|
|
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4386
   |
Posted - 2014.11.02 00:09:00 -
[1] - Quote
So, the QQ about uplinks on towers and tower campers continues unabated, and is leading to calls for nerfing uplinks again.
Personally, just like the "get rid of the redline" threads that pop up now and again, I see this as trying to solve the wrong problem. The problem is not people actually using the tools (uplinks, dropships) available in order to give their team an advantage (God forbid).
No, the problem is that you can't do anything about it if you don't have a good dropship pilot available. There should always be a second way to counter something.
Solution: moar ladders. I'd say about 30% of structures (at best) currently have ladders going to the top. This should be closer to 80% at least.
Example, there are some sockets where the objective is overlooked by a tall tower with a slanted roof leading to it. There is a ladder on the opposite side. Particularly in Domination, this can lead to some pretty epic battles for control of the tower with dropships, people on the ladder, people shooting up, tanks killing the dropships, snipers trying to clear it from another tower, etc. There are counters with other counters to those counters, etc.
The mere presence of that ladder turns the socket from another "meh" group of buildings to roof camp to one with near endless tactical possibilities. We need more sockets like that!
This is how we make Dust more fun. Not by making existing things (like uplinks) worse, but by making other things better!
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
|
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4404
|
Posted - 2014.11.02 22:07:00 -
[2] - Quote
B
U
M
P
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
|
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4404
|
Posted - 2014.11.02 22:52:00 -
[3] - Quote
manboar thunder fist wrote:Ladders reduce the reason for ads usage while allowing people to get higher without even needing to bother using dropships, reducing their usage. Ladders can also be camped easily, resulting in no change to the problem
So, what you are saying is they don't work and won't fix the problem AND they also work so well that you don't need anything else? Which is it?
If the ladders are inneffecitve and get camped so easily, how then do you no longer need dropships?
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
|
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4405
|
Posted - 2014.11.02 23:50:00 -
[4] - Quote
manboar thunder fist wrote:They are not going to work because people will be able to get up there without dropships, and then how does it solve roof camping?
If you pay attention I'm sure you'll notice the variation in dropship types I have mentioned.
Ads is needed to clear roof, ds is needed to get up there.
Adding ladders will result in fall in ds use which will cause a drop in ads/av/tank warpoint earning from killing these vehicles.
More ladders mean ads usage is in higher demand, but with ads nerf this is not viable, and if ladders can be camped then high ground superiority is even more prevalent than before.
The problem isn't roof camping. The problem is that a dropship (either type.. Yes I noticed the difference, it doesn't matter) is the only way to get most of these places, so whoever gets there first has a big advantage.
This gives a second counter to this particular tactic. This is the solution we are looking for, if you would pay attention.
- some of those towers are really high and some will still not have ladders so DS be fine as they will remain the fastest way to get there.
- DS will be getting WP for mCRUs so chill out about the number of DS you will see. Regardless, the fact that other people won't be able to get WP by farming them for kills is not a big problem in my book.
- Complain about ADS nerfs somewhere else
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
|
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4409
|
Posted - 2014.11.03 16:46:00 -
[5] - Quote
manboar thunder fist wrote:dropships are a viable way to get up high, and adding ladders doesn't solve any problems....
Your argument here is: BOO HOO, I WANT TO GET UP HIGH AND CAMP MORE EASILY, WHY DO I HAVE TO CALL A DROPSHIP AND FLY UP? I WANT A SIMPLE LADDER SO I CAN CAMP FASTER :)))))))))
no.
Not only is roof camping a boring and scummy tactic seen on the road tower point map (which is hated by all), but if it's going to be done, at the very least, a vehicle should be neccessary, some sort of effort, to get up there.....
Once people are up there ladders won't help you will they? you want to get headshotted while climbing up? feel free.... this is not a solution and your incessant call for ladders will just cause no change whatsoever.
Lazer Fo Cused wrote:1. Use a DS
1a. You dont even have to skill into a DS to use one
1b. They are cheap
1c. If other players use a DS to get upto the tower in the 1st place then you can too
1d. HTFU
Seriously, read the OP, people.
- I don't want to camp more easily.
- I don't think putting uplinks on towers or using high ground is bad form or needs to stop (for the most part)
- I don't think using DS to get to high ground is something we need to eliminate.
I fly DS to get to rooftops all the time on certain maps. I'm terrible at it, but fortunately militia DS are pretty cheap. It's way faster than ladders. But that's only on certain maps, and primarily for purposes of gaining relaible access to map objectives, not to sit up there in my awesome RR sentinel suit and scrub my way to an inflated K/D.
What I do want is for people to stop blaming logi's for their inability to deal with anything other than someone just coming right at them. Or trying to nerf things like DS and uplinks as the "solution" to some problem that results in them getting killed in a way they deem "unfair."
I'm also getting a little bored with the people giving simultaneous opposing arguments. If you think they won't work, argue that. If you're worried that they will work so well that DS's will disappear, argue that.
Don't argue both, that makes no freaking sense!
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
|
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4409
|
Posted - 2014.11.03 16:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
VikingKong iBUN wrote:There would just be a HMG or shotgun camped at the top of every ladder, it won't stop whole teams from camping on top of a building.
How is that worse than now? This requires more effort than is currently needed to hold the roof. Put a FG or even just a commando with both an RR and swarms and you already deny the area to the other team pretty well.
Even the counter to a tacitc should have a counter in turn, and the presence of this does nothing to invalidate the tactic or this proposal. In fact, the opposite should be true, something should not be introduced if it DIDNT have a counter.
Tactic: Roof camp
counter to roof camp: ADS
counter to ADS: AV
counter to AV: Go up the ladder
counter to going up the ladder: defend the ladder
...and so on. How is having counters with more counters a bad thing, exactly?
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
|
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4417
|
Posted - 2014.11.03 23:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
CLONE117 wrote:no! we do not need more ladders.
we need elevators.
that also plays music when in use.
Can't forget the warbarge chick! Suicide is still prohibited in public areas afaik...
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
|
|
|
| |
|