the commando bonus and another 15% against armor from the weapon it's self and that doesn't sound OP against vehicles ? No because it's slow and hard to use at range. Plus it's only 460 damage. The plasma Cannon does like 1700...
Boot Booter Titans of Phoenix 1249	Posted - 2015.04.05 19:44:00 - [7] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Breach MD becomes Minnie light AV option. Swarm launcher has its damage profile changed to hybrid/rail, and becomes Caldari light AV option. Laser rifle gains breach variant: same dps, but 100% efficiency against vehicles, but heats up faster. Amarr AV option. Gallente keep the PLC, obviously. Racial parity for AV achieved. Yay. I agree but I wouldn't change the swarm launcher profile. It's not a hybrid.. It's a missile.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5685	Posted - 2015.04.05 19:48:00 - [8] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: 100% damage to vehicles .. from a weapon that deals over 500 HP's of damage with 18 rounds , 5% damage increase from the warbarge , 10% from the commando bonus and another 15% against armor from the weapon it's self and that doesn't sound OP against vehicles ? Actually it only really does about 355 DPS base, even with Minmatar Commando and Warbarge buffs, it doesn't really live up to the DPS of other AV weapons. As a comparison, the sustained DPS of a Plasma Cannon is a little less than 500DPS, and even higher if used on a Commando. I think even at 100% efficiency, you would end up with a pretty underwhelming AV weapon. I suppose inversely it's more usable against infantry than other AV weapons so that may be an acceptable tradeoff. But in terms of DPS, it's far from overpowered. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Alena Ventrallis Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 2946	Posted - 2015.04.05 19:59:00 - [9] - Quote Even if we made the breach MD 100% on vehicles, you would have a DPS of 355. Swarms have double the DPS, many times the range, and home in on a target. Swarms are still the superior choice. Whirly gun make much thunder! - Victor
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1929	Posted - 2015.04.05 21:22:00 - [10] - Quote I like a FG myself but I stand corrected , I just use to use one and I disagree with them being hard to use but I guess it might just be me , I find them quite effective but some might not . I just imagined me using one on a Min commando and watching the blood flow when I was skilled to them and it came to mind how frail LAV's are and the fact that now you can destroy one with a MD so ... but if you all think otherwise then I thank you for the correction . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed . #PubsShouldBeRandomPlayers

Nevyn Tazinas Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 66	Posted - 2015.04.05 21:39:00 - [11] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Even if we made the breach MD 100% on vehicles, you would have a DPS of 355. Swarms have double the DPS, many times the range, and home in on a target. Swarms are still the superior choice. Other than the 'tiny' factor that everyone runs an MD because it slaughters infantry in close quarters also and gives loads of assist points. While swarms you can't touch infantry with at all.
Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 1620	Posted - 2015.04.05 22:15:00 - [12] - Quote I am surprised how well a MD can take out an LAV. 4 or 5 hits kills most. Because, that's why.
Kierkegaard Soren Corrosive Synergy Rise Of Legion. 738	Posted - 2015.04.06 20:52:00 - [13] - Quote In EvE missiles can deal any of the four types of damage (EM, thermal, kinetic, explosive) and the Caldari have a particular affinity with kinetic-type warheads, so changing the swarm profile to hybrid-rail would be perfectly in keeping with the lore of the game. Dedicated Commando. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Boot Booter Titans of Phoenix 1254	Posted - 2015.04.06 21:34:00 - [14] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: In EvE missiles can deal any of the four types of damage (EM, thermal, kinetic, explosive) and the Caldari have a particular affinity with kinetic-type warheads, so changing the swarm profile to hybrid-rail would be perfectly in keeping with the lore of the game. I could use that same argument for anything really. Whatever though it doesn't matter,i don't care either way. Just want the breach MD to be viable.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 7860	Posted - 2015.04.06 22:34:00 - [15] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Even if we made the breach MD 100% on vehicles, you would have a DPS of 355. Swarms have double the DPS, many times the range, and home in on a target. Swarms are still the superior choice. hehehe try again grasshopper. The Breach would need a 140% (total damage) versus vehicles to even begin being considered a plausible threat if you gang up. We'd be better off completely building a minmatar AV weapon from scratch. AV
Boot Booter Titans of Phoenix 1254	Posted - 2015.04.06 23:30:00 - [16] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Even if we made the breach MD 100% on vehicles, you would have a DPS of 355. Swarms have double the DPS, many times the range, and home in on a target. Swarms are still the superior choice. hehehe try again grasshopper. The Breach would need a 140% (total damage) versus vehicles to even begin being considered a plausible threat if you gang up. We'd be better off completely building a minmatar AV weapon from scratch. Or buff it's direct damage... It's not like it's any real threat to infantry
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5698	Posted - 2015.04.06 23:46:00 - [17] - Quote I guess my frustration would be then spending time tuning yet another Anti-Armor AV weapon when we still only have 1 Anti-Shield AV weapon. I'd rather do that before we start fiddling with Mass Drivers. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Godin Thekiller Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 3034	Posted - 2015.04.06 23:56:00 - [18] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Breach MD becomes Minnie light AV option. Swarm launcher has its damage profile changed to hybrid/rail, and becomes Caldari light AV option. Laser rifle gains breach variant: same dps, but 100% efficiency against vehicles, but heats up faster. Amarr AV option. Gallente keep the PLC, obviously. Racial parity for AV achieved. Yay. **** no to the LR. click me Blup Blub Bloop. Translation: Die -_-
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5698	Posted - 2015.04.07 00:01:00 - [19] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Breach MD becomes Minnie light AV option. Swarm launcher has its damage profile changed to hybrid/rail, and becomes Caldari light AV option. Laser rifle gains breach variant: same dps, but 100% efficiency against vehicles, but heats up faster. Amarr AV option. Gallente keep the PLC, obviously. Racial parity for AV achieved. Yay. ** no to the LR. Even with a heat building increase, existing LR damage output would likely be extremely overpowered compared to existing AV. "That little st Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Georgia Xavier Y.A.M.A.H 201	Posted - 2015.04.07 00:30:00 - [20] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Breach MD becomes Minnie light AV option. Swarm launcher has its damage profile changed to hybrid/rail, and becomes Caldari light AV option. Laser rifle gains breach variant: same dps, but 100% efficiency against vehicles, but heats up faster. Amarr AV option. Gallente keep the PLC, obviously. Racial parity for AV achieved. Yay. **** YES to the LR. Now that's more like it Scr nerf approaches.We shall see who truly knows how to wield God's wrath and heathens who wish to mimic the Amarr......

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 7861	Posted - 2015.04.07 00:50:00 - [21] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Even with a heat building increase, existing LR damage output would likely be extremely overpowered compared to existing AV. I can't facepalm hard enough whenever this idea comes up. AV
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17994	Posted - 2015.04.07 00:55:00 - [22] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: 100% damage to vehicles .. from a weapon that deals over 500 HP's of damage with 18 rounds , 5% damage increase from the warbarge , 10% from the commando bonus and another 15% against armor from the weapon it's self and that doesn't sound OP against vehicles ? No because it's slow and hard to use at range. Plus it's only 460 damage. The plasma Cannon does like 1700... No its not especially when your target is the size of a tan....... never mind. GÇ£That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even death may die.GÇ¥ -The Nameless City

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 19964	Posted - 2015.04.07 12:52:00 - [23] - Quote I don't see why, i like it more than a whole new minnie AV weapon for sure. Since it can do suppression damage, it can hurt Armor a little less than swarms, but certainly out dps the PLC as that instagibs infantry. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

DJINN Jecture MANUFACTURERS OF DEATH 317	Posted - 2015.04.07 12:57:00 - [24] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I don't see why, i like it more than a whole new minnie AV weapon for sure. Since it can do suppression damage, it can hurt Armor a little less than swarms, but certainly out dps the PLC as that instagibs infantry. I agree, and from time to time I've used my pro breach md to go tank hunting with REs and nanohives to rain the pain down on the support troops around it as well. *-ç +æ+Ä ß+¦ß¦+Gé¦ß+¡ !!!* *ß¦äß¦â-à*
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides Learning Alliance 6163	Posted - 2015.04.07 14:43:00 - [25] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Even with a heat building increase, existing LR damage output would likely be extremely overpowered compared to existing AV. I can't facepalm hard enough whenever this idea comes up. A Laser Rifle AV weapon would work great if the heat buildup was on the target rather than on the weapon. Then CCP would just have to set it so that you had to keep the beam on the target for 2 seconds before it built to AV level damage. (With a longer time before overhead of the weapon.) - Any weapon would kill Infantry in 2 seconds on target anyway, so not OP against Infantry. - It is easier to keep a beam on a large target such as a HAV or Dropship (or parked/stuck LAV) so still effective against vehicles. - Would have to have heat dissipate slowly, so that slipping off target for a fraction of a second does not reset heat. Unfortunately this is probably not easy to implement, as it requires a debuff on the target. Its a shame though. I think if this mechanic could be made to work a lot could be done with it. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Boot Booter Titans of Phoenix 1258	Posted - 2015.04.07 15:46:00 - [26] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Even with a heat building increase, existing LR damage output would likely be extremely overpowered compared to existing AV. I can't facepalm hard enough whenever this idea comes up. A Laser Rifle AV weapon would work great if the heat buildup was on the target rather than on the weapon. Then CCP would just have to set it so that you had to keep the beam on the target for 2 seconds before it built to AV level damage. (With a longer time before overhead of the weapon.) - Any weapon would kill Infantry in 2 seconds on target anyway, so not OP against Infantry. - It is easier to keep a beam on a large target such as a HAV or Dropship (or parked/stuck LAV) so still effective against vehicles. - Would have to have heat dissipate slowly, so that slipping off target for a fraction of a second does not reset heat. Unfortunately this is probably not easy to implement, as it requires a debuff on the target. Its a shame though. I think if this mechanic could be made to work a lot could be done with it. I hadn't thought of that. It would actually work well I think.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 3313	Posted - 2015.04.07 20:23:00 - [27] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I don't see why, i like it more than a whole new minnie AV weapon for sure. Since it can do suppression damage, it can hurt Armor a little less than swarms, but certainly out dps the PLC as that instagibs infantry. PLC Instagib..... I must log on and get some. CCP Rattati, any chance we could smash the player into pieces and have actual giblets flying around from instagibs like PLC shots, Forgeshots etc...? Vitantur Nothus wrote: Why hide a solution under frothy pile of derpa? SCV Ready!
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 710	Posted - 2015.04.07 20:28:00 - [28] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I don't see why, i like it more than a whole new minnie AV weapon for sure. Since it can do suppression damage, it can hurt Armor a little less than swarms, but certainly out dps the PLC as that instagibs infantry. PLC Instagib..... I must log on and get some. CCP Rattati, any chance we could smash the player into pieces and have actual giblets flying around from instagibs like PLC shots, Forgeshots etc...? Ohh, nothing says "I love you" more than a PLC round to the face. Especially a Quafe BPO PLC round to a Proto heavy face
Aeon Amadi Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 9477	Posted - 2015.04.07 23:37:00 - [29] - Quote I'd honestly like to see the Breach Flaylock become an AV weapon. We don't really have an AV Sidearm and that'd be a really good solution for a weapon that is otherwise useless. Have a suggestion for the Planetary Services Department? *Founder of AIV*
The Dark Cloud Negative-Feedback. 4325	Posted - 2015.04.08 03:09:00 - [30] - Quote Regis Blackbird wrote: CommanderBolt wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: I don't see why, i like it more than a whole new minnie AV weapon for sure. Since it can do suppression damage, it can hurt Armor a little less than swarms, but certainly out dps the PLC as that instagibs infantry. PLC Instagib..... I must log on and get some. CCP Rattati, any chance we could smash the player into pieces and have actual giblets flying around from instagibs like PLC shots, Forgeshots etc...? Ohh, nothing says "I love you" more than a PLC round to the face. Especially a Quafe BPO PLC round to a Proto heavy face https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tm4L-CogcdI I make the scrubs scream and the vets cry.



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