DUST Search - Pilot Suits: I Give In

Takahiro Kashuken wrote:

Pokey Dravon wrote:

DUST Fiend wrote:

I don't see why we couldn't have both, pilot suit required for all but LAVs, and an enter exit delay / animation to keep HMG LAV Heavies from being as obnoxious. Pilot suits bypass the delay, and the delay is scaled upwards from light to heavy. LAVs are an open cockpit, generalist vehicle. They're made for rapid transport and that's about it. Being forced to ride around in a squishy suit would be a little lame, especially since the bonuses from the suit likely wouldn't be as useful on an LAV. I don't mind AV hopping out of an LAV because if they're acting solo, they're only a threat to me as either the turret (while stationary) or their AV (mostly stationary), versus having a full combat ready platform with oodles of HP, and plenty of cover to hide behind.

I see no reason to let others pilot actual vehicles. Sorry LAVs, you're the redheaded stepchild of the vehicle tree, deal with it.

I just don't see the need to make pilot suits *required* to pilot a vehicle. Pilot suits should provide enough of a benefit that a pilot is going to be at a disadvantage if they're not using the suit, but they're still not required to.

It just feels like poor design when you have to impose arbitrary limitations (or exceptions) such as "Oh well this is always true, except LAVs, because reasons."

Limitations exist all over this game.

Look at bandwidth and how that killed pubs, you want links use the amarr, you want reps use the minmatar, you want scanner use gallente, you want nanohives use caldari but if you dont you get less of everything and any bonuses lost unless you run all the same equipment

Same with assault suits, don't use the weapon dont get the bonuses.

Lets not forget about vehicles with the impending doom of having 1 hardener or the fact that the core locus grenade, flaylock, mass driver all have bigger splash radius and do more splash damage than a large missile and also last but not least getting new advanced and prototype vehicles but without the increasing slot layout.


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Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5037	Posted - 2015.02.22 21:14:00 - [1] - Quote emm kay wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: Make pilot suits, I don't care what they do. You have to have a pilot suit to operate a vehicle. I am beyond sick of chasing down tanks only for a swarm commando to pop out and dance behind his mobile cover. Pilots should pilot, this is getting absurd. If you want mobile AV as well, fit a turret, and bring someone with you. I think that the pilot suit should have the sentinel hitbox. why? because it should get a 3-second jetpack. + a damage bonus to AV grenades. Why would a suit designed for piloting vehicles, be getting bonuses that apply outside of a vehicle? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5044	Posted - 2015.02.24 01:24:00 - [2] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Also, what's with this no equipment bs? Scouts (light suits) have two, but FU tanker! ??? What do you need equipment for? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5044	Posted - 2015.02.24 01:29:00 - [3] - Quote manboar thunder fist wrote: Uplinks and repair tools. Vehicles are getting native armor reps like infantry, so repair tools are no longer needed. Additionally if you want to be supportive of your team as a vehicle pilot by spawning players, should you not be using a mCRU that's on your vehicle? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5046	Posted - 2015.02.24 17:39:00 - [4] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: I'd take it as is, with nothing on it... The bonus being that you can actually use the vehicles... But if we want to be fair, it should have a non-replaceable rep-tool, for tankers who can't rep or recall because low hp and no accessible supply depos. On a separate thought, leaving out the LAV is a bad idea, as those are stolen more than anything and have the highest rate of excreting HMGs. Which is why, instead of pilot suits being light frame and not for LAV's. I suggest a heavy frame (faat and slow, harder to run away if you escape the explosion) with the rep-tool, side arm combo. Stops the LAV driver from being insta-gibbed, while also allowing us to balance the hp of solo fat suit LAV gunners, such as myself. Again really no reason for the repair tool if all vehicles have some passive armor regen. HAVs are getting them, I imagine LAVs and Dropships will happen at some point as well. The main reason people want this required pilot suit crap, but no on LAVs, is because they use LAVs and don't want any changes that actually impact their personal playstyle, just limit others. I'm not a huge fan of the required pilot suit concept, but if they're going to do it, it better be all vehicles so people can really understand how annoying it'll be to need a pilot to drive them around. Honestly adding an exist/entry timer would help alleviate many of the issues people are experiencing with others popping in and out of vehicles...hell you could even scale it with dropsuit size if you want to get fancy. And to be frank, the only 'must need a pilot suit to drive' system that I might consider supporting, is if anyone can pilot generalist vehicles, but it takes a pilot to drive specialist vehicles (UHAV, Logi LAV, ect) As for the suit itself in terms of frame sized and HP, you do raise a fair point that you don't want them to be too squishy as not to get instablapped out of LAV. I'm not too set on any particular frame or whatever, I think many just jumped tot he Light frame because its the only frame with 1 specialty so far. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5048	Posted - 2015.02.24 20:10:00 - [5] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: I don't see why we couldn't have both, pilot suit required for all but LAVs, and an enter exit delay / animation to keep HMG LAV Heavies from being as obnoxious. Pilot suits bypass the delay, and the delay is scaled upwards from light to heavy. LAVs are an open cockpit, generalist vehicle. They're made for rapid transport and that's about it. Being forced to ride around in a squishy suit would be a little lame, especially since the bonuses from the suit likely wouldn't be as useful on an LAV. I don't mind AV hopping out of an LAV because if they're acting solo, they're only a threat to me as either the turret (while stationary) or their AV (mostly stationary), versus having a full combat ready platform with oodles of HP, and plenty of cover to hide behind. I see no reason to let others pilot actual vehicles. Sorry LAVs, you're the redheaded stepchild of the vehicle tree, deal with it. I just don't see the need to make pilot suits required to pilot a vehicle. Pilot suits should provide enough of a benefit that a pilot is going to be at a disadvantage if they're not using the suit, but they're still not required to. It just feels like poor design when you have to impose arbitrary limitations (or exceptions) such as "Oh well this is always true, except LAVs, because reasons." "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5048	Posted - 2015.02.24 20:23:00 - [6] - Quote I don't have an issue with the reduction to entry/exit timers for pilot suits, that seems like a reasonable bonus. Now I think open cockpit vehicles such as the LAV should have a shorter delay than say an HAV or Dropship, that also makes sense to me. I mean you could make it undesirable to not use a pilot suit because of the delay, but I really don't like restricting it completely. And yes, I dislike the 1 hardener limitation, I think it's a lazy way to fix some of the issues with hardeners. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5051	Posted - 2015.02.25 02:01:00 - [7] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Are you high? Do you even tank bro? mCRU's on ground vehicles, particularly tanks, are last ditch. They also take up fighting slots that the tank can use for survival. Would rather just carry uplinks on a dropsuit of my choice, or one designed correctly for battle, instead of more limitations. Well some will insist I don't, but I assure you that I do. For one, HAVs are gaining 2 additional slots, LAVs will likely receive a similar pass, so fitting is a little more flexible now. Not to mention I don't really consider HAVs as a platform that should really be a spawn point anyways, but since we lack proper MAVs I suppose I can't complain. Additionally I don't have an issue with non-pilot suits hopping out and dropping uplinks. What I do have an issue with is a pilot suit gaining bonuses for piloting, but still maintaining that capability. The Pilot suit should be specialized completely around being inside a vehicle at all time. It should serve zero purpose whatsoever outside of a vehicle, even if its just to hop out for a second. Bonuses for mCRUs and the sort? Awesome. But hopping out to drop uplinks? No, that's not the Pilot suits role. If you want to maintain the ability to use equipment but drop the bonuses that the pilot suit would offer, that's your call. But dropping uplinks is not an integral part of piloting the vehicle, even if you use the vehicle to drop uplinks. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5051	Posted - 2015.02.25 03:06:00 - [8] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: So long as I don't HAVE to spec into this suit to pilot a tank or dropship I don't care. I don't like fighting with my hands behind my back. Yep, which is why I'm against the whole Pilot Suit requirement. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5056	Posted - 2015.02.25 20:19:00 - [9] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: I don't see why we couldn't have both, pilot suit required for all but LAVs, and an enter exit delay / animation to keep HMG LAV Heavies from being as obnoxious. Pilot suits bypass the delay, and the delay is scaled upwards from light to heavy. LAVs are an open cockpit, generalist vehicle. They're made for rapid transport and that's about it. Being forced to ride around in a squishy suit would be a little lame, especially since the bonuses from the suit likely wouldn't be as useful on an LAV. I don't mind AV hopping out of an LAV because if they're acting solo, they're only a threat to me as either the turret (while stationary) or their AV (mostly stationary), versus having a full combat ready platform with oodles of HP, and plenty of cover to hide behind. I see no reason to let others pilot actual vehicles. Sorry LAVs, you're the redheaded stepchild of the vehicle tree, deal with it. I just don't see the need to make pilot suits required to pilot a vehicle. Pilot suits should provide enough of a benefit that a pilot is going to be at a disadvantage if they're not using the suit, but they're still not required to. It just feels like poor design when you have to impose arbitrary limitations (or exceptions) such as "Oh well this is always true, except LAVs, because reasons." Limitations exist all over this game. Look at bandwidth and how that killed pubs, you want links use the amarr, you want reps use the minmatar, you want scanner use gallente, you want nanohives use caldari but if you dont you get less of everything and any bonuses lost unless you run all the same equipment Same with assault suits, don't use the weapon dont get the bonuses. Lets not forget about vehicles with the impending doom of having 1 hardener or the fact that the core locus grenade, flaylock, mass driver all have bigger splash radius and do more splash damage than a large missile and also last but not least getting new advanced and prototype vehicles but without the increasing slot layout. I don't have an issue with limitations that are smart, I have an issue with limitations that are stupid or have arbitrary exceptions for really no reason other than "Well we didn't want to design is properly." Like for example the suggestion that "Oh, Minmatar commando gets a bonus to all projectile and explosive weapons......except Swarms because we dont like that and dont want to properly balance the swarms" is a stupid limitation. Same with Logistics....sure you're encouraged to use uplinks on an Amarr Logistics, but you're not required to use an Amarr Logistics to use uplinks. Same for the pilot suit, you should be encouraged to use a pilot suit, but not outright required to. And I'll say it again, if you haven't see me say it a dozen times already, the single hardener limitation is stupid, and another way to get the intended effect should be explored. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5061	Posted - 2015.02.26 19:06:00 - [10] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: Mad Syringe wrote: There will never be balance, somebody will always complain. CCP said that they want vehicles to have windows of opportunities and that's what we have now, at least for shielded vehicles. You guys want vehicle V vehicle warfare and not be bothered by AV... It's not going to happen. If you want that, go to world of tanks. This is mainly an infantry shooter, that has vehicles as SUPPORT. If you can't accept that, you are in the wrong game. Who said anything about not wanting to be bothered by AV? I just don't want AV driving, is all. You don't need 8000 HP with your swarm launcher. (unless you're a gunner / passenger, then that's legit) What if you allowed anyone to pilot, but the exit timer on a non-pilot was sufficiently long that its not viable to bail out of a dying vehicle to use AV? If you have say a 10 second timer for an HAV, that's really not enough time for someone to realize "Oh, I'm going to die" and bail out before being blown up. I think that would achieve what you're looking to avoid, which is AV popping out of a dying vehicle on the fly and finishing you off, right? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5061	Posted - 2015.02.26 21:59:00 - [11] - Quote True Adamance wrote: You are telling me you wouldn't like a tracking bonus for railguns or missiles? Bro bro bro. What the **? He'll just remind you that he's god's gift to tanking and anything you saw is trumped by his throbbing girthy EXPERIENCE and then start spewing how you know nothing because he's personally never seen you in game. Honestly at this point it feels like the opening to Pinky and the Brain it's gotten so repetitive. But yeah, tracking on a speedy tank is freaking amazing up close. "That little st Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net