DUST Search - equipment spam and my solution.

Kaeru Nayiri wrote:

John Demonsbane wrote:

*facepalm*

Wow, your total lack of insight just boggles the mind. A quote from an old TV show comes to mind:
"My god you are so dumb it makes me tired"

I am an Amarr logi. Please explain to me how your proposal helps me. It results in:
- me being able to use LESS equipment than I do now.
- still being able to use THE SAME amount as some spam monkey who only drops 6 uplinks at the start of a match, possibly from a scout suit, and never setting foot in a logi suit again for the rest of the battle?

How is that an improvement, exactly? You say yourself everyone will run some links. What bizarro world do you live in where that "protects" logis?

And before you employ your typical ignorant ad hominem "argument": Dont bother, I have been an Amarr logi since the suit was un-broken in 1.2 and was a "logi" (there was only one) in beta - Feel free to click the link in my signature. I also have 8 weapons to proto and am part of the original beta logi tradition of omnisoldiers. Do not presume to lecture me on how to do my job.

They EXPLICITLY said no one will have the as much bandwidth as a Logi. How are you figuring some spam monkey is going to have as many uplinks up as you? The idea is to bring down total number of deployables and make logis desireable because, even though they deploy less equipment than they do now, they will be able to deploy much more than any other suit.


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John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4589	Posted - 2014.11.19 03:33:00 - [1] - Quote facepalm Wow, your total lack of insight just boggles the mind. A quote from an old TV show comes to mind: "My god you are so dumb it makes me tired" I am an Amarr logi. Please explain to me how your proposal helps me. It results in: - me being able to use LESS equipment than I do now. - still being able to use THE SAME amount as some spam monkey who only drops 6 uplinks at the start of a match, possibly from a scout suit, and never setting foot in a logi suit again for the rest of the battle? How is that an improvement, exactly? You say yourself everyone will run some links. What bizarro world do you live in where that "protects" logis? And before you employ your typical ignorant ad hominem "argument": Dont bother, I have been an Amarr logi since the suit was un-broken in 1.2 and was a "logi" (there was only one) in beta - Feel free to click the link in my signature. I also have 8 weapons to proto and am part of the original beta logi tradition of omnisoldiers. Do not presume to lecture me on how to do my job. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4598	Posted - 2014.11.19 17:38:00 - [2] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: facepalm Wow, your total lack of insight just boggles the mind. A quote from an old TV show comes to mind: "My god you are so dumb it makes me tired" I am an Amarr logi. Please explain to me how your proposal helps me. It results in: - me being able to use LESS equipment than I do now. - still being able to use THE SAME amount as some spam monkey who only drops 6 uplinks at the start of a match, possibly from a scout suit, and never setting foot in a logi suit again for the rest of the battle? How is that an improvement, exactly? You say yourself everyone will run some links. What bizarro world do you live in where that "protects" logis? And before you employ your typical ignorant ad hominem "argument": Dont bother, I have been an Amarr logi since the suit was un-broken in 1.2 and was a "logi" (there was only one) in beta - Feel free to click the link in my signature. I also have 8 weapons to proto and am part of the original beta logi tradition of omnisoldiers. Do not presume to lecture me on how to do my job. They EXPLICITLY said no one will have the as much bandwidth as a Logi. How are you figuring some spam monkey is going to have as many uplinks up as you? The idea is to bring down total number of deployables and make logis desireable because, even though they deploy less equipment than they do now, they will be able to deploy much more than any other suit. I know. I was talking about the OP's proposal. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4601	Posted - 2014.11.19 18:07:00 - [3] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: most all logi cannot fit a mostly proto tank AND proto equipment and proto weapon.. Why do you need all three? (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4601	Posted - 2014.11.19 18:26:00 - [4] - Quote No system is perfect, everyone will have to make some kind of sacrifice in order to limit EQ spam. This way, IMO, impacts everyone except logi's far more than it does logi's. This topic has been the central point of debate at least 3-4 times in this game's history, and I've been fighting proposals that had huge potential to nerf logi's every time. This is unquestionably the best proposal I've yet seen that will both: A) Work B) Be a lot harder on non-logi's than on logis. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4610	Posted - 2014.11.19 22:20:00 - [5] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: doubt it.. scouts wont have to sacrifice anything neither will assaults commandos sentinels HAVs LAVs or ADS/DS.. this change is only geared at screwing logi's over This I still don't get. Do you actually understand how this thing works? Currently someone in a scout suit can run unlimited equipment. With BW, they can only have like 3 active at proto. Sentinels, same thing. Spawn in a logi suit, spam uplinks, switch to sentinel suit and mow down people with HMG while farming uplink WP. WIth BW someone in a sentinel suit can have zero active equipment. Sounds like a sacrifice to me. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4613	Posted - 2014.11.19 22:56:00 - [6] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: Apothecary Za'ki wrote: doubt it.. scouts wont have to sacrifice anything neither will assaults commandos sentinels HAVs LAVs or ADS/DS.. this change is only geared at screwing logi's over This I still don't get. Do you actually understand how this thing works? Currently someone in a scout suit can run unlimited equipment. With BW, they can only have like 3 active at proto. Sentinels, same thing. Spawn in a logi suit, spam uplinks, switch to sentinel suit and mow down people with HMG while farming uplink WP. WIth BW someone in a sentinel suit can have zero active equipment. Sounds like a sacrifice to me. hmm so sentinels get 0 bandwidth? hmmm i must go deeper Yes you do! Feel free to start here. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4613	Posted - 2014.11.19 23:03:00 - [7] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Ku Shala wrote: this will just leave pubs without uplinks and hives more equipment less usage is the solution example: 20 uplinks can be carried that allow 3 spawns only, same restrictions we currently have Or just put a restriction on the amount of uplinks you can have out. Lump uplinks as one thing, not seperated as they are. As it is now I can have 7 links out using different versions of uplinks. The way I suggest is once you have 3 of one type (or mixed) you can lay no more out. Are you going to pay for my respec if that happens so I can get out of the Amarr logi suit? (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4654	Posted - 2014.11.20 23:32:00 - [8] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: Tebu Gan wrote: Ku Shala wrote: this will just leave pubs without uplinks and hives more equipment less usage is the solution example: 20 uplinks can be carried that allow 3 spawns only, same restrictions we currently have Or just put a restriction on the amount of uplinks you can have out. Lump uplinks as one thing, not seperated as they are. As it is now I can have 7 links out using different versions of uplinks. The way I suggest is once you have 3 of one type (or mixed) you can lay no more out. Are you going to pay for my respec if that happens so I can get out of the Amarr logi suit? well where were you when they nerfed reptools with that god aweful Points per minute cap and more recently you only get triage points from targets who have recently killed some one. hmm? that was the ONE THING minmatar logi were good at.. That was early in beta. I was not on the forums at the time. From what I was told restrictions and some kind of cap absolutely needed to be put in place because the WP farming was over-the-top ludicrous. People were pulling thousands on thousands of WP repping setinels shooting MD's at their own feet, installations being shot at by tanks, another person repping that tank as the installation was shooting it, others repping the freaking MCC, it was crazy. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4665	Posted - 2014.11.21 22:36:00 - [9] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: I remember this thread and the irony in your reposting seems lost on you considering it's basically 18 pages of defense of Logistics playstyle that will be eliminated with BW imposition as proposed. BW imposition that, largely, is agreed upon as not really eliminating the spam issue it's meant to address. Ever heard the phrase, "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"? You're giving up a bird in our hand for nothing in a bush. Thats a nerf . EDIT: Oh, and handing over Athena Sentinel the victory s/he was looking for in posting that thread. So, one, how is that "largely" agreed upon, exactly? By whom.. You and the OP? As for that fool Athena, what victory? Never got what she wanted, and still won't. I can still swap at a supply depot to switch from an uplink suit to a medic suit, or even a nanohive suit, provided I don't need (not want) more than 8 pieces of EQ out, which I rarely do. This is basically the last time I'm going to respond to one of your posts on the subject of BW because it's simply not getting anywhere. Amarrian God as my witness, I honestly don't think you have the slightest clue how this system really works and what it's intended to do. I am not trolling in any way when I say that. Your comments about this being a buff to scouts somehow, for example, simply defy logic. Bandwith is not a fcking buff to scouts, that makes exactly zero sense. It's not a major buff to logis either, but, stay with me here, thats not the purpose of it. The purpose is to limit EQ spam as much as possible while limiting the impact on dedicated logis as much as possible.* To put it another way, BANDWITH NERFS EVERYONE'S ABILITY TO DROP EQUIPMENT. IT NERFS LOGIS SUBSTANTIALLY LESS. WE ARE NOT TRYING TO TOTALLY FIX LOGIS HERE WITH THIS ONE THING AND STOP THERE. The major buffs to logis are still needed, still on the table, and are not directly related to this in any way. Tell you what, give me a better proposal. Come up with an actual proposal specifically designed to reduce spam.: - Not some nebulous combination of things we've been talking about in Cross' thread. - Not buffing logis in a way unrelated to equipment. Focus! - Not nerfing scouts in a way unrelated to equipment (your scout rage is clouding your judgement, tbh) - Not solo orbitals - Not the radius thing which, yes, is a great idea, which is why I've suggested it 83 times, but you can claim to be whatever amazing coding guru you want, if the developers of the damn game specifically say they can't do it, I'm gonna drop it and move on to something that can actually be done.\ - Not some pie in the sky idea that's not practical - and for the love of God not a blanket restriction of x number of peices of equipment on everyone. Anyone who thinks that's a better solution from the logi perspective should be immediately sterilized as for the good of the human race they should not be allowed to pass on their DNA. Do not mention any of those things, give me a better way to do it that's feasible, will, work, and have much less effect on people in logi suits than everyone else. Do that and I'll stop supporting BW and promote yours. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4668	Posted - 2014.11.22 03:11:00 - [10] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Oh, and John? If you don't feel that responding to me is in your best interest I'm ok with that. I'll continue pointing out where you're illogical or incorrect and you can sit mute with nothing to say just like anyone else who's entirely bloated on their own opinion and has the flaws in it made readily apparent for anyone else who comes along to see. If, that's how you want to be. Well, considering that, instead of an actual proposal for EQ spam, you repeated the same off-topic ideas I predicted you would, I think I'm good. It's too bad you wouldn't rather take this idea and improve upon it with ones that actually have some merit in exploring, like the reviving EQ with reptools concept. Instead you dismiss it out of hand, propose fixes to unrelated things, or perseverate on solutions that are not workable. Speaking of which, if you'd like to sit there with your fingers in your ears yelling "lalalala I can't hear you" until CCP Glinda finally admits that, yes Dorothy, we had the power all along, we just didn't want to make the three mouse clicks necessary to enact the installation radius thing, we were just trolling... you go ahead and do that. I'm moving on to find something we can fix. (The godfather of tactical logistics)

John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4681	Posted - 2014.11.22 12:46:00 - [11] - Quote . bwd23 wrote: I do have an even easier solution which was my second choice. It even fixes two big problems at once, and yet again, simple. If you switch suits at supply you lose the suit. It does not count as a death, yet you lose one of that suit. It would make spamming or switching to refill HP very expensive quickly. Yeah, even if you could do the radius thing, 40m is a ginormous area, on some maps it would make certain points very hard to defend. Your second idea I don't see as an improvement, certainly not from the logi side. Most complaints come from logis who want the option to switch to other suits if needed, This would come down even harder on them, not to mention the hammer on new players it represents. (The godfather of tactical logistics)