DUST Search - So Combat Rifles OP?

Lorhak Gannarsein wrote:

so first off I'm going to emphasise the psychological factor that has people instantly switching to swarms to eliminate dropships now that it's a thing that's possible, and second:

the Minmatar Assault was considered the worst of the four assault suits for a good long while.
It was mostly unused, even for an assault suit - it didn't even have the dedicated users the Amarr Assault had.

Now? It's the most used suit.

You can't honestly tell me it's because suddenly the suit is 'balanced'.

Atiim wrote:

The first (and probably greatest) is because it has a balanced slot layout, which means you can tank it however you'd like. This effectively reduces the need to invest into another dropsuit as you can change tasks at a moments notice, whereas previously if you wanted to be diverse you needed to invest into 2 Dropsuits (ie, a Caldari Assault who needed an Armor Tank would have to spec into either a Gallente or Amarr Assault).

The second reason, is because it increases the magazine size of the Combat Rifle (2nd most popular light weapon, and best Anti-Armor rifle) and the Sub-Machine Gun, which is by far the most popular Sidearm. These bonuses make weapons players want to use even better, while also providing you with a solid platform to put it on. This is also why SCR users tend to invest into the Amarr Assault.

As for it being overpowered, it's far from. No matter which way you fit the suit, it is still subject to the weaknesses that would come with using that fit on the specialized version (ie, if you Shield Tank it you'll be weak to SCRs and ARs like the Caldari Assault is).

That, and when trying to mimic the functions of a specialized suit, you won't be as good as said specialized suit (ie, you can Armor Tank it but you'll never be as good at Armor Tanking as the Gal/Am Assaults.


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Atiim Heaven's Lost Property Negative-Feedback 15785	Posted - 2015.02.26 00:12:00 - [1] - Quote The Combat Rifle is considered overpowered by players who: 1. Believe that anything that kills them with regularity is OP 2. Armor Tank and feel like their HP should make them Senti-Strong. 3. Believe that the Matari Assault is OP and want to take something else down with it. Looking at the stats however, it's DPS (and therefore TTK) is in-line with the other rifles, with it's differences being apparent based on which suit it's pitted against (like the other rifles). The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Atiim Heaven's Lost Property Negative-Feedback 15789	Posted - 2015.02.26 04:04:00 - [2] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: defending the CR on Min Assault is like defending the HMG or Breach AR. Only issue with the CR is the Min Assault bonus taking away from the weapons only balancing feature since it's damn good at everything else and costing sidearm level CPU/PG to equip. It's annoying on most suits but I don't call it OP, the problem comes when you have the ability to keep your high RoF, DPS, recoil, decent ranged weapon constantly on a target then you'd get a problem. Well for starters, the exact same thing could be said about the Amarr Assault using a Scrambler Rifle as it also mitigates its only weakness, being the Heat Sink. Claiming that it has "sidearm level CPU/PG to equip" is misleading. The CPU/PG of the most used sidearms rests at 57/10 (SMG), 55/10 (BoP), and 48/8 (SCP). While the PG is indeed similar to the CR, the CPU is far less with a differences of 24-33 (about 30-40%, which quite a bit). Compared to the other rifles its hardly significant, with it having 3/9 less than the RR and 8/4 less than the PR. The only times those will ever make a difference is when stacking as many Complex items as possible, but even then downgrading 1 module will let you save more CPU/PG than swamping to the CR. Though it should be noted that with the Assault's bonus, all of the Light Weapons (even the SCR) are given "sidearm level CPU/PG" which further removes the weight of that statement. Sgt Kirk wrote: That's like if the Gallente Assault was given a bonus to Range. You know how OP that would make the Plasma Rifles then it makes the Breach into Jove mode? Another weapon that has very little drawbacks besides the one main one...then we just get a bonus to negate the main balancing factor of the weapon. Let's give RR more damage if we are to have this mindset. Let's get rid of Laser Rifle heatbuildup even more and give it more damage. I don't consider damage to be the RR's weakness, as only has about 55 DPS less than the PR but when done properly increased damage boosts on the RR can be done without being OP, as noted by the Caldari Commando. However you can nearly achieve both of those results with the Amarr Assault, as with 3 DMs you can get +17% and since you only overheat with 20 shots in the mag you'll never find a target you can't drop before overheating. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Atiim Heaven's Lost Property Negative-Feedback 15794	Posted - 2015.02.26 13:13:00 - [3] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: I run zero damage mods on my Minmatar assault fits, I thought it was normal to do so? Your first mistake was assuming that there's a normal Matari Assault fitting. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Atiim Heaven's Lost Property Negative-Feedback 15799	Posted - 2015.02.26 14:58:00 - [4] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: so first off I'm going to emphasise the psychological factor that has people instantly switching to swarms to eliminate dropships now that it's a thing that's possible, and second: the Minmatar Assault was considered the worst of the four assault suits for a good long while. It was mostly unused, even for an assault suit - it didn't even have the dedicated users the Amarr Assault had. Now? It's the most used suit. You can't honestly tell me it's because suddenly the suit is 'balanced'. Well for starters, being used 2.5% more than the other leading brands isn't much of an accomplishment. Not that it matters, as usage does not equate to power. As for why it's the most used, I covered this in another thread. Atiim wrote: The first (and probably greatest) is because it has a balanced slot layout, which means you can tank it however you'd like. This effectively reduces the need to invest into another dropsuit as you can change tasks at a moments notice, whereas previously if you wanted to be diverse you needed to invest into 2 Dropsuits (ie, a Caldari Assault who needed an Armor Tank would have to spec into either a Gallente or Amarr Assault). The second reason, is because it increases the magazine size of the Combat Rifle (2nd most popular light weapon, and best Anti-Armor rifle) and the Sub-Machine Gun, which is by far the most popular Sidearm. These bonuses make weapons players want to use even better, while also providing you with a solid platform to put it on. This is also why SCR users tend to invest into the Amarr Assault. As for it being overpowered, it's far from. No matter which way you fit the suit, it is still subject to the weaknesses that would come with using that fit on the specialized version (ie, if you Shield Tank it you'll be weak to SCRs and ARs like the Caldari Assault is). That, and when trying to mimic the functions of a specialized suit, you won't be as good as said specialized suit (ie, you can Armor Tank it but you'll never be as good at Armor Tanking as the Gal/Am Assaults. Now my challenge to you, is to find one thing that makes the MinAssault overpowered that can't be reproduced on any other dropsuit. If you cannot, you're reasons for wanting a nerf are solely "because it killed me". The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Atiim Heaven's Lost Property Negative-Feedback 15801	Posted - 2015.02.26 15:42:00 - [5] - Quote Fizzer XCIV wrote: Harder to use items/abilities are more powerful. The LR is one of the harder to use weapons in the game. And extremely situational besides. In its niche, and when used correctly, it roflpwns. Working as intended. Not saying the Laser Rifle is OP but it's not really hard to use. Not that it means anything, as besides Launchers nothing is really "difficult" to use. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND