Well, if you could actually comprehend what was said, I only mentioned Leviticus and Miss Leviticus. Pay attention to what is typed and by whom.

so what if there are Contract Hunters, Opus Arcana, or any of the other "Hot" corps.

Its about costs. Which aren't static. The rewards aren't static either. If a team already took losses in their first push to get an objective, and then took some losses holding the objective, and then took losses losing the objective...guess what? Their offensive capabilities have been blunted.

Ill spend a bit of time here composing an example. Lets say Fracture Road on Domination. For those that dont know what map that is, It is displayed here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=107462&find=unread


So the Domination starts, ill use a dropship to go get some uplinks up high above "A". Because of the nature of the spot, the dropship has to be abandoned to thin air. Its a bare bones Gorgon that costs 27,000ISK. My Logi suit with several droplinks runs up about 20,000ISK. So within the opening minutes of the match, Ive already spent about 47,000ISK just getting the uplinks down.

Now lets say a minute later, a rival dropship lands people where my uplinks are, or an ADS destroys the main ones at the top and the spare ones on the pipe...my team no longer has the spawn advantages, and its going to cost me another 47,000ISK to put some more. Sometimes I do, most of the time i dont.

Alright, so i give up on planting uplinks up high, and I see if i can plant them around ground level. Scouts, vehicles, and random reds will destroy most of them. My 20,000ISK uplink suit is not made for combat, so when I run into any of the above i usually die. Sometimes ill get the suit back to the supply depot, other times I wont. Sometimes Ill use a bare bones LAV to plant some uplinks on the flank. If a tank, ADS, or AV catches me and destroys me, thats another 43,000ISK lost in 1 shot.

So If I try the drop ship for the uplinks twice and fail, on foot twice and fail, and by LAV twice and fail, its only about 6 deaths but its 218,000ISK in losses. And all i was trying to do is plant uplinks.

So what can I do after that? I decide to start forge gunning the ADS buzzing overhead, but then a enemy squad ambushes me before I can land on the kill shot on the ADS. Thats another 25,000ISK. I try to spawn in another point but the CRU is hacked before i can. Now theres no where else to spawn except in our MCC and primary installation. Weve been redlined, and I cant afford any more vehicles or uplink fits to break out.

So what to do at that point? Mostly defensive things. Man an undestroyed turret, grab a sniper, grab a codebreaker militia fit and try to sneak out to the complete other side of the map to hack things for WP.



People gotta understand. What do I get out of the game? Enjoyment, and ISK. I dont enjoy throwing myself in militia fits at entrenched squads. its futile. Even when Im just hanging back doing the bare minimum till the end of the game, im still having fun. ill pick a cheap fit with a laser rifle on it and practice it a bit in the background. Once Im close to or have already passed my tolerable limit of losses, i have zero motivation to take so much as another shot to my armor.

One way to fix this would be to increase salvage exponentially. If i was up against a mostly proto equipped squad, and there was a good chance a bunch of their stuff goes into the salvage pool, I would keep pushing till the end, cause getting salvage is a form of pay, and top tier salvage has worth.

Right now i calculate earnings of 250,000ISK per pub match on overage. So I keep my losses under that number. But with a massive salvage pool, Id be willing to go up to losses of 300,000ISK, and gamble on the fact that my salvage yield could exceed 50,000ISK value.

Sorry. But, I was in a "real" corp. And I got dismissed cause I voiced my opinion about the alliance we joined. I didn't like the the other corps, after having faced them and getting flaylocked to hell and back. (right after flaylock debut, when "people" would run fits with two flaylocks. again, one of those weapons for the lowest order of primate.) And stating that I refused to squad with any of them.
After recieving my "walking papers" I then started my own. The name of which is Latin, meaning "The Betrayed". I've had trust issues since. And i'm not one of those mindless drones that tries to join a "top corp".

This is the only game I know of where people go into a match with the intent of trying NOT to win. WHY THE UNHOLY HELL IS THAT?
I have gone into match's that started out really good. My team has the majority of null points (skirmish, my favorite mode) then part was through they just stop trying, they kind of just roll over and present themselves for mounting. Then while i'm trying to motivate them, give direction or tactical suggestions. I get derided, I catch flak for trying. I'm sorry, but I grew up in the era before they started handing out trophies for just showing up. We had to earn the trophies. You didn't when , guess what? The only thing you got was pizza after the game.
The lamest excuse I get during my DI inspired motivation speech's is "It's just a game." Football is just a game. But, you don't see the Raiders , the Bears, Steelers, Packers or the Vikings going out and NOT trying to kick ass. Baseball is just a game. But, you don't see any of the going out there and not trying to win. Hell, Monopoly is just a game, but I don't know of one person the at plays that GAME and doesn't try to own every property.
But yet, here on Dust it's ok to be Losers. So, what if there are Molon Labe players on the other team, so what if there are Contract Hunters, Opus Arcana, or any of the other "Hot" corps. They are just like you. Not all of them are "Top gun" players.
Just saying.

One of the big drivers of this loser mentality is that CCP builds it right into the mechanics of their game in the form of their WP/ISK payouts, match win'loss payouts and especially their passive in-match sp charity(and don't forget their laughably clownish attenppt at a 'rubberband-proof' AFK mechanic). Then throw in the redline mechanics.

There's more, but i'll stop there.

You can blame the players that aren't sufficiently bloody-minded, but i blame CCP for cutting off real competition at the knees. Tbh, i've never heard a CCP employee address any of these issues which are the real drivers of player dynamics in this game.

it's called being on a team full of blueberries

people realize that pubs don't matter like FW and PC do

I have to agree with the 1st post and anarchide up there.

HTFU. This game is getting soft. I need to come back to show you guys the way the old pro's used to handle things.

This is the only game I know of where people go into a match with the intent of trying NOT to win. WHY THE UNHOLY HELL IS THAT?
I have gone into match's that started out really good. My team has the majority of null points (skirmish, my favorite mode) then part was through they just stop trying, they kind of just roll over and present themselves for mounting. Then while i'm trying to motivate them, give direction or tactical suggestions. I get derided, I catch flak for trying. I'm sorry, but I grew up in the era before they started handing out trophies for just showing up. We had to earn the trophies. You didn't when , guess what? The only thing you got was pizza after the game.
The lamest excuse I get during my DI inspired motivation speech's is "It's just a game." Football is just a game. But, you don't see the Raiders , the Bears, Steelers, Packers or the Vikings going out and NOT trying to kick ass. Baseball is just a game. But, you don't see any of the going out there and not trying to win. Hell, Monopoly is just a game, but I don't know of one person the at plays that GAME and doesn't try to own every property.
But yet, here on Dust it's ok to be Losers. So, what if there are Molon Labe players on the other team, so what if there are Contract Hunters, Opus Arcana, or any of the other "Hot" corps. They are just like you. Not all of them are "Top gun" players.
Just saying.

Yeah like they dont hide and cower in the corner on PC and FW -_- come on dude its an epidemic. These COD noobs are making all these other people have no choice but to sit back and get stomped and those that keep trying to win the match just lose the most, Its not just pubs they are doing this in anymore.

There has never been a reason to win except your own ego.


CCP doesn't incentivize or teach players to get better or be better at DUST 514.

Instead they dumb down the game and make it easy, drastically reduce TTK and install aim assists that track targets for you.


Fixing lag, FPS drops, Hit detection mechanics, Aiming mechanics, Physics, Collision Mechanics, Terrain stickyness, Invisible walls, Map construction...

Has never been something they have fixed even closely...


They just had to build and maintain a solid game to make it a success... Instead they have cut every corner and done what is "easy" and gone the "LAzy" route at every turn.

It's sad... but you get what you give.

All I know is Im having much fun in ambush because the name of the game is kill. But even blueberries mess that up.

Played dom in a squad today and within 5 mins I was pissed. No one dropped uplinks after first set destroyed. Same blues running into the same chokepoints already heavily guarded by reds. Long story short, no one tried it seemed.

I miss pre FF playerbase. The pubs werent exactly golden then but hell you could at least come across smart players with the will to win, even when the chips didnt fall in our favor.

So all I mainly do is run ambush. Objective games **** me off how incompetent the blues are. But they wanna ***** about qsyncs. We do that to lessen the morons on our team.