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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 12 post(s) |
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6799
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Posted - 2014.09.09 13:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
All right, this may get interesting.
First let me thank the CPM, Barbershop, dedicated snipers and Iron Wolf Saber for a lot of feedback and information gathering. In the end, it's going to be CCP, that makes the most informed decision we can, so please don't blame them for the bad things, and pat them on the back for the good things.
The intent is to bring snipers closer to the battle, and specifically not have to rely on countersniping a Thale's with a Thale's. Boosting headshot damage modifiers will reward skilled snipers, and make countersniping and heavy take-downs way more feasible.
We think these are moderate proposals and are intended to be buffs to the role, but will also increase the risk of the sniper, and that is intended. We want there to be a proper range progression from novaknife to sniper rifle, and a place on the battle field for each range bracket.
Now to the design goals/intent. Please try to frame your feedback so it is relative to these roles.
Sniper Rifle - the Suppressor, enough firepower to line up enough bodyshots to suppress, kill stragglers and countersnipe
Highest range, medium clip and medium ammo, sustainable dps High damage - High headshot modifier 300% (from 196%) New Effective range - 450 Reticule - New Sniper reticule based on Plasma cannon
Charged Sniper Rifle - the Executioner, one shot-one kill type
Trades range and ROF for alpha damage, high headshot multiplier and highest native damage, smallest clip and ammo High damage - Very high headshot modifier 350% (from 196%) New Effective Range - 400 Reticule - New Sniper reticule based on Plasma cannon
Tactical Sniper Rifle - the Rifleman, stand and shoot, and has enough ROF and damage output to effectively take down approaching enemies. (basically super TAR)
High damage - high headshot modifier - 250% (from 196%) Main change - Increased ROF, clip size and ammo, direct damage New Effective Range - 350 Reticule - the current circle to allow shorter range engagements and snap shots
Keeping all ranges well out of Forge gun ranges and retaining enough range to be effective.
The Thale's zoom and range will be adjusted properly to fit thes design goals, ie. the zoom will be adapted and the current zoom reduced.
We do not want to touch stability, sway, nor accuracy in this pass, so please refrain from posting such comments.
Please try to keep this civil and constructive, and to the point. There will be no ranting tolerated here, we have had enough in recent threads. Talk about the points, what we missed, what we did right and do not project what you think other people or CCP know or think about snipers. Just your personal feedback.
Thanks!
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6801
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Posted - 2014.09.09 14:10:00 -
[2] - Quote
Right-wing Extremist wrote:Will the Thale's continue to work along the lines of the Garden Variety Sniper Rifle with Charge-caliber damage, Garden Variety clip and improved zoom?
As for the Charge, define "smallest clip and ammo".
I don't use the TacSR now and probably will continue to not do so as lining up a headshot at relatively close range against a dropsuit zig-zagging toward me is outside of my ability. But the proposal seems to accomplish what you set out to do for the TacSR (i.e.: giving it a niche).
I need those first two questions answered before I can be 'okay' with this nerf, though.
Thale's will be an improved "normal" sniper rifle, with the same zoom. The Thale's zoom will be removed from the game.
Charged Sniper - 3 shot clip, 15 ammo.
You can call it a nerf all you want, we think it is a massive buff to headshots and the role.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6806
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Posted - 2014.09.09 14:23:00 -
[3] - Quote
PROPHET HELLSCREAM wrote:Hi Rattati, 1 -¦ quoting you : "... Boosting headshot damage modifiers will reward skilled snipers, and make countersniping and heavy take-downs way more feasible. ..." personally this is the best part... 2-¦ the Tactical Sniper Rifle - Increased ROF, clip size and ammo, direct damage with the damage increased... is a good change for some maps! 3-¦ and sad... the use of the charged will keep hurting my head... or mute tv ! ps: whats the look of the reticule based on Plasma cannon...?
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=172372&find=unread
the third picture in the link above, I love it and so do a lot of snipers. It solves the problem of the dot being obscured by the target by having the two horizontal wings, and the bottom vertical line.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6806
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Posted - 2014.09.09 14:24:00 -
[4] - Quote
SponkSponkSponk wrote:Does the charge have the actual charge-up game mechanic still?
Yes, no behaviour changes except for new reticules and reduction of Thale's zoom.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6813
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Posted - 2014.09.09 15:38:00 -
[5] - Quote
Alaika Arbosa wrote:Will the Tac be functioning as a DMR?
Please say the Tac will function as a DMR, I miss groundsniping
I think it may evolve into that, let's see how this urban tactical sniper works damage wise, and then we can look at sway and "stand and shoot". Soraya actually reprimanded me in skype just now, "it's not stand and shoot, just crouch and shoot" :)
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6874
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Posted - 2014.09.10 01:12:00 -
[6] - Quote
Right-wing Extremist wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:The varitey of other buffs presented are not going into effect until we see the effect of these changes to prevent making a god gun off the bat. After all lots of the changes will change player behavior and that cannot be predictively measured in numbers. What "other buffs"? Was there something in the Narrative thread that I missed? Because Rattati doesn't mention any buff beyond putting the headshot modifier where it should be in the OP of this thread. All he mentions are range and zoom nerfs. What are these 'variety of other buffs presented'? EDIT: If I did in fact miss something, I'll go look for it - but nothing was linked to the barbershop so I might just not know that something better than the situation described here is on the table.
In my OP and replies, we do mention sway and further changes.
We are also increasing normal damage on tactical and normal snipers.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6874
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Posted - 2014.09.10 01:14:00 -
[7] - Quote
Alena Ventrallis wrote:Confused on this part. CCP Rattati wrote:Tactical Sniper Rifle - the Rifleman, stand and shoot, and has enough ROF and damage output to effectively take down approaching enemies. (basically super TAR)
CCP Rattati wrote:We do not want to touch stability, sway, nor accuracy in this pass, so please refrain from posting such comments.
Am I reading that tacs will be able to fire from standing, or am I simply misreading?
You can still stand and shoot with max skills, at a somewhat good efficiency. In Delta it might be a little more of move, crouch and shoot to be honest. We want to see first how it pans out in Delta, collect data, and then maybe decrease sway on the TacSR to fit the role better.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6888
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Posted - 2014.09.10 04:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
Right-wing Extremist wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:In my OP and replies, we do mention sway and further changes.
We are also increasing normal damage on tactical and normal snipers. Ah, so not JUST headshot damage (except on the Charge and Thale's). That's more reasonable. I failed to understand that from the OP - my apologies. I hope you caught the suggestion about tiered Compact nanohives (my original suggestion was to allow ADV and PRO compacts to carry 2 and 3 hives respectively, but an increase in nanite clusters would be equally nice - one or the other, not both, I'm not trying to be greedy here).
Wouldn't a lower nanite consumption on sniper rifles also work?
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6954
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Posted - 2014.09.12 00:45:00 -
[9] - Quote
Symbioticforks wrote:I know what I want to say, but how to say it..
Current Review : Charge Sniper Rifle
The most viable sniper rifle at consistently killing infantry if you're a rather accurate marksman. For those who miss more often or like a higher rate of fire the Ishukone (standard) sniper rifle is preferred. The Charge Sniper Rifle with the highest base damage rewards you with more damage for headshots. As it should because it's a charge to fire mechanic. You can still consistently kill players by going for body shots, usually at a rate of 2,3,4 for scout, assault, heavy. (prototype suits)
IWS Suggested : Charge Sniper Rifle
All in on headshots. You will be reloading 40% more than you currently do. Assuming you always wait until the rifle is empty to reload. In reality since it takes at least 2 shots to kill the weakest of suits with bodyshots, you will be reloading anytime the clip isn't full. (prototype) Having 3 bullets would afford you 1 miss. It used to be the most consistent sniper rifle, but no longer. You'll be wasting precious time missing on headshots all match. (Which are more of a bonus in reality, unless the target is stationary) Since partially obscured moving targets on uneven terrain is commonplace, this rifle is best suited to counter-sniping. Think of it like the new Tactical Sniper Sniper. Then think of the new Tactical Sniper Rifle as something closer to a quickscoping sniper rifle.
You're turning my favorite rifle, and many others into an abomination. For no reason. If you watch some my videos you'll see that often times I use my first shot to feel out my target. Think tracer round. I'm serious, a large amount of the time I miss my first shot on a somebody, the second shot however has an insanely high hit percentage compared to the first. Limiting the clip size to three makes this kind of shooting not worth the time it'll take me to constantly have to reload. Thus, making the rifle inferior at pretty much everything when compared to the standard variant. The one with 2 more bullets, close to the same headshot damage, and no charge time. I'll say it one last time, players won't be going for bodyshot kills with this gun at all. And the standard sniper rifle will suffer the same problem, headshot damage is increased, but bodyshot damage is still awful.
All of this combined will have players, including myself using sniper rifles as headshot only weapons (essentially)
That's boring. Inconsistent. Situational.
#nobodyaskedforthis #yourefired
First of all, these are CCP changes, not IWS. I personally made the 3 shot change from the suggested 4 because we are tracking multiple ratios, dmg/clip, head dmg/clip, dps/range and fully modded alphas and comparing against the other snipers. And honestly, a 4-3 clip goes from Fine to Abomination. If you want to OHK a Sentinel, you are trading that alpha for number of shots.
This is all debatable, but let's do it with less drama, and more facts. Not set in stone yet, but will be very soon.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6957
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Posted - 2014.09.12 02:01:00 -
[10] - Quote
Joel II X wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:Right-wing Extremist wrote:Will the Thale's continue to work along the lines of the Garden Variety Sniper Rifle with Charge-caliber damage, Garden Variety clip and improved zoom?
As for the Charge, define "smallest clip and ammo".
I don't use the TacSR now and probably will continue to not do so as lining up a headshot at relatively close range against a dropsuit zig-zagging toward me is outside of my ability. But the proposal seems to accomplish what you set out to do for the TacSR (i.e.: giving it a niche).
I need those first two questions answered before I can be 'okay' with this nerf, though. Thale's will be an improved "normal" sniper rifle, with the same zoom. The Thale's zoom will be removed from the game. Charged Sniper - 3 shot clip, 15 ammo. You can call it a nerf all you want, we think it is a massive buff to headshots and the role. 15 max ammo? That's the only change I disapprove of. Loving every change, but 15 max ammo? C'mon. 18 max ammo, please. That's 6 mags per rifle instead of 5. Also, will the Charge be given more damage per shot/charge than the standard? It doesn't have a much higher headshot percentage, and with the less range, I expect it be used for body shots more often than not (one shot, one kill).
That's literally no problem.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
6968
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Posted - 2014.09.12 13:41:00 -
[11] - Quote
PROPHET HELLSCREAM wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Symbioticforks wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:
First of all, these are CCP changes, not IWS. I personally made the 3 shot change from the suggested 4 because we are tracking multiple ratios, dmg/clip, head dmg/clip, dps/range and fully modded alphas and comparing against the other snipers. And honestly, a 4-3 clip goes from Fine to Abomination. If you want to OHK a Sentinel, you are trading that alpha for number of shots.
This is all debatable, but let's do it with less drama, and more facts. Not set in stone yet, but will be very soon.
The charge should have more damage per clip, otherwise there would be no charge time. I just think changing the clip size of the charge without a significant base damage increase removes bodyshot sniper rifle play from the game. The standard sniper rifle used to one hit kill on headshots anything except ultra tanked heavies. The return to the original vision is fine, in fact the standard doing 1000-1200 damage on a headshot is great, and allows you to immediately follow up with a body shot for the kill. What I'm asking for, is the charge sniper rifle with the same headshot multiplier as the standard, and with the clip size of 5. One major concern is that for PC, you can't go for headshots as a primary means of detterence. Often times they're laggy, in fact any match that has equipment spam or suffers from graphical lag headshots are almost out of the question. Meaning what sniper rifle does one use when it's like this? I would go for something that hits hard, so long as I hit someone. Obviously the charge sniper rifle. Anyway you get that I'm not happy with the change, I'm sure you see why. If you can find some sort of work around to have the clip size be something more than 3 and not have the charge sniper rifle become come the new Kaalakiota, I would greatly appreciate that. I really don't want to spend the entire match going for headshots, and there isn't a body shot type rifle left if you do this. Currently the charge rifle and standard rifle offers the same magazine size and yet charge rifle is widely immensely more popular. To be honest the new headshot bonuses between ishukone sniper and the wiyrkomi charge rifle wouldn't change the dynamic of the want to use one rifle over the other, the range advantage the ishukone will enjoy is fleeting at best against MOST targets as expected engagement ranges will be well within range and not near the edge of the range. So this brings in the question as to why I would even bother using an Ishukone? When the Wykromi is so much superior? The body shot damage is immensely powerful vs the ishukone and the headshot is going to be ever as lethal as the rest of the rifles. The fitting is not getting messed with. I wouldn't touch the charge time with a 10ft pole that is now how you discourage the use of a gun that mostly works mechanically. Lowering the range any further is not a really good option. ROF is null and moot until you get to 29 rpm Sway is not getting adjusted if anything not improved. This leaves us with every few options Namely Damage (which isn't budging) Headshot bonus (which is comparatively powerful) Zoom, and max ammo and clip size. The max ammo and clip size is probably considered a significant enough but less of the evils necessary to ensure the ishukone remains as popular as the wykromi. Now i don`t understand some things here... but isn`t the base damaged be the same as they are now? if only the headshots are buffed the charged rilfe will have limitations... targets are not still... the relation between clip size and rof don`t limits the use of the charged? Today i prefer the ishukone or kalakyota over the charged... if the headshots are the only thing buffed i will continue to prefer the ishukone... ps: what about the noise of the charged... can`t do anything about it...?? I will post numbers over the weekend
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
7015
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Posted - 2014.09.13 16:24:00 -
[12] - Quote
Thanks for the discussion, we will be sharing numbers when they are finalized.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
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