DUST Search - In defense of the scrambler rifle

Cypher Nil wrote:

KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:

Frankly, I'm sick of constantly seeing nerf threads on th subject, so I'm going to try explain a few things.

"The charge shot damage is too high!"
1) The prototype scrambler rifle does 71 damage. A charge shot does 3.5x regular damage, so a charge shot does 248.5 damage. It takes 2 seconds to charge the shot. Factor that seconds in the DPS, and it's a pitiful 124.25 DPS.
2) The heat generated from a charge shot is very punishing, making a missed shot a massive waste, and can lead to death. With Amarr assault level 5, you can fire 13 more shots after a charge shot before overheating. Without Amarr assault, you can only fire 7 regular shots before overheating.

"The regular damage is too high!"
Actually, the tactical assault rifle of the same tier does more damage. The prototype scrambler rifle does 71 damage, and the prototype tactical AR does 73.

"The rate of fire is too too high!"
Actually, the tactical assault rifle has the exact same rate of fire, 600, (with more damage, and no fear of overheat)

"Stop comparing it to the tactical AR, they're totally different, and thus not comparable!"
Considering the tactical AR is a Gallente attempt to mimic the SCR, I say it's a fair comparison.

"Okay, fine they're comparable, but the scrambler rifle has a lot more range than the tactical assault rifle!"
Nope. Look at this thread by Rattati, the second graph. While the damages are no longer relevant, the ranges are still correct. The ranges in the graph are displayed in centimeters instead of meters, but as you can see, the effective range difference is only like 5 meters.

"The +20 to shields / - 20% against armor damage profile is not fair to shields!"
1) That exact damage profile exists for the assault scrambler rifle, the laser rifle, and the scrambler pistol, yet I don't see anyone complaining about these.
2) The explosive damage profile is the exact reverse, with -20% against shields / +20% against armor. Mass drivers, flaylock pistols, remote explosives, and locus grenades are just as biased against armor.

"My parents were killed by a scrambler rifle, and I have sworn revenge against it!"
I know . . . I was the one who killed them that night! I was part of a radical Minmatar organization who grew clones of Amarr citizens so that mercenaries like us can transfer our consciousness and "respawn" into them. We killed the originals while they were on off-world trips, and assumed their identities to gain access to Amarr society. Once we got in with those identities, we plotted to gain access to Amarr armament facilities, and use those weapons to incur mass casualties on the Amarr population as a means to pressure the local holders (nobles who own slaves) to release our fellow Minmatar from slavery. It was in one of such attacks in which the cell that I belonged to wreaked havoc on the populace, and I killed your parents with a scrambler rifle!

"NOOOOOOOOOO! How could you?! You b*st*rd! You're a monster!!"
That may be so, but the scrambler rifle is not overpowered.

"You think I care about whether some gun is overpowered anymore?! My parents are dead because of you!!"
Look, I'm not going to lie and say I regret the things I've done, and that I'm sorry, because I'm not. In retrospect, the attacks on that Amarr colony didn't accomplish much, but at the time, I thought it was justified, and if I didn't know what I know now, I would have carried out those same actions all over again. I know it's not what you want to hear, but it's the truth, and I don't want to insult your intelligence by telling you otherwise. I know this will not be any consolation, but me killing your parents started the chain of events resulting in you becoming an soldier, and later on an immortal mercenary. You kind of owe me for your eternal life.

Your comparing a burst style weapon to the assault rifle (a standard damage over time weapon). your logic is incorrect.
the POINT is that a player can charge up the rifle, jump out of cover and hit a target, then fire a few shots and get a kill, then jump back into cover all in 3.2 SECONDS????

That is the imbalance players perceive. this weapon doesn't do a certain damage per second, IT GETS KILLS PER SECOND. I wouldn't mind it if the charge shot had large recoil afterwards so you couldn't just continue firing. THEN it would have some balance

'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
P14GU3 Savage Bullet 1153	Posted - 2015.01.24 01:50:00 - [1] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Jack the Rlpper wrote: Actually the scr even with 2 less paper still does more in general becuse of its profile being +20% to shield and the ar is only +10% Funny how you bring up bonus damage to shields, yet ignore lost damage to armor. You only look at the side that support your claim, and ignore the side that shows the weapon's weakness. You mean the -20% to armor that is practically non existent due to the Scramblers damage profile? How many shot does it take to take out 600 armor with a scrambler? Multiply damage against armor by the amount of shots it takes to kill the a 600 armor suit. Know that most armor based suits have little shield. So what, one or two shots to take out a gal assaults 194 shield. Another 6 to 8 for the armor. Let's say 10 to be fair. You still haven't overheated. What are you firing at most armor based suits? 12 shots max? Shooting at heavies, and complaining about overheat is foolish. The fact that you can take out a heavy without reloading is the definition of OP itself. Actually, I was a full time ScR user who now uses the TAC because it is simply the better rifle. The kick on the Tac doesnt matter because they are dead before it become noticeable with max skills. Better profile, more damage, same range/rof, barely more kick, no overheat. TAR/CR are my go-to weapons now. 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
P14GU3 Savage Bullet 1162	Posted - 2015.01.25 21:30:00 - [2] - Quote Charli Chaplin jr wrote: Zepod wrote: I don't think the SCRs are overpowered, however I do believe that there needs to be a Rifle that can kill Armor just as fast as the Scrambler Rifle can kill Shields. I totaly agree with you. the Scr 1hit kills my pro cal scout but there's no other weapon that can do the same to an armor based scout. Bolt pistol, sniper rifle, mass driver.. 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
P14GU3 UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 1314	Posted - 2015.03.11 15:04:00 - [3] - Quote Cypher Nil wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: Frankly, I'm sick of constantly seeing nerf threads on th subject, so I'm going to try explain a few things. "The charge shot damage is too high!" 1) The prototype scrambler rifle does 71 damage. A charge shot does 3.5x regular damage, so a charge shot does 248.5 damage. It takes 2 seconds to charge the shot. Factor that seconds in the DPS, and it's a pitiful 124.25 DPS. 2) The heat generated from a charge shot is very punishing, making a missed shot a massive waste, and can lead to death. With Amarr assault level 5, you can fire 13 more shots after a charge shot before overheating. Without Amarr assault, you can only fire 7 regular shots before overheating. "The regular damage is too high!" Actually, the tactical assault rifle of the same tier does more damage. The prototype scrambler rifle does 71 damage, and the prototype tactical AR does 73. "The rate of fire is too too high!" Actually, the tactical assault rifle has the exact same rate of fire, 600, (with more damage, and no fear of overheat) "Stop comparing it to the tactical AR, they're totally different, and thus not comparable!" Considering the tactical AR is a Gallente attempt to mimic the SCR, I say it's a fair comparison. "Okay, fine they're comparable, but the scrambler rifle has a lot more range than the tactical assault rifle!" Nope. Look at this thread by Rattati, the second graph. While the damages are no longer relevant, the ranges are still correct. The ranges in the graph are displayed in centimeters instead of meters, but as you can see, the effective range difference is only like 5 meters. "The +20 to shields / - 20% against armor damage profile is not fair to shields!" 1) That exact damage profile exists for the assault scrambler rifle, the laser rifle, and the scrambler pistol, yet I don't see anyone complaining about these. 2) The explosive damage profile is the exact reverse, with -20% against shields / +20% against armor. Mass drivers, flaylock pistols, remote explosives, and locus grenades are just as biased against armor. "My parents were killed by a scrambler rifle, and I have sworn revenge against it!" I know . . . I was the one who killed them that night! I was part of a radical Minmatar organization who grew clones of Amarr citizens so that mercenaries like us can transfer our consciousness and "respawn" into them. We killed the originals while they were on off-world trips, and assumed their identities to gain access to Amarr society. Once we got in with those identities, we plotted to gain access to Amarr armament facilities, and use those weapons to incur mass casualties on the Amarr population as a means to pressure the local holders (nobles who own slaves) to release our fellow Minmatar from slavery. It was in one of such attacks in which the cell that I belonged to wreaked havoc on the populace, and I killed your parents with a scrambler rifle! *"NOOOOOOOOOO! How could you?! You bstrd! You're a monster!!"* That may be so, but the scrambler rifle is not overpowered. "You think I care about whether some gun is overpowered anymore?! My parents are dead because of you!!" Look, I'm not going to lie and say I regret the things I've done, and that I'm sorry, because I'm not. In retrospect, the attacks on that Amarr colony didn't accomplish much, but at the time, I thought it was justified, and if I didn't know what I know now, I would have carried out those same actions all over again. I know it's not what you want to hear, but it's the truth, and I don't want to insult your intelligence by telling you otherwise. I know this will not be any consolation, but me killing your parents started the chain of events resulting in you becoming an soldier, and later on an immortal mercenary. You kind of owe me for your eternal life. Your comparing a burst style weapon to the assault rifle (a standard damage over time weapon). your logic is incorrect. the POINT is that a player can charge up the rifle, jump out of cover and hit a target, then fire a few shots and get a kill, then jump back into cover all in 3.2 SECONDS???? That is the imbalance players perceive. this weapon doesn't do a certain damage per second, IT GETS KILLS PER SECOND. I wouldn't mind it if the charge shot had large recoil afterwards so you couldn't just continue firing. THEN it would have some balance Plasma cannon does the exact same thing. Is it OP too? 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.