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Onesimus Tarsus
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Posted - 2014.08.19 19:58:00 -
[1] - Quote
Except he is.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
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2490
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Posted - 2014.08.19 20:02:00 -
[2] - Quote
Death Shadow117 wrote:Onesimus Tarsus wrote:Except he is. No you arent and ill laugh when ccp removes kdr.
Kdr matchmaking removes kdr, you can laugh then.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
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2490
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Posted - 2014.08.19 20:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
Death Shadow117 wrote:Soulja Ghostface wrote:Replace kill and death with isk gained vs isk lost
In eve universe death isn't the end, Bankruptacy is the closest thing to the end This is great too.
In before Bpo/starter fit adjustment.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
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2490
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Posted - 2014.08.19 22:36:00 -
[4] - Quote
TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote:Death Shadow117 wrote:TYCHUS MAXWELL wrote:Death Shadow117 wrote:But dust is very different. You cant judge everyone by kdr you know why. Because cod doesnt have support roles it teaches you to shoot people and dont give a **** about friendlies. Dust belive it or not is more related to real life because we have medics grunts etc. etc. I propose a new stat be added on the carachter sheet it should just be total lifetime healing given and total revives given so, when you apply you can put it into your app so they can judge you with being a logi and how good you are at it. Not everyone is a slayer so not everyone should be judged as one. There is always a way to abuse stats. Your proposal can be pointless if players just revive boost to make themselves look like amazing logis. Not too mention you don't even have to boost for your revive to be pointless and the player die upon revive. The best way to tell how good a player is has always been to play with them/against them. The kd/r guy isn't wrong. It will be weird to start, but over time kd/r will equalize and players will be placed with players who get the same amount of kills. Eventually everyone will be close to 1.0 with the best players probably being at 1.2 to 1.4 and the worst being from .5 to .8. Things like snipers having to only fight snipers just shows how bad a mechanic letting players snipe in the red line is. Likewise, vehicles having high kd/r just shows how OP vehicles are. Logis can kill too, at least the good ones. But to be honest, there isn't much point in caring. This game is mired in bad design flaws that aren't going to magically disappear with any sort of matchmaking system. That's probably why CCP took Dust out to pasture. So i guesa everyone should just become slayers then. I can logi and get 4000 wp wasy with a 0/0 kdr because im keeping my hwavies alive. Maybe not use revivea as one but total health given should get onto your carachter sheet too. Sorry I have a nasty habit of editing my posts as I think more on the subject. Here's a part you missed: "Not everything is about killing in a first person shooter war game!" It's always about killing, varying roles are about helping your team to kill. When's the last time a team not killing anyone won a match? I've never seen one side go 150/75 and the 75 side win by MCC destruction. I've seen like 40/75 with 40 winning by MCC destruction but that implies that the 75 side couldn't apply enough pressure and taking objectives. Again, all comes back to killin'. If your 4000 wp and 0/0 helps the team win then sure. But I have a sneaky suspicion you would be more helpful if you actually killed some people from time to time. Honestly you shouldn't worry about a kd/r matchmaking system if you are really good at this game and just have a bad kd/r because you are a logi you will become a god until you equalize and reach your actual level of play. It will be like the battle academy all over again. To answer your question yes, everyone should be slayers. When I use my mobile command center logi with nanos and uplinks I still plan to be a slayer and when I use a medic suit I still plan to be a slayer. You should always be aiming to kill the enemy when you can.
He's going to burn out a brain cell trying to not get something put far more eloquently than I could have...
but not as succinctly.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
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2490
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Posted - 2014.08.19 22:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
Death Shadow117 wrote:PoP SoTa wrote:Bad logi's making excuses for sucking.
Do you need to stand with a rep tool in your hand 24/7, or a nanite, or even a hive? No? You do hold your gun?
Why not try using it? Concentrated DPS is as useful as healing, if not more so.
Im not even a logi and im speaking for more than just myself. Logis shouldnt go looking for fights they should stay with their heavy and the heavy should look for the fight. If it comes to it and i have to kill someone in my logi i will but i dont go picking fights in my logi.
Player says they aren't a logi.
Player describes how they run logi.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
is-a-Corporation
2490
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Posted - 2014.08.19 23:22:00 -
[6] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:Ryme Intrinseca wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:I wonder how long until that "KDR Matchmaking will fix this" guy shows up.. His struggle for relevance is real. He should try actually defending his point sometimes.  Honestly I don't even remember the guy's name, just his stupid suggestion.
No one can remember, or pronounce my name. That said:
Player A, for whatever reason, is 15/2 KDR for the first hypothetical match.
So is player B.
A and B meet on opposite sides and start pew pew.
A kills B.
A is now 16/2, B is 15/3.
If matchmaking is purely by KDR (not that it's the only relevant stat, just the one that most jarringly separates stompers from stompees), then A and B are that much less likely to meet again (with population being a big factor) unless their KDRs are somehow re-matched by wins/losses to other players. After a few thousand people have done this for a while, striation of KDR occurs and people generally only meet people of their lethality (KDR over time). Because of this, stomping simply stops. Every match is closely contested and the margin of victory thins.
Then it gets interesting. KDR has been largely negated as a stat that wins matches, and other, more nuanced factors begin to emerge. Capturing points, repping heavies, needling corpses effectively all become vastly more important than before, because they are the new difference. WPs matter so much more because one well-placed (or poorly placed) orbital can be the only difference in winning and losing.
Gear gets chewed up at a phenomenal rate for all but the Starter Fits and BPO crowd, but payouts match expense far more closely than before. FOTM is basically just another way to jack your KDR up to a place where you get your teeth caved in while wearing it (and losing it). Squads matter more, and they have to function well or they don't matter. Corps matter, but only if they make good squads.
New players quickly find their lethality and have challenging matches that don't spiral them into despair. Even the most seasoned vet is challenged at almost the exact same pace. Players are forced to diversify to fill gaps in game-to-game strategy. A new game mode emerges: King of the hill. And everyone is playing it, whether they know it or not.
It's everyone vs everyone. E. v. E. BEH!
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
is-a-Corporation
2490
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Posted - 2014.08.19 23:24:00 -
[7] - Quote
Freccia di Lybra wrote:inb4 snipers vs snipers matches.
If you want to judge a player you should look at K/D Ratio, WP/match ratio, K/min ratio, W/L ratio. That's what make a good player good, all the rest are carebears.
This wouldn't happen unless all snipers killed all other snipers at the exact same rate every time forever. Thank you, KDR matchmaking, you just fixed the redline too!
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
is-a-Corporation
2492
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Posted - 2014.08.19 23:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:Onesimus Tarsus wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Ryme Intrinseca wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:I wonder how long until that "KDR Matchmaking will fix this" guy shows up.. His struggle for relevance is real. He should try actually defending his point sometimes. Honestly I don't even remember the guy's name, just his stupid suggestion. No one can remember, or pronounce my name. That said: Player A, for whatever reason, is 15/2 KDR for the first hypothetical match. So is player B. A and B meet on opposite sides and start pew pew. A kills B. A is now 16/2, B is 15/3. If matchmaking is purely by KDR (not that it's the only relevant stat, just the one that most jarringly separates stompers from stompees), then A and B are that much less likely to meet again (with population being a big factor) unless their KDRs are somehow re-matched by wins/losses to other players. After a few thousand people have done this for a while, striation of KDR occurs and people generally only meet people of their lethality (KDR over time). Because of this, stomping simply stops. Every match is closely contested and the margin of victory thins. Then it gets interesting. KDR has been largely negated as a stat that wins matches, and other, more nuanced factors begin to emerge. Capturing points, repping heavies, needling corpses effectively all become vastly more important than before, because they are the new difference. WPs matter so much more because one well-placed (or poorly placed) orbital can be the only difference in winning and losing. Gear gets chewed up at a phenomenal rate for all but the Starter Fits and BPO crowd, but payouts match expense far more closely than before. FOTM is basically just another way to jack your KDR up to a place where you get your teeth caved in while wearing it (and losing it). Squads matter more, and they have to function well or they don't matter. Corps matter, but only if they make good squads. New players quickly find their lethality and have challenging matches that don't spiral them into despair. Even the most seasoned vet is challenged at almost the exact same pace. Players are forced to diversify to fill gaps in game-to-game strategy. A new game mode emerges: King of the hill. And everyone is playing it, whether they know it or not. It's everyone vs everyone. E. v. E. BEH! In theory that works, but the reality is much different. mostly becuase your theory is based on the assumption that the goal is to win the match, when there is a large subsect of the game population that have no such interest and that fact completly undermines the mechanics that would make this theory function. not to mention twinking will be a thing as theres already a large portion of people that roll new alts over and over again to mess with things. its also VERY easy to manipulate by just joining matches and scuiciding over and over and over and over again to tank your KDR and manipulate the metrics to put them back in the bracket they want to be in and yes ALOT of people will do that.
Let them, if they want to put in the time, which increases with each kill. Please, try to think deeper than one match.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
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2492
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Posted - 2014.08.20 00:34:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:Onesimus Tarsus wrote:
Let them, if they want to put in the time, which increases with each kill. Please, try to think deeper than one match.
i am, you can play at about a 4 to 1 ratio of stomp to scuicide games and still stay in whatever KDR bracket you want to. the lower the KDR bracket the more scuicide games you have to play to maintain your position however so its not exactly a 4 to 1 thats pretty much just an average. see the problem you dont see is the math part. lets say you run 20/3 for 4 games thats 80/12 to balance out to a 1/1 bracket you only need to kill yourself 68 times wich you can easily do in 2 games so if you suicide for 1/3rd of your games you will stay in a 1/1 bracket indefinatly its a whole lot easyer to tank your kdr then it is to increase it, your thinking its harder to tank then it is to raise... tanking your KDR gets easyer the higher your KDR is not the other way around so saying "it increases with each kill" is pointless as it gets easyer to manipulate the higher your KDR is. saying "let them" is dumb as it undermines the whole point of changing the matchmaking system its the same thing as saying "lets change the matchmaking system so that its easyer to pair yourself up against new players more consistantly and face no real oposition."
So, people who are willing to suicide for 1/3rd of their game time all day, every day are the most relevant? Odd that your mind went there so quickly. And then of course, we have the six guys all agreeing to suicide together at the exact same rate so that they can squad stomp, and the corps of dozens of players duty-bound to suicide at the exact same rate in order to rule the world. If that's the game, nothing stops it. Thank God, however, most people are normal and those pitiful few will fall to insignificance as fast as they perpetrate their idiocy. Of course, having a rule that the fifth suicide in a match removes you from the match with no statistical results recorded...
But what am I saying? That's just crazy pills.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
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2493
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Posted - 2014.08.20 01:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:Onesimus Tarsus wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:Onesimus Tarsus wrote:
Let them, if they want to put in the time, which increases with each kill. Please, try to think deeper than one match.
i am, you can play at about a 4 to 1 ratio of stomp to scuicide games and still stay in whatever KDR bracket you want to. the lower the KDR bracket the more scuicide games you have to play to maintain your position however so its not exactly a 4 to 1 thats pretty much just an average. see the problem you dont see is the math part. lets say you run 20/3 for 4 games thats 80/12 to balance out to a 1/1 bracket you only need to kill yourself 68 times wich you can easily do in 2 games so if you suicide for 1/3rd of your games you will stay in a 1/1 bracket indefinatly its a whole lot easyer to tank your kdr then it is to increase it, your thinking its harder to tank then it is to raise... tanking your KDR gets easyer the higher your KDR is not the other way around so saying "it increases with each kill" is pointless as it gets easyer to manipulate the higher your KDR is. saying "let them" is dumb as it undermines the whole point of changing the matchmaking system its the same thing as saying "lets change the matchmaking system so that its easyer to pair yourself up against new players more consistantly and face no real oposition." So, people who are willing to suicide for 1/3rd of their game time all day, every day are the most relevant? Odd that your mind went there so quickly. And then of course, we have the six guys all agreeing to suicide together at the exact same rate so that they can squad stomp, and the corps of dozens of players duty-bound to suicide at the exact same rate in order to rule the world. If that's the game, nothing stops it. Thank God, however, most people are normal and those pitiful few will fall to insignificance as fast as they perpetrate their idiocy. Of course, having a rule that the fifth suicide in a match removes you from the match with no statistical results recorded... But what am I saying? That's just crazy pills. Suicides 4 times, leaves match, joins another, rinse repeat. Better yet play 95% of match purposefully die a lot, leave match, deaths are recorded but not the kills.. Look at the players we have today, so many are afraid of a fair fight they will go great lengths to avoid them, adding a simplistic kdr system won't solve it. In all honesty their is no matchmaking system that could currently be implemented in DUST that would actually ensure people would play against enemies of equal skill. This game gives greater reward for cowardice than it does for bravery!
Yet another baseless anecdotal refutation of the system to seemingly abnegate it's benefits in the face of imagined detriment.. So, people are going to spend all their time in the loading screens to avoid what? Playing the game? Meanwhile, all the normal people will be playing normally, the top 50 or so will have bragging rights, and the rest can compete or idiotically fake greatness. You're right in a way, proper matchmaking doesn't end delusional stomp-chasing. Nor does it end acne. Or political ineptitude. Let's just fold the whole thing and have protostomping 24/7 instead or chase the "balance" unicorn around a while longer.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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Onesimus Tarsus
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2494
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Posted - 2014.08.20 03:41:00 -
[11] - Quote
Death Shadow117 wrote:Onesimus Tarsus wrote:Death Shadow117 wrote:PoP SoTa wrote:Bad logi's making excuses for sucking.
Do you need to stand with a rep tool in your hand 24/7, or a nanite, or even a hive? No? You do hold your gun?
Why not try using it? Concentrated DPS is as useful as healing, if not more so.
Im not even a logi and im speaking for more than just myself. Logis shouldnt go looking for fights they should stay with their heavy and the heavy should look for the fight. If it comes to it and i have to kill someone in my logi i will but i dont go picking fights in my logi. Player says they aren't a logi. Player describes how they run logi. sorr i have a tunnel vision mind idc what i say but im still amazed that you think kdr is all we should focus on anyways what is yours? Lets see dustboards says your a corphopping unknown kdr scrub. Give it up who is your main? Just checked your all time kdr its .86. Guess thats why ive never seen you in a match.
Look, you pantsed yourself enough already and you seemingly have no way of perceiving the concept. Go eat some cereal or something.
K/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. BEH!
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