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TRULY ELITE
WarRavens Capital Punishment.
117
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Posted - 2014.11.03 18:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
I like to use racial weapons on my suits as much as possible and I would love to fit the Magsec on my Caldari asault but it really has no advantages over the SMG and more specifically the breach SMG. The kick itself combined with the seemingly longer TTK just makes killing people a slugfest and by the time you have their shields down you then have that kick to deal with. On the other hand the breach SMG in particular as a lot less kick, higher mag size, no charge up time and what seems like more damage or a higher ROF which makes it a much better weapon than the Magsec. A way to buff I think would to outright increase the damage and lower the kick because right now, it isn't viable at all. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
4389
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Posted - 2014.11.03 18:45:00 -
[2] - Quote
Magsec can outrange and kill HMG sentinels. at 45m you can kill a sentinel in an shield tanked caldari suit from 100% to 0%.
You have to get within the fatty's optimal to do the same with the standard SMG.
EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
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CUSE WarLord
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
1
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Posted - 2014.11.03 18:53:00 -
[3] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Magsec can outrange and kill HMG sentinels. at 45m you can kill a sentinel in an shield tanked caldari suit from 100% to 0%.
You have to get within the fatty's optimal to do the same with the standard SMG. a heavy running around out in the open can be killed by all most anything. Magsec needs some love as it is still one of the worst sidearms.
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
4389
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Posted - 2014.11.03 18:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
I've gotten some nice utility out of it.
Buffing it isn't gonna make me cry though
EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
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CUSE WarLord
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
1
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Posted - 2014.11.03 19:12:00 -
[5] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:I've gotten some nice utility out of it.
Buffing it isn't gonna make me cry though haveing a charge up time on a sidearm that you switch to in a gunfight seems to be a big drawback. take some of the kick out give it a reddot sight and a silencer and then its boss.
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TRULY ELITE
WarRavens Capital Punishment.
118
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Posted - 2014.11.03 20:31:00 -
[6] - Quote
CUSE WarLord wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:I've gotten some nice utility out of it.
Buffing it isn't gonna make me cry though haveing a charge up time on a sidearm that you switch to in a gunfight seems to be a big drawback. take some of the kick out give it a reddot sight and a silencer and then its boss. ^ also instead of killing heavies from 45m with a Magsec I'd obviously just pull out my RailRifle. I want a sidearm that is effective in CQC and racially correct. The only Caldari weapon that can do this is the bolt pistol. Get 1 shot on em and wipe their shields then finish with the rail. |
DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
5775
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Posted - 2014.11.03 20:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
It already does better than the AR at range and had one of the best hip fire boxes out of any of the weapons in Dust. What more does it need?
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TRULY ELITE
WarRavens Capital Punishment.
118
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Posted - 2014.11.03 20:42:00 -
[8] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:It already does better than the AR at range and had one of the best hip fire boxes out of any of the weapons in Dust. What more does it need? You have no idea how easy it is to out strafe the Magsec. Because of the charge up time they have to stop firing if you move around a corner because spamming shots just increase the recoil and then you'll have to reload. All they have to do is jump around like a headless chicken and they'll wreak you. |
Terry Webber
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
475
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Posted - 2014.11.03 20:47:00 -
[9] - Quote
I rarely ever see the magsec on the killfeed during a match. That may be an indication of it needing a change or it may be well-balanced and it's just not very popular. I would need to see some statistics to decide between these two situations. |
TRULY ELITE
WarRavens Capital Punishment.
119
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Posted - 2014.11.03 21:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
Terry Webber wrote:I rarely ever see the magsec on the killfeed during a match. That may be an indication of it needing a change or it may be well-balanced and it's just not very popular. I would need to see some statistics to decide between these two situations. It has no advantages to the SMG. Nuff said. |
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
4415
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Posted - 2014.11.03 21:34:00 -
[11] - Quote
TRULY ELITE wrote:Terry Webber wrote:I rarely ever see the magsec on the killfeed during a match. That may be an indication of it needing a change or it may be well-balanced and it's just not very popular. I would need to see some statistics to decide between these two situations. It has no advantages to the SMG. Nuff said. I disagree, but playstyle and opinion has more bearing on the argument than anything else, so pointless to try and convince you
EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
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zzZaXxx
Vengeance Unbound
621
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Posted - 2014.11.03 21:55:00 -
[12] - Quote
Agreed it needs something. I think its ADS recoil could be reduced more, both min and max, but at least the max. It has good range but it tickles too much. It should be as devastating at range as the SMG is close up. An ADS recoil reduction would do it. To balance this buff its hipfire recoil could be increased (but not charge up time). Sound familiar? This worked well to balance the RR. Why not apply the same concept to the SMG that fills the exact same role among sidearms? |
hfderrtgvcd
1071
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Posted - 2014.11.03 22:06:00 -
[13] - Quote
I think halfing the charge time and reducing the kick a bit should be fine.
You can't fight in here! This is the war room.
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G Felix
100
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Posted - 2014.11.03 22:09:00 -
[14] - Quote
I have the Magsec to lvl 3 and have experimented with an array of fits, but have yet to find a situation where the Breach SMG or Scrambler Pistol variant don't outperform it. I really like the idea of the Magsec, and can see it's potential as a nice offset to high ROF shorter range primary weapons such as the HMG or AR, but as of yet it just doesn't seem to get the job done.
Dust can be frustrating. (Gò»°Gûí°)Gò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+)
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Ariadne Broadside
Army of 420's
0
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Posted - 2014.11.04 02:24:00 -
[15] - Quote
I have noticed that even using the Milita MagSec SMG, I can still kill Heavy's if ADS towards the upper body, Unless you have damage mods however I can see how underpowered this weapon is because in other loadouts without a sidearm bonus this weapon fails and I endup picking my battles carefully when switching to my backup |
DeathwindRising
ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance
636
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Posted - 2014.11.04 08:08:00 -
[16] - Quote
TRULY ELITE wrote:Terry Webber wrote:I rarely ever see the magsec on the killfeed during a match. That may be an indication of it needing a change or it may be well-balanced and it's just not very popular. I would need to see some statistics to decide between these two situations. It has no advantages to the SMG. Nuff said.
I use it. I even have the BPO and get kills with it. Against smg, it's fine on a shield tanked caldari suit, because the smg will have trouble getting through you shields a bit than you will. And the range is great too. How pissed would you be to killed by a militia magsec? |
VikingKong iBUN
T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K
160
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Posted - 2014.11.04 11:53:00 -
[17] - Quote
I love the range on it, and it's very nice for hip-firing but the iron sights are horrible. And the fact that it has a has a scope and silencer and looks really badass in the fitting screen, but then doesn't in game really bugs me. It looks awesome so I spend the SP and put it on my suit, and get all excited - then I get in game and it's a stubby little thing without the attachments and looks wack. Then i'm sad. |
ThePlayerkyle13
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
173
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Posted - 2014.11.04 16:00:00 -
[18] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Magsec can outrange and kill HMG sentinels. at 45m you can kill a sentinel in an shield tanked caldari suit from 100% to 0%.
You have to get within the fatty's optimal to do the same with the standard SMG.
This is true, with my Caldari Character is a Scout with Knifes & MagSMG, with a Flux to take out shields and the MagSMG to finish him off, good combo.
Don't F**K with Gamers Angry Joe style
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james jared
Vengeance Unbound RISE of LEGION
32
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Posted - 2014.11.04 16:50:00 -
[19] - Quote
I find the magsec smg is good on HMG fits. Gives u the range to fight ppl that u cant reach with the short HMG range. I find my self running around with it out and switching to the HMG when some one gets close. The kick gets prity bad after a cuple seconds of straght fire. I think a decrease in ADS kick and it would be in a good place. No other side arm can be effective at range fights like the magsec smg but the charge up time makes it a bad gun to swich to when ur main runs out of ammo.
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Xocoyol Zaraoul
Superior Genetics
2630
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Posted - 2014.11.04 18:24:00 -
[20] - Quote
The Magsec is a nice weapon when you lack a normal primary, such as using a Swarm or Forge, but when paired with any other primary it does seem to lack as it is more of a "substitute primary" then a "complementary secondary."
"You see those red dots over there?
Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
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Blueprint For Murder
Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State
435
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Posted - 2014.11.04 20:34:00 -
[21] - Quote
I would say the problem is the smg over preforms it is better close and at range because of its lack of recoil and for some reason has like no dispersion. The smaller barrel on the smg means it should have much more dispersion. The mag sec would then be the long range side full auto side arm while the smg would be a close range spray and pray as it should be.
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Bone Doc
Commando Perkone Caldari State
12
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Posted - 2015.01.17 22:31:00 -
[22] - Quote
The Magsec is a nice weapon by numbers but in practice it's just bad compare to the breach SMG,I dont care how much range the magsec has, you cant kill anything accuracy close or far compare to other SMG variants to merit using it, from it's weak performance in hipfire cqc combat to the recoil at range while ADS with the iron sights being so erratic and obstructive.
how to make it better: -Tighten the crosshairs more -Give it the holo scope it was meant to have as the nothing will be obstructive but a dot to aim. |
Fizzer XCIV
Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire
2279
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Posted - 2015.01.17 23:25:00 -
[23] - Quote
Beyond the longer range, which is worthless due to recoil and terrible ironsights, there is no reason to be using in in lieu of a Breach SMG.
BrSMGs are easier to fit, have more DPS, much more Damage per mag, better sights, more controllable recoil/kick, and a better damage profile for sidearms (because sidearms are more likely to be used against armor than shields), and it doesn't have a spool up time which hampers its use as a weapon to pull out after shields are dropped.
All in all, it ends up being a wash. The BrSMG is just superior for any and every occasion.
Home at Last <3
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Jathniel
G I A N T
1439
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Posted - 2015.01.18 17:31:00 -
[24] - Quote
The Magsec is garbage. I have to wait for it to spool up, just to get performance below that of a SMG? It has already been said, the Breach SMG is superior in every way. No firing delay. No ridiculous recoil. Sufficient range.
When my primary weapon runs out, the SMG is plenty sufficient to kill fully shielded enemies until I reach a supply depot or find a nanohive.
Rail weapons in general have too much kick, and that alone negates their range advantage.
The Magsec smg needs to have its recoil greatly reduced, and it needs a weapon sight similar to the Bolt Pistol, and maybe, just MAYBE, it'll be more viable.
Retired
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Vesta Opalus
T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance
305
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Posted - 2015.01.18 18:36:00 -
[25] - Quote
TRULY ELITE wrote:I like to use racial weapons on my suits as much as possible and I would love to fit the Magsec on my Caldari asault but it really has no advantages over the SMG and more specifically the breach SMG. The kick itself combined with the seemingly longer TTK just makes killing people a slugfest and by the time you have their shields down you then have that kick to deal with. On the other hand the breach SMG in particular as a lot less kick, higher mag size, no charge up time and what seems like more damage or a higher ROF which makes it a much better weapon than the Magsec. A way to buff I think would to outright increase the damage and lower the kick because right now, it isn't viable at all.
MagSec is poop, I support some tactical buffing |
Vesta Opalus
T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K General Tso's Alliance
305
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Posted - 2015.01.18 18:39:00 -
[26] - Quote
zzZaXxx wrote:Agreed it needs something. I think its ADS recoil could be reduced more, both min and max, but at least the max. It has good range but it tickles too much. It should be as devastating at range as the SMG is close up. An ADS recoil reduction would do it. To balance this buff its hipfire recoil could be increased (but not charge up time). Sound familiar? This worked well to balance the RR. Why not apply the same concept to the SMG that fills the exact same role among sidearms?
It does sound familiar, it sounds just like the changes made to the rail rifle which is now used about as much as the MagSec.
Maybe we should do something else :( |
Fizzer XCIV
Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire
2296
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Posted - 2015.01.18 18:45:00 -
[27] - Quote
Vesta Opalus wrote:zzZaXxx wrote:Agreed it needs something. I think its ADS recoil could be reduced more, both min and max, but at least the max. It has good range but it tickles too much. It should be as devastating at range as the SMG is close up. An ADS recoil reduction would do it. To balance this buff its hipfire recoil could be increased (but not charge up time). Sound familiar? This worked well to balance the RR. Why not apply the same concept to the SMG that fills the exact same role among sidearms? It does sound familiar, it sounds just like the changes made to the rail rifle which is now used about as much as the MagSec. Maybe we should do something else :(
The RR is far from being used "about as much as the MagSec".
In fact, the RR is the second most used light weapon in the game, which is roughly a tie between the Shotgun, CR, and itself. The Magsec is the second least used sidearm in the game, only beating the Ion Pistol.
Home at Last <3
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
3560
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Posted - 2015.01.18 21:14:00 -
[28] - Quote
Id like to see the MagSex be more viable.
It really isn't very good right now.
Perhaps making the CalAss bonus be towards reducing kick on racial weaponry would help it?
Also, silencer?
Makes the shots not make a sound as a variant...?
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I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
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Zindorak
Nyain Chan General Tso's Alliance
1653
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Posted - 2015.01.18 22:25:00 -
[29] - Quote
Yea Magsec is pretty bad right now and why would you use it when you can use bulletmagnetism Bolt Pistol
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Jakkal Shoobah
Y.A.M.A.H
46
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Posted - 2015.01.20 18:00:00 -
[30] - Quote
Magsec is underwhelming with no skill. With all skills maxed out it is a baby assault rail rifle with less recoil. On a nova knife fit with sidearm damage mods the magsec becomes as potent as any rifle. In fact the magsec has roughly .1 extra damage on the AR with approximately 75% fire rate and some more range to work with.
That. Magsec is a beautiful smg that is most effective mid range. Did some math. Triple damage mod kal magsec put out more than 50 damage per shot against armor. I couldn't imagine the wrath of the officer version in the right hands.
If it doesn't seem as good as smgs that is because it is definitely harder to use in the regular oh **** I'm out of ammo let me switch to my side arm way.. It is more of a sidearm meant to be used as a primary on fits with primary's that are meant for particukar engagements.
While slow to anger and occasionally indecisive, they are also capable of harnessing enormous resolve when truly tested.
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