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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
10517
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Posted - 2014.06.08 20:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'd settle for an Amarrian HAV.
"You are weak Ouryon....weakness serves not the Empire. I shall teach you strength."
-Yurius of the Brutor to Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
10689
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Posted - 2014.06.17 01:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:Dagger-Two wrote:Godin Thekiller wrote:Dagger-Two wrote:
It physically pains me that you're making me stay up so I can give you examples how how wrong you are, but I'll get over it.
From the story 'Theodicy' : (Hint: The guards are Amarrian)
He ran through crowds of flashing knives and spilled blood; past men clutching at their Glaive-collars with one hand and bashing Amarrians with the other. With abdominal pain intensifying every step, he hurled himself into a lift and shut the door. The elevator began rocketing upwards amidst a hail of bullets. Guards filed into a second lift and gave chase.
Or from Templar One, when Vince is training with some weapons:
"Arrayed before him were plasma rifles, arc cannons, various explosives, and electronics, all of which he could explain the inner workings of in intimate detail, down to the smallest nuance"
And while, granted, it never says a MAKE for the plasma rifles, do you REALLY think they're Gallentean?
At an Imperial Armaments training facility?
Teaching a Templar of all things?
lol. I want you to think about all of that, and why it's so wrong.......... I think I'm just going to pretend you don't exist from now on. If you don't believe proof well...what can you say. But you didn't give proof........ Yet I gave ingame proof that they don't.
You are trying to argue that a game...... barely finished and missing masses of content is somehow more logically sound in determining which empires use what weapons with someone who has spend more time playing EVE than most people on the forums and with those who have PRIME FICTION on their side being the lore from which players actively drawn information and role play from.
Godin, frankly you are not as smart and infallible with your suggestions as you think you are, you seem to have this narrow field of vision where your suggestions are right and those who have greater understanding of the universe of New Eden and its workings do.
Frankly given these displays you are in no place whatsoever to critique anyone who makes any suggestion related to advancing the lore and immersive aspects of this game because you have shown here you do not have the requisite knowledge of New Eden, and are not willing to accept the reasoning of those who do.
Using LOGIC Godin considering that clone soldiers are new technology as established by prime fiction through Templar One, though most people despite the authors space opera style, we can assume that any and all tech we currently use for Dust 514 is specifically made and designed for clone use and thus was only developed within the time Dust has been considered Canon. Additionally as Theodicy is considered prime fiction it words undeniable from a lore perspective unless stated otherwise.
"You are weak Ouryon....weakness serves not the Empire. I shall teach you strength."
-Yurius of the Brutor to Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
10690
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Posted - 2014.06.17 03:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
Allotek produces Nanohives
Ishukone produces Nanohives
This is a shared technology indicating that both groups from the Gallente and Caldari respectively can produce a technology that is exactly the same, has the same underlying principles and components.
Any pilot can loot any factions turret once they destroy an enemy ship and bring it to their respective faction, this is an in game mechanic.
The Caldari and Gallente have been at war for decades, this the likelihood of this having happened is insanely high.
Logically RD develops by taking the oppositions armament and then producing a counter to that armament.
It stands to reason drawing a logical conclusion that if two different Empire factions can produce the came technology they have equivalent levels of technology, thus it stands to reason that a technology that the Gallente invented, Railgun Technology is not being developed by the Caldari.
It is also equally likely that the Caldari can and do have the technological ability to produce Blaster Technology.
I am still looking for the quote but it directly infers that the Caldari were vastly less technologically developed than the Gallente, the Garoun Kindgom at the time, and adopted magnetic projection technology and blaster technology.
I will however leave you with this to some effect.
"The major Gallente nations established embassies across the Tikiona states, and began to assist the Caldari in emerging out of their industrial era and into the Space Age. Thanks to Gallente assistance, the Caldari were able to populate other areas of the world in earnest, which had remained undeveloped for centuries."
"Over the following decades, the Caldari proved remarkably efficient in catching up with the GallenteGÇÖs level of development, thanks to a more homogeneous history creating a stronger sense of collective identity. In addition, the bureaucratically authoritarian governments of Caldari were not weighed down by democratic or populist concerns that may otherwise have held them back. The two races worked on colonizing and developing their home system together, which eventually was named Luminaire."
Cited: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Nascent_Era_of_the_Gallente_Federation
These implying that during the Nascent era of the Gallentean expansion the Caldari and Gallente shared technology, very likely developing both rail and blaster tech before the schism that was the Caldari-Gallente war.
"You are weak Ouryon....weakness serves not the Empire. I shall teach you strength."
-Yurius of the Brutor to Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
10701
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Posted - 2014.06.17 10:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:True Adamance wrote:Allotek produces Nanohives Ishukone produces Nanohives This is a shared technology indicating that both groups from the Gallente and Caldari respectively can produce a technology that is exactly the same, has the same underlying principles and components. Any pilot can loot any factions turret once they destroy an enemy ship and bring it to their respective faction, this is an in game mechanic. The Caldari and Gallente have been at war for decades, this the likelihood of this having happened is insanely high. Logically RD develops by taking the oppositions armament and then producing a counter to that armament. It stands to reason drawing a logical conclusion that if two different Empire factions can produce the came technology they have equivalent levels of technology, thus it stands to reason that a technology that the Gallente invented, Railgun Technology ,is not just able to be developed by the Caldari but improved on a specialised. It is also equally likely that the Caldari can and do have the technological ability to produce Blaster Technology. I am still looking for the quote but it directly infers that the Caldari were vastly less technologically developed than the Gallente, the Garoun Kindgom at the time, and adopted magnetic projection technology and blaster technology. I will however leave you with this to some effect. "The major Gallente nations established embassies across the Tikiona states, and began to assist the Caldari in emerging out of their industrial era and into the Space Age. Thanks to Gallente assistance, the Caldari were able to populate other areas of the world in earnest, which had remained undeveloped for centuries." "Over the following decades, the Caldari proved remarkably efficient in catching up with the GallenteGÇÖs level of development, thanks to a more homogeneous history creating a stronger sense of collective identity. In addition, the bureaucratically authoritarian governments of Caldari were not weighed down by democratic or populist concerns that may otherwise have held them back. The two races worked on colonizing and developing their home system together, which eventually was named Luminaire." Cited: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Nascent_Era_of_the_Gallente_FederationThese implying that during the Nascent era of the Gallentean expansion the Caldari and Gallente shared technology, very likely developing both rail and blaster tech before the schism that was the Caldari-Gallente war. I know all of that. That still doesn't proves that Caldari has developed their own blaster tech. Also, you yourself said it, as I've already said it. How do they get their blasters? they buy from a 3rd party, or they steal the stuff (which you yourself pointed out).
Or literally build it themselves.
Dagger Two has already proven Caldari Weapons Manufacturers produce blaster tech in his post about the Gistii 10 and Pithum 2 Automatic.
If I can build blaster tech with a blue print or a complex ship, even a titan, it stands to reason the four major powers with their trillions of ISK can do much...much better.
"You are weak Ouryon....weakness serves not the Empire. I shall teach you strength."
-Yurius of the Brutor to Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
10714
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Posted - 2014.06.17 21:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Fox Gaden wrote:Regarding the great Godin vs Dagger debate, there have been points made on both sides of this debate which I agree with.
However, from a game development perspective I donGÇÖt think it is a good investment of resources to create two art models for the same turret. At least not initially.
Perhaps that's so but you can't argue with the Prime Fiction. It's more about the semantics of proving that all empires use varied forms of technology and are not limited to what we are presented with in Dust.
My only other suggestion is a rework of the Skills Tree alongside an item tiering over haul seperating modules, weapons, and dropsuits initially into T1 and T2 varients with meta level gear being opened as expansive content later on.
Alongside that drawing more from EVE skill trees and breaking down literally every aspect of our characters into skills to be invested in.
E.g-
Engineering Trees with Capacitor Emissions Systems, Capacitor Stabilisation Systems, Advanced Capacitor Emissions Systems, Advanced Capacitor Stabilisation Systems, Engineering, Electronics, Electronics Upgrades, Engineering Upgrades, Capacitor Upgrades, Powergrid Management, Powergrid Upgrades, etc etc etc.
Weaponry, Light Weapon Operation, Scrambler Rifle Operation, Scrambler Rifle Proficiency, Scrambler Rifle Stability, Scrambler Rifle Heat Management, Scrambler Rifle Reload Speed, Scrambler Rifle Accuracy, Scrambler Rifle Rapid Firing, Range Projection, etc etc etc.
If Legion is supposed to be a 10 year game like Dust was it will need a solid, reasonably balanced, and robust skills system which does not need large scale additions and augmentations often.
"You are weak Ouryon....weakness serves not the Empire. I shall teach you strength."
-Yurius of the Brutor to Ouryon
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
10763
|
Posted - 2014.06.18 19:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:True Adamance wrote:Godin Thekiller wrote:True Adamance wrote:Allotek produces Nanohives Ishukone produces Nanohives This is a shared technology indicating that both groups from the Gallente and Caldari respectively can produce a technology that is exactly the same, has the same underlying principles and components. Any pilot can loot any factions turret once they destroy an enemy ship and bring it to their respective faction, this is an in game mechanic. The Caldari and Gallente have been at war for decades, this the likelihood of this having happened is insanely high. Logically RD develops by taking the oppositions armament and then producing a counter to that armament. It stands to reason drawing a logical conclusion that if two different Empire factions can produce the came technology they have equivalent levels of technology, thus it stands to reason that a technology that the Gallente invented, Railgun Technology ,is not just able to be developed by the Caldari but improved on a specialised. It is also equally likely that the Caldari can and do have the technological ability to produce Blaster Technology. I am still looking for the quote but it directly infers that the Caldari were vastly less technologically developed than the Gallente, the Garoun Kindgom at the time, and adopted magnetic projection technology and blaster technology. I will however leave you with this to some effect. "The major Gallente nations established embassies across the Tikiona states, and began to assist the Caldari in emerging out of their industrial era and into the Space Age. Thanks to Gallente assistance, the Caldari were able to populate other areas of the world in earnest, which had remained undeveloped for centuries." "Over the following decades, the Caldari proved remarkably efficient in catching up with the GallenteGÇÖs level of development, thanks to a more homogeneous history creating a stronger sense of collective identity. In addition, the bureaucratically authoritarian governments of Caldari were not weighed down by democratic or populist concerns that may otherwise have held them back. The two races worked on colonizing and developing their home system together, which eventually was named Luminaire." Cited: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Nascent_Era_of_the_Gallente_FederationThese implying that during the Nascent era of the Gallentean expansion the Caldari and Gallente shared technology, very likely developing both rail and blaster tech before the schism that was the Caldari-Gallente war. I know all of that. That still doesn't proves that Caldari has developed their own blaster tech. Also, you yourself said it, as I've already said it. How do they get their blasters? they buy from a 3rd party, or they steal the stuff (which you yourself pointed out). Or literally build it themselves. Dagger Two has already proven Caldari Weapons Manufacturers produce blaster tech in his post about the Gistii 10 and Pithum 2 Automatic. If I can build blaster tech with a blue print or a complex ship, even a titan, it stands to reason the four major powers with their trillions of ISK can do much...much better. Then I ask again, why isn't there a Cal Navy blaster, or a Ika PLC?
In Dust?
Because CCP hasn't even bloody well put in the Minmatar and Gallente vehicle lines or heavy weapons let alone started on fleshing out the lore and setting.
"You are weak Ouryon....weakness serves not the Empire. I shall teach you strength."
-Yurius of the Brutor to Ouryon
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