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Natu Nobilis wrote:

Severus Smith wrote:

Thanks for the clarification and I apologize for the misunderstanding.

Though, I have another small question. If the "deployable" salvager takes up an Equipment slot then what does that mean for suits with limited, or no, equipment slots? It could easily mean "if you want to salvage get a suit that's built for salvage" but I want to make sure.

A final idea of mine. Rather than a deployable piece of equipment, could you instead call in a small salvage drone via the vehicle commands? It follows you, and can fit into small places like interiors, and uses its amazing quantum hammer space engine to compress materials into a small compartment for rapid recovery. Something small like this (Amarr, Caldari, Gallente, Minmatar). Roughly the size of a large dog, with a salvage laser and a small auto-turret. Have them cost as much as a LAV, so you want to defend them but won't be crushed if it is destroyed. Getting them picked up is similar to how you recall a vehicle, or you have to take them to a recovery station.

Again, probably not going to happen. But I figured I'd ask since I like drones, and it would be cool to see a squad of players deploying some of these to boost their salvaging rate. And it would also explain why the rouge-drones would not like these guys - they're drones who aren't free.

Dude, processing power.

Drones consume CPU, CPU is available on a limited ammount.

One drone for a player is one less drone for the PVE.

Drone - Pet - Companion, whatever we call it, they consume resources that demand a lot in terms of processing, energy and bandwith. EVE changed a lot of drone performance lately because it impacted like crazy on TiDi, they don-¦t want the same to happen here.

You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 66 post(s)
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1356	Posted - 2014.06.10 11:20:00 - [1] - Quote How about making this "harvester" a proper companion with its own part of the skill tree and fitting screen that can do more than just salvaging, such as resupplies, repairs or even fire support/point defence etc. And entire sub-mechanic for the sandbox part of the game? It's basically a suitcase-sized flying drone that you launch and can alternate between "assist" and "salvage" modes. Salvage will have it wander around, looting stuff autonomously but dependant on your protection. Assist makes it help you and squadmates with whatever you're doing, based on the capabilities you chose to fit it with based on the situation. It would, for example, activate an integrated nanohive if someone is on low ammo, initiate repairs for a damaged friendlies or even fire at enemies, provided it has the according mods fitted of course. You might also want it to listen to comm-wheel or hotkey orders for when more precision is needed. Simply point somewhere or at someone and select between basic "go there, attack/salvage, use function 1/2/3" to have it execute the corresponding action. Now, I said earlier that you "launch" or deploy it. That is because you can also get it back so you don't risk losing it in combat including whatever loot it happens to carry. This would give interesting pvp/pve interactions where one has to decide whether to have it out in combat for the additional support but risk getting it destroyed or pull the harvester back in order to protect it but miss out no its benefits. I imagine three base types of harvesters per race: The Guardian Low salvage efficiency (efficiency refers to the maximum difficulty of loot containers it can crack without getting mostly junk) Average salvage speed High offensive/ Average defensive capabilties Average mobility/ range (range is the maximum distance to you it can reach) Additional Utility slots and bonus to turret efficiency (analoguous to equipment slots on infantry) The Guardian trades salvaging proficiency for improved Combat and support capabilities. Has inherent bonus to damage output and can efficiently support others in combat through logistics. The Harvester High salvage efficiency High salvage speed Low offence/High defence Low mobility/range Additional cargohold capacity and bonus to loot quality Nomen est omen. The Harvester is the optimal choice for safer areas and players that are ready to baby-sit this slow guy for higher potential profits as its improved looting mechanism has a higher chance of retrieving items without damaging them in the process. The Probe Average efficiency Average salvage speed Average offence/low defence High mobility/range Relays scan results to friendlies, bonus to survey modules The Probe can be sent along great distances to scout ahead hostile territory for potential salvaging opportunities and enemies in relative safety. It also sports inherent bonuses that assist other drones in their salvaging by finding harder to detect spots. And because this wouldn't be New Eden without some low-sec counterplay dickishness I further propose the Drone Signal Inhibitor. Once deployed, it prevents drones in an area from being launched, taking commands and being recalled so they can be easily scooped by the aspiring criminal. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1357	Posted - 2014.06.11 00:14:00 - [2] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: So a salvage drone with guns on it? A tad more involved but yeah. Not yet sure if guns should be a general thing or part of a role defining trait. I want the salvage thing to something unique to all other FPS. We have seen enough "press and hold E to receive loot" and "guard/capture this illogically defenceless tactical asset" imho. Having these drones would add another layer of tactics to combat in that even a solo player is not necessarily "alone". I'd like them to be something you learn to use efficiently in assisting you with tasks that might otherwise turn stale after a while and become sort of an extended arm of yourself. Maybe even as central a part of your fit and target of emotional attachment as your suit itself. As a side note, I image these three types being per race so that there's a variety of different harvesters for different situations/ play styles. I also consider splitting the current "guardian" into two clearly offensive and defensive types as they're awfully close to being "general purpose". You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1359	Posted - 2014.06.11 16:36:00 - [3] - Quote Natu Nobilis wrote: Severus Smith wrote: Thanks for the clarification and I apologize for the misunderstanding. Though, I have another small question. If the "deployable" salvager takes up an Equipment slot then what does that mean for suits with limited, or no, equipment slots? It could easily mean "if you want to salvage get a suit that's built for salvage" but I want to make sure. A final idea of mine. Rather than a deployable piece of equipment, could you instead call in a small salvage drone via the vehicle commands? It follows you, and can fit into small places like interiors, and uses its amazing quantum hammer space engine to compress materials into a small compartment for rapid recovery. Something small like this (Amarr, Caldari, Gallente, Minmatar). Roughly the size of a large dog, with a salvage laser and a small auto-turret. Have them cost as much as a LAV, so you want to defend them but won't be crushed if it is destroyed. Getting them picked up is similar to how you recall a vehicle, or you have to take them to a recovery station. Again, probably not going to happen. But I figured I'd ask since I like drones, and it would be cool to see a squad of players deploying some of these to boost their salvaging rate. And it would also explain why the rouge-drones would not like these guys - they're drones who aren't free. Dude, processing power. Drones consume CPU, CPU is available on a limited ammount. One drone for a player is one less drone for the PVE. Drone - Pet - Companion, whatever we call it, they consume resources that demand a lot in terms of processing, energy and bandwith. EVE changed a lot of drone performance lately because it impacted like crazy on TiDi, they don-¦t want the same to happen here. CCP Wolfman already said himself that this might be an issue, not that it has to be. Also in eve we're talking about a thousand players having 5-10 drones each, not maybe a hundred with one drone each. Totally different scales. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1359	Posted - 2014.06.11 19:22:00 - [4] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: So it's stuff that appeared out of nowhere that nobody actually killed? That's pretty lame. Also, last time I checked, those scavenger drones immediately comes onto the battlefield to reclaim that stuff, so why would it still be there? A bunch of the EVE industry stuff started off as server seeded and was slowly switched to player interaction. I expect this to be possible here aswell. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1361	Posted - 2014.06.12 19:30:00 - [5] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Or you could just borrow from Eve Online's Safety system. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXwBrlEGshM#t=84 How I would apply this to Dust would be like this. Keep in mind that the Safety doesn't care what the security status is of the star system you're in. If you set the safety to any of the colors below and click "CONFIRM" then you know what you're getting into and thus you made your bed. SAFETY GREEN: Utilizing the TACNET scanner built into the front of the gun, which is what enables you to read a target's health and weapon efficiency, if the target you are about to shoot happens to be a neutral, ally, or corp mate, your gun will jam only as long as that target is standing in the way. The same applies to vehicles and installations. Criminals are exempt from this protection and thus your gun will allow you to shoot them to death until their timer runs out. If aimed at a suspect while GREEN, the gun will fire until target's shield is depleted. After that, the gun will jam once it senses that the shields are down. SAFETY RED: Gun doesn't jam at all regardless of who you shoot. Suspect timer will be 1 minute long and you only get suspect timer after reaching a certain damage threshold. Criminal timer is 5 minutes long if you continue and reach an even higher threshold. This will reliably prevent FF with ADSed hitscan weapons but what about the odd statistical outlier bullet from hip firing, any AoE or trajectory weapon? In EVE there's only a handful of things (bombs and smartbombs from the top of my head) that can cause unintentional FF and those are arguably advanced enough to assume people know (usually) what they're doing when handling them. A mass driver is a pretty basic weapon. Or grenades You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1361	Posted - 2014.06.12 22:49:00 - [6] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: [ Eve Online does have bombs and smartbombs, but there is a difference between the two. Bombs in Eve are prevented from launching in high-sec and low-sec regardless of the SAFETY setting. You can only use a bomb in null-sec. It's just like the interdiction bubbles which are only allowed in null-sec. Smartbombs however are an entirely different beast. Currently in Eve Online you can use them in any system but you will have to set it to SAFETY RED in order to use it at all. Bare in mind that once you fire that smartbomb, you will suffer punishment from Concord if anyone in high-sec is caught in the blast. However, we're talking about a point-to-point MMO here. In Eve Online, it's nearly impossible to commit friendly fire unless you really are going out of your way to troll everyone. In a FPS setting however, it's different. I'm going on a limb here and think that certain weapons will be jammed in high-sec and low-sec unless you manually set yourself to SAFETY RED. Ah right, I forgot about sec restrictions on weapons. While I agree that locking those high risk weapons to RED safety is a possibility, it worries me to think how many weapon systems have to be "redlocked" to provide the safety necessary to provide new players a friendly environment. Worst of all, I just thought of another, technical, problem with the system you propose. Latency The games' current net code is based on a client/server architecture with the latter having full authority over the game state. This means that the client does not directly control the simulation but merely sends user input to the server which will incorporate it into the simulation. However, to provide a fluid and responsive gameplay experience the client does a fair amount of predictions regarding his actions and the results thereof. For example, firing a shot from any weapon will immediately commence the firing animation, draw the fired projectile and, if it sees a shot connecting from his end, the impact animations. But all of these actions are just anticipated by the client while the server has to confirm on his end that a shot has been fired before deducting a bullet from the magazine and check itself whether the hitscan function or bullet simulation actually produces a hit before deducting health from the target. Due to lag and interpolation, the exact positions of all moving entities displayed to the user by the client never matches their respective coordinates exactly. This regularly leads to cases where the client, based on the game state known to him, predicts a hit and displays the hit marker and effect while the server, in control of said gamestate, negates the hit and deals no damage to the target. The inverse does also happen for the same reasons. In th the case of GREEN security settings and firing at a friendly with a pinpoint hitscan weapon, four particular things can happen: Client predicts hit. Server calculates hit Server and client agree that the shot would've caused friendly fire. The client draws no animations and the server denies the fire command. What the user sees is congruent with what is actually happening. Client predicts miss. Server calculates miss. Server and client agree that the shot wouldn't cause FF. Client draws animation and server confirms shot and deducts a bullet from the magazine. User feedback is, again, consistent with reality. Client predicts miss. Server calculates hit. That's where things get awry. The client assumes the weapons trajectory does not intersect with a friendly hitbox, thus displays weapon and (ground) impact animations, while the server declares that the shot would've connected and that no shot was ever fired because of the FF lock. Feedback and reality do not align. Client predicts hit. Server calculates miss. Lastly. The client predicts a FF hit and draws no animations. The server, however decides that the shot can happen and deducts a bullet from ammo count. The user loses a bullet despite having been given the information that no shot has been fired. Remember that the two latter scenarios are no edge cases. This kind of stuff happens in FPS all the time. While surely not a game breaking flaw, this kind of behavior can be very annoying and is very detrimental to the gameflow as well as perceived net code quality. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1361	Posted - 2014.06.12 23:13:00 - [7] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Interesting scenarios. Those seriously need to be looked into BEFORE Legion goes into closed beta. But I fear there is not much to do except one thing. Streamline the server architecture so that there is as minimal hit-n-miss cases. But that's easier said than done as that probably will require a level of Client/Server communication that is unheard of in the gaming industry. The client hit/server miss scenario is actually rather easy to prevent with a minor drawback attached. When the client anticipates friendly fire, it doesn't send the "firing" packet in the first place. This means no chance of uncommunicated shots but results in reduced combat efficiency as potentially valid firing opportunities are denied on initiative of the client. This seems like a reasonable tradeoff since a "when in doubt, hold fire" approach at least makes some sense when thinking about it. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1453	Posted - 2014.06.25 08:23:00 - [8] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Don't have anything to hand right now. It's about the size of a very large back pack. We have noticed the the FOV makes it look a little smaller than we expected. We'll need to get a functional test in game first to test it out (right now it's represented by a rotating box!). It looks pretty sweet. Out of curiosity. Is the concept of drones being more of an active component in moment to moment gameplay still on the table or should slowly say goodbye to this dream? You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1453	Posted - 2014.06.25 09:14:00 - [9] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: steadyhand amarr wrote: That is awsome and a good move :-), hard to kill is a plus to prevent sniping :-) i could even see some awsome firefights over them if u can hack them once the owner is dead....hint hint :-P Yeah at first they were easier to destroy but it proved to be a lot more annoying than fun. Right now you can pick up other peoples and steal them. No hacking yet, we're still deciding if we want to add that step, leaning towards it. So the plan is for them to be mostly passive at any rate? What happens when I pick one up while already carrying my own? You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1456	Posted - 2014.06.27 05:56:00 - [10] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: On GÇÿwandering off' Yes you can leave your harvester harvesting and wander off to steal someone elseGÇÖs. Can we get a variation with a small automated turret at the expense of salvage capacity? And one that uses said turret to remotely steal from other harvesters but is rather squishy? You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...

Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1459	Posted - 2014.07.02 03:38:00 - [11] - Quote Can a suspect become a thread without killing someone. After reaching a threshold of continuous damage for example? Will damaging/killing a suspect result in any criminal flags on me? Will squads share criminal flags? What if provide logistics support to the aggressor without dealing damage myself? Just throwing around things that will come up eventually here. I also like the idea of the "marked" status. How about separating the chevron into one smaller middle section indicating the highest criminal status during the current session and the outer section displaying the current one. That way you not only know of a player's criminal history but also the extend of which. You'd also avoid having to use black/white contrasts for a HUD element because very light/dark scenes will definitely cause issues to one of them. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1463	Posted - 2014.07.03 16:52:00 - [12] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Better to just disable your weapon after a certain amount of time in high sec, if you deliberately damage a non-threat (which you have a safety setting to enable or disable, otherwise friendly fire is off) 1.0: 0.5 seconds 0.9: 1.0 seconds 0.8: 1.5 seconds 0.7: 2.0 seconds 0.6: 3.5 seconds 0.5: 5.0 seconds After that, if you actually damaged someone (rather than just equipment) then your clone is terminated and you drop a little pile of salvage. This will only work on low alpha weaponry. A cloaky shotgunner can one-shot just about everyone, cloak, and wait for the cooldown to expire for the next hit. Same with FGs, snipers, PLCs, REs and, to a lesser extent, fully charged SCRs. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1463	Posted - 2014.07.03 17:01:00 - [13] - Quote Emo Skellington wrote: Maybe what we could do is make like a low sec mining operation. The drones that come out and "loot" will be the npcs of the faction in that system "blood raiders guristas. etc.. These drones will attack you making the salvaging into a pve session while looking for look. You should be able to choose the security system to go into and depending which you schoose depends on the suits and the gear that these npcs have (just like in EVE) Lower security means the harder it will be to kill the more the more difficul I definitley want to see proto suits with proto gear and a decent difficulty in their tactics in 0.1 and into null sec Salvage rates and the rarity should be determined in the security its found also Proto and salvage only gear should be found in low sec with higher drops rates the lower the security. Sounds like the blueprint for NPC combat missions. Go there -> kill pirates -> receive bounties/loot. While not horribly creative, this would be a good way for players who don't quite care for the whole mining aspect of the sandbox. The question is. Can I side with the pirates and make my mission to kill the attacking players (dark souls invasion style) in low/null? You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1466	Posted - 2014.07.04 00:11:00 - [14] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: This will only work on low alpha weaponry. A cloaky shotgunner can one-shot just about everyone, cloak, and wait for the cooldown to expire for the next hit. Same with FGs, snipers, PLCs, REs and, to a lesser extent, fully charged SCRs. Yes, that's the point. You can still kill people in high-sec, you just die 0.5 seconds afterwards and whatever other penalties accrue from that. Then the lock mechanic is superfluous. A precision concordukken after certain damage with a slight delay as you propose will do the exact same thing, whether you lock the weapon or not. Why artificially limit the options available for non-consensual PVP when there's no need to do so? If someone wants to pull off a suicide gank with his HMG, let him (assuming Wolfman is willing to allow FF in high-sec in the first place). Nevermind that OHKOs are the least enjoyable form PVP for the victim due to the complete lack of counterplay. Essentially blocking all but those specific tactics has only downsides, albeit minor because most will use these weapons regardless of any further rules (have I mentioned the lock mechanic is superfluous?). You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1466	Posted - 2014.07.04 01:54:00 - [15] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Quick note on consequences - Pking not only increases your suspicion rating but it is also one of the largest factors for increasing drone hostility towards you. High hostility will mean the drones are actively hunting you. Are hostile drones immediately aware of my presence and position or can cloaks & low suit profiles be used to avoid detection? You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1466	Posted - 2014.07.04 02:30:00 - [16] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: SponkSponkSponk wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Quick note on consequences - Pking not only increases your suspicion rating but it is also one of the largest factors for increasing drone hostility towards you. High hostility will mean the drones are actively hunting you. Well then there better be sentry drones around CRUs otherwise they'll be camped more heavily than anywhere in DayZ. The CRU's in salvage are going to be going away soon (at least as a test). I'll talk more about that soon to get your opinion Drop zones. Please say drop zones. And drop pods that we can also call in as OMS to evacuate. Destructible and with reasonable take off time so that others can prevent evacuation. Slower ones that can carry more loot. Faster ones that may force you to leave behind some of your loot. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Malkai Inos Any Given Day 1466	Posted - 2014.07.04 02:45:00 - [17] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: True Adamance wrote: Will modifiers such as standing or Milita status be visually present during these kinds of actions. E.G- Can I down rep someone who has killed me before and see that bad standing while he is not suspect? We're looking at a session based system not a persistent one at this stage. That doesn't mean persistent isn't a place we can go but I think session based makes sense as a starting point. It's still early days Regarding reps (and logi in general) Have you thought about what happens If I rep/stab/re-ammo someone who is not in my squad and aggresses another party? He'll obviously become a suspect/threat, but what about me who is actively contributing to the conflict without dealing damage? Will the other party be able to take me out without getting a criminal flag? Eve had issues with that for a long time afair so it would be good figuring this out early on. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...