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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13278
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Posted - 2014.09.15 01:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
Bahirae Serugiusu wrote:You are a tank. You are not meant to be invincible. You are meant to be the biggest target in the field if you want to go one man army and you die no ones problem but yourself. Jihad jeeps? So what do you recommend? Removing LAV or RE because slamming a car into a tank with a bomb on it kills everyone? You have a BFG you should be killing them before they even get close to you at least thats what I'm doing in a puny little Sica.
Rooftop campers. Those are a nuisance for everyone and the only counter is a dropship or a good sniper able to take out the uplinks do you want a mod to make your tank start flying around like its GTA:SA?
Of course HAV are not thats a given. But that does not mean they should not have the feeling of durability and power associated with Tanks.
I mean the Tiger Tank (Panzer VI Ausf. M H1) was a tank that was slow, rock solid, and put the fear of God into infantry the world over..... weren't invulnerable.
Personally I'd just like to see another tier of HAV with more purposes and a full HAV line up. Might even make me return to the game.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13282
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Posted - 2014.09.15 03:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
Atiim wrote:JLAVs are a valid tactic.
The only way to get killed by one is if you aren't paying attention (incompetence), or if the LAV Pilot manages to out-smart and/or out-maneuver you, in which case he's simply better than you.
All you have to do to stop them is either activate a NOS and then thrust in the opposite direction, causing them to miss their mark and allows you to destroy them; or shoot the REs and blow up the LAV. Heck, you can even shoot them out of the driver seat if you have a Missile Turret (AT-201 or better).
As for rooftop campers, if Pilots weren't able to zoom in and insta-kill AVers with a Boundless or Six Kin HMG, you'd see far less tower camping. Though the short range of a SL (175m) makes tower camping rather redundant in most situations.
Though if an AVer catches you by surprise, you should suffer the consequences.
You know that's not true...... but hell what does it matter at this point.
Only reason I hate JLAV's is because it utterly destroys immersion and spits on the values of New Eden on which this was designed.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13284
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Posted - 2014.09.15 22:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:You should really calm down. I have seen the same entitled attitude regarding vehicles before and it was just as laughable then too.
Vehicles are OP if they are meant for single user operation. If they were crew served, it would be a different story.
As for you spending so many SP on them, I would say that was your choice, though why you want to be a vehicle purist in an FPS, IDK why you chose dust when other games have implemented vehicles better.
If you did it so you could own infantry from a "safe" place, why not go kick puppies instead?
I can understand the point of view but it simply is not possible to make an enjoyable aspect of the game if you require a minimum of two other players to operate (tank crews normals at 3+ if I remember correctly).
It simply isn't possible to crew them, especially competitively, it isn't possible to have the co-ordination to function as a useful piece of machinery, and its not possible to make it and enjoyable aspect of gameplay with 3+ players required to operate a single vehicle.
Plus tanks in Dust don't even work or feel like proper tanks.
They have no weight, they move and fire on the fly, their cannon do not have AOE or powerful recoil, they do not one shot infantry, they do not have 1000+ m ranges like they should.....
Tanks in Dust are pitiful.
Their modules are in such a state of disrepair, their pilots filled with apathy and loathing for a simplified system that ****** over skill and well invested players to **** away on a bunch of players who picked up a simplified system of OP monsters (1.7-1.8) and thought themselves good at what they did.
Were is the Mass? The slow Acceleration? The Skilled active module activation? Where is the powerful ordinance that no other class/ role in the game to can bring to the battlefield? Where's the goddamned recoil!
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13288
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Posted - 2014.09.16 02:05:00 -
[4] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:Wait...
This is a tanker thread asking for tank buffs?
This is why a lot of people don't like tankers, because of this sense of entitlement. As if tanks are in a bad place right now and need some help.
Tanks are in the bad place right now.
Not Efficiency wise..... but in the sense that they are poor renditions of tanks with no role, no in depth skill tree, no technical skill as all modules are essentially passive, and do not function as proper armoured vehicles.
They do not bear massive fire power and ordinance such as no infantry man would be able to carry alone, they do not have mass, do not accelerate slowly, not not skid to a halt when stopping. Hell they can fire away on the move.
Their turrets do not fire single shot AOE Shells with incredible AV potential...... their turrets do not track slowly, do not fire more than 500m......
Yet another reason I walked away from Dust 514 and right into Battlefield 4 and War Thunder Ground Forces.
Better renditions of tanks, better gameplay.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13302
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Posted - 2014.09.16 20:52:00 -
[5] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:True Adamance wrote:Atiim wrote:JLAVs are a valid tactic.
The only way to get killed by one is if you aren't paying attention (incompetence), or if the LAV Pilot manages to out-smart and/or out-maneuver you, in which case he's simply better than you.
All you have to do to stop them is either activate a NOS and then thrust in the opposite direction, causing them to miss their mark and allows you to destroy them; or shoot the REs and blow up the LAV. Heck, you can even shoot them out of the driver seat if you have a Missile Turret (AT-201 or better).
As for rooftop campers, if Pilots weren't able to zoom in and insta-kill AVers with a Boundless or Six Kin HMG, you'd see far less tower camping. Though the short range of a SL (175m) makes tower camping rather redundant in most situations.
Though if an AVer catches you by surprise, you should suffer the consequences. You know that's not true...... but hell what does it matter at this point. Only reason I hate JLAV's is because it utterly destroys immersion and spits on the values of New Eden on which this was designed. What value? HTFU? I'd say devising a method to circumvent the OP tanks of what was 1.8 follows this one? Don't fly what you can't afford? Works here again. Welcome to New Eden MF! I'd say this almost perfectly describes the JLAV. Also which appears more immersion breaking out of the following options. An Immortal Mercenary sacrificing himself in giant ball of death to eliminate a tank? OR A tank out running Missiles and Jeeps? OR Infantry units standing in the open 'chop-strafing' against each other?
As I often say it should not require one broken mechanic to counter another broken mechanic.
Lets be honest here I've never claimed I was a good tanker through the 1.8 massacre of quality tankers...... worst period of balance in the game.
However I stand by my statement. Personally I found JLAVS to be a **** poor casualised mechanic out of battlefield.... I was not against AV being buffed to make tanking more risky, in fact that and a combination of ISK increases for HAV across the board would do leaps and bounds to make tanking more enjoyable for me personally. But I'd rather be taken down by a forger, swarmer, plasma cannonier, than a douche in a complete in his BPO suit, lav, side arm, with remotes.
It's poor design. Let proper AV do its job and not resort to poor mechanics like this.
But lets be honest if I could strap a couple of those RE to a tormentor all you'd see me doing in EVE is suicidal battleships and Cruisers for an instant kill.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13303
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Posted - 2014.09.16 22:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:@ True
I agree with your perspective overall. It seems balanced and reasonable. It assumes that there should be a role for both tanks AND AV.
However, I do not agree with the perspective of the OP that tanks are weak and need to be made stronger, and that AV is just too tough.
I would much rather see a thread that addresses the real issues instead of pretending that poor old tankers need a buffing to contend with the mean old AV.
AV is.... or was pretty punchy when I left the game..... personally I am more for single shot high alpha AV (MOAR ROCKETRY/ Stinger type weapons)...... while I do appreciate DPS AV has its role...... I just don't see the point of it when alpha trumps it all.
Tbh I just want to see a tank that is a tank. Not these skeet shooting light assault platforms that we have now.
What is the purpose of a tank? To carry ordinance and other weapons bigger and more devastating than any weapon infantry mean to operate while remaining mobile. What is the side effects of a such a weapons system. Mass, time to target, inability to target small mobile units, etc.
What we have now are not tanks.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
13304
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Posted - 2014.09.16 22:40:00 -
[7] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:One Eyed King wrote:@ True
I agree with your perspective overall. It seems balanced and reasonable. It assumes that there should be a role for both tanks AND AV.
However, I do not agree with the perspective of the OP that tanks are weak and need to be made stronger, and that AV is just too tough.
I would much rather see a thread that addresses the real issues instead of pretending that poor old tankers need a buffing to contend with the mean old AV. Mean old AV wants Chromosome AV/V with marauders again. I swear to God popping tanks was fun. Someone dropped a Mad and I'd go berserk till I killed it, popping militia tanks and poorly fit mid-grade tanks like after-dinner mints while hunting the real prize: A Marauder with a pilot with higher-than-lukewarm IQ.
Yeah it was. I was only using Standard Swarms back then and trying to Pop as Sagaris was hell...... but the feeling of destroying one was actively visible throughout the entire team of players.
It was exquisite.
"We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
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