Because it ruins the game for others? Particularly new players who don't know anything about the game, and their first experience out of the Academy is likely a proto stomping squad in a pub.

Some of us actually want the game to stick around, and that can't happen when the current NPE is Academy to being proto stomped.

Heck, even many vets are getting tired of it.

Because it ruins the game for others? Particularly new players who don't know anything about the game, and their first experience out of the Academy is likely a proto stomping squad in a pub.

Some of us actually want the game to stick around, and that can't happen when the current NPE is Academy to being proto stomped.

Heck, even many vets are getting tired of it.

Yeah, I agree. But people shouldn't have to defend themselves for playing the game the way they want to. Nobody is complaining about people using BPOs and that ruining the game. That battle academy thing should be extended a lot. It only last like two missions and then the new guys are "out in the galaxy" with little to prepare them for the terrors New Eden has to offer.

In the scenario I described above, more clones are going to die if a good squad is bringing proto. If they don't it's a redline match with 20 minutes of minimal deaths.

I was not expecting these responses. I guess the whiners don't get on the forums until later.

So you just agreed proto stomping is a problem, then condoned the people who do it...

I guess I am a realist. It would be nice if we could have a game where people who want to pull out their proto suits and play as hard as they want would have a viable game mode in which to do it. I do not have a problem with the idea of people using proto suits and trying their hardest.

What I can't understand is ignoring the real circumstances and the real ramifications. We do not have a game where such conditions exist, and never will if the game can't grow.

If people want to shoot themselves in the foot that is fine, but they really don't have a right to complain that their foot hurts and is bleeding after they do it, then blame someone else for simply handing them the gun.

Yeah, I agree. But people shouldn't have to defend themselves for playing the game the way they want to. Nobody is complaining about people using BPOs and that ruining the game. That battle academy thing should be extended a lot. It only last like two missions and then the new guys are "out in the galaxy" with little to prepare them for the terrors New Eden has to offer.

It's a problem but no one should ever expect their opposition in online games to be responsible for their personal enjoyment of the game, it is firstly unreasonable, and secondly likely to conflict with their enjoyment of the game.

In competition I am a firm believer that no one should pander to another teams ineffectualness as it does nothing to encourage them to do better or gives them a false impression of their own capabilities, though this is only in a competitive setting.
Not sure why people are so discouraged by death and loss in this game where it should galvanise them to look at their own playstyle and take the knowledge from the previous death into account when attempting something again with the intent to go and and get some goddamn revenge. If that means stepping up to Proto then they need to step up not whine about how they refuse to use it or some such other nonsense.

You personally are responsible for your own enjoyment of a game, just as another player is responsible for their own. Despite this fostering a positive gaming experience in non competitive matches is something that should be looked at.

I would agree if:

A: This weren't a multiplayer game in which the play of others directly influences the enjoyment of the game. If there were a PvE element like in Eve where people who do not want to play against others competitively existed.

B: We weren't talking Pubs, but we are. Pubs aren't where the competition is supposed to be. If the only people intended to play this game were competitive players, this game would go down in flames, particularly since this game is F2P. Anyone complaining about Proto suits in FW and PC is out of touch.

C: People didn't play for any number of reasons, including casually, but they do. Not everyone wants to play at a high level. I like bowling, but it doesn't mean I want to be in the PBA each time I go out.

It's precisely because of A that I have this mindset. When we engage in PvP which currently is the only game mode I cannot be responsible for your enjoyment of the game. My goal is simply to win, or get a lot of kills, or have fun doing what I do. For what reason would you expect me to compromise the enjoyment of the game so that you all might find some enjoyment? To what extent should I expect you to compromise your enjoyment to pander to me.

Should I not use my HAV?
Should I expect you not to us AV?
Do you expect me not to shoot back or move you you can get a kill?
Should I expect you to present yourself in the open so that I can farm you for kills?

No. The game itself is fundamentally about conflict and people can always find things to while about it something doesn't go their way, myself included. However as there is no non competitive element of the game I would suggest that players have to accept that they are currently in a setting where competitive players usually are found or thrive and need to accept this as the game as it stands now.

Pub wise I guess you are right. I'm personally not very interest in pubs when I play them so I have no drive to win, just there to fight tanks and maul infantry.

As for your last point I can accept that but that does not mean you can expect your opposition to hold the same values as you do. It's New Eden, competition, power, wealth, that's what it all about regardless of whether or not you personally are a competitive individual. Yes you can find yourself a place in Null Sec and be a care bear if you wish....that won't stop PvP oriented players from finding you, killing you, and continuing to do so.

AKA Low Sec ganking.

It's precisely because of A that I have this mindset. When we engage in PvP which currently is the only game mode I cannot be responsible for your enjoyment of the game. My goal is simply to win, or get a lot of kills, or have fun doing what I do. For what reason would you expect me to compromise the enjoyment of the game so that you all might find some enjoyment? To what extent should I expect you to compromise your enjoyment to pander to me.

Should I not use my HAV?
Should I expect you not to us AV?
Do you expect me not to shoot back or move you you can get a kill?
Should I expect you to present yourself in the open so that I can farm you for kills?

No. The game itself is fundamentally about conflict and people can always find things to while about it something doesn't go their way, myself included. However as there is no non competitive element of the game I would suggest that players have to accept that they are currently in a setting where competitive players usually are found or thrive and need to accept this as the game as it stands now.

Pub wise I guess you are right. I'm personally not very interest in pubs when I play them so I have no drive to win, just there to fight tanks and maul infantry.

As for your last point I can accept that but that does not mean you can expect your opposition to hold the same values as you do. It's New Eden, competition, power, wealth, that's what it all about regardless of whether or not you personally are a competitive individual. Yes you can find yourself a place in Null Sec and be a care bear if you wish....that won't stop PvP oriented players from finding you, killing you, and continuing to do so.

AKA Low Sec ganking.

Soon the meta lock will arrive an maybe help with this problem till then we must fight the good fight against proto squads. o7 p.s. apex suits are fine.