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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 12 post(s) |
BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3441
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Posted - 2014.12.09 11:41:00 -
[1] - Quote
Any changes to shields? Or is it just regular armor plates?
supercalifragilisticexpialidocious
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3441
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Posted - 2014.12.09 11:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:I'll be completely honest. Armor plates were rarely used by me as is, I now see no reason to use them ever again.
They cost more PG, have a speed penalty, and now only give a marginal increase in HP compared to ferros and reactives.
Just my opinion, others might disagree, but even with current plates I only use them in edge cases.
The speed penalty should technically go down, probably to 1,2,3. Reactives give 60 hp and 1%, new basic plates give 60 hp and 3%.
I haven't used normal plates since the time ferros and reactives got buffed, although my new assault that I made in anticipation of 1.10 used enhanced plates to keep it's hp balanced with my EWAR cal assault, which is now no longer the case...
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3441
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Posted - 2014.12.09 11:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Valor Goat wrote:"Armor plates STD/ADV/PRO from 85/110/135 to 60/80/100"
Awesome, but you should normalize ferroscale plates' and reactives as a consequence of this or everyone will just put complex ferroscale plates that cost way less than armor plates in terms of PG and CPU and give you no movement penalties, at the cost of 25 hp.
STD plate - 60 HP, costs 9 CPU and 3 PG, 3% penalty Complex Ferroscale - 75 HP, 23 CPU and 8 PG, no penalty You pay 14 CPU and 5PG for an extra 15HP and -3% penalty.
Its actually the normal plates that need to be normalized, the old plates were made to penalize stacking on medium suits and to a small extent heavies, these plates keep those penalties and are now made to penalize scouts. Armor plates are just a huge pile of penalty now.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3441
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Posted - 2014.12.09 12:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
Valor Goat wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Valor Goat wrote:"Armor plates STD/ADV/PRO from 85/110/135 to 60/80/100"
Awesome, but you should normalize ferroscale plates' and reactives as a consequence of this or everyone will just put complex ferroscale plates that cost way less than armor plates in terms of PG and CPU and give you no movement penalties, at the cost of 25 hp.
STD plate - 60 HP, costs 9 CPU and 3 PG, 3% penalty Complex Ferroscale - 75 HP, 23 CPU and 8 PG, no penalty You pay 14 CPU and 5PG for an extra 15HP and -3% penalty. I was referring to complex armor plates. Complex armor plates - 100 HP, 37 CPU and 12 PG, 5% speed penalty plus strafe penalty Complex ferroscale plates - 75 HP, 23 CPU and 8 PG, 0% penalty of any kind You pay 14 more CPU and 4 PG plus +5% speed penalty and you lose strafe for 25 HP. Just say you don't want your ferros nerfed - you know it's coming.
Because they shouldn't be nerfed?
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3442
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Posted - 2014.12.09 13:28:00 -
[5] - Quote
Valor Goat wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Seriously, armor tankers use Damage Mods because that's ALL they can really use.
Actually, on that topic, you might notice Cat was a proponent of the ORIGINAL passive scan changes that would have made it viable to put some Precision Enhancers on Medium suits to help them see better, but that one got shouted down, meaning Damage Mods are still the only slot to put in Highs.
Also, shield suits have as much native HP regen as an armor suit gets through the use of THREE Complex Repair modules without fitting a single module at all, and you can easily boost that with a single Energizer and Regulator.
I skilled first into C/1 Assault, and use a fit with Extenders, a single Energizer, and a single Regulator. That enables me to fully regen my primary HP in SECONDS just by ducking out of the line of fire.
Let's also not forget that shield tankers are protesting the idea of Shield Extenders having a strafe penalty while the shield penalty can be fully countered with a SINGLE module, and the armor penalty cannot be countered at all. Kinetic Catalyzers only boost your Sprint speed, so when your Stamina is gone you're left at a crawl until it regenerates.
Back off the anti-armor crusade a little, buddy. Again, your repping has no delay, while our takes 5 seconds to start recharging, 3 seconds if you fit a regulator. That means 5 seconds of taking TOTALLY AND LITERALLY 0 DAMAGE, NOT EVEN 1 HP. My anti-armor crusade is justified and I'm sick of the armor tanking meta.
Sick of shieldtanksthatdontknowhowtofitashieldtanksotheycomplainaboutarmor meta
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3442
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Posted - 2014.12.09 13:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Valor Goat wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Seriously, armor tankers use Damage Mods because that's ALL they can really use.
Actually, on that topic, you might notice Cat was a proponent of the ORIGINAL passive scan changes that would have made it viable to put some Precision Enhancers on Medium suits to help them see better, but that one got shouted down, meaning Damage Mods are still the only slot to put in Highs.
Also, shield suits have as much native HP regen as an armor suit gets through the use of THREE Complex Repair modules without fitting a single module at all, and you can easily boost that with a single Energizer and Regulator.
I skilled first into C/1 Assault, and use a fit with Extenders, a single Energizer, and a single Regulator. That enables me to fully regen my primary HP in SECONDS just by ducking out of the line of fire.
Let's also not forget that shield tankers are protesting the idea of Shield Extenders having a strafe penalty while the shield penalty can be fully countered with a SINGLE module, and the armor penalty cannot be countered at all. Kinetic Catalyzers only boost your Sprint speed, so when your Stamina is gone you're left at a crawl until it regenerates.
Back off the anti-armor crusade a little, buddy. Again, your repping has no delay, while our takes 5 seconds to start recharging, 3 seconds if you fit a regulator. That means 5 seconds of taking TOTALLY AND LITERALLY 0 DAMAGE, NOT EVEN 1 HP. My anti-armor crusade is justified and I'm sick of the armor tanking meta. Sick of shieldtanksthatdontknowhowtofitashieldtanksotheycomplainaboutarmor meta Seriously, running Caldari Assault I never feel at a disadvantage against an armor suit. Now, if you want to talk weapons, I think the currently massive damage bonuses on each side need some work. A Combat Rifle will eat an armor tanker like they aren't even trying, and a Scrambler Rifle will do the exact same to a shield tanker. If anything, I think we need to look at backing down the racial damage bonuses a little.
I asked CCP to fix this a million times and they never even reply. All they need to do is change the weapon damage prof bonus to 1 or 2% damage per level.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3442
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Posted - 2014.12.09 14:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
This is gonna sound crazy but can we nerf the regular AR dps, buff it's range to 50M and leave the breach as the short range version?
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3442
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Posted - 2014.12.09 14:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Valor Goat wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Valor Goat wrote: Armor has no delay in repping. Armor has rep tools. Armor has triage hives. Armor has damage mods on high slots. And more that I don't mention because it is compensated.
I'm sure a slight nerf to ferros to make balance them with the new armor plates won't make shields OP.
Shields have infinitely stronger BASE recharge, and that recharge can be increased to insane levels with a single module. Rep tools < Guns - Unless you're a sentinel who has a giant ass HMG, don't expect reps mid battle Triage hives force you to remain stationary, perfect grenade target (And they're also quite uncommon on the battlefield now-a-days) Shields have LITERALLY EVERY USEFUL UTILITY MODULE in low slots. Like, choose anything you would like, literally everything but damage mods you have. Not to mention that I expect 1-2 damps on Assaults to be the new meta in 1.10, so shield suits will have an easier time. Wanna talk about PG and CPU? Our 54/11 to your 23/8, with the same amount of HP lol, and we even have a penalty. -not comparing to armor plates because quite none uses them outside of heavies and scrub assaults and it's gonna be even worse. Than Damage mods > all. EDIT: I often have min logis with their ******* reps on my cal assault farming WP on my kills, no idea of what matches you are playing. 1 Armor HP < 1 Shield HP Ours doesn't regenerate nearly as fast buddy, and it doesn't get 1100 DPS from HMG's.
Also most weapons are anti armor, and any weapons that are antishields are extremely limited in effectiveness barring the SCR which murders everything..
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3444
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Posted - 2014.12.09 21:03:00 -
[9] - Quote
Valor Goat wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Valor Goat wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Meeko Fent wrote: And fitting a shield suit as shield makes me substantially weaker for front lining.
As we all can agree, armor is better suited for CQC, which every map forces. At that point I have to brick to get to a good HP for close in fighting. Throwing away my advantage in having really strong regen. Sure base regen is good, but it's nothing to write home about. Better then armor, but still quite meh. You need to mod it to be very good. And I sacrifice that for being viable in CQC.
Which I have to do to take obbys effectively.
They work, mainly thanks to bricking, but pure shield is very much reliant on a playstyle that you can't win matches with.
The armor adjustment should be fine however. It's not a big issue since bricking is a thing, and still will.
"Nothing to write home about" One energizer and you're at 52hp/s. One regulator and the delay is 3.9 seconds. That means full shield HP on a Cal Assault (Around 600HP) in 14 seconds. Compare that to armor regen that in a best case scenario, in very rare suits, you will see 30hp/s. When they're at 30hp/s, they either have half of your HP, or are moving like snails and have equal HP to you. Armor cannot compete in the regen game, shields win at it big time. You get 540 aHP by fitting two reps and three reactives (I.E. 30hp/s), that ain't half of our HP, nor you are moving like a snail, but even then moving slow is compensated by the nonexistent delay. Than if that's not enough you still have your triage hives (or a repper on you). So, basically... I have 80 less armor than you have shields. Clearly that's not a good reason to have 30hp/s. And your shield regen is still 22hp/s higher. Put on a reg and those delays become lol. lel Yeah, with ADV fluxes, std SMG and compact nanohive I would make a gallente assault god-mode fit too. Honestly though I don't find the constant regen to be such a thing for the gal assault since it is more for speed than for HP, the assault I really struggle to kill because he keeps regenerating as I shoot him through his 650-700 armor is the amarr assault, and after having that 20-30hp/s with unexistent delay he can still triple mod his Viziam ScR and fit an allotek nanohive - while shield tanking makes it impossible to do. <--- these kind of situations are the first source of my crusade againts armor tanking, the only way to kill it is to either throw a core nade on his face (you won't have the time to do that, I mean, he has an ScR on his hands) or to put my gun game at MAX level
Seems to me like your problem is with amarr suits not gallente suits, yet your armor witch hunt would not only nerf them but also gallente suits which are between balanced and UP.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3449
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Posted - 2014.12.11 11:20:00 -
[10] - Quote
Please don't reduce strafe speeds that really won't do anything except make everything look awkward, it also doesn't fix the problem that we have with strafing it just makes it less noticeable. The problem with strafing is being able to instantly change speeds without having to slow down.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3450
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Posted - 2014.12.12 05:40:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:Would any zoom changes on the burst assault rifle make it more competitive?
Very smal maybe, it doesn't operate at a range necessary for high zoom.
50M is borderline short-mid range. At 60M yes.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3450
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Posted - 2014.12.12 06:21:00 -
[12] - Quote
Tesfa Alem wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:ASCR needs love and the Burst, any users that want to get their weapons buffed? Carte blanche i want my small railgun turret buffed, and a few more tweaks to the large blaster. Infantry weapons that do need a bit more love: - Ion Pistol - Normal AR - Lazer Rifle - Scrambler Pistol Bolt pistol still needs to be looked at. - Kalikiota Bolt Pistol does 251 damage per shot - Kalikiota Sniper Rifle does 221 damage per shot - Ishikune Sniper rifle does 250 damage per shot If hipfire / noscope sniping is game breaking then why is the bolt pistol an mini hipfiring sniper rifle? It ought to have More bullets, less damage per bullet., a better ROF, and keep the same damage per clip.
What this guy said except the bolt which kinda sucks :/
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3451
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Posted - 2014.12.12 11:14:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jacques Cayton II wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Valor Goat wrote:Cat Merc wrote:Valor Goat wrote:"Armor plates STD/ADV/PRO from 85/110/135 to 60/80/100"
Awesome, but you should normalize ferroscale plates' and reactives as a consequence of this or everyone will just put complex ferroscale plates that cost way less than armor plates in terms of PG and CPU and give you no movement penalties, at the cost of 25 hp.
STD plate - 60 HP, costs 9 CPU and 3 PG, 3% penalty Complex Ferroscale - 75 HP, 23 CPU and 8 PG, no penalty You pay 14 CPU and 5PG for an extra 15HP and -3% penalty. I was referring to complex armor plates. Complex armor plates - 100 HP, 37 CPU and 12 PG, 5% speed penalty plus strafe penalty Complex ferroscale plates - 75 HP, 23 CPU and 8 PG, 0% penalty of any kind You pay 14 more CPU and 4 PG plus +5% speed penalty and you lose strafe for 25 HP. Just say you don't want your ferros nerfed - you know it's coming. Because they shouldn't be nerfed? Yea they should. Look at shield extenders low hp with a deadly stacking penalty to regen which forces you to put regulators on. Every module needs a stacking penalty. And sadly ferros should to. Since they are armor plates two possibilities 1 slow down slightly or 2 more cpu pg
No they shouldn't . Look at armor high hp but with a even deadlier stacking penalty to movement speed which forces you to put nothing on because nothing is available. Every module doesn't need a stacking penalty. And sadly ferros shouldn't . Since they are armor plates similar to some that exist in EVE that sacrifice hp for speed, also armor isn't stacked the same as shields so nerfing the hp of armor would nerf all buy the most basic and unimaginative of fits.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3451
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Posted - 2014.12.12 11:17:00 -
[14] - Quote
Jacques Cayton II wrote:30 hp regen after 4 secs..... adds a recharger or energizer now 45 or 50 after 4 secs. Puts hp on 5 sec.... puts reg on 3 sec. Goes to fight gal with brch ar at 60 m gets him down to half armor waits for shields pops out full armor repeat. Why cant i get his armor down. Sees its a logi with 4 rep hives cries on the inside
Yeah because this scenario happens all the time , also your range is probably 30-40M, since the breach does almost half it's dps at that range. Also if your energized is only getting you from 30-45, it means your shield skills are low or you are using a non proto suit, if the guy you fight had 4 hives he is in a proto suit... Just saying.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3451
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Posted - 2014.12.12 11:56:00 -
[15] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:ASCR needs love and the Burst, any users that want to get their weapons buffed?
Change the weapon prof bonus skill to %damage at 1 or 2% per level, this makes it so weapons don't hit brick walls. Something shield weapons suffer from, along with the combat rifles.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3451
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Posted - 2014.12.12 12:18:00 -
[16] - Quote
Valor Goat wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Jacques Cayton II wrote:30 hp regen after 4 secs..... adds a recharger or energizer now 45 or 50 after 4 secs. Puts hp on 5 sec.... puts reg on 3 sec. Goes to fight gal with brch ar at 60 m gets him down to half armor waits for shields pops out full armor repeat. Why cant i get his armor down. Sees its a logi with 4 rep hives cries on the inside Yeah because this scenario happens all the time , also your range is probably 30-40M, since the breach does almost half it's dps at that range. Also if your energized is only getting you from 30-45, it means your shield skills are low or you are using a non proto suit, if the guy you fight had 4 hives he is in a proto suit... Just saying. Breach AR's efficency is 100% at 60m range.
No it's not....
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3451
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Posted - 2014.12.12 12:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
Sinboto Simmons wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:ASCR needs love and the Burst, any users that want to get their weapons buffed? Would love it, I believe the profile was changed from the racial -5/+15, been gone for a while so may have been changed. Should it still be though I'd think that's be an impactful change. Or one more round like with the burst plasma rifle.
He isn't talking about the combat rifle
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3459
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Posted - 2014.12.12 23:24:00 -
[18] - Quote
Omg just change the weapon proficiency bonus to raw damage and you won't have any problems
At 1.5% damage per level ttk doesn't increase but weapons won't hit brickwalls on the opposition damaging tank.
All this ascr being bad started after the weapon balancing a year ago which nerfed this skill to what it is now.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3459
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Posted - 2014.12.12 23:30:00 -
[19] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:We could tone down racial profiles. Hybrid weapons would sit at +-5/+-5, Projectile at -7.5/+10, EM at +10/-10, Explosive at -10/+10.
Did you mean for projectile to get a net 2.5%?
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3468
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Posted - 2014.12.14 12:58:00 -
[20] - Quote
One parameter that we can look at is making shields passive but slightly faster than armor repair, and making armor repair slightly but higher in bigger cycles, for example an armor rep would do 8 hp in 3 seconds while a shield rep would do 3 hp in one.
Then, like in EVE, we could have modules that lower the intervals for armor, we then move rechargers, death to regulators, to the low slot which would also end up increasing overall shield hp and now everybody is happy!
You might also like this instead of nerfing hp stacking, https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2514287#post2514287 it is a lot more work to implement than just a raw hp stacking nerf but the end result of this would make the game so much fun!
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3469
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Posted - 2014.12.14 14:07:00 -
[21] - Quote
Vitantur Nothus wrote:Funkmaster Whale wrote:I'm honestly baffled that nerfing strafe speeds is something that's on the table. Effective strafing is the only way a low HP suit can outplay brick-tanked Sentinels. Last I checked this was an FPS not a turn-based RPG. You seriously want to make the game more slow paced and ultimately easier for HMGs and laser-accurate Breach ARs?
I just don't know anymore. I've stuck with this game a long time. Nerfing movement speed is just something that makes me entirely lose faith. With respect, is gyrating-in-place an FPS staple? I've played lots of shooters, and I haven't encountered wiggle-wiggling anywhere but here. Here's an example of strafe and counter-strafe as deliberate lateral movements: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2SlbYkzAGo^ Note the distinct lack of gyrating-in-place.
Edit: Wiggle-wiggling has less to do with strafe speed than movement mechanics. The "right way" to fix wiggle-wiggling would involve changes to inertia or acceleration. These seem to be non-options ... but that doesn't mean we can ignore the issue.
Notice how when he move side to side his character slows down, instead of changing directions instantly. That is th only problem with strafing in dust. Strafing is a nice fps mechanic, but you need the proper physics for it which dust lacks. Because of that we have to fix strafing by some means, the alternative being the speed.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3470
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Posted - 2014.12.14 14:13:00 -
[22] - Quote
Vitantur Nothus wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote: Notice how when he move side to side his character slows down, instead of changing directions instantly. That is th only problem with strafing in dust. Strafing is a nice fps mechanic, but you need the proper physics for it which dust lacks. Because of that we have to fix strafing by some means, the alternative being the speed.
Yes! Inertia is the key! You'd think our Unreal Engine would have inertia parameters buried somewhere.
Well tanks have them, you cant put a tank in full reverse without slowing down first.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3478
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Posted - 2014.12.15 16:54:00 -
[23] - Quote
Jadd Hatchen wrote:HOLY COW!!!
It's been how long and STILL no one has pointed out the unbalanced parity issue with the ARMOR SPEED NERF YET? I even pointed it out a few pages back and no one commented on it?
WTF?! Has the world gone blind?
I like the armor nerf that is proposed, but there is NO NERF BEING INSTITUTED FOR SHIELDS!!! How does that fix the problem? Yeah, that's right, it only fixes HALF THE PROBLEM!!!
And it's these half-assed fixed that end up unbalancing the game and making even more problems!!!!
Come on already! Use your brains and not your assess. If you created a penalty to the armor plates for game balance then you need to do a a different yet equivalent penalty for the shield extenders!!! Or else the meta will shift to sheilds and you will get an imbalance!!!!
Come on! This is simple game-theory 101.
Ratatti said he wasn't going to nerf armor , at least not with the proposed nerf
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3499
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Posted - 2014.12.23 01:27:00 -
[24] - Quote
There are a couple of reasons to my proposal, one to allow for better balance by making shield tanking slightly simpler, to borrow from the balance EVE has achieved, and to open up module slots (by eliminating regulators which don't exist in EVE) for better customization.
In EVE shields rep very fast and have a nice constant stream of healing, while armor has slow but very high burst heals. I want for Dust to take some ideas from EVE to achieve balance (weapon systems, dropsuits, vehicles) obviously not 100% but some of the basics, why throw away 10 years of balance when it can easily work here !
IMO shields and armor are balanced but only because of massive HP module stacking which is just boring, we have a whole plethora of unused modules that cannot be accesed because of how dropsuits are balanced.
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BL4CKST4R
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
3501
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Posted - 2014.12.23 18:21:00 -
[25] - Quote
GLOBAL fils'de RAGE wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:I actually forgot to write the HMG nerf, in the form of heat, again.
Removing headshot bonus is actually something we can look at too, but that eliminates skill in heavy vs heavy. So many times am I bested by someone that knows how to aim, don't want to mess with that.
Managing heat is the way to go to reward skill, you want to get that window of opportunity during the animation to get your kill. GAU's and miniguns do not overheat- RL fact based on physics. Rail guns do not recoil another RL fact.
Minmatar weapons =/= rl weapons. And minmatar ammo def =/= rl ammo, ever shot a depleted uranium shell? Neither have I.
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