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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Imp Smash
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
688
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Posted - 2015.02.23 01:48:00 -
[1] - Quote
Logging in for the first time in almost a week (thanks Sony.)
The graph is a bit hard to understand for me Rattati. Actually I don't get it at all even though I have read the whole thread. Can you explain it a bit better? I'd really like to know what I am looking at.
Edit note: Easier to differentiate colors would also be cool...
Unrelated note, why the hell are random people on the forums trying to hijack a thread about rifle balance to argue or propaganda about HMGs among other stuff? So ridiculous...you know who are you are... |
Imp Smash
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
690
|
Posted - 2015.02.23 12:05:00 -
[2] - Quote
No HMG is not a factor hit how you balance rifles anymore than the sniper or mass driver is a factor for how you balance rifles. Assaults and light rifles are (implied) to be the bread and butter guns of Dust. always have been. So we fix light weapons against each other, then alter the specialty weapons around that. I respect your opinion on how the HMG should be (even though I completely disagree with it for many many reasons) but that is literally for another thread. For example, one that discusses suit effectiveness.
For now, I'd like to understand that graph. Understand the data behind how rifles compare to each other. Once we do that everyone can put their heads together and figure out the causes of said data. As it is we are just guessing what it means which makes our respective opinions on cause even further away from the truth.
Focusing on giving each rifle overlapping roles and relative flexibility is paramount. That'll make everything else (explosive balance, equipment balance, suit balance, specialty weapon balance, armor/shield dynamic balance, sidearm balance, etc) significantly easier as we will be easily able to see where all of the above compliments, overlaps, supplements, and even supplants the basic bread and butter guns. ie...light rifles.
So again Ratatati, can you explain this graph better and PLEASE make the colors significantly easier to differentiate so that we, the players, can provide any sort of constructive feedback and maybe even good ideas? |
Imp Smash
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
690
|
Posted - 2015.02.24 00:25:00 -
[3] - Quote
Fizzer XCIV wrote:Atiim wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Edit: Is there any truth to this thread? Does the ScR really out-range the RR? According to these tests performed in-game, the range is about the same (SCR is higher by 1m). That document is painfully outdated. Weapon ranges don't increase with tier anymore like that. The SDE says the RR has an effective of 100m and the ScR has an effective of 96m. No hard info on the Optimal, but anecdotally I can say the RR feels like it reaches further out.
There is a theory bouncing around (that fits in with my experience) about damage falloff curve. Essentially, as a weapon is fired at a target at ranges between optimal and effective the damage reduces. That rate is different for each weapon and follows different damage falloff curves. For example, (made up numbers for easy demonstration purposes only:)
Urine Soaked Pillow Launcher 9000:
1000rpm. 10 damage per shot.
Optimal - 50m (100% damage)
Effective - 60m (80% damage)
Loses 1% damage per meter from 51m to 55m. Loses 3% damage per meter from 56m to 60m. ie.
51m = 99%
52m = 98%
...
55m = 95%
56m = 92%
57m = 89%
...
59m = 83%
60m = 80%
vs.
Earwax Chaingun Omega the Final:
1000rpm. 10 damage per shot.
Optimal - 50m (100% damage)
Effective - 60m (80% damage)
Loses 3% damage per meter from 51m to 55m. Loses 1% damage per meter from 56m to 60m. ie.
51m = 97%
52m = 94%
...
54m = 88%
55m = 85%
56m = 84%
...
59m = 81%
60m = 80%
With these two hypothetical weapons (assume same recoil, dispersion) you have the exact same DPS and ranges. However, the Pillow Launcher will outperform the Earwax Chaingun simply by virtue of the damage fall off curve.
It appears that many guns in Dust have different curves, and as such some guns seem to perform bettter at ranges outside of their optimal (up to effective) than others. This many be what you are seeing when you experience some weapons performing where you would not expect them to. Add to that, virtually every time someone comments on weapon balance on the forums they only consider optimal only in extremely rare cases consider effective -- much less the difference in weapon effective ranges.
Post to be continued in further edit.
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