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True Adamance
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Posted - 2014.06.22 06:16:00 -
[1] - Quote
Seymour KrelbornX wrote:right?
nobody wants them in ambush, no one wants to play OMS (because tanks) some have begun talk of limiting them or removing them altogether from dom...
it seems to me, with well over a year of failing to balance AV/tanks, ccp has no idea what to do with them.
let me just say what we are all thinking; tanks are the red headed step children of dust.
tankers, please tell us, why should we miss you when you're gone? if there are no tanks on the field, what role do you serve that is uniquely yours?
LAVs and dropships are great transports, and infantry hack objectives.
what do you do, tankers?
tell us why we should keep you, tell us why we need you, why dust isn't better without you.
I think mores the point from an EVE player is what do you infantry do and why should we keep you.....?
However I will properly answer your question once I can put I into a persuasive and coherent argument.
" Those men died loving duty more than they feared death..... they died well."
-Templar Ouryon after Iesa III
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True Adamance
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Posted - 2014.06.22 07:51:00 -
[2] - Quote
Lets be honest here....HAV have no dedicated role..... in fact quite frankly they don't have a lot of anything to them right now.
Since the CCP Wolfman HAV "fixes" tanks have had no specific role on the ground, not customisation, no reason to exist other than to make the lives of infantry miserable.
As they are.....well Seymour you are right. We don't need tanks like this.
Vehicles that have their power curve based on the hull of the vehicle and not the players supporting skills, and or their skills as a player.
What HAV could be is what we should be considering.
I have always found that in Dust, as they were tanks provided a tactical objective/diversion for the enemy players. When an HAV was present on a map it was a threat, and one that forced players to look outside of their own small infantry run and gun sphere and at the wider battlefield. It forces players to consider the location, capabilities of the pilot, their own squads position, and our course their load out dictating a change to heavier weapons.
Also more importantly HAV and all vehicles really escalate the engagement.
While HAV do a reasonable job of achieving these battlefield changes it is their lack of a true role that caused them to receive so much hatred. They are durable, fast, and have heavy fire power all in one package, with powerful statistics as a basis and able to be improved a few skills that really sell for less SP than they deserve.
As I said before its what HAV could be that we should be considering.
HAV should be a choice, a highly SP invested unit and high ISK cost unit which provides and unparalleled platform for Anti Vehicle firepower over large ranges while being impervious to small arms.....but of course weak to hand held AV fire and installations.
Additionally HAV should have their generalist hulls broken down into more specific roles, increasing the number of hulls per race and also diversifying and specialising the roles an HAV can achieve in the field. Pre- 1.7 a tanker could specifically fit out a tank to fulfil any battlefield role.
Pre 1.7 I was fitting our Heavy Armour Combat Madrugars with massive HP values and active resistances, I also had fast moving light scouting tanks with low HP a scanner and a heat sink.
TL;DR
Tanks as they are lack focus, lack a role, and lack balance. This is because they achieve everything in a generalist way to a high standard and do so with minimal SP investment.
What the HAV could be is something that adds a great tactical element to combat if done properly, something that few other games can and will achieve.
Just to add my own personal notes to this....... I also feel like if the player base is so hell bent on removing HAV and vehicle from the game then they do not want an FPS set in New Eden and probably should focus on other games then. I still have faith in CCP's vision if not their staff barring of course some of them, and do not want to see Dust casualised for the sake of making another crappy and generalist sci fi shooter when it could be so much more..
" Those men died loving duty more than they feared death..... they died well."
-Templar Ouryon after Iesa III
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True Adamance
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Posted - 2014.06.22 08:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:HAVs are just seriously missing a role.
And IWS what do you believe that role should be.
I have made it no secret that I consider HAV the battleships of Dust, designed to target other large assets and have tougher times targeting small units.
But what do you think about HAV?
" Those men died loving duty more than they feared death..... they died well."
-Templar Ouryon after Iesa III
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True Adamance
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Posted - 2014.06.22 22:43:00 -
[4] - Quote
Alpha 443-6732 wrote:Seymour KrelbornX wrote:Alpha 443-6732 wrote:GeneralButtNaked wrote:Huge nerf to tanks, remove them from Ambush, and the poor little infantry STILL can't do anything?
Yeah, this community sucks. Not as people, but as gamers.
Knowing that you guys are the ones giving CCP feedback, and not the year plus of solid feedback from real FPS players, I can say with a high degree of confidence that Legion is going to suck balls.
I would say get good, but clearly, even with years of practice, most of you still couldn't punch your way out of a wet paper bag with scissors in your hand. This is why PC stats should've always taken priority. All the pubbies had to do was not stick their heads into the barrel of the blaster tank and everything would've been fine. the sad truth is, if you don't have balance at the lowest tier, you wont have balance at the highest. you cant make the roof of a building before you construct the foundation. What's stopping high quality feedback from being the foundation of a balanced game?
You assume that players of PC have valuable things to say.
Given the chance Sota would lobby for the inclusion of Hatsune Miku in Dust and your prescious PC battles would see beams of energy, Gundam, and Magical Girls everywhere.
" Those men died loving duty more than they feared death..... they died well."
-Templar Ouryon after Iesa III
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
11043
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Posted - 2014.06.23 08:56:00 -
[5] - Quote
Alpha 443-6732 wrote:
He is an exception to the rule. Also remember I'm saying that stats or statistics, not necessarily feedback. A good player doesn't necessarily mean a good arguer.
And I know FW mechanics better than most players in this game as well, I have plenty to say on the subject...... your point is meaningless.
" Those men died loving duty more than they feared death..... they died well."
-Templar Ouryon after Iesa III
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