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Major A-Logi change, Discussion

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Eko Sol Strange Playings 540	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:00:00 - [1] - Quote This is one of the few times I am not going to call someone something negative for disagreeing with me. But I think the following should NOT happen to the A-Logi: CCP Rattati wrote: * Move all logistics to the same number of Equipment slots, removing the Amarr sidearm. Reduce Logi speed slightly and remove Cloak fitting bonus. 1) A-Logi has one or more less total module than other logis so increasing it's equipment should still warrant the side arm. This changes the suit SO MUCH that I believe it is fair to offer A-Logi people a respec specifically for the SP put into the suit. 2) The side arm offers no advantage. It is a just a versatile option. 3) A-Logi's are relatively slow already reducing all of the logi's speed would make it only a smudge faster than a heavy 4) The uplink bonus already has two major issues. It sometimes shows the incorrect time on the map when choosing the spawn point. And Sometimes the bonus doesn't apply at all even when staying in the same suit. I would like to read what others think. I will say this. If you are argument for having the change is "shouldn't all of the logi's be the same" then I better see you posting that everyone should have 9 module slots like the cal logi as well otherwise you are a troll. PSN is "Ekopalm" Playing: Murdered Soul Suspect WIP: Child of Light, MGS5 Welcome to play with me anytime, message me.
RKKR The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 930	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:04:00 - [2] - Quote Cal-logi will probably need their "extra" low slot to fit a CPU-mod to fill up all four equipment slots ;-). I'm not really surprised that the logi-suit has to undergo this...as CCP has no experience with the support role.
ratamaq doc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 708	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:07:00 - [3] - Quote Eko Sol wrote: This is one of the few times I am not going to call someone something negative for disagreeing with me. But I think the following should NOT happen to the A-Logi: CCP Rattati wrote: * Move all logistics to the same number of Equipment slots, removing the Amarr sidearm. Reduce Logi speed slightly and remove Cloak fitting bonus. 1) A-Logi has one or more less total module than other logis so increasing it's equipment should still warrant the side arm. This changes the suit SO MUCH that I believe it is fair to offer A-Logi people a respec specifically for the SP put into the suit. 2) The side arm offers no advantage. It is a just a versatile option. 3) A-Logi's are relatively slow already reducing all of the logi's speed would make it only a smudge faster than a heavy 4) The uplink bonus already has two major issues. It sometimes shows the incorrect time on the map when choosing the spawn point. And Sometimes the bonus doesn't apply at all even when staying in the same suit. I would like to read what others think. I will say this. If you are argument for having the change is "shouldn't all of the logi's be the same" then I better see you posting that everyone should have 9 module slots like the cal logi as well otherwise you are a troll. Hold up, wait. Is there a discussion going on about balancing Logi's We are fine! Not that it would effect me, I have all 4 of them, but they better NOT take away my A Logi sidearm! Everything about that suit is balanced vs the other Logis module wise. The bonus are a different story, but the modules are fine. Only beef I have is the BPO A-1 Logi is completely outclassed by the BPO G-1 Scout. YouTube
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 15827	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:08:00 - [4] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Too much role redundancy overlapping scouts and assaults creates a rather muddled experience and leaves the amarr logi or other two wanting to do their own things better. I have to side on CCP ratatti on this is does mess up the experience of balance as well; look to eve's worst case outliers. Caldari is still the only race with a battleship designed for ewar. No other standard battleship in Eve is built for such. Its best to nip these ideas in the budding state as they are now. There are plenty of ways we can make amarr logi feel unique without having to resort to that extreme of a gimmick. it is unfourtunate the only amarrian equipment available now is the drop uplink though. While you can point to lore on this; I'll point to it as well. Side arm deal is not amarrian in nature; if anyone should have more dakka it would be the minmatar. Additionally in response to the op 1. Chances are CCP Rattati is going to make the slots equal numbered across the entire class; he has already correct an amarrian suit deficient of slots because of this already. 2. Further reason to remove it; don't ever use dismissive to protect something; they typically fester later on. 3. You can further argue against this but they're ability to fix multiple kinkats can make them pretty fast which lead to some issues of the original killer bee. 4. Emphasis one this please; I know there are certain conditios to easily triggering the bug (dying usually) CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Minmatar Sentinel =// Unlocked
RKKR The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 931	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:11:00 - [5] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: Hold up, wait. Is there a discussion going on about balancing Logi's Read the Charlie Hotfix notes: Logis are getting a slight (they will probably decide on a number just before the hot fix launch) speed reduction (because everyone was complaining about logis being to fast and mobile ) Every logi will get the same equipment slots. Amar logi will lose its sidearm. Quote: 1. Chances are CCP Rattati is going to make the slots equal numbered across the entire class; he has already correct an amarrian suit deficient of slots because of this already. What's the point of hot fix notes if their are not complete? Quote: 2. Further reason to remove it; don't ever use dismissive to protect something; they typically fester later on. What's the point of a hotFIX if they only FIX something in the future? Quote: 3. You can further argue against this but they're ability to fix multiple kinkats can make them pretty fast which lead to some issues of the original killer bee. You say this like we don't have unscannable suits with better speed,... atm? Quote: 5. This is in light of an assault buff mind you. So why does a logo-suit has to pay for an ASSAULT buff?

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 3703	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:17:00 - [6] - Quote There is no reason to discuss this outside of the Feedback thread really... "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Eko Sol Strange Playings 542	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:25:00 - [7] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Too much role redundancy overlapping scouts and assaults creates a rather muddled experience and leaves the amarr logi or other two wanting to do their own things better. I have to side on CCP ratatti on this is does mess up the experience of balance as well; look to eve's worst case outliers. Caldari is still the only race with a battleship designed for ewar. No other standard battleship in Eve is built for such. Its best to nip these ideas in the budding state as they are now. There are plenty of ways we can make amarr logi feel unique without having to resort to that extreme of a gimmick. it is unfourtunate the only amarrian equipment available now is the drop uplink though. While you can point to lore on this; I'll point to it as well. Side arm deal is not amarrian in nature; if anyone should have more dakka it would be the minmatar. Additionally in response to the op 1. Chances are CCP Rattati is going to make the slots equal numbered across the entire class; he has already correct an amarrian suit deficient of slots because of this already. 2. Further reason to remove it; don't ever use dismissive to protect something; they typically fester later on. 3. You can further argue against this but they're ability to fix multiple kinkats can make them pretty fast which lead to some issues of the original killer bee. 4. Emphasis one this please; I know there are certain conditions to easily triggering the bug (dying usually) 5. This is in light of an assault buff mind you. 1) He didn't state this and even if it happens I expect a respect option on the logi. I like the fact it has only 7 modules. And I recall very specifically the deficiency in modules was for the assault only and his response was to that statement. He might have had one later but I cannot remember for sure. 2) This is where you are wrong. It already gets 1 thing for 2 things. One less eq and one less module. If anything it is imbalanced but people like ratamaq and I aren't complaining like everyone else does on these sorts of things. Rebalancing it to be more similar to other logis doesn't make it unique. In this case I want a different ******* logi suit. I deserve a respect if this happens. 3) I have fixed 2 complex kinkats on it before. Try it. You run as fast as the base min scout. But then try to fix some complex shields and equipment and a proto weapon. Yeah, you get my point. I already have tested and do this. It is pointless If you are against the CPU and PG then request that to be nerfed. Don't make up fits and say "that is an issue". It is a sucky fit. It is very hard to work with. Even 1 complex kinkat is a bit lower in speed then the slowest scout. Actually just typing this out is pissing me off. You should know better. Look at the numbers. Fit one for yourself and see how well you fair. 4) I reported the damn bug so many times I'm sick of explaining it. If I use the proto Viz Flux Uplink and have 4 points in a logi then the spawn in time should be 5 seconds (4.x rounded up). Unfortunately, it will display 8 seconds even if I don't dye or change suits. Sometimes when you decide to spawn in on said uplink it will change from 8 to 6. Not 5. That math is incorrect or needs to be shared. In addition, other times it will stay at 8 seconds. I've tested this ALOT with all of the adv and proto uplinks with SouthPac and we have confirmed this to be an issue. If I ever have to type this again I'm going to explode. 5) I don't care about the assault buff This is too many changes at once without community input. I am an A-Logi Specialist. I run 3 complex precision enhancers, 1 enhanced range amp, 1 enhanced armor rep, 1 enhanced armor plate. Obviously My ADV Fit. I put down strong uplinks and protect them until the heavy or others spawn in. I keep themmm repped and keep ammo close. It's that simple. It isn't complicated. Without the side arm I can't effectively run this strategy. Sometimes I come in with swarms to help ward off vehicles early. Adding a module and equipment but taking the side arm away make it a different suit that I didn't skill into. Not to mention the serious fact I spent my hard earned money to buy aur suits that are just going to be changed on whim. Actually I am getting really angry right now. This better get fixed bc I really can't handle this b/c as far as I am concerned I got scammed out of my HARD EARNED MONEY. @Ratamaq, If you look at the features and Ideas, he posted the draft changes they are going to or are planning on making. PSN is "Ekopalm" Playing: Murdered Soul Suspect WIP: Child of Light, MGS5 Welcome to play with me anytime, message me.
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Cornballs Get Stonewalled 858	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:29:00 - [8] - Quote I knew of none of this so it is good that this was brought to the general attention . Speed reduction and Amarr side-arm changes does nothing but make arguably the worst suit in terms of battlefield sustainability from a defensive and somewhat offensive standpoint , more handicapped . Logistics are the biggest and most defenseless target on the battlefield by far . Scouts can handle themselves better and have far more options that Logi's do and you can argue about roles but how can you support if you are hindered in such a way and by so many hurdles ? I understand slaying and all but the bonus is to equipment so that should not be a problem . There are more pressing issues in game than to hamper the most important role anymore than it already is . Just give them the scouts HP's ( which they are already there since some scouts can tank more than a logi ) and paint a big bulls eye on them and let all who choose to go at them . This is a shame and an example with what's wrong with this game . You would think that CCP would have given the infantry refund that should have been in 1.8.
Luther Mandrix WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 284	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:31:00 - [9] - Quote I think the changes are ok as the less equipment carried the more logi becomes slayer. Cloaks are for scouts. Assaults have sidearms Idea Devs to keep logi from using cpu and pg for not equipping slots have a base cpu and pg automatically deduct from unused equipment slots so no more slayer logi.
P14GU3 The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 784	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:40:00 - [10] - Quote Ha, figures. I actually start playing again and rattatti fucks the game up for me. Why are there discussions about logi imbalance anyways? There is nothing wrong with any of the logis. Removing the a-logi sidearm will make it useless again. Its the only logi that can fit AV and survive. Scouts and heavies are the most abundant suits in the game. Maybe fix those and leave the few logis left alone... I really thought rattatti was going to do something good for this game. Figures, he is just another clueless dev.. I only play dust514ums now. It was always more fun than the actual game anyways.

Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Cornballs Get Stonewalled 858	Posted - 2014.07.09 20:47:00 - [11] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Removing the a-logi sidearm will make it useless again , it's the only logi that can fit AV and survive. One of the reasons that I play Logistics besides being a medic . Your statement is inarguably true . The Amarr logi in my mind is the ultimate anti-vehicle suit . Edit : You just can't fit a forge on it , if you could it would be . You would think that CCP would have given the infantry refund that should have been in 1.8.
Vitharr Foebane Terminal Courtesy Proficiency V. 1591	Posted - 2014.07.09 21:20:00 - [12] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: There is no reason to discuss this outside of the Feedback thread really... Not everyone looks at the feedback forum religiously... having this in GD gives it more exposure and for the record I dont care about an extra equip let me keep my sidearm its kinda how we Amarr roll. We are brawlers, so let us brawl. Amarr: Sentinel V Scout V Assault V Commando IV Logistics IV I place my faith in my God, my Empress, and my Laz0r
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 15832	Posted - 2014.07.09 21:30:00 - [13] - Quote Vitharr Foebane wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: There is no reason to discuss this outside of the Feedback thread really... Not everyone looks at the feedback forum religiously... having this in GD gives it more exposure and for the record I dont care about an extra equip let me keep my sidearm its kinda how we Amarr roll. We are brawlers, so let us brawl. This thread would be fine if it remains a discussion. if suggestions and ideas start seeping in though... CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Minmatar Sentinel =// Unlocked
aaaasdff ertgfdd Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 69	Posted - 2014.07.09 21:56:00 - [14] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: There is no reason to discuss this outside of the Feedback thread really... I like you Rat, you get **** done, but without General, Discussion threads like this the word just doesnt get out. My main account, Infinite Diversity plays all roles, weapons, and suits. I have 60 mil sp and I can tell you that this is a non issue. Logis are not a problem. Not like that anyway. Who is complaining about Logis? I mean every game I play has 10 scouts and 6 of something else. Look man bottom line is this dont start down this path of making all the suits the same. We like unique slot characteristics, and things like that. Im telling you this train of though is a mistake, this should not be the mentality of someone looking for balance. Why is this even being considered?
aaaasdff ertgfdd Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 69	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:06:00 - [15] - Quote Luther Mandrix wrote: I think the changes are ok as the less equipment carried the more logi becomes slayer. Cloaks are for scouts. Assaults have sidearms Idea Devs to keep logi from using cpu and pg for not equipping slots have a base cpu and pg automatically deduct from unused equipment slots so no more slayer logi. Look, I got a friend Roeg X, he was one of the first people I seen to do this Logi cloak thing with the Amarr Logi. I thought it was cool. I think it is a bad build personally because of what you lose but still thats Dust man the fact that you can do things like that. Why does the cloak only have to be for scouts? Ive seen assaults with it, Commandos, Logis, and Scouts. I mean equipment is equipment, right? Dont restrict the game like this it is always bad. Logis are not even a problem. The reason so many are here are these unique freedoms, otherwise we would be on Planetside 2 enjoying 1080p with 60fps. Dust your skill investment and unique loadout choices and customizations are why you still have customers. For the love of the Caldari Assault rapid reload Rail Rifle dont do it.
Cody Sietz SVER True Blood Dark Taboo 3518	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:10:00 - [16] - Quote You gained a slot and equipment slot, either lose the slots or the weapon. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
aaaasdff ertgfdd Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 69	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:14:00 - [17] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: You gained a slot and equipment slot, either lose the slots or the weapon. I have 60 mil sp and 6 proto suits. None are logis. I am not a logi. It has nothing to do with being a logi. It has to do with we want our slots, the choice, the uniqueness, the freedom. Heres my question, why do you even think Logis are a problem? Who is killing you so much in a logi fit? They are HORRIBLE compared to Scouts, Heavies, Commandos, hell even Assaults.
aaaasdff ertgfdd Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 69	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:16:00 - [18] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: You gained a slot and equipment slot, either lose the slots or the weapon. Amarr gained a low slot, and they gained an equipment slot? They have 4 equipment slots now?
Eko Sol Strange Playings 550	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:25:00 - [19] - Quote So everyone that disproves with the A-Logi change of gaining an equipment and module and removing the side arm should post their opinion here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908 I think that it is fine the way it is. It is a specialist Logi and is already difficult enough to play with. The lack of an equipment slot and module slot warrants the need for a side arm. It can't be a slayer because it is too slow. Biotics don't help it and make it any better since I've tried this aggressively. The 4th equipment slot is unnecessary for me. If I can be a 3 eq slotted Logi since 1.8 then I can be it until the end of the game. Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 3524	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:43:00 - [20] - Quote FTFY don't touch my Amarr logi. Its alright everyone, no need to worry it's just an Amarr scout :(

Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Cornballs Get Stonewalled 867	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:48:00 - [21] - Quote aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: There is no reason to discuss this outside of the Feedback thread really... I like you Rat, you get ** done, but without General, Discussion threads like this the word just doesnt get out. My main account, Infinite Diversity plays all roles, weapons, and suits. I have 60 mil sp and I can tell you that this is a non issue. Logis are not a problem. Not like that anyway. Who is complaining about Logis? I mean every game I play has 10 scouts and 6 of something else. Look man bottom line is this dont start down this path of making all the suits the same. We like unique slot characteristics, and things like that. Im telling you this train of though is a mistake, this should not be the mentality of someone looking for balance. Why is this even being considered? Agreed . Totally and fully . You would think that CCP would have given the infantry refund that should have been in 1.8.**
Eko Sol Strange Playings 557	Posted - 2014.07.09 22:49:00 - [22] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: You gained a slot and equipment slot, either lose the slots or the weapon. I'm fine with losing those slots. I think 100% of A-Logi's would agree to this. Leave it as is with 7 modules and 3 eq slots. It's the slowest. no build in reps like the cal (shields) and gal (armor). Only a little more armor then the others. The bonus is a specialist bonus that can become unnecessary where the min logi has the rep bonus which can be used for Guardian WP even if no one actually needs reps. Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
Beld Errmon 1751	Posted - 2014.07.09 23:11:00 - [23] - Quote Ugh its like the dev watches my client and nerfs every thing I use, is the amarr hvy getting nerfed as well and the small rail? Pilot - Tanker - FOTM (insert here)
Eko Sol Strange Playings 563	Posted - 2014.07.09 23:16:00 - [24] - Quote Beld Errmon wrote: Ugh its like the dev watches my client and nerfs every thing I use, is the amarr hvy getting nerfed as well and the small rail? LOL Both are. Sentinals are losing CPU/PG. Small rail is losing range...I think if I read it right. Goto the link in my signature and post your dislike. It looks like CCP and CPM are putting up resistance but at least try. Try and help us out. Be there for all of the A-Logis, Small Rail users, and Sentinal users. The only thing I care about right now is the A-Logi change. Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
Mikey Ducati Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 157	Posted - 2014.07.09 23:17:00 - [25] - Quote We don't have to chop everything down on the cutting block. Leave the Alogs alone. Since when this been an issue anyway?
Eko Sol Strange Playings 564	Posted - 2014.07.09 23:21:00 - [26] - Quote Mikey Ducati wrote: We don't have to chop everything down on the cutting block. Leave the Alogs alone. Since when this been an issue anyway? Never. Join us in the discussion thread in my sig and post your concern. That's where they want to hear it. There are people I haven't seen post in ages showing concern. Join us! Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
Mortedeamor Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1796	Posted - 2014.07.09 23:30:00 - [27] - Quote ive had the amar logi since day one 1 its not viable as a speed tanked suit. and its the slowest logi 2 it has less ehp than the other logis 3 nerf logis SPEED WTF logis suffer from an extreme glitch that locks their run ability up also they suffer from wrong run speeds after deploying equipment...ive gone from running ina amar logi with low ehp to running ina amar logi with higher ehp at a supply depot and for some reason the high ehp logi ran faster..because i was bugged down with this speed glitch so nice to lay an uplink and then start crawling in quicksand because this glitch chopped my knees off. the only thing the amar logi has that sets it aside from the other logi's is the sidearm..and you wanna take that away....take away more of the versatility in dust..dude if i ***** wanted to play call of duty i would have *** bought into the franchise and not wasted the past 2 and a half years in your bullshit game. oh so lets take the slowest logi..who has the responsibility of *** uplinks and nerf it more.. do you know why amar logis need a sidearm BECAUSE WE ARE *** HUNTED so long as i am alive there are 3 second spawns on the field period...and as if that didnt make them want to kill me enough.. i am always laying uplinks at the worst places for the enemy and then repping 2 heavies at once and reviving anyone downed who isnt in the line of fire....i gotta get my slow ass to the point lay a crucial uplink and then guard it...with my slow ass nerfed and one of my *** guns taken away? looks like you have decided to go back to screwing dust up some more ccp *** BRILLIANT and here i was just starting to think you had pulled your heads out of your rears. you better give all the logis a respec and they're gear back logis have to dedicate allot more sp than other roles..this is straight ** up. that you think anything on logis needs to be nerfed is appalling for once they are ina good place and you like always wanna ** it up G FUCKIN G
Eko Sol Strange Playings 567	Posted - 2014.07.09 23:33:00 - [28] - Quote Mortedeamor wrote: ive had the amar logi since day one 1 its not viable as a speed tanked suit. and its the slowest logi 2 it has less ehp than the other logis 3 nerf logis SPEED WTF logis suffer from an extreme glitch that locks their run ability up also they suffer from wrong run speeds after deploying equipment...ive gone from running ina amar logi with low ehp to running ina amar logi with higher ehp at a supply depot and for some reason the high ehp logi ran faster..because i was bugged down with this speed glitch so nice to lay an uplink and then start crawling in quicksand because this glitch chopped my knees off. the only thing the amar logi has that sets it aside from the other logi's is the sidearm..and you wanna take that away....take away more of the versatility in dust..dude if i ***** wanted to play call of duty i would have *** bought into the franchise and not wasted the past 2 and a half years in your bullshit game. oh so lets take the slowest logi..who has the responsibility of *** uplinks and nerf it more.. do you know why amar logis need a sidearm BECAUSE WE ARE *** HUNTED so long as i am alive there are 3 second spawns on the field period...and as if that didnt make them want to kill me enough.. i am always laying uplinks at the worst places for the enemy and then repping 2 heavies at once and reviving anyone downed who isnt in the line of fire....i gotta get my slow ass to the point lay a crucial uplink and then guard it...with my slow ass nerfed and one of my *** guns taken away? looks like you have decided to go back to screwing dust up some more ccp *** BRILLIANT and here i was just starting to think you had pulled your heads out of your rears. you better give all the logis a respec and they're gear back logis have to dedicate allot more sp than other roles..this is straight ** up. that you think anything on logis needs to be nerfed is appalling for once they are ina good place and you like always wanna ** it up G FUCKIN G Goto the link in my sig and post this or your opinion. It counts there more than it will here. Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
Mikey Ducati Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 159	Posted - 2014.07.09 23:44:00 - [29] - Quote I went to that thread as you suggested. Now I'm nervous and scared after reading the OP. Just what in god's name is CCP thinking? Reduction of PG/CPU on heavies? Changing Logis so that racial means nothing, its just another Cal logi with a different color scheme? Removing vehicles from Ambush totally? This is insanity. I really can't make sense of the choices they are making. Why are they refusing to discuss about new game modes?
Eko Sol Strange Playings 569	Posted - 2014.07.10 00:01:00 - [30] - Quote Mikey Ducati wrote: I went to that thread as you suggested. Now I'm nervous and scared after reading the OP. Just what in god's name is CCP thinking? Reduction of PG/CPU on heavies? Changing Logis so that racial means nothing, its just another Cal logi with a different color scheme? Removing vehicles from Ambush totally? This is insanity. I really can't make sense of the choices they are making. Why are they refusing to discuss about new game modes? You know. The sentinel thing isn't an issue for me because fitting all proto is freaking expensive. It is actually one of the most expensive full proto if not the most expensive. My full proto fit (if there wasn't AUR) is almost 200k ISK with my Proto Assault Forge. So I thought that was the trade off with going full proto. lowering CPU/PG...sure, isn't THAT big of a deal. 100 less armor because I use two enhanced armor plates now instead of complex? Not a big deal IMO. Removing vehicles from ambush is a joke. The matches will be too long and the 50 clone ones, sometimes, are as long as a dom match which makes the dom match more viable for ISK and WP grinding. I agree, I like that the logis are different enough. If they make them more the same or all the same then everyone will be a min logi or no logi b/c the min logi has the absolute best bonus. Just make a ruckus in the discussion. Maybe we can see something happen for us. Maybe they won't follow through. Maybe they will let us discuss it more and wait until delta. Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908

The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3476	Posted - 2014.07.10 00:34:00 - [31] - Quote Ive got something for Rattati that eve players like to say: "dont fix thats not broken" I cannot see a reason why logis should receive another revamp. They are fine how they are at the moment and using a cloak on a logi suit is just as legit as using a heavy with 2 sidearms. Both doesnt work and is stupid.
Eko Sol Strange Playings 576	Posted - 2014.07.10 00:45:00 - [32] - Quote The dark cloud wrote: Ive got something for Rattati that eve players like to say: "dont fix thats not broken" I cannot see a reason why logis should receive another revamp. They are fine how they are at the moment and using a cloak on a logi suit is just as legit as using a heavy with 2 sidearms. Both doesnt work and is stupid. Throw that statement into the thread/link in my sig. It looks like it's on deaf ears between Ratatti and IWS. My current hope, if any, is that they discuss it more and wait until delta for Logi changes. Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
Atiim Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 10340	Posted - 2014.07.10 00:47:00 - [33] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: The Amarr logi in my mind is the ultimate anti-vehicle suit . Then your mind is tainted. Long Live The Anime Empire "You know what? You really, REALLY, like to dampen the mood" - Lea Silencio -HAND
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 3664	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:04:00 - [34] - Quote Atiim wrote: Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: The Amarr logi in my mind is the ultimate anti-vehicle suit . Then your mind is tainted. Agreed. I tried it for a while even back when swarms were a little OP and tbh, I switched to using a basic Amarr med frame. Naturally the Minmando totally outclasses everything else right now, though I do like the gallente scout I made with swarms, re's, AV nades, AND a cloak. It's pretty fun. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3481	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:14:00 - [35] - Quote Eko Sol wrote: The dark cloud wrote: Ive got something for Rattati that eve players like to say: "dont fix thats not broken" I cannot see a reason why logis should receive another revamp. They are fine how they are at the moment and using a cloak on a logi suit is just as legit as using a heavy with 2 sidearms. Both doesnt work and is stupid. Throw that statement into the thread/link in my sig. It looks like it's on deaf ears between Ratatti and IWS. My current hope, if any, is that they discuss it more and wait until delta for Logi changes. Doesnt really matter. They wont listen to what i say or the 100 other guys that are against it.
Mikey Ducati Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 163	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:16:00 - [36] - Quote The dark cloud wrote: Doesnt really matter. They wont listen to what i say or the 100 other guys that are against it. The depressing truth.
Eko Sol Strange Playings 578	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:18:00 - [37] - Quote What is funny is that in this thread, the OP doesn't even know the slot layout for his own logi and didn't even shell out an idea. Then Ratatti blue tagged it asking for "other good ideas". He didn't even have an idea in the first place. Not to mention that the cal logi gets an extra module slot for the sacrificed equipment slot. You know as well as I do how many people have like 2 complex shields, 2 damage mods, 1 shield energizer, some combo of regulator, dampener, cpu, and pg boost and just slay EVERYTHING. Not to mention the 5 damage mod cal logi snipers. Yeah, they don't get ANYTHING special LOL https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=167740&find=unread Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
aaaasdff ertgfdd Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 76	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:19:00 - [38] - Quote Mikey Ducati wrote: The dark cloud wrote: Doesnt really matter. They wont listen to what i say or the 100 other guys that are against it. The depressing truth. Where are the requests coming from for this nerf though?
Vicious Minotaur 1064	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:21:00 - [39] - Quote Not a fan of the suggested Logi- nerfs. If they are to take place, then I shan't take my Amarr alt past level 1 Amarr Logistics. No point. The sidearm is the only redeeming quality, especially since the bonus only applies to your uplinks IF YOU DON'T DIE. Even if I respawn in the same exact suit, my bonus is broken and have to re-drop my uplinks. And never mind that logis are already slow, especially if they armour tank so they can survive while repping (also known as being a sitting duck, with no weapon and a glowing sign that says "Shoot this person!"). I have a hard time keeping up with people in my Minmatar Logistics, especially if I make any attempt to use my rep-tool bonus. Not a fan. Not a fan at all... But whatever. Nerf a class that is not causing problems. Alter things to the point people want a respec. Address non-issues and ignore player feedback. At the end of the day, you are just shooting yourself in the foot. So be my guest... I am a minotaur.
Atiim Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 10340	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:24:00 - [40] - Quote Lol at whoever thinks that Speed Reductions are needed. Did anyone honestly look at the speed, and say that 5m/s is too fast? Long Live The Anime Empire "You know what? You really, REALLY, like to dampen the mood" - Lea Silencio -HAND

Eko Sol Strange Playings 579	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:24:00 - [41] - Quote Vicious Minotaur wrote: Not a fan of the suggested Logi- nerfs. If they are to take place, then I shan't take my Amarr alt past level 1 Amarr Logistics. No point. The sidearm is the only redeeming quality, especially since the bonus only applies to your uplinks IF YOU DON'T DIE. Even if I respawn in the same exact suit, my bonus is broken and have to re-drop my uplinks. And never mind that logis are already slow, especially if they armour tank so they can survive while repping (also known as being a sitting duck, with no weapon and a glowing sign that says "Shoot this person!"). I have a hard time keeping up with people in my Minmatar Logistics, especially if I make any attempt to use my rep-tool bonus. Not a fan. Not a fan at all... But whatever. Nerf a class that is not causing problems. Alter things to the point people want a respec. Address non-issues and ignore player feedback. At the end of the day, you are just shooting yourself in the foot. So be my guest... Not to mention I have reported, numerous times, that the uplink bonus will (sometimes) fail to apply even if you didn't die or lose the suit. I got no word back. It's really sad man. The player base is only getting smaller. It isn't growing. At some point they have to understand that they have co workers that are trying to feed their kids. Experiment with Legion, let us have Dust the way we want. At the very least, I think they should have more discussion and wait for logi changes until Delta. If we had more time for it to sink in. more time to ask for logi respect then I'll be happy. Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
Eko Sol Strange Playings 579	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:26:00 - [42] - Quote Atiim wrote: Lol at whoever thinks that Speed Reductions are needed. Did anyone honestly look at the speed, and say that 5m/s is too fast? IWS even said that the A-Logi can fit kinkats. 2 complex kinkats make it as fast as the base min scout I THINK. I might have to try when I get off of work. If I recall it was either like 8.1-ish or a high 7.x-ish. It just doesn't work. I think ratamaq had it right. I think that CCP wants to nerf logis so people go assault. Unfortunately, they will go scout or pop a kinkat on a commando. Actually, I would argue that it will ultimately be either Min Logi or no logi after Charlie if this all gets "fixed". Post Distaste for A-Logi changes in Charlie here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2249908#post2249908
aaaasdff ertgfdd Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 77	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:34:00 - [43] - Quote Eko Sol wrote: Atiim wrote: Lol at whoever thinks that Speed Reductions are needed. Did anyone honestly look at the speed, and say that 5m/s is too fast? IWS even said that the A-Logi can fit kinkats. 2 complex kinkats make it as fast as the base min scout I THINK. I might have to try when I get off of work. If I recall it was either like 8.1-ish or a high 7.x-ish. It just doesn't work. I think ratamaq had it right. I think that CCP wants to nerf logis so people go assault. Unfortunately, they will go scout or pop a kinkat on a commando. Actually, I would argue that it will ultimately be either Min Logi or no logi after Charlie if this all gets "fixed". IWS should have no input in this game. He rarely plays. Hes horrible when he does play, and how that dude ever became appointed to the cpm ill never know. I killed him 10 times in one game wearing a basic min assault with std combat rifle. Hes absolutely terrible. This can not be a legitimate opinion about anything in this game. I know it sounds bad to say. But if you absolutely suck at a thing how can you be the person giving relevant information about that thing when you obviously, do not understand it enough to be proficient at it. I dont knkw about his input but ive been seeing his name pop up around this subject.
Vicious Minotaur 1064	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:35:00 - [44] - Quote Eko Sol wrote: Vicious Minotaur wrote: Not a fan of the suggested Logi- nerfs. If they are to take place, then I shan't take my Amarr alt past level 1 Amarr Logistics. No point. The sidearm is the only redeeming quality, especially since the bonus only applies to your uplinks IF YOU DON'T DIE. Even if I respawn in the same exact suit, my bonus is broken and have to re-drop my uplinks. And never mind that logis are already slow, especially if they armour tank so they can survive while repping (also known as being a sitting duck, with no weapon and a glowing sign that says "Shoot this person!"). I have a hard time keeping up with people in my Minmatar Logistics, especially if I make any attempt to use my rep-tool bonus. Not a fan. Not a fan at all... But whatever. Nerf a class that is not causing problems. Alter things to the point people want a respec. Address non-issues and ignore player feedback. At the end of the day, you are just shooting yourself in the foot. So be my guest... Not to mention I have reported, numerous times, that the uplink bonus will (sometimes) fail to apply even if you didn't die or lose the suit. I got no word back. It's really sad man. The player base is only getting smaller. It isn't growing. At some point they have to understand that they have co workers that are trying to feed their kids. Experiment with Legion, let us have Dust the way we want. At the very least, I think they should have more discussion and wait for logi changes until Delta. If we had more time for it to sink in. more time to ask for logi respect then I'll be happy. Indeed. I can get behind the changes to scouts/heavies/assaults, because there has been ample feedback and discussion on those topics. But this logistics change? Right out of left field. No discussion, nothing. At least solicit feedback and discussion before metaphorically pissing on us. I am a minotaur.
Derrith Erador Fatal Absolution 2237	Posted - 2014.07.10 01:39:00 - [45] - Quote Honestly, I like a lot of what you said, but my chief concern is the glitched links. That's the only reason I specced into Amarrican Logi. Betty White, the worlds hottest grandma.
Mortedeamor Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1803	Posted - 2014.07.10 11:16:00 - [46] - Quote aaaasdff ertgfdd wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: There is no reason to discuss this outside of the Feedback thread really... I like you Rat, you get **** done, but without General, Discussion threads like this the word just doesnt get out. My main account, Infinite Diversity plays all roles, weapons, and suits. I have 60 mil sp and I can tell you that this is a non issue. Logis are not a problem. Not like that anyway. Who is complaining about Logis? I mean every game I play has 10 scouts and 6 of something else. Look man bottom line is this dont start down this path of making all the suits the same. We like unique slot characteristics, and things like that. Im telling you this train of though is a mistake, this should not be the mentality of someone looking for balance. Why is this even being considered? seriously most peeps only look at gd..i know i do..so there isa reason for it to be doubly posted here...
SHANN da MAN D3LTA FORC3 C0VEN 250	Posted - 2014.07.10 18:01:00 - [47] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: There is no reason to discuss this outside of the Feedback thread really... Welcom to the wonderful world of Forums ... where everyone wants their thoughts to be heard first ... so they post a new thread instead of being buried deep inside someone else's nothing to see here ... move along


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