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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5197
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Posted - 2014.10.30 03:02:00 -
[1] - Quote
Atiim wrote:Shared Passives only nerf every other frames, and wouldn't do anything to Scouts other than cause them to have to point out where something is (which is trivial given that it only requires you to speak). It seems more like a "nerf players w/o mics" ordeal than anything. As for Cloak Fields, they'll still have their uses as it makes you much more harder to spot (and in many cases, invisible).
Disagree.
If a heavy with a scout in squad can see all red assaults around him, without any sacrifice, that is insane.
If shared passives are removed, suddenly that heavy has to use his vision and awareness to handle medium frame enemies and can't rely on his scout.
Why should other frames get the benefit of scout SP and fittings sacrifice?
Do we get extra armor just because a heavy in our squad has some?
Do our weapons get a damage increase if someone in our squad has damage mods?
The entire idea behind shared scans is ridiculous.
If you want to share scans, use an active scanner.
No more Sprint Glitch? This party is going to be off the hook!
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5197
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Posted - 2014.10.30 03:03:00 -
[2] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Here's a better idea. Before we start throwing out doomsday prophecies like how it was before December 21, 2012, how about we wait and see how it really turns out? If nothing changes, oh well. If cloaks really do become crappy, then I will be coming back to this thread to say how wrong I was. Deal?
That will make me more viable.
You saying, "Guess I was wrong, oh well. Good thing I am not focused on hacking."
That will help out a lot I am sure.
No more Sprint Glitch? This party is going to be off the hook!
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5197
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Posted - 2014.10.30 03:23:00 -
[3] - Quote
matsumoto yuichi san wrote:you guys are so overreacting, the tf2 spy has a decloak delay, AND it make a nice sound, AND YET SPIES DON'T SUFFER
i mean it just mean you gasp use the cloak to gain positioning, not to murder death kill,
and the scan thing is fair, the i can't be seen, can see everyone doesn't have good parity, it's not like you are blind you jsut don't get your passive wallhack, i mean for mediums the passive scans are useless anyway, as they have to be on your face for it to work. so use the cloak to position and then decloak and then kill, it's not hard
and yes now this means if someone spots you while cloaked and gets some shots in they get a slight upper hand, only fair.
Cloak delay is not an issue. Not in the least. I even advocated for a second delay, 3 times what is actually being implemented.
What I have been against since the first suggestion of it is the 85% reduction to range. That not only affects slayer scouts, which do need some balancing, but it affects hackers as well, which don't need balanced.
No more Sprint Glitch? This party is going to be off the hook!
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5200
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Posted - 2014.10.30 03:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
Bradric Banewolf wrote:I just don't wanna be shot gunned by a guy that still invisible?! I like passive scans, and giving the cloak a delay will make them vulnerable to something. Proto scout myself, and I must admit that it's easy mode compare to assault?! You just hide and wait for a merc you can clearly see that can't see you?!
Next to turbo controllers there's nothing better in this game than scouts?!
Cloak delay is necessary.
Range reduction while cloaked is not.
There are many other nerfs that could be put in place.
Strafing is an issue that needs fixed.
Tanks scouts as well, which can be fixed with doubling the speed penalty on armor plates just for scouts, or removing EWAR passive skills and making them solely module efficacy based.
Those are REASONABLE and affect slaying tanked scouts without negating other roles scouts can, and do, play.
The range reduction during cloak is a sloppy nerf that affects multiple roles, and STILL DOESN'T FIX SOME OF THE BIGGEST PROBLEMS!
No more Sprint Glitch? This party is going to be off the hook!
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5201
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Posted - 2014.10.30 03:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
matsumoto yuichi san wrote:One Eyed King wrote:matsumoto yuichi san wrote:you guys are so overreacting, the tf2 spy has a decloak delay, AND it make a nice sound, AND YET SPIES DON'T SUFFER
i mean it just mean you gasp use the cloak to gain positioning, not to murder death kill,
and the scan thing is fair, the i can't be seen, can see everyone doesn't have good parity, it's not like you are blind you jsut don't get your passive wallhack, i mean for mediums the passive scans are useless anyway, as they have to be on your face for it to work. so use the cloak to position and then decloak and then kill, it's not hard
and yes now this means if someone spots you while cloaked and gets some shots in they get a slight upper hand, only fair. Cloak delay is not an issue. Not in the least. I even advocated for a second delay, 3 times what is actually being implemented. What I have been against since the first suggestion of it is the 85% reduction to range. That not only affects slayer scouts, which do need some balancing, but it affects hackers as well, which don't need balanced. in the hacker scenario you are still A near invisible, and B probably at the point have essentially the range of an assault so i wouldn't complain that if you want to hack whilst invisible you are brought back to normal levels for scan range...
An Assault does not have 15% of the range of a scout. That is a massive exaggeration.
We are not being brought to "normal" levels.
Scouts with level 5 Range and no damps get 30 m.
An 85% reduction is 4.5, rounding to 5 m.
FIVE F*ING METERS!!!
A heavy with a shotgun could be outside my range and still be able to kill me!
An Assault with level 5 Range has 15 m. That is THREE TIMES the range of a cloaked scout.
Get your facts straight my friend. This Range nerf is unbelievable.
No more Sprint Glitch? This party is going to be off the hook!
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5201
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Posted - 2014.10.30 04:20:00 -
[6] - Quote
LUGMOS wrote:IMO, the range nerf is good and logical for a few reasons. 1. Prevents scouts from spotting someone on passives while cloaked 20-30 meters out and slaying them. This makes the cloak a defensive piece of equipment, making it only very useful for escaping or for getting through a battlefront by relying on visual and not tacnet. 2. Prevents scouts from camping a door or objective with a cloak on and ganking a few people by giving the scout a lower time to react, as there could be a lot going on 5 meters out. Overall, the range nerf while cloaked turns the cloak into a situational piece of equipment, only useful in certain instances, which changes its role from the 1.8 and before essential turn it on whenever you can type of equipment. Keep in mind, I used to be a scout before it went FoTM 
1. Cloak can't be a defensive weapon if it makes you as blind as a heavy. Heavies have the advantage of incredibly high HP and insanely high DPS weapon.
2. Scouts can still camp the objective. Once someone starts hacking, they know EXACTLY where they are, regardless of whether or not they can pick them up on tacnet. If they are around an installation, they cant simply eyeball it while cloaked, and if not seeing any legs or hacking, uncloak and run around the exterior til their shotgun circle turns red. This hurts campers zilch.
As for slayers, they will simply go back to the Gal Scout, put on 2 damps to be tacnet invisible, throw on some armor and shields, and they are good to go. Oh, and they can instantaneously help their heavy friends out with your position. Still.
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5216
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Posted - 2014.10.30 05:39:00 -
[7] - Quote
Mexxx Dust-Slayer wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Imp Smash wrote:OP post makes no sense.
You want to balance scouts (implying that you think they are imbalanced) by making every other suit weaker EXCEPT the scout (loss of the scout's info feed).
So, by that I assume that you feel scouts are Under powered and need a buff? ONLY scouts know where the enemy is and scouts themselves stay invisible yet with very high combat abilities.
I don't even.... This could be the most ignorant post Ive seen. Scouts are not overpowered from any standpoint other than that they provide shared passives, which makes them commonly used. They are also not underpowered. In PC's, scouts are used for passives, and heavies for slaying. Taking away shared passives means assaults and scouts and heavies and commandos all slaying together because they are on a balanced playing field. And your response is equally ignorant. How will a squad no longer being able to see the enemy from their scouts passives make the assaults, scouts, commandos and heavies slay together on a balanced playing field? You will then have tanked scouts then being a clear OP choice in PC since they will have all the situational awareness to themselves and will be able to get the jump on every non scout. At least with shared passives all the heavies know where each other are because both sides are likely to have scouts and scouts are forcing each other to dampen If SHARED passives are going to be removed from anything, it should be from all non-scout suits because a major part of the role of a scout is to provide intel for the team while picking off targets and placing uplinks in a stealthy manner, and leaving the main slaying to the assaults and the heavies. But of course this cannot be the case without an even harder cloak delay nerf and another hindrance to the slay-everything scouts. You will notice how scouts are able to top the leaderboards so easily with the most kills in PC because they are so capable of kill chasing. They uncloak and 2-3 shot any poor assault because they can get the jump on him with ewar & cloak. Then they'll throw an RE 20m and kill a group of heavies and logistics. Removing shared passives doesn't seem to be the answer. Hopefully the cloak range nerf is enough. For context, I have and am experienced in all roles. It's not bias QQ, hopefully.
How will the squad be able to see enemies?
Active scanners.
Scouts were never intended to "scout" via shared passives. They didn't even come in to play until about a year ago, but no one notice because of Active Scanner spam. Now it has shifted too far in the other direction.
How will they allow all roles to slay on a balanced playing field?
By encouraging medium frames from playing the EWAR game with Active Scanners, Dampeners and Range Enhancers. By removing the incredible advantage heavies have of playing their role, and seeing medium frames moving to attack them, without having to make any sacrifice whatsoever..
What has effectively happened is that they removed shared scanning from cloaked scouts by removing their ability to scan anything whatsoever, outside 4 meters or so. Not only does this nerf slaying ability, which was too imbalanced, but it ALSO nerfs defensive abilities, which were never the problem to begin with. Scouts will more likely start tanking more, giving up on the cloak nearly entirely, and further eroding the Logi role as a result.
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
5275
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Posted - 2014.11.01 23:06:00 -
[8] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:el OPERATOR wrote:Thread reported for being an insult to the intelligence of anyone who's played pc in the last 6 months.
Ridiculous line of bs is ridiculous.
Please allow me to solve all your problems with the cloak, your passive scan range and hacking:
NOTE *The following is borrowed from the feedback "scouts" provided to the community who have questioned the imbalanced design of scouts and by proxy, cloaking*
-> USE YOUR EYES<-
Sincerely,
Nerf scouts. With no delay. Coming from Cap Aq, second to only LATINO KILLER CORP in the number of HMG heavies deployed on the field in PC.  Nerf Heavies. Nothing should have enough HP to survive a remote explosive.
Notice he also ignores all the scouts recommending reasonable nerfs and the fact that a scout gave Rattati the idea of reducing range while cloaked.
At least scouts know there is a problem and try to find common sense solutions.
1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?
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