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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
1665
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Posted - 2014.10.06 13:41:00 -
[1] - Quote
is it possible for CCP to do some data mineing in PC battles because the scrambler rifle i believe was unfairly nerfed off of pub match data. the amarr assault was rarely used in PC before this patch and it has pretty much killed it in competition LvL.
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
1666
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Posted - 2014.10.06 13:55:00 -
[2] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:It seems to kill just fine.
And balancing off of 1% of the playerbase is stupid. its not fine dude and there should never be anything that only works in pub matchs but useless in PC.
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
1666
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Posted - 2014.10.06 14:11:00 -
[3] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:CUSE TOWN333 wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:It seems to kill just fine.
And balancing off of 1% of the playerbase is stupid. its not fine dude and there should never be anything that only works in pub matchs but useless in PC. You need to provide more data than "no one uses it." This doesn't tell us WHY no one uses it. Honestly with the armor meta I'm amazed ANYONE In PC used it. Its crap for popping gallente and amarr dropsuits. In pubs where people run cal and min fits it performs as well as any other rifle. So if you want to assert that it was overnerfed you need to give reasons not anecdotes. Preferrably with math. how things perform in game has never been about math or on paper DPS values. we all know the factors that made the scrambler rifle good in pubs but rarely used in PC. there has to be a way to balance it in both game modes and thats what i would like to discuss.
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
1670
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Posted - 2014.10.06 16:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
Fizzer XCIV wrote:It overheats too fast now. The RoF is still fine. The hipfire nerf wasn't necessary I don't think, but I'm not too bent out of shape about that. But the overheat is just terrible now.
Amarr Assault now makes it as good as it used to be on non Amarr Assaults, roughly. ScRs can barely dish out 1000 damage before it blows up in the users face now. Killing heavies, commandos, and even assaults is disproportionately hard compared to the other rifles now. Good luck against an armor sentinel. Your gonna need to get the drop on them, and land every shot in their head to kill them. that is what i mean by the nerf the rate of fire is fine and hipfire i can live with but that over heat now is ********. see there is a wall when balanceing the scrambler rifle and that is the overheat. its like takeing the combat rifle and nerfing it to a 20 shot clip makeing it unable to kill most targets. and here is where the balance problem comes in make the overheat to fast and you can kill starter suits in pubs no problem but it fails at killing proto suits. make the overheat to slow then it is to strong at killing starter suits in pubs but balanced in PC. but then you have weapons like the combat rifle that kill anything. believe me i did not spend all this SP and time on maxing the amarr assault and scrambler rifle just to have something that only works in pubs. so how can we balance the gun for both gamemodes?
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
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Posted - 2014.10.06 18:02:00 -
[5] - Quote
i just wish they nerfed people useing turbo controlers wthout braking the gun all together. o well i guess ill put my amarr assault and scrambler rifle back in my locker with the other nerfed useless gear i put SP into for over a year.
KEQ diplomat/ intel /GC officer
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CUSE TOWN333
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Posted - 2014.10.06 22:05:00 -
[6] - Quote
Her Nibs wrote:CUSE TOWN333 wrote:is it possible for CCP to do some data mineing in PC battles because the scrambler rifle i believe was unfairly nerfed off of pub match data. the amarr assault was rarely used in PC before this patch and it has pretty much killed it in competition LvL. Maybe you have lost your touch...because they still KILL. and are still annoying as SH&t you sound like someone who gets shot by them but does not use the gun to understand what im talking about.
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CUSE TOWN333
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Posted - 2014.10.08 13:55:00 -
[7] - Quote
Bright Cloud wrote:CUSE TOWN333 wrote:is it possible for CCP to do some data mineing in PC battles because the scrambler rifle i believe was unfairly nerfed off of pub match data. the amarr assault was rarely used in PC before this patch and it has pretty much killed it in competition LvL. Nobody cares about PC matches. Its all about pubs and using the biggest crutch in the game possible. pub matchs are more about what team has less droolers.
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
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Posted - 2014.10.09 11:36:00 -
[8] - Quote
KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:CommanderBolt wrote:An interesting discussion.
First off, where do we begin as the point of balance for the scrambler rifle? Do we begin at the base weapon? Do we begin at Amarr assault level 5 coupled with the scrambler? etc..
Not many other weapons have such varying levels of performance purely depending on what suit they are on. The combat rifle coupled with Minmatar assault or commandos with their racial flavours of weapons are probably the next nearest thing to compare against. Even still, the Amarr assault bonus is quite a different beast to the other bonuses.
Answer: Balance must always based on the maximum conceivable combination.Otherwise there will be new fotm. The combo meaning the the maxed out skill+gear+fitting combo. Now the fitting combinations make this a challenge for the devs, of course. When the things (weapons f.ex.) have been balanced at maximum level, then the lesser variants will be created/balanced/calculated. i would say part of the problem was invisible scouts running around with a high alpha damage weapon like the scrambler rifle. if you increase the amarr assaults heat bonus to tone down some of this crazy heat build up of the scrambler rifle it might help. because i believe the scrambler rifle should be good with the amarr assault because its the gun and bonus that made the suit viable with drawbacks like being slow and no ewar and trouble takeing on high armor targets.
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
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Posted - 2014.10.09 11:56:00 -
[9] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Problem is the commando only has the laser rifle and scram rifle bonused. In my experience the overheat makes scrams largely untenable in the hands of the amarr commando.
You cannot take advantage of the scram alpha if you overheat before the gun has fired six shots. ok well you just answered a couple problems right there. the commandos are lacking right now and could use some buffs so give the amarr commando a small heat build up bonus and the amarr assault a much bigger one. then the other commandos could get there own buff to and the other assaults suits i fell need a small buff and we are that much closer to balance in the game.
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
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Posted - 2014.10.09 15:20:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jack 3enimble wrote:Even on the armor scouts my viziam works fine. Now on armor mediums it's not that great. Working as intended since it's a anti shield weapon.
I'm one of the few that often uses the Viziam ScR in PC, just know who to engage when and you'll be fine. it would be a good idea to engage everyone thats trying to take your letter in PC.![Blink](https://forums.dust514.com/Images/Emoticons/ccp_blink.png)
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CUSE TOWN333
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
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Posted - 2014.10.10 07:47:00 -
[11] - Quote
Cruor Abominare wrote:Imp Smash wrote:My 2 isk.
The gun was fine before any of the nerfs. The problem was that autofire controllers allowed it to put out the highest DPS in the game.
Nerfing the RoF was, therefore, a great idea. That would have fixed the gun right there. The heat nerf was a bit of a blow as a non amarr class can't kill before the gun overheats and Amarr's are pushing it right to the limit. No other gun has that severe a limitation. It shouldn't be an 'assist' gun to pad your combat rifle using teammate's KDR. (this also limits your ability to do ANYTHING alone - say watch a backdoor...)
So the heat nerf should be undone.
Also, I don't understand the hip dispersion nerf. I don't know if the gun was overperforming at close range but it never felt like it did to me (of course -- i never used an autofire controller. Maybe it did for them.)
Regardless -- the RoF nerf be the only change. See how it performs then before all this other stuff... This is pretty typical of most posts about the gun. But to continue to beat the dead horse. Myth 1 You could only hit the max dps with a rapid fire controller There were plenty of videos of people achieving the max ROF without a rapid fire controller. Myth 2 that rapid fire controllers some how fired faster than the ROF limit on the gun False again, no proof has ever been submitted on this and all available footage keeps the weapons firing rate inline withe the RoF. Myth 3 Adjusting the rof impacted using a rapid fire controller False again. The whole point of using the rapid fire controller is to guarantee that the weapon fires at its max rof every time. Because of lag and performance issues having your natural timing get thrown off diminishes the effectiveness of the gun. A slower natural timing on the gun actually accentuates this issue. You're even better off using the rapid fire controller now than you were before because every shot matters so much more because of the ******** and lazy heat mechanic being used on the gun. The two things hindering the weapon are the insanely lackluster charging mechanic (which would do away with using a turbo altogether) and the silly heat mechanic that that forces the user to care more about firing off as many shots as possible as the primary concern when firing. (which again would diminish the benefit of using the rapid fire as well) actually bringing the ROF down to the limit of what a human can achieve without a turbo controler means useing a turbo controler would give no benefit.![Roll](https://forums.dust514.com/Images/Emoticons/ccp_roll.png)
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