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KA24DERT
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Posted - 2015.02.04 04:20:00 -
[1] - Quote
Get rid of Aim Assist and you'll have your fun fights again.
Aim Assist bears 90% of the blame for low TTK in this game.
The barriers to getting rid of AA are CCP's total lack of vision, and the loud scrubs sucking on the Aim Assist tit that will cry long into the night if it goes away.
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KA24DERT
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Posted - 2015.02.04 08:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
Leadfoot10 wrote:Aim assist is fine, IMO. It is weak compared to just about any other console FPS.
But damage across the board is too high IMO causing a TTK too low for my taste.
For me, FPS games should be about who has the best gun game and situational awareness, not who sees who first and who steps out of cover first. Dust is getting too much like the latter and too little like the former -- but it's not far off.
If Leadfoot ruled the world, I'd nerf HMGs 15% and everything else 10% (except forge guns and PLCs).
Leaving aim assist as is, you'd need to start the damage nerf at 30%, and I'm pretty sure you'd have to go up to 50% before the gunfights got fun again.
10% damage nerf will not do anything appreciable to TTK.
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KA24DERT
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Posted - 2015.02.06 23:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:KA24DERT wrote:Get rid of Aim Assist and you'll have your fun fights again.
Aim Assist bears 90% of the blame for low TTK in this game.
The barriers to getting rid of AA are CCP's total lack of vision, and the loud scrubs sucking on the Aim Assist tit that will cry long into the night if it goes away. Lawl, has absolutely nothing to do with the 200 dmg/shot bolt pistols, insanely high alpha of Scrambler Rifle's, Shotguns, Nova Knives... Extremely high DPS of the HMG... Nothing to do with things like cloaking devices, EWAR, and 25% splash resistances to Sentinels who receive a healthy 15% resistance toward racial weaponry while toting around a 600+ DPS death mini-gun that gains accuracy as you shoot it. Nope. Not a thing to do with that. All Aim Assist. Come on guys, seriously..? The Aim Assist thing is a red herring, it's a symptom to a larger disease that's plagued the overall game for a long time now. Even with the Aim Assist there are ways of increasing TTK and making gun-game more skill based.
Aim assist negates strafing, dispersion, and human error.
It turns the theoretical DPS of a hit-scan weapon into nearly guaranteed DPS.
Yes, I do agree that the high-alpha weapons are a pain point, but AA turns almost every rifle into a "Burst Alpha" weapon, and that contributes greatly to the low TTK. If AA stays in the game, every aim assisted weapon would need a humongous nerf(think at least 30%), which would cause a huge cascade of rebalancing. And then if Dust/Legion comes out on PC, AA will have to be removed regardless, and now you'd need another re-balance.
Better to rip the bandaid off now.
The more troubling issue is that somewhere within CCP's organization low TTK is the intended goal(which is reflected in the points you brought up), and I don't know what will convince them that they are ruining Dust with their gank oriented gameplay.
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KA24DERT
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Posted - 2015.02.07 22:08:00 -
[4] - Quote
Zeylon Rho wrote:KA24DERT wrote:
Aim assist negates strafing, dispersion, and human error.
It turns the theoretical DPS of a hit-scan weapon into nearly guaranteed DPS.
Yes, I do agree that the high-alpha weapons are a pain point, but AA turns almost every rifle into a "Burst Alpha" weapon, and that contributes greatly to the low TTK. If AA stays in the game, every aim assisted weapon would need a humongous nerf(think at least 30%), which would cause a huge cascade of rebalancing. And then if Dust/Legion comes out on PC, AA will have to be removed regardless, and now you'd need another re-balance.
Better to rip the bandaid off now.
The more troubling issue is that somewhere within CCP's organization low TTK is the intended goal(which is reflected in the points you brought up), and I don't know what will convince them that they are ruining Dust with their gank oriented gameplay.
AA is only part of it (though a large part in a manner of speaking). The problem with removing it is that the post-uprising engine has always kinda sucked. The AA and hit-prediction they have in place now was their way of working around the latency, framerate issues, and generally wonky mechanics we inherited post-chromosome. It was the easier way to "fix" things as opposed to reworking the engine, and I don't think the Dust team has engine programmers anymore? I don't think they can realistically remove AA unless they: make a new engine, rework this one a lot, or roll back to Chromosome. The problem with most of the options is that Legion is still very question marky and not spoken of, and Dust's future is also pretty hazy considering the last official word from corporate was "Dust is canned." I'm not sure if their skeleton crew is equipped to do the sort of adjustments the game would require without AA. However, I agree with you about the apparent goal of lower TTK. There seems to be a push towards that sort of mainstreaming with their current content. Unfortunately, considering Dust's relative lack of success, it seems problematic to persuade them to be less mainstream given they probably want "as many players and as much income as possible." It's the same mistake companies like EA make when they try to make X game a game for everyone instead of excelling in a particular area or filling an under-served niche. It's not always clear why a game failed, and there's always a hundred voices to give you a hundred different explanations, even here.
I have to concede that removing AA is unrealistic given the Dev constraints you highlighted, but I still hold it is what SHOULD happen under more ideal circumstances.
But TTK is still a huge issue, and I guarantee that most of the hundreds of new players that try this game every day rage quit after being repeatedly vaporized with no warning. That's working directly against CCP's goal, player retention is vital to wide appeal, and the current gankfest is not appealing. You can't be "mainstream" if nobody plays your game.
With AA as a fixture of necessity, that leaves nothing but a HUGE damage nerf on the table.
Question is, when we have people pissing and moaning about 5-10% nerfs, how would one convince anybody that a 50% damage reduction to most weapons is the way to go?
Or more fundamentally, how do we convince anyone that low TTK is what's killing Dust?
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KA24DERT
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Posted - 2015.02.09 21:02:00 -
[5] - Quote
Shamarskii Simon wrote:CoD TTK in a game where all your assets cost money you have to earn or else you'll be down to suits which get instagib'd instantly (instantly twice? Yes im aware, i just needa put a lil "EMPH" in it). Then it's just constant death and failure.
No human want's constant failure, especially if it destroys your ability to compete.
Not just that, it really destroys immersion when no matter how you configure your dropsuit, the most you could do is delay your gibbing by MAYBE a whole second.
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