Vicious Minotaur
1195
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Posted - 2014.10.05 22:39:00 -
[1] - Quote
Derpty Derp wrote:valad II wrote:Crimson Cerberes wrote:700+ eHP with a tiny hitbox is better than having 1200 HP and a huge hitbox. This is getting out of hand. Yes you can. Run 2complex damps. They obviously arent running Ewar mods. Be stealth & shotgun them to the back of the head. G-1 Series Scout 2complex damps 1 Complex Kincat 2 Complex Precision Enhancers K5 Spec. Shotgun TLO ( I think) Scrambler pistol or the Breach is hiting them Cald. pretty hard now too. Adv Cloak Compact Nano So when everyone cried about the main dropship counter being another dropship...
The whole "counter to something is itself" dilemma gets a wrench thrown into it when you realize that in order for that to apply here, in this contex, vlad II would have had to recommend a 700+ eHP scout. I could be wrong, but damps/kincats/precision mods do not modify HP values (you know, with them being biotics and eWAR mods instead of shields/armour).
And last time I checked... Tanked scout =/= Completely untanked scout. Unless, of course, one places all scouts as being equal, regardless of DUSTs entire fitting system. But then that begs the question as to why one would single out a specific scout fitting, when fittings are irrelevant...
I am a minotaur.
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Vicious Minotaur
1195
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Posted - 2014.10.05 22:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
valad II wrote:Vicious Minotaur wrote:Derpty Derp wrote:valad II wrote:Crimson Cerberes wrote:700+ eHP with a tiny hitbox is better than having 1200 HP and a huge hitbox. This is getting out of hand. Yes you can. Run 2complex damps. They obviously arent running Ewar mods. Be stealth & shotgun them to the back of the head. G-1 Series Scout 2complex damps 1 Complex Kincat 2 Complex Precision Enhancers K5 Spec. Shotgun TLO ( I think) Scrambler pistol or the Breach is hiting them Cald. pretty hard now too. Adv Cloak Compact Nano So when everyone cried about the main dropship counter being another dropship... The whole "counter to something is itself" dilemma gets a wrench thrown into it when you realize that in order for that to apply here, in this contex, vlad II would have had to recommend a 700+ eHP scout. I could be wrong, but damps/kincats/precision mods do not modify HP values (you know, with them being biotics and eWAR mods instead of shields/armour). And last time I checked... Tanked scout =/= Completely untanked scout. Unless, of course, one places all scouts as being equal, regardless of DUSTs entire fitting system. But then that begs the question as to why one would single out a specific scout fitting, when fittings are irrelevant... Counter to scout with 700+hp is not another scout with 700+hp. A counter would be dampening and precision, with speed. Thats why it is called a counter.
....what?
People are bringing up the idea that the counter to something should not be itself. (and directed that idea at what you said)
I simply mentioned that countering a tanked scout with an untanked, eWAR scout does not fit with the idea of "The counter to something is itself."
Because, again, Tanked scout =/= Completely untanked scout, which is directed at the aforementioned idea. (being: the counter to something should never be itself) In order for that idea to apply, it would have to have been 700eHP scout vs. 700eHP scout, which, given what has been said, is not at all applicable (because you suggested an eWAR scout).
To put it simply, I was agreeing with you.
I am a minotaur.
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Vicious Minotaur
1198
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Posted - 2014.10.06 07:35:00 -
[3] - Quote
Crimson Cerberes wrote:
If you think it is ok for scouts to be the only valid counter for scouts you are crutcher.
I frequently counter any and all armour tanking scouts (be it eWAR or Tanked) with a Mass Driver. They don't like those (hell, even shield tanked scouts don't like them). And Mass Drivers can be used on any suit.
Ion and scrambler pistols can wreck shields of any scout, and can be used to counter any shield tanking scout (provided you can aim). And sidearms can be used on all suits.
In fact, every single weapon in the game, barring the swarm launcher, can be used to counter a scout suit if you are competent. If you can't counter a tanked scout suit with anything other than another scout, then, well... you just flat out suck at this game.
"But they can cloak!"
Oh, but you have eyes, and the cloak, when active, is easily seen through.
"But they can avoid scans!"
Oh, but again, you have eyes. Check your back frequently, avoid getting tunnel vision during engagements, and your eyes will see scouts, even cloaked ones. Oh, and you have active scanners. And yes, they work. Tanked scouts will have trouble beating an active scanner.
"But they are fast!"
Oh, but they are not faster than bullets, now, are they?
"But they can tank lots w/ better speed and a hitbox!"
Oh, but if you use the right weapon, they are as good as dead. Can't hit them? Get better aim, or use a different weapon that is more forgiving. That speed won't mean a thing when you force them to either run or die with proper weapon usage.
In fact, the best counter to scouts (and anything, really), is YOU. As in, your brain and your eyes. That's how it is in virtually every game.
Now, that's not to say that there are not problems with scouts, for there are (I won't go into the real problems, because this thread is trash). But Come on. There is an entire fitting system in DUST with a plethora of options. I counter scouts, even heavily tanked ones, on a regular basis using ARs, MDs, Bolt pistols, HMGs and others, all on Logis/assaults/Commandos/Sentinels, and yes, even scouts.
TL;DR
Get good, and use the damn fitting system.
I am a minotaur.
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