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Viktor Hadah Jr
Negative-Impact
Gentlemen's.Club
5610
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Posted - 2014.10.25 05:21:00 -
[1] - Quote
After this SP payout from event i think i will pass 68mil SP and will start specing into HAV's. So a question should i go armor or shield HAV? why pick one over another?
EVE 21 Day Trial
Templar BPOs 350Mil ISK
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13832
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Posted - 2014.10.25 06:02:00 -
[2] - Quote
Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:After this SP payout from event i think i will pass 68mil SP and will start specing into HAV's. So a question should i go armor or shield HAV? why pick one over another?
Gunlogi as a general rule of thumb primarily because the hull provided significantly better PG and CPU statistics over the Madrugar. Moreover all fitting modules are low slots and on a Madrugar you cannot afford to sell short on those slots as you need them for reps and armour hardeners.
Gunlogi also has the added benefit of a stable set of movement stats and tracks better than a Madrugar allowing you to bear your cannon (missiles or rail) rapidly even of the enemy HAV is behind you.
Further more most turrets and AV deal more damage to armour than shields and since you shields buffer before armour you can have massive HP pools.
Additionally the Shield Hardener is set to a default 40% and you get stable pulsing reps anyway.
No matter how you swing it the Gunlogi and Shield HAV as a general rule are better than Madrugars.
E.G-
On a well fitted Madrugar you are looking at roughly 1200 Shields and 4000 armour with 2x Heavy Reppers and possibly an Armour Hardner. Put a solid Turret on that and your PG is already nearly capped out not truly allowing for solid fitting capacity for high slot modules or small turrets should you want them.
This is a what you see is what you get build with about 200 reps per second and moderate EHP that rails and Missiles with tear through.
On a well fit Gunlogi and you can fit them in any manner you wish...okay lets go with my Gunlogi.
5300 Shield Base, 1500 Armour, Proto Missile Turrets, 2x Particle Accelerators, and a Shield Hardener. That's roughly 9500 EHP, can be more if I sub out my Small Turrets in favour of plating with turn over cycle of roughly..... 40 seconds or so.
Even if an armour tank could quickly break those 7500ish Shields they'd need to have survived a volley of missiles which easily hit other Rail and Missile HAV, or suffer the horribly precarious 20-30 seconds of blaster fire with me missing every shot.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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Bradric Banewolf
D3ATH CARD
RUST415
426
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Posted - 2014.10.25 06:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
Gunlogi. You'll see.
"Anybody order chaos?"
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13832
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Posted - 2014.10.25 06:20:00 -
[4] - Quote
However the Gunlogi and the Maddy operate and two completely different manners and they feel different to drive.
As you no doubt guess the Madrugar feels like a tank should. It has a certain inertial to it which can come in very handy for jerky dodging motions that fool AV into placing rounds too far forwards of the HAV. Additionally its top speed is higher and does better in open spaces where you can chase down your enemy. Weaker when more precise targeting is required and slightly less durable than the Gunlogi. Tough to beat tanks at a range especially if the enemy HAV is a Gunlogi and has Anti Armour Rounds.
The Gunlogi feels like driving a Family Sedan. Handles well, very stable, and very comfortable to pilot new entry. Moreover it tracks well, you will rarely find yourself without anything to target and often times simply cannot be out manoeuvred. Stable firing platform for both AV and AI gunnery and goddam durable or able to dish out insane alpha damage. Great for in city fighting and ranged kills but if a Maddy gets close to you really have to be on game to get your fire accurate as they seem to jerk around and move faster than you can track around your HAV.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
1753
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Posted - 2014.10.25 06:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
What True is saying.
One advantage I like of the Maddy is the turret depression. It can aim lower then the gunlogi. This has gotten less useful since rail ranges have been reduced but help with hills on maps like spine crescent.
Delt for CPM2
CPM1 MISSION : FAILED
Moss-delt on skype
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13833
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Posted - 2014.10.25 06:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mossellia Delt wrote:What True is saying.
One advantage I like of the Maddy is the turret depression. It can aim lower then the gunlogi. This has gotten less useful since rail ranges have been reduced but help with hills on maps like spine crescent.
Can be completely ignored by fitting 2x Small turrets to your HAV with a single AV turret. You can afford to stop and use the small turret from about 50m away then use the main AV turret to take down tanks.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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Hakyou Brutor
Second-Nature
1447
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Posted - 2014.10.25 06:46:00 -
[7] - Quote
Gunnlogi is better for railgun, missiles, and it's durable against AV. Madrugar is a really good up in your face brawler, ramming speed!
Overall I'd go for Gunnlogi with large missile and small railgun side turrets, seeing as blasters are still no fun. |
True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13833
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Posted - 2014.10.25 07:02:00 -
[8] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:Gunnlogi is better for railgun, missiles, and it's durable against AV. Madrugar is a really good up in your face brawler, ramming speed!
Overall I'd go for Gunnlogi with large missile and small railgun side turrets, seeing as blasters are still no fun.
Shield HAV are certainly better brawlers.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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Hakyou Brutor
Second-Nature
1447
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Posted - 2014.10.25 07:48:00 -
[9] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Hakyou Brutor wrote:Gunnlogi is better for railgun, missiles, and it's durable against AV. Madrugar is a really good up in your face brawler, ramming speed!
Overall I'd go for Gunnlogi with large missile and small railgun side turrets, seeing as blasters are still no fun. Shield HAV are certainly better brawlers.
Whaaat?
So then when is a Maddy ever good? |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
3960
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Posted - 2014.10.25 07:52:00 -
[10] - Quote
Hakyou Brutor wrote:True Adamance wrote:Hakyou Brutor wrote:Gunnlogi is better for railgun, missiles, and it's durable against AV. Madrugar is a really good up in your face brawler, ramming speed!
Overall I'd go for Gunnlogi with large missile and small railgun side turrets, seeing as blasters are still no fun. Shield HAV are certainly better brawlers. Whaaat? So then when is a Maddy ever good?
When CCP allows similar PG/CPU snd fitting ability to the gunnlogi.
I have a tank alt. The maddy doesn't have the same level of beefy that it used to. Seriously considering running the gunnlogi even though I hate it.
EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
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CommanderBolt
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
2140
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Posted - 2014.10.25 08:11:00 -
[11] - Quote
lol both tanks are powerful but it depends what you want to be more resistant to. lol shield tanks crumble to plasma cannon fire, but are more resistant to other forums of AV.
Either tank can beat the other, anyone fitting only 4k armour with dual reps on a Maddy is doing it wrong. With certain special fits the maddy can beat a damage modded stack Gunlogi but it leaves you without repair. Still both tanks are really nice once you have high skills.
Certainly I would say pick based on your personal preference.
Also small blasters on your tank with 2 gunners **** face. Anyone telling you otherwise truly has not had good gunners use them because they slaughter infantry!
"Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones"
"Guns for show, Knives for a pro"
MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
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Chief-Shotty
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL
Top Men.
333
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Posted - 2014.10.25 09:23:00 -
[12] - Quote
Maddy tanks with the heavier armor are good battering rams.
Sica is a lot easier to use and more forgiving.
If you want to have anti-tank options you want to use a rail turret. You can use a blaster but you need a damage modifier and activate it when you start shooting other tanks.
When im in a Maddy or Soma the moment i see a Gunnlogi or Sica I activate my ground booster/injector (whatever its called)
and go full speed into the other tank.....4 out of 5 times you can flip them upside down....you take no damage with armor but shield tanks take a decent bit of damage from any hard impacts. Its quite fun in a pinch.
8-Time New Eden Mass Driver Champion
Min Commando Combat Rifle and Mass Driver = FUN and Tears
OMG the Tears!! :)
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Alena Ventrallis
Vengeance Unbound
2025
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Posted - 2014.10.25 09:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
If If he Maddy got a CPU buff, I'd be all over it. As it stands, I run gunnlogi with missiles or rails. I prefer to crack vehicles and leave infantry slaying to the infantry.
Mercs whine about the rail rifle but refuse to shield tank to counter it.
But that's none of my business.
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Bright Cloud
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
440
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Posted - 2014.10.25 10:19:00 -
[14] - Quote
None. get a new game and let this here pass on. Not worth the time playing anymore.
Bright is the opposite of dark! Who would have thought of that?!
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hold that
Krusual Covert Operators
Minmatar Republic
298
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Posted - 2014.10.25 10:34:00 -
[15] - Quote
don't know nothing about tanks, but i killed by gunlogis 9 times out of 10 |
Horizon Limit
Nexus Balusa Horizon
97
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Posted - 2014.10.25 11:13:00 -
[16] - Quote
I've started with armor tanks, but then i fell in love with shield tanks.
Cal scout vs Cal scout
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1406
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Posted - 2014.10.25 11:30:00 -
[17] - Quote
Agreeing with True Adamance's posts, especially the first one.
Another possible approach for op's decisionmaking: Choose turret which you want to use and follow chart:
Railgun - Gunnlogi (turn rate, can fit 1-3 damamods WITH tank)
Missile - Gunnlogi (CPU limitations simply deny maddies to have missiles)
Blaster - Both possible MAD/GL
And here's unbeforementioned wild card:
UTILITY (Scanners, nitros, MCRUs etc) - Madrugar (not Gunlogi as their strength lies in hi slots. Maddies fit tank on lows, often leaving his near empty especially on junior characters, but I user wants they can save some CPU for utitily mods which all go to hi)
People would enjoy Dust a lot more if they accepted the fact that EVERYTHING is subject to change
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Racro 01 Arifistan
501st Knights of Leanbox
428
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Posted - 2014.10.25 11:38:00 -
[18] - Quote
I prefer the maddy over the gunnlogi for this very simple reason....
THE GUNNLOGI CANT CLIMB HILLS...or climb very fast
this is a very powerful difference between the 2.
the maddy accelerates slower than the gunnlogi but makes up for it with much higher top speed and torque.
gunnlogi accelerates quickly but has low speed and low torque.
however the gunnlogi is much easier to fit and can preety much do whatever you want it to.
even with max fitting skills on blaster/armour mods. Iam still forced to gimp my maddy fit with a cmplx cpu enhancement...
madrugar.
ion cannon
complex heavy rep
complex armr hardner
complex cpu enhancement
enhanced fuel injector
complex blaster amplifer.
the gunnlogi however.
xt-201
complex shield hardner
basic shield booster
complex missile amp
complex light armour rep
basic power upgrade
ironically these fits I have used/run since beta/chromosome and still find them the best go to fits for my self personally. (since the vehcle changes these fits arnt as strong as they were).
unless the gunnlogi is using missiles. I refer to them as scrub tanks.
Elite Gallenten Soldier
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Henrietta Unknown
Nox Lupos
413
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Posted - 2014.10.25 15:31:00 -
[19] - Quote
Having run both Madrugar and Gunnlogi fits, I'll say that the Gunnlogi is indeed in a better place than its Gallente counterpart.
Shields and one or two hardeners makes all the difference, and you can usually fit a repper in the low.
On the other hand, the Madrugar is still workable. Get those CPU/PG skills up though. As of now, I can roll with a Neutron Blaster, basic armor hardener, and two complex reppers. I have yet to test this fit, but another one I have is one repper, one hardener, and one plate.
Fatal tie with a Sica w/o hardeners and an ADV railgun. Though I actually would have had him had some lag not allowed him to teleport. By the time I got back to him, he was already at full shield.
But ramming, blocking, and engaging from behind are Maddy tactics that can turn the tide away from the Gunny's favor. 
Give the Magsex some love.
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Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
2094
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Posted - 2014.10.25 15:40:00 -
[20] - Quote
I prefer the Madrugar, even if it is Gallente filth technology.
* It can take sustained damage without needing to retreat.
Counter point: It cannot take MASSIVE damage for a sustained period of time.
* The Armor Hardeners have a far shorter cooldown than shield Hardeners and last longer.
Counter point: Shield Hardeners offer MUCH greater protection for that limited time.
* The Madrugar has higher top speed.
Counter point: Gunnlogi has much better turning and acceleration
The big one though: surprise damage. Let's say that I am rolling in my Madrugar and I get hit with a Railgun before my hardener is online. It take 1,000 shield damage, I turn my Armor Hardener online and the next hit wipes my shields and my Armor is resistant. I am at full EHP. If a Gunnlogi eats 1,000 shield damage before throwing on the Hardener(s), they lose a grotesque amount of EHP.
They are really close, honestly. Missile turrets make Madrugars cry, Flux grenades make Gunnlogi cry. And yes, Shield tanks are so much easier to fit than Armor tanks. Armor tanks are critically starved for CPU.
"This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
EoN.
2226
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Posted - 2014.10.25 15:45:00 -
[21] - Quote
Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:After this SP payout from event i think i will pass 68mil SP and will start specing into HAV's. So a question should i go armor or shield HAV? why pick one over another?
Don't bother, if you don't have the experience to pilot them, you'll get melted very easily.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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Nocturnal Soul
Primordial Threat
4202
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Posted - 2014.10.25 15:53:00 -
[22] - Quote
Well True has been a tank ***** since God knows when so what he says is probably(only) the right choice.
(Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ.
LASERS BTCH!!!!!!
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Nirwanda Vaughns
857
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Posted - 2014.10.25 15:55:00 -
[23] - Quote
as it stands almost all AV is more profficiency vs Armour so shield vehicles are fotm. depending on how long CCP take to alter the damage profile of swarms/forge to a more neutral setting Armour vehicles get slaughtered pretty easily
Never argue with an idiot. they bring you down to their level and beat you through experience
proud C-II bpo owner
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Victor Moody Stahl
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
54
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Posted - 2014.10.25 16:11:00 -
[24] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Can be completely ignored by fitting 2x Small turrets to your HAV with a single AV turret. You can afford to stop and use the small turret from about 50m away then use the main AV turret to take down tanks.
As someone who likes to mess around with a militia Sica, I'd like to pick your brain about small turret choices for HAVs.
Currently, I feel that (small) missiles are not a good fit for HAVs, but small blasters/rails are quite fantastic. Small blasters in particular seem to simply make infantry evaporate (somewhat like an HMG...), while small rails have better range and can punch "up" a little against a vehicle.
Buff Logis | Nerf Goldfish
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JIMvc2
The Wanga Empire Strikes Back
277
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Posted - 2014.10.25 16:27:00 -
[25] - Quote
Go with Madrugar :D
When I face a gunlogi from behind = Too late which results = your dead.
My highs are scanners and Engine boost thing.
My lows are 2 enhanced Repping and 1 medium rep = Not bad.
My advantage is demolishing the Rail tanks >:D You stand no chance against a blaster.
I'm currently saving for proficiency level 1 to 5 so I can get a 10% turn for blaster turrent each level.
Its on you.
Have been killed by a lav with bombs attached ? The answer is Nope.
MAG Raven vet 7 times. Favorite weapon F90 and Highest Kills 78 and 23 deaths.
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Zindorak
G0DS AM0NG MEN
General Tso's Alliance
1146
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Posted - 2014.10.25 16:42:00 -
[26] - Quote
After nerfs to my ADS, im thinking of skilling into tanks. Are they good atm
Pokemon master and Tekken Lord
Gk0 Scout yay :)
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Viktor Hadah Jr
Negative-Impact
Gentlemen's.Club
5616
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Posted - 2014.10.25 16:48:00 -
[27] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:After this SP payout from event i think i will pass 68mil SP and will start specing into HAV's. So a question should i go armor or shield HAV? why pick one over another? Don't bother, if you don't have the experience to pilot them, you'll get melted very easily.
Sorry tanking did not work out for you but i'll still give it a shot.
EVE 21 Day Trial
Templar BPOs 350Mil ISK
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
EoN.
2226
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Posted - 2014.10.25 16:52:00 -
[28] - Quote
Zindorak wrote:After nerfs to my ADS, im thinking of skilling into tanks. Are they good atm
No, tanks are not good.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
EoN.
2226
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Posted - 2014.10.25 16:53:00 -
[29] - Quote
Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:After this SP payout from event i think i will pass 68mil SP and will start specing into HAV's. So a question should i go armor or shield HAV? why pick one over another? Don't bother, if you don't have the experience to pilot them, you'll get melted very easily. Sorry tanking does not work out for you but i'll still give it a shot.
Lol not work out for me? I've been doing it for around 2 years now, and I've tanked in PC. It's just not worth it most of the time.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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Viktor Hadah Jr
Negative-Impact
Gentlemen's.Club
5616
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Posted - 2014.10.25 16:54:00 -
[30] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:Viktor Hadah Jr wrote:After this SP payout from event i think i will pass 68mil SP and will start specing into HAV's. So a question should i go armor or shield HAV? why pick one over another? Don't bother, if you don't have the experience to pilot them, you'll get melted very easily. Sorry tanking does not work out for you but i'll still give it a shot. Lol not work out for me? I've been doing it for around 2 years now, and I've tanked in PC. It's just not worth it most of the time.
sure
EVE 21 Day Trial
Templar BPOs 350Mil ISK
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