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iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
69
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Posted - 2014.07.13 04:51:00 -
[1] - Quote
you know i have dreaded bringing this topic up ,but with all changes taking place to fw payouts i feel is now safe without getting trolled with "git gud"
When i finish a match i average 30+kills/4- deaths and finish #1 with between 2300wp-3400wp and yet i find myself going negative earning between 280k-400k assuming my team won. My suit cost 220k so that means if i die twice i am going negative regardless of how well i performed.
So this thread is to ask ccp specifically rattati "Why?". Now i understand a substantial isk payout would allow me to continually proto stomp however could you least increase it enough to cover my losses?
If anybody thinks my request is a foolish one keep in mind they are many corporations that have hoarded hundreds of millions if not billions of isk that they distribute throughout their corp members to allow them to run proto whenever they choose.
so either wipe away all the isk that was generated from pc districts or increase isk payout
any constructive feedback is welcome
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
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Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
1305
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Posted - 2014.07.13 04:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
find ways to cheapen your proto suit. Mine costs 93k
"Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
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Seymour KrelbornX
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
477
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Posted - 2014.07.13 04:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:you know i have dreaded bringing this topic up ,but with all changes taking place to fw payouts i feel is now safe without getting trolled with "git gud"
When i finish a match i average 30+kills/4- deaths and finish #1 with between 2300wp-3400wp and yet i find myself going negative earning between 280k-400k assuming my team won. My suit cost 220k so that means if i die twice i am going negative regardless of how well i performed.
So this thread is to ask ccp specifically rattati "Why?". Now i understand a substantial isk payout would allow me to continually proto stomp however could you least increase it enough to cover my losses?
If anybody thinks my request is a foolish one keep in mind they are many corporations that have hoarded hundreds of millions if not billions of isk that they distribute throughout their corp members to allow them to run proto whenever they choose.
so either wipe away all the isk that was generated from pc districts or increase isk payout
any constructive feedback is welcome
run cheaper suits.
you should go isk negative in pubs running proto if you die a couple times. |
iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
69
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 04:55:00 -
[4] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:find ways to cheapen your proto suit. Mine costs 93k
lol sir my suit and my viz scr alone cost more than 93k yeah wouldn't help much
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
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iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
69
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 05:01:00 -
[5] - Quote
and who decided that seymour and why other than to prevent continous proto stomping that still exist due to pc generated isk ?
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
|
Seymour KrelbornX
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
477
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 05:18:00 -
[6] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:and who decided that seymour and why other than to prevent continous proto stomping that still exist due to pc generated isk ?
because in new eden high risk means the chance to lose isk... ccp decided that
example
you run a 10k isk suit... low risk you will probably die a lot since you have a more difficult time taking down adv and proto, you probably wont get to the top of the board, you wont make the most isk.
but the guy running proto he is risking a lot, he should maul through std and militia gear, he will probably be on the top of the board hence make the most isk.
granted it doesn't always happen this way, but that why its called risk... |
Seymour KrelbornX
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
477
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 05:28:00 -
[7] - Quote
oh and by the way pc doesn't generate isk anymore.... they stopped that....no more passive isk... have to fight to make isk now again risk for isk. |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
3240
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 05:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
Increase the ISK payout.
Removed all hope with this post
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Unum Intrepidus
Commando Perkone
Caldari State
16
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Posted - 2014.07.13 05:50:00 -
[9] - Quote
Still remains that some corps have most likely hoarded billions upon billions of ISK to allow their members to protostomp.
"Oh, whats that? Your last protostomp didnt work out like you planned? Heres a couple million ISK to cover your losses. Teach those scrub redberries what it means to suck"
Quit CoD to play Dust, never regretted it, never looking back.
Play safe, Play smart. Use the brain you were given.
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iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
71
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 07:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
Seymour KrelbornX wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:and who decided that seymour and why other than to prevent continous proto stomping that still exist due to pc generated isk ? because in new eden high risk means the chance to lose isk... ccp decided that example you run a 10k isk suit... low risk you will probably die a lot since you have a more difficult time taking down adv and proto, you probably wont get to the top of the board, you wont make the most isk. but the guy running proto he is risking a lot, he should maul through std and militia gear, he will probably be on the top of the board hence make the most isk. granted it doesn't always happen this way, but that why its called risk...
so by that logic then there is no effective way to gain or maintain isk thus the purpose of this thread.
may i ask why are you against this thread?
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
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Zelda Harkinian
Isuuaya Tactical
Caldari State
90
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 08:32:00 -
[11] - Quote
lol. my sniper suit costs about 6000, my assault suit about 7000, and my medic scout 13,000. I can't wait until I'm like you guys and can run proto!!! |
iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
71
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 08:36:00 -
[12] - Quote
Zelda Harkinian wrote:lol. my sniper suit costs about 6000, my assault suit about 7000, and my medic scout 13,000. I can't wait until I'm like you guys and can run proto!!!
zelda i believe i've seen you tank you actually do quite well if you are (forgive me for saying it) a noob or am i thinking of another zelda
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
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Zelda Harkinian
Isuuaya Tactical
Caldari State
90
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 08:55:00 -
[13] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:Zelda Harkinian wrote:lol. my sniper suit costs about 6000, my assault suit about 7000, and my medic scout 13,000. I can't wait until I'm like you guys and can run proto!!! zelda i believe i've seen you tank you actually do quite well if you are (forgive me for saying it) a noob or am i thinking of another zelda
I don't know. I think I do ok. I usually run positive in my kd/r and average 700- 1200 wp per match (unless I'm going against protos). I'm not sure what constitutes a noob, since I don't think I am one anymore. My lifetime sp is at 2.1 million... I think. or around there.
If you're interested I can give you my fittings to try out. |
Malkai Inos
Any Given Day
1497
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Posted - 2014.07.13 11:30:00 -
[14] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:Seymour KrelbornX wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:and who decided that seymour and why other than to prevent continous proto stomping that still exist due to pc generated isk ? because in new eden high risk means the chance to lose isk... ccp decided that example you run a 10k isk suit... low risk you will probably die a lot since you have a more difficult time taking down adv and proto, you probably wont get to the top of the board, you wont make the most isk. but the guy running proto he is risking a lot, he should maul through std and militia gear, he will probably be on the top of the board hence make the most isk. granted it doesn't always happen this way, but that why its called risk... so by that logic then there is no effective way to gain or maintain isk thus the purpose of this thread. may i ask why are you against this thread? You can gain ISK with STD fits and maintain it with ADV fits.
Proto is supposed to be too damn expensive for pubs. The fact that people could passive farm ISK to run PRO 24/7 was an issue in and of itself that has now been fixed.
If you can't afford your current suit, downgrade your suit. It's that simple.
You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
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Zindorak
CaUsE-4-CoNcErN
99
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Posted - 2014.07.13 13:56:00 -
[15] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:find ways to cheapen your proto suit. Mine costs 93k lol sir my suit and my viz scr alone cost more than 93k yeah wouldn't help much
Use a CRW-04 SCR with damage mods to get a cheaper suit  |
iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
72
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 14:07:00 -
[16] - Quote
lol you'll say that proto wasn't meant to gain isk in pubs, what other gamemode is there to gain isk by using proto pc? lol most players/corps don't even participate in pc and even if they did, it's assuming you win if not you don't get no isk.
and yes i could run standard and advanced if i wanted to get stomped into the ground every match (still resulting in going negative) that why i suggested wiping way all the isk that WAS gained due to the old pc mechanic that way all players/corps would have to run cheaper fits at some point or increasing isk payout to level the playing field.
again i say any constuctive feedback is welcome and please use common sense before posting
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
|
iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
72
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 14:10:00 -
[17] - Quote
Zindorak wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:find ways to cheapen your proto suit. Mine costs 93k lol sir my suit and my viz scr alone cost more than 93k yeah wouldn't help much Use a CRW-04 SCR with damage mods to get a cheaper suit
sir i'm am cal scout my high slots are reserved for shields and precision enhancors not damage mods that ain't worth pissing on
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
|
iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
72
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 14:15:00 -
[18] - Quote
Zelda Harkinian wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:Zelda Harkinian wrote:lol. my sniper suit costs about 6000, my assault suit about 7000, and my medic scout 13,000. I can't wait until I'm like you guys and can run proto!!! zelda i believe i've seen you tank you actually do quite well if you are (forgive me for saying it) a noob or am i thinking of another zelda I don't know. I think I do ok. I usually run positive in my kd/r and average 700- 1200 wp per match (unless I'm going against protos). I'm not sure what constitutes a noob, since I don't think I am one anymore. My lifetime sp is at 2.1 million... I think. or around there. If you're interested I can give you my fittings to try out. *edit* wait, we're talking tank as in getting a lot of shields and armor right? not tank as in HAV's? Cause I don't own any tanks. o_O
diffrent zelda my bad .
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
|
Nerf Everything
Xpert Intervention
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 14:37:00 -
[19] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:you know i have dreaded bringing this topic up ,but with all changes taking place to fw payouts i feel is now safe without getting trolled with "git gud"
When i finish a match i average 30+kills/4- deaths and finish #1 with between 2300wp-3400wp and yet i find myself going negative earning between 280k-400k assuming my team won. My suit cost 220k so that means if i die twice i am going negative regardless of how well i performed.
So this thread is to ask ccp specifically rattati "Why?". Now i understand a substantial isk payout would allow me to continually proto stomp however could you least increase it enough to cover my losses?
If anybody thinks my request is a foolish one keep in mind they are many corporations that have hoarded hundreds of millions if not billions of isk that they distribute throughout their corp members to allow them to run proto whenever they choose.
so either wipe away all the isk that was generated from pc districts or increase isk payout
any constructive feedback is welcome
NO NO NO!!!!!
Im guessing you have money management problems?
You die 4 times in a 200k suit? WOW! What a scrub.
If you can't afford to lose it, DON'T USE IT!
If you want to run proto, you are required to run free/advance suits to earn isk to pay for them. |
iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
72
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 14:50:00 -
[20] - Quote
"4-" means 4 or less deaths my dear little scrublet 4 being a gg where both teams have good players, my deaths come from orbies, scrubs in a lav, or a thales with an opportunity.
yes sir i have isk management problems cause i don't ask my corp for the isk we use to play pc, i don't red line tank, and i don't snipe.
i can afford to use it because most games I don't die
and may i ask why you are against this thread?
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
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Malkai Inos
Any Given Day
1498
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 15:24:00 -
[21] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:lol you'll say that proto wasn't meant to gain isk in pubs, what other gamemode is there to gain isk by using proto pc? lol most players/corps don't even participate in pc and even if they did, it's assuming you win if not you don't get no isk. Yes. It's the most powerful gear ISK can buy for the most competitive situations you can get. The low PC participation is an entirely separate issue. You can still run full PRO in pubs when you really want to tear somebody a new one. Just don't expect to automatically make a profit from it.
iKILLu osborne wrote:and yes i could run standard and advanced if i wanted to get stomped into the ground every match (still resulting in going negative) You're either overestimating the power gap between ADV and PRO, underestimating your own capabilities, or both. Weapons improve at around 5% per tier and have lost their inherent range bonuses, making the difference so marginal that it's literally the first thing I'd toss in any fit where ISK matters that is not a sniper/SL. PRO tanking mods are more or less mandatory (more so for shields, less for armor) but are also easy to fit on most ADV suits (assuming you have the core skills) and rather cheap. Overall, an ADV suit & weapon with some PRO mods will cost around 20-25% of the respective full PRO fit but provide 60% to sometimes 80% of their power if you're being smart about your sacrifices.
Will you die more and kill less without full PRO? Yes. Does it make the difference between stomping and being stomped over squad composition and skill? No.iKILLu osborne wrote: that why i suggested wiping way all the isk that WAS gained due to the old pc mechanic that way all players/corps would have to run cheaper fits at some point or increasing isk payout to level the playing field. Agreed here. CCP should've deemed the various locking mechanics exploits from the get go and rigorously removed ISK from corps that used them to farm in complete safety. Now that they didn't it's hard to justify such a step, though.
You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
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iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
72
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 16:47:00 -
[22] - Quote
yes i could perform well in advanced gear but I run solo and more often then not scotty doesn't match make to well
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
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gauntlet44 LbowDeep
Heaven84 Devils
General Tso's Alliance
79
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Posted - 2014.07.13 18:33:00 -
[23] - Quote
i run advanced suits with advanced weapons and proto gear.
until i get proto'ed
then i run all proto
and i will have to admit it is more fun in the full proto even if i dont break even
Absorb what is useful,
discard what is not,
make it uniquely your own........ Bruce Lee
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Seymour KrelbornX
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
486
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Posted - 2014.07.13 18:54:00 -
[24] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:Seymour KrelbornX wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:and who decided that seymour and why other than to prevent continous proto stomping that still exist due to pc generated isk ? because in new eden high risk means the chance to lose isk... ccp decided that example you run a 10k isk suit... low risk you will probably die a lot since you have a more difficult time taking down adv and proto, you probably wont get to the top of the board, you wont make the most isk. but the guy running proto he is risking a lot, he should maul through std and militia gear, he will probably be on the top of the board hence make the most isk. granted it doesn't always happen this way, but that why its called risk... so by that logic then there is no effective way to gain or maintain isk thus the purpose of this thread. may i ask why are you against this thread?
I'm not against this thread...lol
I'm against over compensation for poor decision making...
why do you have to run a 220k isk suit every match?
I get it if you just chose to, but then you have to accept the consequences of that choice.
i pretty much just run std and militia gear, i have a 1.31 kdr, I win much more than I lose, have a lot of fun and without any help from PC I have close to 620 mil isk atm...
I also run proto and adv gear whenever I feel like it for fun, and have no concern for whether I make a profit or not when I do...
I just cant sympathize with your issue.... run cheaper suits if you want to make isk.
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iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
72
|
Posted - 2014.07.13 19:15:00 -
[25] - Quote
i appreciate your honesty sir, however you severly misinterpret the point of this thread as i stated it's not so that i can continously stomp it is to cover my losses when i put forth my best and perform extremely well and to also clear out all the hoarded isk from the old pc mechanic that allows people to proto stomp every match, that is mainly what has prevented this game from growing.
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
|
Seymour KrelbornX
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
505
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 02:48:00 -
[26] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:i appreciate your honesty sir, however you severly misinterpret the point of this thread as i stated it's not so that i can continously stomp it is to cover my losses when i put forth my best and perform extremely well and to also clear out all the hoarded isk from the old pc mechanic that allows people to proto stomp every match, that is mainly what has prevented this game from growing.
you will never clear that isk out, for it is more vast than all the sands of all the beaches on all the planets of new eden.
regardless of your righteous intentions, it would motivate the stomp, and I question how good your best effort truly is if you only use proto regardless of your competition, furthermore in a match where you are faced with a team of proto users as well, if your best effort is still putting you in the red, while your opposition is profiting, then you may want to reassess your own ability.
the bottom line is if you are truly skilled then do PC, you can die 4 times there and still make a decent profit on a 220k suit when you figure the avg payout is 3 - 4 mil not to mention any ringer fee you incur which is around 2 - 3 mil isk...
as I stated, I'm non PC rich off pubs because I play smart and cheap.... many are, and unless you are a dropship pilot you don't have much excuse to go negative in a pub. unless you choose to. |
iKILLu osborne
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
72
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 03:08:00 -
[27] - Quote
so it has come down to you wanting to run your mouth get the f off my thread
here is a joke, so an amarr scout walks in lol
after charlie it will be"oh shlt a amarr scout walked in"
|
Zindorak
CaUsE-4-CoNcErN
106
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 03:18:00 -
[28] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:Zindorak wrote:iKILLu osborne wrote:Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:find ways to cheapen your proto suit. Mine costs 93k lol sir my suit and my viz scr alone cost more than 93k yeah wouldn't help much Use a CRW-04 SCR with damage mods to get a cheaper suit sir i'm am cal scout my high slots are reserved for shields and precision enhancors not damage mods that ain't worth pissing on
Lol not worth pissing on that made my day Try the assault SCR i guess? It does decent damage or you could run the BK. |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
League of Infamy
3779
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 03:20:00 -
[29] - Quote
CCP has specifically stated on multiple occasions that prototype gear is not supposed to be sustainable.
Much of the game was built around this, and only their horrible design decisions in PC made this concept irrelevant. I completely agree that the PC isk slush funds should have been wiped out, but not much I can do about that, it's been a bone of contention for about a year now. However, this fact does not justify throwing everything out the window and saying "well f*ck it, lets make it so everyone can afford to run proto all day and destroy the game once and for all."
99.9% of the suits I've used in the past 16-18 months have been BPO's or ADV. Prior to fanfest, I had never used even a single proto suit in a pub match. And this is as a support-oriented Amarr logi. That sh!t ain't cheap.
I'm also not an amazing Dust player, yet I manage to consistently run ISK positive and on the top half of the leaderboard with a respectable KDR for a logi. I stockpiled a good 100 million ISK probably, then blew it all on proto stuff for the big PC war that never came. Still sitting on a few hundred fully-loaded Logi ak.0's.
Why do I tell you this? To demonstrate that anyone can make enough ISK to run proto (when needed) if they're smart about it:
1) It's not hard to make money in pubs. Choose your spots. Have similar fits of multiple tiers and run only what you need for the job. (Pro tip: An ADV weapon on a proto suit is very effective and will cost substantially less)
2) The #1 rule of New Eden is don't fly what you cannot afford to lose. Learn how to cut corners on certain aspects of your suits to shave a few thousand ISK off the cost without hurting the effectiveness.
TL;DR: Proto is only run consistently in pubs due to broken PC mechanics. If 24-7 proto was made sustainable, even as a break-even proposition, the stomps would never ever stop. That's not desirable, and that's why I am against this thread.
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
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Seymour KrelbornX
Holdfast Syndicate
Amarr Empire
510
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 03:42:00 -
[30] - Quote
iKILLu osborne wrote:so it has come down to you wanting to run your mouth get the f off my thread
and that's about the place where you lose any spec of respect you may have had...
taking the attitude "if you don't agree with me then eff you" is paramount to saying "I have nothing more useful to add to this conversation, I have been put in my place"
it's no one's fault but your own that you cant go isk positive, if you refuse to play the game by the rules to achieve what you desire then you deserve nothing, and will get nothing.... |
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