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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
494
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Posted - 2014.10.13 16:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
I really wanted your video to be this video |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
494
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Posted - 2014.10.13 16:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
Dreis Shadowweaver wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:No.
I've spent my SP wisely. Why should someone gain an advantage over me from spending it unwisely? It's not spending SP unwisely if what you spent it on gets changed. How are choices supposed to matter if CCP takes our choices and ***** all over them? Which is why I support respecs just on things that get changed, not full-blown respecs. That way, our choices REALLY WILL MATTER.
You're crying over spilled milk
The only skill point refund I remember in EVE in 8 years when was they removed learning skills. It wasn't a respec, it was a return.
THAT IS WHY IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN
If CCP won't refund SP in EVE, their bread and butter, even when they make such sweeping changes to ship design, they WILL NOT do it in Dust.
You know what happens in EVE when something get's put on it's a$s? People adapt, they skill into new ships, they pull out old ships they haven't used in 3 years, a very tiny amount rage on the forums. Those that rage get told the same thing you see on these forums.
It's exponentially easier to skill into new suits and weapons in this game that it is in EVE. Suck it up and quit whining.
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RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
494
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Posted - 2014.10.13 17:29:00 -
[3] - Quote
Dreis Shadowweaver wrote:*Rayray James Nevertheless, you can't say that our choices matter, despite that it is supposed to be a major aspect of Dust.
Your choices do matter. They still matter.
Things change. Everyone complains about OP/UP in a hundred threads a week in GD alone. There will be continual balances of fittings, things will change. The fact that this gun got buffed, or that suit got nerfed isn't that big of a deal. If it's a minor change (which they usually are) it's nearly irrelevant. If something was so OP that it got the nerf bat, then you knew it when training that item, and should have known it was going to get the bat. If something you trained into got extremely buffed and then nerfed back, well, you're probably still in a better position than before.
The only people I see wanting a respec seem to have this "grand plan" on what they'd do with the SP, were they to get it back. You can see it in every thread. I'd take this to 5 and that to 5 and this over here to 5 and finish that. What do they always seem to skill into? The things that were most recently buffed.
Look, I wasn't thrilled with the way the ADS got hit this time around. I have so many LVL 5 skills in vehicles that I can't use the way I used to before. That doesn't mean the points are useless. The ADS will get looked at 10 more times before Legion and it'll get hit with the bat again and buffed again and hit with the bat again, etc. I still fly my ADS, I just lose them more often than I did before.
Just because something got changed, doesn't make you skill point investment pointless. I means you need to reevaluate your play style. Adapt. Figure out something new. You might just stumble upon something you truly love that you wouldn't have seen before you were forced to.
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RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
499
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Posted - 2014.10.14 15:15:00 -
[4] - Quote
maluble wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:No.
I've spent my SP wisely. Why should someone gain an advantage over me from spending it unwisely? So what your saying is you dont have 10 mil worth of skills that were drastically changed making them invalid to your playstyle?
I do, He does, we all do if we've been playing for any sort of long time.
They aren't invalid. You can't use all your skills all the time. If you use a logi suit, your points in commango, sentinel or scout aren't invalid, they just aren't being used at the time. Do you want a respec every time you switch a suit? Before every match? How many respecs do you want, because there's more changes coming down the pipe. |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
499
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Posted - 2014.10.14 15:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
Bradric Banewolf wrote:RayRay James wrote:Dreis Shadowweaver wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:No.
I've spent my SP wisely. Why should someone gain an advantage over me from spending it unwisely? It's not spending SP unwisely if what you spent it on gets changed. How are choices supposed to matter if CCP takes our choices and ***** all over them? Which is why I support respecs just on things that get changed, not full-blown respecs. That way, our choices REALLY WILL MATTER. You're crying over spilled milk The only skill point refund I remember in EVE in 8 years when was they removed learning skills. It wasn't a respec, it was a return. THAT IS WHY IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN If CCP won't refund SP in EVE, their bread and butter, even when they make such sweeping changes to ship design, they WILL NOT do it in Dust. You know what happens in EVE when something get's put on it's a$s? People adapt, they skill into new ships, they pull out old ships they haven't used in 3 years, a very tiny amount rage on the forums. Those that rage get told the same thing you see on these forums. It's exponentially easier to skill into new suits and weapons in this game that it is in EVE. Suck it up and quit whining. So I spec into assault full proto. Assault is rendered useless currently do to the fact that scouts are better at being assault. I can do ten times more with my gal scout than I can with my gal assault. Both are proto, but the assault is a waste of isk?! If I were to get just my suit and weapon points back I could choose to run two types of scout instead. I don't even run the assault at this point?! Almost got the gal commando proto too because it's also more versatile than my assault. It can use light weapons and tank armor. It can be slow or fast ( as you can get a heavy). It serves double as AV and fire support. With assault you have to choose one or the other. All my points in the AR and gal assault were pretty much a waste as I watched both the weapon and the class get nerfed and outclassed into oblivion?! Any points into the ScR was a waste as it has been killed?! These changes were after the fact that I spent the points. I spec into it for one reason only to have that reason removed. To be completely honest with you I can care less about eve outside of OB support. The two games simply aren't integrated enough to matter. What you don't get in eve shouldn't be denied to me in dust simply because you get on the forums and say "htfu"?! Eve is an entirely different game. When they change a ship it's still a ship. You change guns or whatever and keep mining?! In dust when they nerf something it gets obliterated!!! They completely change the way the suit or weapon operates. The gal heavy slot were 4 low 1 high. They switch them with the Amarr 3 low 2 high for the game "lore". That's a complete suit change! Well now gal heavy players want to spec into Amarr heavies to get their performance back, and rightfully so! I understand tweaks, but you must also understand how steep some of these changes have been. Once rattati finds a balance a respec is in order. The race you picked might be useless to your playstyle altogether by the time he's through. If you play well with Amarr weapons, and they get nerfed? Maybe your new weapon is minmatar weapons. By the time they're done I will have points all over the skill tree at this rate?! Remember! If I ran proto assault first that means I ran assault style mods. Armor, damage mods, shields, etc. Now due to the fact that assault is useless I run proto scout, but I must also spec into scout weapons and mods?! Your talking about saving millions of sp just to be effective?! We're not whining. We're asking for some consideration.
You really think swapping out t2 blasters for t2 lasers is a simple as swapping an AR for a CR?
CCP has done slot layout changes every 6 months I can remember playing. The ships are no different than the suits in that sense.
You may not care about EVE, and that's fine, but you should understand that the same developer is making the game. Set in the same universe, set by (essentially) same rules for both. Yes, I in fact have had ships destroyed by changes to the game. I used to fly a Myrmadon that was armor tanked and had 5 heavy drones. Now the right way to fit that is shield tanked with medium drones. Same hull, completely different ship. The hurricane is another ship they keep changing. Don't even LOOK at the EVE forums regarding the Jump Distance changes coming in. Every null-sec block $hit themselves.
YES! You will have skill points spread across everything in game, get over it. My main has MILLIONS of SP in industry that haven't been used in half a decade. I used them at one point, I don't anymore. Mostly because changes to industry made me not want to play that style anymore.
YES! CCP wan'ts you to retrain into weapons, your "millions of SP to save", when they make changes. Conversely, if you know changes are coming, save your SP. Wait to see how things play out, then apply them.
Asking for consideration while sounding like a petulant, spoiled child (not you specifically) is going to come across as whining. There are plenty of people here, who have gotten an answer from a GM, and have said "Waah, but that's not fair, that's not what I want". The people with concise arguments for getting a respec keep getting drowned out by the whiners and when a GM all but says 'Ain't happening, here's why', people keep going on.
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RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
499
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Posted - 2014.10.14 16:04:00 -
[6] - Quote
Leadfoot10, I like you.
I wish I had more votes to give. |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
500
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 17:12:00 -
[7] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:Leadfoot10 wrote:
And so you know, the "model that will [not] succeed even on a PC" has been surviving for more than a decade with Eve, not to mention countless other FPS and MMOs that use a similar model, and respecs after every change water down a fundamental tenet of the genre -- your choices matter.
The choices you make don't matter when CCP changes things on a whim. But they're not "changing things on a whim". They are changing things to introduce new content and improve balance.... ...just like every FPS I've ever played in the past two decades.... ...and just like Dust has been since closed beta. So, either you can recognize that and plan accordingly or you can continue to cry for respecs and argue that those who disagree make no sense. The choice is yours. I guess you forgot we only had a dropsuit SP refund for 1.8, when everybody on here wanted a full infantry respec. I had a full vehicle SP refund for 1.7, there wasn't any reason not to get a full dropsuit SP refund. You have no logical argument against one. You think people will get an unfair advantage over you, even though everybody would get one. Or do you enjoy stomping on noobs so much that you won't allow one for that reason alone?
People already have an unfair advantage over me and I have 52 Mil SP
It's called skill. They have it, i don't. (When it comes to guns, I'll Logi the $hit out of someone though)
I still don't think there needs to be a respec.
The reason they did only dropsuits vs full vehicle respecs was because of just how much they removed in 1.7. Trying to unwind the modules, vehicles and core skills for all the vehicles would have taken forever if it could have been done at all. Dropsuits, they refunded the whole tree because the rest of the modules and weapons weren't so intertwined.
I don't think most of the people here against respec's are that way because they want too scream "get gud, noob" on the forums. In my scenario, it's because I have seen that even after the respecs we have gotten, people will never be satisfied. If CCP gives an inch (one time respec) the forums will want a foot (anytime respecs). The only way to prevent that is to just never give in. |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
500
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 17:14:00 -
[8] - Quote
CUSE TOWN333 wrote: come on now Lead stop acting like we don't know how to play dust and use SP wisely. i have 4 proto suits heavy,2 assaults, and a scout plus 6 proto weapons
If you have all those Proto items and haven't maxed out your preferred role, that's your own fault.
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RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
502
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Posted - 2014.10.14 18:03:00 -
[9] - Quote
CUSE TOWN333 wrote:RayRay James wrote:CUSE TOWN333 wrote: come on now Lead stop acting like we don't know how to play dust and use SP wisely. i have 4 proto suits heavy,2 assaults, and a scout plus 6 proto weapons
If you have all those Proto items and haven't maxed out your preferred role, that's your own fault. small things like fitting optimization LvL 5 on a gun.
Now your just being silly |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
502
|
Posted - 2014.10.15 01:22:00 -
[10] - Quote
DrewEon1 wrote:Game Informer- Dust 514 A low-end shooter with sky-high ambitions.
Maybe a start could be a respec? Please just tell us why you won't give respecs!
How may ways and times do they have to repeat themselves
It's currently not fecking happening
If you want reasons why, use the search function at this point |
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RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
523
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Posted - 2014.10.16 17:33:00 -
[11] - Quote
Leadfoot10 wrote:Cpt McReady wrote:I am sorry for the aggressive tone but this topic is old and annoying and can be mostly summerized into following: some people want a respec, they bring good arguments for it, other people do not want that others get nice things and bring not so good argumentst. lol Biased much?
I think what he really meant was:
I am sorry for the aggressive tone but this topic is old and annoying and can be mostly summerized into following: some people want a respec, they bring good arguments for it, other people do not want a respec, they bring good arguments for it, but since I don't agree with them, they're wrong and I'm going to call them names for it. |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
528
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Posted - 2014.10.16 19:28:00 -
[12] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:GM Archduke wrote:You do get points for at least calling it a respec, and not respect, but seriously, another respec thread?
I have yet to hear a valid reason/argument for this, and trust me, I've heard a lot of different ones. Wow. Trolling Proficiency increased to 5. Never heard a good argument huh? I don't know if you considered this or not, but just because YOU specifically don't think it is a good argument, that does not mean it isn't one. Considering the allocation of likes in this thread, you are clearly in the minority. I'm assuming that you are of the mentality that, "you should pay for your mistakes," but what about the Gallente Sentinel, Caldari Scout, and Amarr Scout? In some cases they may be better because of their changes, but those changes made them completely different suits, and the player is hardly the one who made the mistake when the developer changed the way the suit plays. But I'm wasting my breath, if you are the kind of GM who only posts to say, "trollololol nothing will change but I'm glad that you can at least spell," then my post is hardly going to do anything. I'm glad we have this player-dev/GM communication though, whatever it may be worth.
All the arguments, like counts, and bullspit that's tossed around mean nothing if the DEVs and GMs don't want to give respecs.
The people who make the game have repeatedly and loudly said that there are no plans to give a respec.
What more needs to be said?
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RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
528
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Posted - 2014.10.16 19:31:00 -
[13] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:GM Archduke wrote:I decided not to try and explain why we don't want respecs - again. Whatever I would say would be misinterpreted and you guys would just go on repeating the same over-used arguments. So I'll do the same, and just suggest to keep an eye on the Forum and DEV-Blog - if we'll ever have such an option in DUST 514 ever-ever-ever again, these are the two places it would be announced. I don't like to double post usually, but I had to after reading this golden comment. Let me summarize this: "You guy's arguments for respecs are totally overused and provide insufficient reason to actually give a respec, so we won't be doing it. What? You want to know our reason's for not wanting a respec? You can't handle our argument. Just trust us that it's totally solid." If our arguments are so over-used that you aren't even taking a millisecond to consider them, why would you even care if we misinterpret your explanation?
I wouldn't blame them if they did a copy / paste comment at this point and started locking respec threads. It's tired. It's over. There's no current plan to do respecs.
move on |
RayRay James
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
528
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 19:34:00 -
[14] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:RayRay James wrote:Logi Bro wrote:GM Archduke wrote:You do get points for at least calling it a respec, and not respect, but seriously, another respec thread?
I have yet to hear a valid reason/argument for this, and trust me, I've heard a lot of different ones. Wow. Trolling Proficiency increased to 5. Never heard a good argument huh? I don't know if you considered this or not, but just because YOU specifically don't think it is a good argument, that does not mean it isn't one. Considering the allocation of likes in this thread, you are clearly in the minority. I'm assuming that you are of the mentality that, "you should pay for your mistakes," but what about the Gallente Sentinel, Caldari Scout, and Amarr Scout? In some cases they may be better because of their changes, but those changes made them completely different suits, and the player is hardly the one who made the mistake when the developer changed the way the suit plays. But I'm wasting my breath, if you are the kind of GM who only posts to say, "trollololol nothing will change but I'm glad that you can at least spell," then my post is hardly going to do anything. I'm glad we have this player-dev/GM communication though, whatever it may be worth. All the arguments, like counts, and bullspit that's tossed around mean nothing if the DEVs and GMs don't want to give respecs. The people who make the game have repeatedly and loudly said that there are no plans to give a respec. What more needs to be said? I said what needs to be said. If they don't want that respec so much, then fine, I'll live, but the fact that he comes in here trolling and saying everyone else's arguments are trash then specifically says that he isn't willing to give his own argument is an insult to the community. I'm just disappointed that I noticed this thread so late and that he probably won't be reading this thread any longer.
He's tired of saying the same thing, so he had a little fun. If you want to know the reasons, use the search function.
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