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[Video] - New player describes Dust

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sabre prime Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 609	Posted - 2014.10.15 02:17:00 - [1] - Quote An interesting video from a struggling newberry in Dust: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lueYvtjgmVA At 11:35 he describes the complexity of Dust as "almost like a giant math problem". Great way of summing up the difficulty for new players. The slow blade penetrates the shield.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1982	Posted - 2014.10.15 02:46:00 - [2] - Quote I feel for new players. A lot of what this guys says is totally wrong, for instance "you cant really take heavies on solo, soo much hp" etc... however from a new player perspective I agree with him in the sense that, options in combat are not obvious nor always available to the new player. Lets be honest, the new player to proto stomper disparity is absolutely huge. Of course we know this is because of many many reasons. Skills, fitting, better dropsuits and weapons etc... However look at it from the point of view of the new guy (my own mates in real life said the same thing before they stopped playing) - A new player might fire an entire magazine or two and not get a kill, yet in there newbie suit they can easily be taken out, one-shotted by a bolt pistol, sniped from 400m away etc... Now this would all work out just fine if there were progressive areas of the game or progressive battle selection. The noobies could go against other newbies , vets fight other vets etc.. Now I know the mu matchmaking is supposed to help this some what but in reality this game is very very hard for the new player. Like I have said many times, a tutorial video that could explain some of this stuff to the new guy would go a long way towards helping. Explaining strengths and weaknesses of suits, game play modes, tips and tricks. For instance when watching this 'tutorial video' - it could mention heavies. "The heavy suits are formidable behemoths of the battlefield. Combining strengthened armour and shield systems, with the unique ability to use heavy weapons, they can soak up a lot more punishment that other suit classes. However this extra survivability comes at a price. Slower than most other suits and severely lacking in EWAR capabilities, stealth tactics and ambush strategies using shotguns, explosives, plasma cannons and other hard hitting weapons are the key weaknesses to a heavy suit." The video could then explain the TACNET and the role of EWAR....... If CCP would allow the community to make a youtube video that they could show in game or something, I am sure between the community and CCP with some cool video footage they could provide we could quite easily make a professional, fun and above all helpful tutorial video for new mercs to watch, and then later on go back to. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Joel II X Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3813	Posted - 2014.10.15 02:57:00 - [3] - Quote "I'm shooting at this guy, emptying like 1 or 2 clips, and ultimately, it does absolutely nothing". He didn't aim properly. Being new, I believe he got Weaponry, Light Weapons 5, and Assault Rifle Operation 5, and still managed to land only a few hits. Anywho, what Dust needs, in my opinion is giving players more information on items. We get to see how much damage, and ammo the weapon has, but that's it. Accuracy Rating is absolutely useless because we don't know what the hell those numbers mean, and the stats themselves are static. That's another thing Dust is horrible at. If the ScP only has 8 shots, but I have operation 3, it should change to say that it has 11 shots per clip, but it doesn't. Stats are completely static in the descriptions, and they don't tell enough. How are we supposed to know that the Assault Rifle has less range than the Rail Rifle without trying them out ourselves? As for the nonexistent matchmaking (mu system is a joke), he's totally right. Throwing academy guys at the protobears isn't really fair. That's why all my friends quit. I talked to a friend recently whom I haven't seen in a while to catch up, and when I brought up Dust, he said exactly this, "At first, Dust is cool. I'm going up against guys with equal gear, experience, and all that, but then, all of a sudden, I get thrown in with the pros. That's why I left Dust." He only played for about a week. Dust still has ways to go, and seeing new guys leave really hurts me and gets me mad at times because I know that in the end, they're right. Dust punishes new players and there's nothing that the community can do about it. Thanks for showing us the video, sabre.
Fizzer XCIV Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 511	Posted - 2014.10.15 03:17:00 - [4] - Quote I don't mean to sound harsh, but he was bad. Plain and simple. He expected a low TTK, and got mad when people didn't die in 2-3 rounds. The SP disparity is pretty big, but not impossible to overcome. Its not that difficult to overcome actually. I've been doing it regularly. After biomassing and starting a new character, I still regularly get 2.0+ KDR, and finish in top 5 almost every match. Using nothing but skill and knowledge. I'm not even squadding up or anything. Just like any other shooter, the primary differences between a noob and a vet is skill and knowledge. Even SP only goes so far in this game.
Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 416	Posted - 2014.10.15 03:24:00 - [5] - Quote I find it amusing that he claims to has played more then a month and he still runs around in starter fits, using militia weapons and as it seems he doesnt even use plates/shield extenders to increase his survivability. Either the tutorials failed massively to send the message "more HP on suit=harder to kill" or the guy is just simply a moron not even attempting to improve. I think CCP needs to make the tutorials idiot proof, holding the hand of new players etc. Hell it would aswell help if a popup would appear with a hint saying: "if you use shield extenders/plates you can take more hits before you die!". Bright is the opposite of dark! Who would have thought of that?!
Eruditus 920 Prodigy Ops 563	Posted - 2014.10.15 03:44:00 - [6] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: I find it amusing that he claims to has played more then a month and he still runs around in starter fits, using militia weapons and as it seems he doesnt even use plates/shield extenders to increase his survivability. Either the tutorials failed massively to send the message "more HP on suit=harder to kill" or the guy is just simply a moron not even attempting to improve. I think CCP needs to make the tutorials idiot proof, holding the hand of new players etc. Hell it would aswell help if a popup would appear with a hint saying: "if you use shield extenders/plates you can take more hits before you die!". First of all, he says within the first 20 seconds that he has been playing "a week and a half maybe two almost everyday", not more than a month. I feel bad for him. I can remember when I first started playing. I was terrible. I don't really know why I stuck with it. I think it takes a particular type of personality to stick with DUST if you weren't here from the very beginning. As far as NPE, I spent of good amount of time watching you tube videos watching game play and getting info on weapons etc. This is ridiculous to have to resort to but nothing exists in game. The game does a poor job for new players. I think we all agree on that. For those that want to play that ignorant Eve card about being tough and finding your own way... Well it may sound great on paper but the reality is this: When you are a business trying to sell a product or service to the consumer, whatever you can do to make it more user friendly will directly correlate with it's success. I didn't say easier, more user friendly. CCP purposely makes it's products niche targeted and as a result you have a company struggling to survive. CCP will be bought out in 12 months or less, mark my words. Wisdom is what you gain after you need it.
Vell0cet Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 2390	Posted - 2014.10.15 03:54:00 - [7] - Quote I posted a thread on some suggestions to improve the NPE. I think these would help keep guys like this around. Best PvE idea ever!
Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 3934	Posted - 2014.10.15 03:56:00 - [8] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: I find it amusing that he claims to has played more then a month and he still runs around in starter fits, using militia weapons and as it seems he doesnt even use plates/shield extenders to increase his survivability. Either the tutorials failed massively to send the message "more HP on suit=harder to kill" or the guy is just simply a moron not even attempting to improve. I think CCP needs to make the tutorials idiot proof, holding the hand of new players etc. Hell it would aswell help if a popup would appear with a hint saying: "if you use shield extenders/plates you can take more hits before you die!". Reach out to the guy then. Invite him to squad, help get him up to speed on things if he seems so out of the loop. The single greatest asset in game is a new player. If anything, recruit him for the taxes. He'll have no knowledge on community meta. Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 1081	Posted - 2014.10.15 03:58:00 - [9] - Quote Fizzer XCIV wrote: I don't mean to sound harsh, but he was bad. Plain and simple. He expected a low TTK, and got mad when people didn't die in 2-3 rounds. The SP disparity is pretty big, but not impossible to overcome. Its not that difficult to overcome actually. I've been doing it regularly. After biomassing and starting a new character, I still regularly get 2.0+ KDR, and finish in top 5 almost every match. Using nothing but skill and knowledge. I'm not even squadding up or anything. Just like any other shooter, the primary differences between a noob and a vet is skill and knowledge. Even SP only goes so far in this game. Sure, the NPE needs to be better, but a new NPE can only help so much. It won't magically make their aim better, or give them map knowledge... when i start a new alt for lulz its a massacre.. last time i did it i was at like 47/1 and second time was 36/2 think it was with gal starter frontline so experance and knowing the weapons, the maps, the types of damage do what to who.. the effective ranges.. hell even how to move and flank.. on an even playfield experience trumps everything [[LogiBro ADV/PRO]] [[Level 1 Forum Warrior]] [[Level 2 Forum Pariah]]
Bri Bub Eternal Beings Dark Taboo 40	Posted - 2014.10.15 04:08:00 - [10] - Quote Eruditus 920 wrote: ... As far as NPE, I spent of good amount of time watching you tube videos watching game play and getting info on weapons etc. This is ridiculous to have to resort to but nothing exists in game. All his impressions were justified regarding NPE but I think it's interesting to consider that the same guy that posts YTs to educate his viewership on DUST 514 gameplay evidently didn't even view others' YTs that are available on all things DUST 514... Increasingly, this is how I inform myself and better my capabilities in the game... I don't post this to strip blame from CCP for not supplying proper tutorials, advice, in-game data and so forth, hell they could do a much better job of just directing noobs to these forums (and maybe to prominent DUST YouTubers), but the saying "doctor heal thyself" seems to at least partly apply in cases such this fellow... EDIT: not aimed at Eruditus, I was trying to add to the quoted material in commenting on the Final Thoughts YT poster... Be just and if you can't be just be arbitrary.

X7 lion Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 321	Posted - 2014.10.15 04:14:00 - [11] - Quote On one side i want to be nice to new players and help them find the fun in dust, on the other hand DIE stab stab stab Do not contribute to malice what can be explained by ignorance. being contradictory is not the same as being offensive.
Izlare Lenix Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1050	Posted - 2014.10.15 04:30:00 - [12] - Quote I laughed watching this video because everything he "complained" about why Dust sucks are the very things about Dust that make it unique and are the reasons I like Dust. It is obvious he is a typical FPS gamer that had been spoonfed with all the other easy ass FPS games out there. He has no idea what he is doing in this game and is terrible so in his mind Dust sucks. Even though he is clueless about Dust the fact does remain that the new player experience in Dust is beyond terrible. Hopefully in Legion new players can wade in the kiddie pool before swimming with the sharks. Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 1082	Posted - 2014.10.15 04:39:00 - [13] - Quote sabre prime wrote: An interesting video from a struggling newberry in Dust: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lueYvtjgmVA At 11:35 he describes the complexity of Dust as "almost like a giant math problem". Great way of summing up the difficulty for new players. why did you have to post it at this time of night/morning.. i watched it and did like 50 lines of feedback -¼.-¼ [[LogiBro ADV/PRO]] [[Level 1 Forum Warrior]] [[Level 2 Forum Pariah]]
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 1083	Posted - 2014.10.15 04:43:00 - [14] - Quote Izlare Lenix wrote: I laughed watching this video because everything he "complained" about why Dust sucks are the very things about Dust that make it unique and are the reasons I like Dust. It is obvious he is a typical FPS gamer that had been spoonfed with all the other easy ass FPS games out there. He has no idea what he is doing in this game and is terrible so in his mind Dust sucks. Even though he is clueless about Dust the fact does remain that the new player experience in Dust is beyond terrible. Hopefully in Legion new players can wade in the kiddie pool before swimming with the sharks. when he called the LAV's warthogs that gives you an indication of his fps background.. however i can feel for him.. i felt exactly like he did when i was a newbie and not even at 2m+ SP only now at 15m am i feeling like I make a differance.. I can hold my own.. I.. cant also be a douchebag killing newbros :( it makes me sad.. the NPE needs a change.. Battle acadamy needs to be for like 50k SP gained. not 5k then Battle University till they hit 750k - 1m skillpoints so they are a little tougher for when they dive into the pre-Chummed Shark infested waters that is open battles in Dust. [[LogiBro ADV/PRO]] [[Level 1 Forum Warrior]] [[Level 2 Forum Pariah]]
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 408	Posted - 2014.10.15 06:11:00 - [15] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: when i start a new alt for lulz its a massacre.. last time i did it i was at like 47/1 and second time was 36/2 think it was with gal starter frontline so experance and knowing the weapons, the maps, the types of damage do what to who.. the effective ranges.. hell even how to move and flank.. on an even playfield experience trumps everything I agree, The problem is the players with the knowledge usually are the ones wearing Advanced or Proto (with max core skills) producing a double whammy to newberries. Unless we can ineject knowledge a la Matrix, the tutorial needs to be seriously improved. I know CCP Rattati asked a while ago for suggestion regarding tool-tips, which they could include in the loading screens(?), but I have not heard anything after that.
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9034	Posted - 2014.10.15 06:29:00 - [16] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: Izlare Lenix wrote: I laughed watching this video because everything he "complained" about why Dust sucks are the very things about Dust that make it unique and are the reasons I like Dust. It is obvious he is a typical FPS gamer that had been spoonfed with all the other easy ass FPS games out there. He has no idea what he is doing in this game and is terrible so in his mind Dust sucks. Even though he is clueless about Dust the fact does remain that the new player experience in Dust is beyond terrible. Hopefully in Legion new players can wade in the kiddie pool before swimming with the sharks. when he called the LAV's warthogs that gives you an indication of his fps background.. however i can feel for him.. i felt exactly like he did when i was a newbie and not even at 2m+ SP only now at 15m am i feeling like I make a differance.. I can hold my own.. I.. cant also be a douchebag killing newbros :( it makes me sad.. the NPE needs a change.. Battle acadamy needs to be for like 50k SP gained. not 5k then Battle University till they hit 750k - 1m skillpoints so they are a little tougher for when they dive into the pre-Chummed Shark infested waters that is open battles in Dust. More divisions are good and dandy, but the more divisions you have the more you split up the player base and the more players you need to fill up all those divisions to a point where you aren't waiting long and always getting fresh opponents. Amarr are the good guys Join "PIE Ground Control" for secure Amarr FW syncing and orbital support
Varoth Drac Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 288	Posted - 2014.10.15 07:41:00 - [17] - Quote Seems clear from this video there are 3 important things that need to be done to improve NPE. 1) clearly indicate weapon ranges. Also other important stats that are either hidden or unclear. But range is most important as it is a staple of gameplay. 2) buff basic medium frames. These are laughably underpowered. 3) introduce a tiered public contract approach. Lower award lower skill point players in tier 1. Mid range in tier 2. Rest of us vets and squads with vets in tier 3, with higher isk rewards to show progression.
Kaughst Nyain San General Tso's Alliance 691	Posted - 2014.10.15 09:08:00 - [18] - Quote If you want to do him a favor tell him about Legion, direct him to this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnsLCz10CVU... You know you have at least thought about cow tipping. They know, and they're out to settle the score.
The Master Race Immortal Guides 115	Posted - 2014.10.15 09:14:00 - [19] - Quote He said he has played for two weeks yet he is still obviously clueless. He didn't know the difference between dom/skrm, had no idea about ewar, FC, or the abilities and limitations of each weapon. Now I understand there is a bit of a learning curve, but in two weeks you would think you would have at least a minor understanding of one of these aspects. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 115	Posted - 2014.10.15 09:14:00 - [20] - Quote He said he has played for two weeks yet he is still obviously clueless. He didn't know the difference between dom/skrm, had no idea about ewar, FC, or the abilities and limitations of each weapon. Now I understand there is a bit of a learning curve, but in two weeks you would think you would have at least a minor understanding of one of these aspects. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.

postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 226	Posted - 2014.10.15 10:24:00 - [21] - Quote sabre prime wrote: An interesting video from a struggling newberry in Dust: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lueYvtjgmVA At 11:35 he describes the complexity of Dust as "almost like a giant math problem". Great way of summing up the difficulty for new players. Im qiute realist even really big "nonosence" pragmatic and i can tell you hes basicalz off the line from whole time. He doing review, withou proper knowledge, without any materials Call me ol' fashioned, but there is no reason for making review on something what i dont know as such. He basicaly play few games, without even look on skill tree and assets. (his bshates about imposible killing heavy and no use for map) Hell i killed heavy yesterday just with flaylock, i see enemies on map because i using map. Just a waste of time for him and for me honestly "Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."*
sabre prime Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 614	Posted - 2014.10.15 14:36:00 - [22] - Quote An interesting set of responses. Some reasonable and measured, some plain dumb. It's obvious he is not a player who has had enough time to learn the game. But he actually shows some decent ability, and importantly, explains why he has found dust a struggle. I'm sure he is similar to a lot of us when we started playing. I know it took me ages to understand the skill system and how to invest SP in the right way... There in lies the NPE problem. The game is highly complex compared to the type of FPSes such players are coming from. But that complexity is what kept me coming back, and that complexity needs to be explained and tutored to new players in a better NPE. It's obviously not going to happen now, because the game is going back to its core PC community. I think it is an interesting video, because it shows the disconnect that existed between the game, and the majority of console players who ever tried playing it. The slow blade penetrates the shield.
soulreaper73 PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 1169	Posted - 2014.10.15 14:49:00 - [23] - Quote New Eden was never meant to be a level playing ground. It is just like EVE. The sharks will always eat the guppies until the guppies survive long enough to be sharks themselves. Unfortunately, this turns off quite a bit of people who are not willing to stick it out. Back in the closed beta days, I got owned all the time with my free starter suits. It was a terrible experience. I stuck it out and eventually became good enough to join PFBHz. At that time, I became the shark and had no remorse either. As others have suggested, the academy should have a longer duration than it currently has. This might solve new player retention problems to an extent. Unfortunately, there is a very small and limited player base, so it remains the way it is. CCP is thus in a catch-22.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 115	Posted - 2014.10.15 15:08:00 - [24] - Quote It isn't even sticking it out, not that many players play with proto; I only pull it out when seeking revenge. I have a proto assault and weapon that just sit there cause I would rather stab people with my mk1 suit or soon spend a little time with my ak.1 heavy bpo (I can't wait) along with the fact that there is FW that closes any gear/isk gap. I am a new player and can not believe how little he has picked up if this was his first video game I would get it. This guys video is nothing, but QQ about his own ignorance which is fine if he wanted his mother to watch it then coddle him. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.


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