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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
9525
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Posted - 2014.09.23 17:16:00 -
[31] - Quote
Thang Bausch wrote:I actually saw some ambush OMS games that looked like they would be stomps turning into respectable loses or narrow wins and it was always because the losing team got their **** together.
In one, someone from my team placed a drop uplink in a perfect position (don't know the map names, but the one with the raised concrete and pipes going over a deep depression; the uplink was on the corner where there was an installation) and the clone count went from 60-30ish to 0-13. The other team was dominating us by constantly pushing onto the retreat DL.
Once a DL was put in that position very far from the enemy line (instead of in the next defensive position behind the current position like where I kept putting them), the opposing team kept doing that same push but now running up the corner to the installation and tanks separately up top against my SL, the installation, and a forge gunner. Killing the infantry running up the corner was like shooting fish in a barrel.
I came out of that match something along the lines of 20/13/5 and my gun game is meh at best and on bad days just plain bad. Just proved to me that even with good match making there will still be some lopsided matches because one team just fell apart or never got it together in the first place or half the team team decided to red line snipe or AFK in the MCC.
In that case, no amount of matchmaking fixes will cure that. If some players don't want to be team players or at least put more effort into pushing the enemy away, then you can't force them to. It's like trying to cure stupidity.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Joe Macro
Acme.Taco
19
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Posted - 2014.09.23 17:30:00 -
[32] - Quote
Outie 500 wrote:Out of the 10 mcc matches I played, I lost 9. Only won the 10th match by pulling out my thale and camping the mcc roof. Seemed fitting for the occassion. Even though I lost the 9 matches, I got first place on most. Scotty has too much faith in my motivation . I have always been a solo player in every game I play. That will NEVER change. In the two years I've been playing dust, I've squaded twice. Im fast pace and people can't keep up.The thing that gets me the most, giving someone a ride, jump out to drop a link and they jack my ship. Then I waste half the match chasing it down just to crash into it. (Principal and I don't want an enemy making money off my loss). I'll be uploading a pic of my wallet tomorrow showing a horrible loss streak. I did check score boards at the end. Either I was matched with a team of noobs or boosting was going on. Same people too. 2/35, 1/25. Both in the 9th match. Sure proto stompers will say matchmaking is working. They like easy kills. Matchmaking needs to be based off total SP or KDR. Not what it is now.
I think after a while your Mu should adjust and your matches will get better. It did for me anyway. First 10 were just horrible and then they started to get better to where by Sjunday they it just felt like a typical match.
I solo all the time now and have a fairly low overall KDR (1.15) but have maintained around 2. weekly and montly for the last few months. When I started this week I was struggling to get 1.0, but it improved to around 1.5. So, yeah I think it will get better for you in time. |
Joe Macro
Acme.Taco
19
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Posted - 2014.09.23 17:35:00 -
[33] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:[quote=Thang Bausch]I actually saw some ambush OMS games that looked like they would be stomps turning into respectable loses or narrow wins and it was always because the losing team got their **** together.
In that case, no amount of matchmaking fixes will cure that. If some players don't want to be team players or at least put more effort into pushing the enemy away, then you can't force them to. It's like trying to cure stupidity.
Soloing does NOT mean you are stupid, not a team player, or you have lack of effort.
Thats sort of like saying special forces or airborne troops are really ****, because they are not part of with the larger force. |
Outie 500
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
11
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Posted - 2014.09.23 17:59:00 -
[34] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:All our data says that battles are massively more balanced after the fix. I might even write a little thread on our findings once Delta is out.
Im sorry, but my data says otherwise! As a matter of fact, I posted a similar post maybe a week ago. I played three matches and lost all 3 and left dust. So out of the last 13 matches Ive played, "my team" only won (1) match! I even pushed HARD the last two matches (full proto heavy/thale). That is way beyond underdog! I guess my data has not been added because I moved on to another game. Was hoping to come back when the game was fixed.
Here's a screen shot of my wallet. I ONLY deleted corp name to prevent death threats from proto stompers....
http://postimg.org/image/h19nftenf/
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Nothing Certain
Bioshock Rejects
1168
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Posted - 2014.09.23 18:16:00 -
[35] - Quote
Outie 500 wrote:Out of the 10 mcc matches I played, I lost 9. Only won the 10th match by pulling out my thale and camping the mcc roof. Seemed fitting for the occassion. Even though I lost the 9 matches, I got first place on most. Scotty has too much faith in my motivation . I have always been a solo player in every game I play. That will NEVER change. In the two years I've been playing dust, I've squaded twice. Im fast pace and people can't keep up.The thing that gets me the most, giving someone a ride, jump out to drop a link and they jack my ship. Then I waste half the match chasing it down just to crash into it. (Principal and I don't want an enemy making money off my loss). I'll be uploading a pic of my wallet tomorrow showing a horrible loss streak. I did check score boards at the end. Either I was matched with a team of noobs or boosting was going on. Same people too. 2/35, 1/25. Both in the 9th match. Sure proto stompers will say matchmaking is working. They like easy kills. Matchmaking needs to be based off total SP or KDR. Not what it is now. HERE IT IS: The worse loss streak in Dust history! http://postimg.org/image/h19nftenf/9 losses 1 win! I have 60mill SP. Imagine how the new players feel!
I don't see how you losing matches is evidence for anything regarding matchmaking, in fact, a 60 million SP guy losing is evidence of it working well.
Because, that's why.
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Leadfoot10
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
1531
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Posted - 2014.09.23 19:02:00 -
[36] - Quote
I disagree strongly with the OP.
Matchmaking on both my main char and vehicle char has been MUCH better since the change has been implemented. Sure, the do-nothings are still on the teams, but overall the matches are much closer as a general rule than they were before. Well done. |
Tech De Ra
Electronic Sports League
839
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Posted - 2014.09.23 21:45:00 -
[37] - Quote
valad II wrote:Tech De Ra wrote:Outie 500 wrote:Out of the 10 mcc matches I played, I lost 9. Only won the 10th match by pulling out my thale and camping the mcc roof. You didn't win the 10th because you used a thales, you won because the other 15 people carried you snipers dont win matches Don't be a d!ck. Let him think he carried the whole team with his Thales. Do just the opposite and stroke his ego. "OMG dood, you are so good with that Thales bro. Can you teach me" . He is in for a wake up call when Delta drops and he cant redline snipe as easy as it is now.
I'm pretty sure **** isnt banned on the forums yet
edit: it is, i hope shite isnt though
edit 2: YES MY FAVOURITE WORD STILL ISN'T BANNED, WHAT A GLORIOUS WORD IT IS
Prime League champion
SGL Sidearm champion
Fanfest '14 All star champion
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Michael Arck
5733
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Posted - 2014.09.23 23:36:00 -
[38] - Quote
I know you can't fix the players and I'm really hoping that these players continue to grow. Until they do, I play ambush. Humor me devs, just check play some domination and see how it plays out. It's just not that intensive or even battle worthy at times. I know it can't be fixed on CCP's end really. I don't think they can because like I said, players need to be seasoned more. That's not on CCP to administer of course.
But I play only Ambush for a reason. Couple of guys I talk to in game feel the same way. It's why I made a joke thread about finding Oceania in domination. It is just as barren and non competitive as that server was. Also another reason why I made another thread "Adopt a Blueberry".
Heck, I'm even thinking about helping Fox out so we can help the playerbase which in turn helps the community of Dust to have more fulfilled battles. I think plenty of players are not understanding what can be done in objective games. It might be a bit intimidating for them to grasp.
TL:DR? It's not really the matchmaking system. I think it works fine. I think we just have to nurture and guide the young padawans in New Eden. Water the seeds and the garden shall be prosperous.
Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah
*Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
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Taurion Bruni
D3ATH CARD
259
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Posted - 2014.09.24 00:01:00 -
[39] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:All our data says that battles are massively more balanced after the fix. I might even write a little thread on our findings once Delta is out.
Do they look balanced or are they balanced?
does your matchmaking engine take into account that some people perform better in different game modes? so for example if clone A is good in Ambush, but is terrible at Skirmish, while Clone B is the opposite, and their average mu is the same, so they both get put into the same Ambush match?
is there any multiplier for clones that enter the game as a squad? the 6 mercs in a squad should be weighed more than 6 mercs of equal skill, but were thrown in together (not in a squad at all)
Python Pilot // Minmatar Assault
Adapt or Die!
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
9528
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Posted - 2014.09.24 00:18:00 -
[40] - Quote
Joe Macro wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:[quote=Thang Bausch]I actually saw some ambush OMS games that looked like they would be stomps turning into respectable loses or narrow wins and it was always because the losing team got their **** together.
In that case, no amount of matchmaking fixes will cure that. If some players don't want to be team players or at least put more effort into pushing the enemy away, then you can't force them to. It's like trying to cure stupidity. Soloing does NOT mean you are stupid, not a team player, or you have lack of effort. Thats sort of like saying special forces or airborne troops are really ****, because they are not part of with the larger force.
I guess I worded that wrong. What I meant is that regardless of whether or not players are in a squad, if they don't contribute to the team as a whole then they are just dead weight to the team and therefore no amount of proper matchmaking will encourage them to help out. They will likely leave the match at the first sign of resistance or just resort to redline sniping when they have lost two or three suits.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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SponkSponkSponk
The Southern Legion Final Resolution.
1076
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Posted - 2014.09.24 00:21:00 -
[41] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:All our data says that battles are massively more balanced after the fix. I might even write a little thread on our findings once Delta is out.
Rattati, will you be doing more statistical analysis on squads vs solo?
I know there's a multiplier for a squad vs 6 individuals; it would be good to see how accurate the calculated mu is, vs the effect of the squad on W/L ratio.
Dust/Eve transfers
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
9528
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 00:26:00 -
[42] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:I know you can't fix the players and I'm really hoping that these players continue to grow. Until they do, I play ambush. Humor me devs, just check play some domination and see how it plays out. It's just not that intensive or even battle worthy at times. I know it can't be fixed on CCP's end really. I don't think they can because like I said, players need to be seasoned more. That's not on CCP to administer of course.
But I play only Ambush for a reason. Couple of guys I talk to in game feel the same way. It's why I made a joke thread about finding Oceania in domination. It is just as barren and non competitive as that server was. Also another reason why I made another thread "Adopt a Blueberry".
Heck, I'm even thinking about helping Fox out so we can help the playerbase which in turn helps the community of Dust to have more fulfilled battles. I think plenty of players are not understanding what can be done in objective games. It might be a bit intimidating for them to grasp.
TL:DR? It's not really the matchmaking system. I think it works fine. I think we just have to nurture and guide the young padawans in New Eden. Water the seeds and the garden shall be prosperous.
The problem with domination matches is that they are poorly laid out. The objective is usually situated in a location where it can be easily be covered by snipers, massholes, or burst HMGs. Case in point is Fracture Road -- aka King of the Hill -- where the objective is literally on the peak of a hill where the central tower structure provides an elevated platform for covering the objective from above which is conveniently facing their side. Whoever establishes themselves here first has effectively won the match long before the MCC has been destroyed or before either side is cloned out. You need a very good team to take that objective from the opposition and even then you will need to sacrifice a large number of clones to do so. The map will need to be redone to balance it out.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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Heimdallr69
Nyain San General Tso's Alliance
3661
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 00:27:00 -
[43] - Quote
So all day I've been solo and pitted against 1-2 full squads and none on my side. I understand my MU is good but I can't play 6 roles at the same time. This game is no longer enjoyable solo. Looks like I'll pubstomp with a full squad now =ƒÿç
Removed inappropriate content - CCP Logibro
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Ryme Intrinseca
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
1923
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 00:32:00 -
[44] - Quote
Ahkhomi Cypher wrote:https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=175428&find=unread
It seems as though the new formula takes win/loss and kill/death into account. You may have gotten some fraudulent k/d w/l having players on your team against some players with legit k/d and w/l ratios. Formula is new and it will even out eventually. Just guessing. May be wrong. Groan... not this again. Read your link. Mu does not take K/D into account. It is only correlated with it. |
Ryme Intrinseca
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
1923
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Posted - 2014.09.24 00:40:00 -
[45] - Quote
I agree with OP. When I played solo I've found the balancing to be no better, maybe worse. Not so noticeable on my main character (COUGH because I can carry a team if needs be COUGH) but on my low SP alts for trying new things out the games were very unbalanced.
In squad, though, I think the games are more balanced. We still win almost every game but there are more close games.
Maybe so many people are saying 'it works' because they play in squads. |
Ryme Intrinseca
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
1923
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 00:43:00 -
[46] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:All our data says that battles are massively more balanced after the fix. I might even write a little thread on our findings once Delta is out. Would be interesting to hear what this mysterious 'data' that gets used to shoot down every one of these threads actually is... |
Michael Arck
5734
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Posted - 2014.09.24 00:56:00 -
[47] - Quote
Heimdallr69 wrote:So all day I've been solo and pitted against 1-2 full squads and none on my side. I understand my MU is good but I can't play 6 roles at the same time. This game is no longer enjoyable solo. Looks like I'll pubstomp with a full squad now =ƒÿç
Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding!
Exactly. I love playing solo, even more so now because alot of folks jumped ship for Destiny. I usually join a random squad but damn some of those are just bad. I know I'm not elite but I can handle my own in a decent squad.
Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah
*Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
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Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
9529
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Posted - 2014.09.24 01:04:00 -
[48] - Quote
Heimdallr69 wrote:So all day I've been solo and pitted against 1-2 full squads and none on my side. I understand my MU is good but I can't play 6 roles at the same time. This game is no longer enjoyable solo. Looks like I'll pubstomp with a full squad now =ƒÿç
Keep in mind that some players have padded their stats quite a bit using "questionable" tactics while others work hard for those stats. That and we were all playing under a team-building system that was broken during that time. CCP Rattati or CCP Frame said that our MU was already adjusted from the beginning using data gathered from us months ago. That said, I suspect it will be some time before the MU gets adjusted based on the new system.
On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
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maluble
Art.of.Death VP Gaming Alliance
74
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Posted - 2014.09.24 01:07:00 -
[49] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:Play more ambush. Lol ambush is where you will most likley get proto stomped |
Michael Arck
5736
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Posted - 2014.09.24 01:09:00 -
[50] - Quote
maluble wrote:Michael Arck wrote:Play more ambush. Lol ambush is where you will most likley get proto stomped
Not really my friend. I know a little while ago it was brutal but its not that bad now, really. Just hold the line, lessen your hitbox and just have some fun. Some intense battles be happening in Ambush. Check it out sometime again.
Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah
*Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
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Heimdallr69
Nyain San General Tso's Alliance
3664
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Posted - 2014.09.24 01:21:00 -
[51] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Heimdallr69 wrote:So all day I've been solo and pitted against 1-2 full squads and none on my side. I understand my MU is good but I can't play 6 roles at the same time. This game is no longer enjoyable solo. Looks like I'll pubstomp with a full squad now =ƒÿç Keep in mind that some players have padded their stats quite a bit using "questionable" tactics while others work hard for those stats. That and we were all playing under a team-building system that was broken during that time. CCP Rattati or CCP Frame said that our MU was already adjusted from the beginning using data gathered from us months ago. That said, I suspect it will be some time before the MU gets adjusted based on the new system. True.. I still do good but there's only so much an assault Can do. Especially when the Other side vehicle spams =ƒæ+ oh well it's what we deserve for playing solo.
Removed inappropriate content - CCP Logibro
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Vrain Matari
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
2243
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Posted - 2014.09.24 13:26:00 -
[52] - Quote
RKKR wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:So far when running solo since the change, every time my team has been stomped into the ground it has been because no one was placing Drop Uplinks. That's because the current system doesn't include jack **** about what actually makes an actual balanced fun interesting battle. Now it's just the few players that carry the team, at least you had used to have a few matches were you could switch roles instead of doing the same thing in the hope of winning. I've seen matches in the new system where the winning team had terrible stats and the losers posted solid KDRs. Granted that happened occasionally in the old system too.
In the vast majority of skirmish matches i've experienced the result has been close in terms of MCC health, clone count or both.
The -¦ system might need adjustments in the long run, but as a first pass i'd say it's pretty damn good given our concurrent player count.
PSN: RationalSpark
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Mobius Wyvern
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
5327
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Posted - 2014.09.24 13:52:00 -
[53] - Quote
valad II wrote:Tech De Ra wrote:Outie 500 wrote:Out of the 10 mcc matches I played, I lost 9. Only won the 10th match by pulling out my thale and camping the mcc roof. You didn't win the 10th because you used a thales, you won because the other 15 people carried you snipers dont win matches Don't be a d!ck. Let him think he carried the whole team with his Thales. Do just the opposite and stroke his ego. "OMG dood, you are so good with that Thales bro. Can you teach me" . He is in for a wake up call when Delta drops and he cant redline snipe as easy as it is now. I'm looking forward to the sniper changes because that's effectively a buff for me. I can't stand redline sniping, and the new Tactical stats will make it perfect for using on the field.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Outie 500
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
12
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Posted - 2014.09.24 16:18:00 -
[54] - Quote
I forgot to mention something in the original post but did so in my last one.
These 10 matches were not even close to being even, because they were COMPLETE blowouts. By the time the match was finished, the enemy had FULL shields on MCC.
I saw a LOT of big name corps on OTHER teams (D,M,X) and a bunch unheard of's on mine. They were ALL random corps, none of the same. Could ALL solo players be getting matched together?
I AGREE everyone should be in a "squad". Heck I stayed in a SOLO squad and keep in LOCKED (for orbital purposes/vehicle lock). Maybe newer players who are'nt in a squad, should be put into one on deployment? Highest SP is squad captain?
Even though I no longer play dust(blue moon), I have emotional, financial ties to the game. Dust could have been the GREATEST game ever made! It was the love of my life for over a year! The wife came second..... Dont tell her that ok? |
Thang Bausch
Pierrot Le Fou Industries
222
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Posted - 2014.09.24 18:46:00 -
[55] - Quote
Joe Macro wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:[quote=Thang Bausch]I actually saw some ambush OMS games that looked like they would be stomps turning into respectable loses or narrow wins and it was always because the losing team got their **** together.
In that case, no amount of matchmaking fixes will cure that. If some players don't want to be team players or at least put more effort into pushing the enemy away, then you can't force them to. It's like trying to cure stupidity. Soloing does NOT mean you are stupid, not a team player, or you have lack of effort. Thats sort of like saying special forces or airborne troops are really ****, because they are not part of with the larger force.
Solo playing definitely does not mean you can't be a team player. I spent the first year playing this game running almost exclusively solo and I still came in the top half of the board in majority of matches (at least in the latter half of that year because I was a horrible, horrible noob for the first half)
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RKKR
The Southern Legion Final Resolution.
1038
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Posted - 2014.10.04 14:27:00 -
[56] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:All our data says that battles are massively more balanced after the fix. I might even write a little thread on our findings once Delta is out.
Did I miss this thread somewhere? |
Aria Gomes
The dyst0pian Corporation
546
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Posted - 2014.10.04 17:28:00 -
[57] - Quote
Do you add people to your contacts? Anybody I have on my contact list, I usually have them on my team or the enemy team. Makes for some good games. Maybe you should squad up and you would've had 10 out of 10 wins :P Just some food for thought
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Paeonn
xCosmic Voidx Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
6
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Posted - 2014.10.04 18:23:00 -
[58] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:So far when running solo since the change, every time my team has been stomped into the ground it has been because no one was placing Drop Uplinks. This man speaks truth!! How many times I find the entire map devoid of any (usably placed) blue uplinks. Forcing me to switch back to my spawn spam fit...
Everybody can place a link people! Want to win more games? Start every game with a suit with uplinks and keep refilling when you need to. Don't wait for a blueberry to do it for you.
Maybe this will motivate you: It's getting WP easy mode too!
Paeonn, dedicated LogiBro, for all your supplies, reps and rezGÇÖs
Greek mythology: Paeon, Healer of the Gods
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ACT1ON BASTARD
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
203
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Posted - 2014.10.04 18:24:00 -
[59] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:All our data says that battles are massively more balanced after the fix. I might even write a little thread on our findings once Delta is out. It seems.balanced to me but there are still a lot of q syncers in fw. Thats where the q syncers go now, played 4 matches yesterday everyone of them stacked. |
RKKR
The Southern Legion Final Resolution.
1038
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Posted - 2014.10.04 18:36:00 -
[60] - Quote
Paeonn wrote:Fox Gaden wrote:So far when running solo since the change, every time my team has been stomped into the ground it has been because no one was placing Drop Uplinks. This man speaks truth!! How many times I find the entire map devoid of any (usably placed) blue uplinks. Forcing me to switch back to my spawn spam fit... Everybody can place a link people! Want to win more games? Start every game with a suit with uplinks and keep refilling when you need to. Don't wait for a blueberry to do it for you. Maybe this will motivate you: It's getting WP easy mode too!
Just wait until you won't care about the WP anymore (funny because you'll probably make 80% of WP for your team and CCP will be happy that the team-WP are balanced )...you're left with a boring game unless you squad up (sadly a lot of people are not playing this game anymore or it get's too easy again). |
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