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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
15958
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Posted - 2014.07.17 17:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
I fear that moving the PG unit to high would exemplify armor tanking much more. While it would solve some issues of dual tanking (ie shoving shields in top row just because)
The other issue with the current PG progression is that only two types of players have to deal with it. Newbies; and Top gear vets. People who are between suffer naught from fitting problem. While I do not identify this as the sole culprit there are others issues I feel are contributing to this
First of which is by nature of the game to help keep it lower budget on the network and easier access to the common audience. This problem would be low module count. By nature things very limited in resource typically you are in the mindset of making every slot count. Combine into the environment of shoving in a PG module upgrade RARELY translates into another modules worth of additional power. Thus ergo its far better to just shove a downgrade (which goes back to the issue of not having a tetricide as well; however this is the positive of the current tiered system) that would fit within fitting budget without wasting a module slot at all.
There are a few solutions.
1. Offer something that cannot be obtained by use of another module. Arguably you can say that PG addition is a unique aspect of the module but Ill retort to the previous statement that some tighter fits can give up a higher tiered module to allow a lower one is just as similar in function.
An example would be additional ammunition in the reserve; however that makes little to no lore sense as I just stated it for an example.
2. Offer expansive hybridization whose performance would be to slot costly to reproduce but the offering on any one aspect is far weaker than specialized module. IE Shield Recharge; Shield HP Max, Stamina Max, Stamina Recover AND PG
3. Alter the PG of various items (bad route) I feel that this may be a solution but I am emotionally opposed to it as its additionally lots of work and to top it off its vibes of bad enforcement of game play. Positive enforcement should be rewarding not punishing.
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
15961
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Posted - 2014.07.18 04:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
Cat Merc wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I fear that moving the PG unit to high would exemplify armor tanking much more. While it would solve some issues of dual tanking (ie shoving shields in top row just because)
The other issue with the current PG progression is that only two types of players have to deal with it. Newbies; and Top gear vets. People who are between suffer naught from fitting problem. While I do not identify this as the sole culprit there are others issues I feel are contributing to this
First of which is by nature of the game to help keep it lower budget on the network and easier access to the common audience. This problem would be low module count. By nature things very limited in resource typically you are in the mindset of making every slot count. Combine into the environment of shoving in a PG module upgrade RARELY translates into another modules worth of additional power. Thus ergo its far better to just shove a downgrade (which goes back to the issue of not having a tetricide as well; however this is the positive of the current tiered system) that would fit within fitting budget without wasting a module slot at all.
There are a few solutions.
1. Offer something that cannot be obtained by use of another module. Arguably you can say that PG addition is a unique aspect of the module but Ill retort to the previous statement that some tighter fits can give up a higher tiered module to allow a lower one is just as similar in function.
An example would be additional ammunition in the reserve; however that makes little to no lore sense as I just stated it for an example.
2. Offer expansive hybridization whose performance would be to slot costly to reproduce but the offering on any one aspect is far weaker than specialized module. IE Shield Recharge; Shield HP Max, Stamina Max, Stamina Recover AND PG
3. Alter the PG of various items (bad route) I feel that this may be a solution but I am emotionally opposed to it as its additionally lots of work and to top it off its vibes of bad enforcement of game play. Positive enforcement should be rewarding not punishing. So, PG upgrades to improve my armor suit isn't fine, but CPU upgrades for a shield tanker is fine? Stop being this sensitive, armor was never that far ahead of shields, that little buff in Bravo (or Alpha) was all that was needed. Fun fact: Shield tankers complain about having to fit a CPU upgrade, but it's not for the shields alone. It's for the rest of the suit, they want to get proto weapons, proto hives, proto low slots. But in my armor suit I can RARELY afford all of that already! And yet most shield suits, saying how it's terrible to have to use CPU upgrades, pack everything proto to the max.
0 of my fits use any fitting modules and other than commandos I have yet ran into fitting problems.
Secondly you are proving my point that this will cause 'gulfing' between the two methods and further exacerbate the issue difference as to why armor is generally far more preferred over shields. Finally you didn't read the whole thing as evident of your snippy reply.
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
15964
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Posted - 2014.07.18 20:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
DeathwindRising wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:Floyd20 Azizora wrote:Has anyone considered moving cpu mods to high slot instead? shield tanks are meant to be cpu heavy, and armor tanks are pg heavy. either give both the mod they need in their off slot, or give neither of them it. Also, PDU's from eve would be nice (less pg, but small shield bonuses). the one thing everyone here agrees is something needs to move up, and some of these mods need less pg usage. high slot utility mods: damage precision low slot utility: pg and cpu profile range speed and stamina hacking
It seems to me that the only way for it to be useful, even in high, is to cram in another proto rep or plate. Personally I would alwas stick with adv low and a proto dmg mod in my high. Noone really replied with a good use case so we will take these ideas, and your myofib ideas into consideration for future buffs, but nothing immediate. Thanks everyone. To be fair, nobody in eve use fitting mods either. The general rule is that if you need to use a fitting mod, you did something wrong in your fit or you need to improve your fitting skills. You can always find something more useful than a fitting mod
^^^^This
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Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
15964
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Posted - 2014.07.18 21:01:00 -
[4] - Quote
DeathwindRising wrote:IAmDuncanIdaho II wrote:DeathwindRising wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:Floyd20 Azizora wrote:Has anyone considered moving cpu mods to high slot instead? shield tanks are meant to be cpu heavy, and armor tanks are pg heavy. either give both the mod they need in their off slot, or give neither of them it. Also, PDU's from eve would be nice (less pg, but small shield bonuses). the one thing everyone here agrees is something needs to move up, and some of these mods need less pg usage. high slot utility mods: damage precision low slot utility: pg and cpu profile range speed and stamina hacking
It seems to me that the only way for it to be useful, even in high, is to cram in another proto rep or plate. Personally I would alwas stick with adv low and a proto dmg mod in my high. Noone really replied with a good use case so we will take these ideas, and your myofib ideas into consideration for future buffs, but nothing immediate. Thanks everyone. To be fair, nobody in eve use fitting mods either. The general rule is that if you need to use a fitting mod, you did something wrong in your fit or you need to improve your fitting skills. You can always find something more useful than a fitting mod Sure they do. I have two Large Ancillary Current Routers on my Domi. Whether or not that means I should do something else that doesn't require them isn't really relevant, because that is my go-to fit, not a throw-away fit that I use in highly situational scenarios. Comparing DUST mods to Eve is problematic because mid-slots and rigs. those rigs and rigs arent modules. i said nobody use fitting modules. rigs are different, and are regularly used to squeeze on better mods. in dust, we dont have rigs. then again, neither did eve online when it first came out. thats a good question to ask those guys. Before rigs were released, were the fitting mods used more often?
No they were not usually unless it's one of those stupidly weird edge cases for a type of performance that usually got nerfed like a Micro Reactors which gave raw grid + instead of % in which those modules are more useful on ships with poor pg to start with.
Another example of a weird case? using the said fitting modules to fit a module for a ship size above yours.
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