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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 66 post(s)
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8716	Posted - 2014.05.29 02:53:00 - [1] - Quote Q: What would make for interesting ways to search for good salvage? A: As a long-time Eve Online player, perhaps you can take a page from the sensor overlay that is present in Eve Online. Here is a link to the video showing what I'm talking about. I'm not asking for an exactly copy of this but something based off of this concept of a sensor overlay that can at least help new players get an idea on where to start as soon as they deploy to a planet of their choosing. This can also be used in conjunction with NPE so that new players won't be as lost as some of us were back in 2003 (some of us remember those days). Q: What kind of player interactions do you think would be interesting? A: That's up to the visitors to decide. If they want to greet with bullets, then I would like to say "hi" as well in kind. Of course, the security status of the system you're in should play a role in this. This could also be a chance to encourage team play if players want better returns in their investment (those salvage tools will cost ISK after all). Q: How do you think drones should behave? A: Honestly I would say borrow from the null-sec AI or sleeper AI since those provide a challenge in Eve. Of course, how prevalent they are should also depend on the sec status of the system. One interesting thing I like to see is a chance to go after drone hives in an attempt to salvage even better loot but that should likely require actual teamwork just like how Eve players handle Incursions using public fleets like The Ditanian Fleet. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8719	Posted - 2014.05.29 16:39:00 - [2] - Quote steadyhand amarr wrote: Eeehb that sounds more like a bug hunt tham salavaging a battlefield. I think it has its place but its not part of ccps current vision. To be honest im all for bug hunts but it could get samy very quick and your not going to get the emergent gameplay we are all after. Ie(people get bored quickly) Not part of CCP current vision? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCCTrEhkUCY Just look at the first 50 seconds of the video alone. And yes, that is a Caldari Assault holding a forge gun. Just remember that the drones CCP Wolfman is describing are salvagers as well. If I under stand him correctly, drones are just icing on the cake because they are also there to look for the same loot that you and someone else are looking for. It's likely we'll end up looking for a set of wreckage left behind by the last unknown battle that occurred within districts and you're just there for clean up thereafter. I kind of envision it going like this: First someone starts a normal lobby match either in a high-sec district or in a factional warfare low-sec district. Once the match has concluded and both teams are done getting their share of the salvage, a beacon is sent out by the district calling for salvage drones to pick up whatever stuff remains on the battlefield. While the salvage drones are on the way, you just happen to notice the beacon on your sensor overlay while you were visiting the planet. You head over to see how much loot you can salvage before the drones get there or probably have to blast your way through the drones to get it. Keep in mind that you're not going to be the only one who picked up the beacon. If someone else comes, the race is finally on. I would like it to be more like ninja salvaging in front of the Jita station in Eve Online. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8719	Posted - 2014.05.29 16:42:00 - [3] - Quote BUGSBUNNY LOONEY wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Hi guys, IGÇÖm here to have a chat about Salvage. That is, deploying to the surface of a planet and searching for valuable loot. YouGÇÖre not the only one with this bright idea of course, reclaimer drones (and other players) are there doing the same thing and theyGÇÖre probably not all that keen that you are too! This is a pretty important part of the Legion economy since this salvage gathered by players is what will supply the market. ItGÇÖs something weGÇÖre beginning to look at now and I would like to hear your thoughts and harvest your ideas about it. This will then allow me to pretend all the good ones were mine. So, you have 3 main components: The ability to search for and find loot Armed drones that search and gather loot Other players that most likely have varying reasons for being thereGÇª What would make for interesting ways to search for good salvage? What kind of player interactions do you think would be interesting? How do you think drones should behave? Have at it! CCP Wolfman This is what you promised us in dust514 so bring it to dust514 It's not likely to come at this point for Dust. Back then CCP said they weren't entirely sure if and when drones would be implemented on Dust which is why they never gave a timeline on it. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8719	Posted - 2014.05.29 16:48:00 - [4] - Quote @CCP Wolfman Is it possible to tie in free-for-all salvage to previous battles as I described in post #53? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8720	Posted - 2014.05.29 18:20:00 - [5] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: I'm baffled that you guys think that it's a good idea to have salvaging being the only way to fund the market............. Well, until Eve-side manufacturing finally gets linked up with Legion, what alternative is there besides the primary NPC market? Besides the primary NPC market wouldn't be a good source for the secondary market anyways since you won't be able to sell for any higher than what the NPC price is going for. Therefore market trading between the primary and secondary is not profitable unless you isolate the NPC market far away in isolated regions from that of the secondary markets in other (more populated) regions. Salvage to me is a good first step at least. Although I wonder if it's possible to implement mining in Legion. At least for materials that are exclusive to planets. That way mining in Legion won't compete with mining in Eve. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8721	Posted - 2014.05.30 00:49:00 - [6] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: I'm baffled that you guys think that it's a good idea to have salvaging being the only way to fund the market............. Well, until Eve-side manufacturing finally gets linked up with Legion, what alternative is there besides the primary NPC market? Besides the primary NPC market wouldn't be a good source for the secondary market anyways since you won't be able to sell for any higher than what the NPC price is going for. Therefore market trading between the primary and secondary is not profitable unless you isolate the NPC market far away in isolated regions from that of the secondary markets in other (more populated) regions. Salvage to me is a good first step at least. Although I wonder if it's possible to implement mining in Legion. At least for materials that are exclusive to planets. That way mining in Legion won't compete with mining in Eve. Well, saying that "until" crap doesn't help anything. Rather, it should be there day one.............. It should, but knowing how complicated it will be to implement Eve-side manufacturing of Legion gear, can you tell me with a straight face that it's possible to implement on the first day assuming the game is scheduled to be in beta in 12 months? Here is a list of things to consider when it comes to manufacturing in general. This is based off of what I have seen in Eve Online. If you were to make industry the first thing available in Legion, ask yourself these questions. How are the blueprint copies obtained? How many unique materials are called for in the blueprint copy to manufacture 1 unit of a specific item? How many units for every unique material listed on the specific blueprint copy are called for? How many units are produced after every production run? How many production runs can this specific blueprint copy have before it expires? If a planet is a Temperate type, what materials can be extracted from it? What about Barren types or lava types, etc.? How are the materials distributed across each planet type? What tools are needed for scanning down the raw materials and how accurate are they? What tools are needed for extracting the raw materials and what are their yields? Does sec status impact the type of materials you will find on the specific planet? How will you be able to transfer the raw materials to Eve-side for manufacturing? What are the fees to be imposed when using NPC-provided production slots? How long should a specific blueprint take (in number of hours) to manufacture the item in question? What skills are needed to be able to use specific blueprint copies? What are the material efficiency and time efficiency of each blueprint copy? Remember this is assuming we are going to let Eve players handle production as that is the fasted thing to implement for Legion. The production chains have been established by the players for 11 years along with solid logistical systems and efficient ways of researching blueprints for maximum material and time efficiency. Therefore it makes sense to go this route. If Legion were to try to establish their own production methods on day 1, it will likely take far too long. EDIT: Sorry for straying off topic here as I know this is mainly about salvage and not production. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8721	Posted - 2014.05.30 02:57:00 - [7] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Maken Tosch asked if the locations could be tied to real battles. This is an idea we really like, might not make it in to the first iteration though. As long as it's being considered, I'm ok with waiting. I just think it will be much more immersive to have us come to an outpost that is completely in shambles after a recent match as we approach to loot from whatever is left behind in it. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8722	Posted - 2014.05.30 03:45:00 - [8] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Ku Shala wrote: Will Wasteland Junk Removal become a salvage NPC corp? JK But seriously will the maps in salvage be similar to the maps in dust or more open like the maps in planetside2 Map size is something we'll be determining through playtesting. We have to find the right balance between player count, drone count, enjoyable exploration and the chance of encounters. Our current test map is larger than a skirmish map, it's still early days. One more thing. That redline. I like to call her Lady Redline as she looks sexy in red. Anyways, I just like to point out that the redline should be as far back as possible to promote vehicle use and allow solo players to be able to flank random players without being forced into a funnel like you see in skirmish maps. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8722	Posted - 2014.05.31 00:05:00 - [9] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: 1. Searching and finding loot is probably best done on probability. I would say you can base chance of loot on "level of drone" you are destroying. Level of drone could be capped based on sec status. Some loot should drop in all areas of space and more rare items drop only in high/low/null. That way you have reasons to be in each section. EX: Proto AR only in Gal HighSec, Balac ARs drop only in Gal low sec space, Krin AR drop only in Null Gal space. Make it so racial varients drop in the correct space. I realize that the Empires don't really work in low/null but create weapons/tools in the various regions of space owned by pirates that correlate. "Guristas flaylock pistol" for example. We could take that one step further and make it so that salvage missions are created shortly or immediately after a player-vs-player match concludes with the salvage being based on whatever is left behind. Of course we all know that the after-battle reports show what salvage you got in Dust, but in Legion there should be things that those players may have overlooked and left behind. So if a PvP match had some players using officer gear, there should be a chance of finding leftover officer gear in that area. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8725	Posted - 2014.05.31 20:37:00 - [10] - Quote Meeko Fent wrote: If we are doing salvage... Please dont do it for items. Do it for resources for manufacturing improved items (we are doing that, right?), similar to EVE's salvaging. It makes zero sense for me to go to a battlefield, die 10 times, and then leave with 11 suits. Maybe the stuff needed to make 11 suits, but 11 full formed suits is just stupid bananas. Eve Online's salvage system is based on the extraction of broken components. That much is true. But the vast majority of actual salvage comes from the loot that it inside the wrecks. For those of you who never played Eve Online, when a ship in Eve is destroyed, a small portion of the modules fitted on the ship are dropped in space as salvage inside the wreck. This also includes a portion of the stuff already inside the cargo hold. The wreckage itself (that thing that holds the loot) can be targeted and salvaged for broken components. But the value of the broken components often make up only a tiny fraction of the actual value of the loot inside the wreck. But yes, if you die on the ground you shouldn't be able to recover not even 40% of what you lost. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.

Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8727	Posted - 2014.06.01 00:56:00 - [11] - Quote Captain Crutches wrote: Baltazar Pontain wrote: * Drills. This please. And let us use them as weapons. Isn't that what the Forge Gun use to be? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8729	Posted - 2014.06.01 17:49:00 - [12] - Quote Ghural wrote: Does the salvage have to be just lying around? Can we have a drill similar to Firefall. Where you place a drill, a timer begins, nearby drones (and players) are drawn to the noise and attack it, if it's kept intact then you get stuff. CCP can copy the Salvager modules from Eve. Make it an equipment item that, when held, emits a beam that first scans the damaged hardware looking for modules that may have been left behind and then eats through the surface to access those modules. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8734	Posted - 2014.06.02 11:20:00 - [13] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: I think making Salvage the main source of item production is a bad idea, there is nothimg wrong with the concept. But how much of the games economy will come from people salvaging items? I should really have the opportunity to salvage if I need a few quick bucks, but it shouldn't be a steady source of income unless it's practically all I do Has EvE production been considered? This would be a very meaningful way of connecting the two games, not to memtion it would expamd and inflate the EvE econmy even more. How are you going to ensure there is never a shprtage of items? Im running low on my beloved ACR, so I go out to salvage, come back with a load of junk I don't want and sell it on the market, I then go to buy some ACR's with my hard earned ISK . . . and find that no-one is selling them. How are you going to ensure this doesn't happen? On your last point, supply and demand will ensure there is something for everyone. It will be pricey but you'll get it. Remember that if there is a demand for it someone will figure out the most efficient way to get it for you. Trust me. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8736	Posted - 2014.06.03 01:37:00 - [14] - Quote Magpie Raven wrote: What would make for interesting ways to search for good salvage? Encounters: Simple and easy looting of recent battles. Easy to find and easy to retrieve. Larger quantity with a lower chance of high quality Random- This includes coming across random bodies and vehicle wrecks that when accessed contain components, scrap, ammunition and usable gear. Wrecks should be random and scattered around. They stay in one place until looted then eventually respawn with new stuff in another location at a later time. Intentional- Scanners or salvage drones could be used to find larger looting sites with a higher concentration of stuff. Things like the site of a skirmish between two forces which would have many corpses and wrecks to loot. Or larger vehicle wrecks. Sizes could range from relatively small to fairly large sites. The quantity of loot would be higher but there would be more risk because such places tend to draw other would be looters. Underground: Hard to find and difficult to retrieve. Basically it is stuff forgotten about or overlooked that gets buried. Player must locate the underground anomaly and dig it out using drones or a tool of some kind. The process takes a while during which the player is at risk. However the rewards are better. Either it is damaged beyond repair from being underground or it has been preserved. Could be old weapons, dropsuits, or whole vehicles Small quantity with a higher chance of quality The actual salvage process Each body or wreck must be hacked by the player. This should take some time depending on the actual size of the wreck. Once hacked, the items would then be moved from the wreck to the players inventory or storage vehicle. It should not be as simple as just hacking it then its yours. Salvage should have to be transported around and be a physical thing. To be taken into orbit when the merc leaves the surface An acceptable concept for me. Some of the loot we find should be tied somehow to recent battles. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8738	Posted - 2014.06.03 19:36:00 - [15] - Quote Jadek Menaheim wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: Jadek Menaheim wrote: @Severus Smith Agreed. I do not want to revisit the days of sweating in Entropia Universe. That looks god awful (never played, and now I don't want to ) The thing about Entropia universe is the creators of the game allow player to turn in-game currency (PEDs) into real world cash. You are also able to purchase in-game land and essentially make money off collecting rent from players who use the land. Sweating is the very basic component of the game, which also allows you to make money. People who are very poor in RL have actually made enough to get by through sweating in a video game. http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/123163-Virtual-Moon-Over-Entropia-Universe-Sells-For-150-000 But is that kind of system balanced at all? I never played it but I doubt it, though. If someone is able to farm the in game currency effectively enough, wouldn't the value of said currency diminish over time? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8740	Posted - 2014.06.04 17:43:00 - [16] - Quote lateriss wrote: calisk galern wrote: my main question about this is why in gods name is nobody making weapons for the legion users.... is their a fluff reason nobody in eve's industrial focused economy wants to make weapons for these planet battles. Crafting! I would craft weapons in Eve for the boots on the ground. But I would prefer to do it in Legion. In Eve Online, it's not called "crafting". It's called "manufacturing" because technically you're relying on factories to produce the goods. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8752	Posted - 2014.06.06 00:50:00 - [17] - Quote lateris ablon wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: I'm baffled that you guys think that it's a good idea to have salvaging being the only way to fund the market............. Allow manufacturing. Manufacturing will require some time without a doubt. Every item will need a blueprint copy with a set limit of runs, type of materials needed and what quantities for every unique item, material efficiency and time efficiency level, etc. It's a long list to do and that's just on what we already have in Dust which is not including the many things still missing. But remember that this is all for Eve players who already have an established system of manufacturing. This means they will need Legionaries to provide the materials which means we will have to harvest those materials which also means salvaging will NOT be the only source to rely on (looks at the PC districts). On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8758	Posted - 2014.06.09 14:18:00 - [18] - Quote Introducing junk salvage is a great first step to one day implement manufacturing. Eve Online already uses junk salvage to manufacture rigs for starships. However acquiring the broken complements takes quite a lot of effort in high sec space. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8760	Posted - 2014.06.10 18:06:00 - [19] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: lateris ablon wrote: Quote: Is loot destructible and how do you GÇÿbankGÇÖ it? Yes. The idea weGÇÖre developing is that players use a deployable GÇ£harvesterGÇ¥ to gather loot from a site before you take it to an extraction point to GÇÿbankGÇÖ it. This harvester contains the salvage and can be destroyed or you can be killed and it taken from you. Will the deployable Harvester be launched from a UI? Or will it be dropped by a vehicle we call in?? Will there be an animation that makes it look a bit realistic? You carry it and deploy it yourself. Right now if you die you drop it (and all salvage in it). You always know it's location even if someone else takes it. In that sense it's a little similar to some of ocelots ideas. We experimenting with possible looks and style as well as animations atm. Honestly I wouldn't want it to be too compact. I don't want a piece of salvage the size of a Forge Gun to fit in a suitcase. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8761	Posted - 2014.06.11 21:40:00 - [20] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: So it's stuff that appeared out of nowhere that nobody actually killed? That's pretty lame. Also, last time I checked, those scavenger drones immediately comes onto the battlefield to reclaim that stuff, so why would it still be there? A bunch of the EVE industry stuff started off as server seeded and was slowly switched to player interaction. I expect this to be possible here aswell. That was lame as well. That's why I didn't play it before. But you know it had to start off like that. In every economy, whether it's in a video game or in real-life, there needs to be an artificial means to get it going. But that's just the easy part. The hard part is maintaining balance. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.

Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8761	Posted - 2014.06.12 02:27:00 - [21] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: @ Severus Smith At the moment the harvester doesnGÇÖt take up a slot. We didnGÇÖt want to place an extra step (fitting) between the player and salvaging. The current idea is that you will be able to fit modules to your dropsuit that will augment the harvester. Player controlled drones as a concept are really cool. I like the idea of putting a drone in the drone equivalent of a bleed out state and then hacking it to my GÇ£teamGÇ¥. But, before we think about that we need to get the base gameplay fun, see what kind of player/drone counts that takes and what the performance impact is. We then also have to factor in player count Vs server costs. There are all sorts of different factors in the balance. Would like to do something with them if possible. I got a question for you. Assuming Legion gets the green light from Hilmar, are we going test the salvage system in the Singularity Test Server? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8761	Posted - 2014.06.12 02:54:00 - [22] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: @ Severus Smith At the moment the harvester doesnGÇÖt take up a slot. We didnGÇÖt want to place an extra step (fitting) between the player and salvaging. The current idea is that you will be able to fit modules to your dropsuit that will augment the harvester. Player controlled drones as a concept are really cool. I like the idea of putting a drone in the drone equivalent of a bleed out state and then hacking it to my GÇ£teamGÇ¥. But, before we think about that we need to get the base gameplay fun, see what kind of player/drone counts that takes and what the performance impact is. We then also have to factor in player count Vs server costs. There are all sorts of different factors in the balance. Would like to do something with them if possible. I got a question for you. Assuming Legion gets the green light from Hilmar, are we going test the salvage system in the Singularity Test Server? We'll certainly be testing it, I'll leave the decision as to where up to the tech gods /pulls out the nova knives Excellent. How many virgin gamers do I have to sacrifice to appease the gods? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8764	Posted - 2014.06.12 18:33:00 - [23] - Quote Or you could just borrow from Eve Online's Safety system. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXwBrlEGshM#t=84 How I would apply this to Dust would be like this. Keep in mind that the Safety doesn't care what the security status is of the star system you're in. If you set the safety to any of the colors below and click "CONFIRM" then you know what you're getting into and thus you made your bed. SAFETY GREEN: Utilizing the TACNET scanner built into the front of the gun, which is what enables you to read a target's health and weapon efficiency, if the target you are about to shoot happens to be a neutral, ally, or corp mate, your gun will jam only as long as that target is standing in the way. The same applies to vehicles and installations. Criminals are exempt from this protection and thus your gun will allow you to shoot them to death until their timer runs out. If aimed at a suspect while GREEN, the gun will fire until target's shield is depleted. After that, the gun will jam once it senses that the shields are down. SAFETY RED: Gun doesn't jam at all regardless of who you shoot. Suspect timer will be 1 minute long and you only get suspect timer after reaching a certain damage threshold. Criminal timer is 5 minutes long if you continue and reach an even higher threshold. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8764	Posted - 2014.06.12 20:25:00 - [24] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Or you could just borrow from Eve Online's Safety system. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXwBrlEGshM#t=84 How I would apply this to Dust would be like this. Keep in mind that the Safety doesn't care what the security status is of the star system you're in. If you set the safety to any of the colors below and click "CONFIRM" then you know what you're getting into and thus you made your bed. SAFETY GREEN: Utilizing the TACNET scanner built into the front of the gun, which is what enables you to read a target's health and weapon efficiency, if the target you are about to shoot happens to be a neutral, ally, or corp mate, your gun will jam only as long as that target is standing in the way. The same applies to vehicles and installations. Criminals are exempt from this protection and thus your gun will allow you to shoot them to death until their timer runs out. If aimed at a suspect while GREEN, the gun will fire until target's shield is depleted. After that, the gun will jam once it senses that the shields are down. SAFETY RED: Gun doesn't jam at all regardless of who you shoot. Suspect timer will be 1 minute long and you only get suspect timer after reaching a certain damage threshold. Criminal timer is 5 minutes long if you continue and reach an even higher threshold. This will reliably prevent FF with ADSed hitscan weapons but what about the odd statistical outlier bullet from hip firing, any AoE or trajectory weapon? In EVE there's only a handful of things (bombs and smartbombs from the top of my head) that can cause unintentional FF and those are arguably advanced enough to assume people know (usually) what they're doing when handling them. A mass driver is a pretty basic weapon. Or grenades Edit for moderation: I think this system might be secure enough for low-sec (don't fire explosives into a bunch of blues, duh) but this and the following posts by CCP Wolfman et al. makes me suspect that he'd prefer a safer rule set for hi-sec areas. Thanks for bring up the AoE weapons. Eve Online does have bombs and smartbombs, but there is a difference between the two. Bombs in Eve are prevented from launching in high-sec and low-sec regardless of the SAFETY setting. You can only use a bomb in null-sec. It's just like the interdiction bubbles which are only allowed in null-sec. Smartbombs however are an entirely different beast. Currently in Eve Online you can use them in any system but you will have to set it to SAFETY RED in order to use it at all. Bare in mind that once you fire that smartbomb, you will suffer punishment from Concord if anyone in high-sec is caught in the blast. However, we're talking about a point-to-point MMO here. In Eve Online, it's nearly impossible to commit friendly fire unless you really are going out of your way to troll everyone. In a FPS setting however, it's different. I'm going on a limb here and think that certain weapons will be jammed in high-sec and low-sec unless you manually set yourself to SAFETY RED. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8764	Posted - 2014.06.12 23:00:00 - [25] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: [ Eve Online does have bombs and smartbombs, but there is a difference between the two. Bombs in Eve are prevented from launching in high-sec and low-sec regardless of the SAFETY setting. You can only use a bomb in null-sec. It's just like the interdiction bubbles which are only allowed in null-sec. Smartbombs however are an entirely different beast. Currently in Eve Online you can use them in any system but you will have to set it to SAFETY RED in order to use it at all. Bare in mind that once you fire that smartbomb, you will suffer punishment from Concord if anyone in high-sec is caught in the blast. However, we're talking about a point-to-point MMO here. In Eve Online, it's nearly impossible to commit friendly fire unless you really are going out of your way to troll everyone. In a FPS setting however, it's different. I'm going on a limb here and think that certain weapons will be jammed in high-sec and low-sec unless you manually set yourself to SAFETY RED. Ah right, I forgot about sec restrictions on weapons. While I agree that locking those high risk weapons to RED safety is a possibility, it worries me to think how many weapon systems have to be "redlocked" to provide the safety necessary to provide new players a friendly environment. Worst of all, I just thought of another, technical, problem with the system you propose. Latency The games' current net code is based on a client/server architecture with the latter having full authority over the game state. This means that the client does not directly control the simulation but merely sends user input to the server which will incorporate it into the simulation. However, to provide a fluid and responsive gameplay experience the client does a fair amount of predictions regarding his actions and the results thereof. For example, firing a shot from any weapon will immediately commence the firing animation, draw the fired projectile and, if it sees a shot connecting from his end, the impact animations. But all of these actions are just anticipated by the client while the server has to confirm on his end that a shot has been fired before deducting a bullet from the magazine and check itself whether the hitscan function or bullet simulation actually produces a hit before deducting health from the target. Due to lag and interpolation, the exact positions of all moving entities displayed to the user by the client never matches their respective coordinates exactly. This regularly leads to cases where the client, based on the game state known to him, predicts a hit and displays the hit marker and effect while the server, in control of said gamestate, negates the hit and deals no damage to the target. The inverse does also happen for the same reasons. In th the case of GREEN security settings and firing at a friendly with a pinpoint hitscan weapon, four particular things can happen: Client predicts hit. Server calculates hit Server and client agree that the shot would've caused friendly fire. The client draws no animations and the server denies the fire command. What the user sees is congruent with what is actually happening. Client predicts miss. Server calculates miss. Server and client agree that the shot wouldn't cause FF. Client draws animation and server confirms shot and deducts a bullet from the magazine. User feedback is, again, consistent with reality. Client predicts miss. Server calculates hit. That's where things get awry. The client assumes the weapons trajectory does not intersect with a friendly hitbox, thus displays weapon and (ground) impact animations, while the server declares that the shot would've connected and that no shot was ever fired because of the FF lock. Feedback and reality do not align. Client predicts hit. Server calculates miss. Lastly. The client predicts a FF hit and draws no animations. The server, however decides that the shot can happen and deducts a bullet from ammo count. The user loses a bullet despite having been given the information that no shot has been fired. Remember that the two latter scenarios are no edge cases. This kind of stuff happens in FPS all the time. While surely not a game breaking flaw, this kind of behavior can be very annoying and is very detrimental to the gameflow as well as perceived net code quality. Interesting scenarios. Those seriously need to be looked into BEFORE Legion goes into closed beta. But I fear there is not much to do except one thing. Streamline the server architecture so that there is as minimal hit-n-miss cases. But that's easier said than done as that probably will require a level of Client/Server communication that is unheard of in the gaming industry. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8764	Posted - 2014.06.13 00:19:00 - [26] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Interesting scenarios. Those seriously need to be looked into BEFORE Legion goes into closed beta. But I fear there is not much to do except one thing. Streamline the server architecture so that there is as minimal hit-n-miss cases. But that's easier said than done as that probably will require a level of Client/Server communication that is unheard of in the gaming industry. The client hit/server miss scenario is actually rather easy to prevent with a minor drawback attached. When the client anticipates friendly fire, it doesn't send the "firing" packet in the first place. This means no chance of uncommunicated shots but results in reduced combat efficiency as potentially valid firing opportunities are denied on initiative of the client. This seems like a reasonable tradeoff since a "when in doubt, hold fire" approach at least makes some sense when thinking about it. I see. Also, I just took the time to put together a visual diagram of the SAFETY system. Something for CCP Wolfman to look into when it comes to dealing with Friendly Fire. https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1U6hArz8JY-QD3ZEGYxqXepq2v43ymPmP_-7eaZ9C0ic/edit?usp=sharing I just noticed. We strayed off from the topic of salvage to the topic of friendly fire. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8767	Posted - 2014.06.14 19:18:00 - [27] - Quote Godin Thekiller wrote: Ghural wrote: I think being able to use emotes, proximity voice chat, and being able to holster your weapon are ways that players can use to show their non-hostile or hostile intentions. Most people won't even use the ingame chat. Calling it now. Quoted for truth. Eve alliances even often discourage the use of in-game chat because of how insecure the communication is. If you have critical intel to relay to very important people and you want to do it in the most secret way possible, the last thing you would ever use is the in-game chat. Teamspeak and Mumble are well known to provide secure comms. But even then those aren't the only options. Some players even go as far as sharing cell phone numbers and emails. I swear, us Eve players are some of the most paranoid bunch you've ever seen. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8769	Posted - 2014.06.15 17:45:00 - [28] - Quote Ghural wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Godin Thekiller wrote: Ghural wrote: I think being able to use emotes, proximity voice chat, and being able to holster your weapon are ways that players can use to show their non-hostile or hostile intentions. Most people won't even use the ingame chat. Calling it now. Quoted for truth. Eve alliances even often discourage the use of in-game chat because of how insecure the communication is. If you have critical intel to relay to very important people and you want to do it in the most secret way possible, the last thing you would ever use is the in-game chat. Teamspeak and Mumble are well known to provide secure comms. But even then those aren't the only options. Some players even go as far as sharing cell phone numbers and emails. I swear, us Eve players are some of the most paranoid bunch you've ever seen. Ok. I'm going to go ahead and state what should be incredibly obvious but you've both missed. Your opponents won't be on your teamspeak, nor will the potential allies that you might happen across. Whilst many players (according to the stats that you didn't bother to quote) don't use EVE speak. Doesn't mean people wouldn't use it in Legion. Look at CoD or planetside 2, or DayZ, or Dust514 (yeah I went there) or any number of other games. I was talking about alliances. I don't mind having an improved in-game comm system for Legion for those who like to chat with the enemy or a random neutral. I'm just letting you know ahead of time that most alliances, especially the most powerful and influential ones, will often discourage you from using in-game comms and encourage you to use TS or Mumble. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8809	Posted - 2014.06.25 18:27:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Thought you might like to check out some early pics of the Harvester. Here you see it closed: [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/NebJcxw.jpg[/IMG] Here it's open and you can probably see why it's been nicknamed scorpion [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/QsoeYTn.jpg[/IMG] Me like! But why do all of your creations have to be Caldari first? Do you have anything that's more Minmatar or Gallente? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8811	Posted - 2014.06.26 05:05:00 - [30] - Quote Forlorn Destrier wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Salvage fields are set in the aftermath of battle and the salvage is scattered across the map and must be located and harvested. You don't gain it from directly killing drones currently. Will there be a direct correlation to what others have lost in these battles, or will these be random loot drops? Some would have to be random - to start. Eventually, I'd like a larger percentage to be what someone actually lost at some point in a real life battle. Adds context and immersion. Thoughts? It will probably be NPC seeded for the short term until CCP figures out how to link the prior battles with the salvage sites. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.

Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8812	Posted - 2014.06.27 04:26:00 - [31] - Quote Ghural wrote: My main question regarding the "Salvage" is who is dropping it in the first place? Who is having the battles that we are cleaning up after? The one thing I really don't like about the Salvage concept, is that at the moment we seem to be playing the part of garbage collectors, rather than immortal mercenaries. The fact that the salvage is just 'there' seems like we are missing an opportunity for a cool bit of lore and a reason for the Legion mercs to exist. Maybe we are exploring remnants of sleeper facilities? Maybe the drone have been deployed by the sleepers whom are seeking revenge for the original theft of the techonology that created the Dust mercs. It does seem that way, does it? But remember that we will also have the option of profiting from other means such as doing public matches and market trading. Trade will be a big thing for sure since the secondary market will be predominantly player-seeded. So I wouldn't need to go out and salvage for anyone or for myself if I can just buy out what you salvaged already and then turn it around to sell for a profit. The profit that I make from trade will then go towards supporting my battles and maybe even my corp. Of course, I will have to compete against other traders who are looking to do the same thing and undercut me. From the looks of it, there will be three kinds of PvP. Pub match PvP, ninja salvage PvP, and market PvP all on day one if CCP does it right. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8818	Posted - 2014.06.28 22:20:00 - [32] - Quote Roger Cordill wrote: Where's the said pics? Look back a couple of pages. Page 14 actually. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8818	Posted - 2014.06.28 22:22:00 - [33] - Quote True Adamance wrote: I'm sorry to ask CCP Wolfman but why in Gods name do you have a Harvester Model and not an Amarr HAV model? I don't think the Amarr would appreciate seeing their 'cleansing machine' being relegated to salvaging duties. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8830	Posted - 2014.07.02 05:10:00 - [34] - Quote Garth Mandra wrote: What about retaliation? Someone shoots at me and becomes a threat, if I shoot back do I get marked too? That is a good question. Also, what about if I die as a result of the criminal's action against me. Do I get a kill right like how Eve Online players get when they lose a ship? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8830	Posted - 2014.07.02 05:13:00 - [35] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: Ok I want to go back to a topic weGÇÖve already chatted about a bit and share our current thinking on what weGÇÖre calling GÇÿsuspicion ratingGÇÖ in Salvage. A playerGÇÖs suspicion rating helps other players identify him as a possible threat, particularly PKGÇÖers. It is a reactive system used to rate and grade player behavior rather than a proactive system. This is to allow for an exciting degree of uncertainty over the motives of other players who are still GÇ£neutralGÇ¥. There are four suspicion states that define the color of a playerGÇÖs tags: Neutral GÇô white Neutral Marked GÇô white/black (half white and half black) Suspect GÇô yellow Threat GÇô red All players start in the neutral state. If a player deals x damage to the same target within y seconds his/her rating becomes suspect. If a player kills another player his/her rating immediately becomes threat. A player in the neutral marked state has killed another player in the current session but has since returned to neutral. Neutral marked is functionally equivalent to neutral, but serves to indicate that the player has a history of violence. A playerGÇÖs suspicion rating is not reset at death. If a player has not damaged or killed another player for x seconds his/her state will degrade to the next lowest state (i.e. a player at GÇ£threatGÇ¥ will move to GÇ£suspectGÇ¥ and a player in GÇ£suspectGÇ¥ will move to GÇ£neutralGÇ¥). There should be two separate timers for threat-->suspect (default: 180 seconds) and suspect-->neutral marked (default: 90 seconds). We wanted to begin with a very simple system that could then be iterated on through play. We will be trying out a first version of this soon which only has neutral and threat. I would love to hear your thoughts Looks pretty solid to me. But I like to make a suggestion. Give us the ability to manually change the colors of the flags. Some people here are color blind and won't be able to tell apart a red from a blue. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8830	Posted - 2014.07.02 05:27:00 - [36] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Garth Mandra wrote: What about retaliation? Someone shoots at me and becomes a threat, if I shoot back do I get marked too? That is a good question. Also, what about if I die as a result of the criminal's action against me. Do I get a kill right like how Eve Online players get when they lose a ship? This is already a big problem in Dust's FW, you have a friendly fire on you but you cannot return fire without risking getting banned as well. If another player engages you first, you should be allowed to retaliate without becoming suspect or threat yourself. Exactly. That's the beef I have right now with DUST's FW system. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8830	Posted - 2014.07.02 06:26:00 - [37] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Garth Mandra wrote: What about retaliation? Someone shoots at me and becomes a threat, if I shoot back do I get marked too? Perhaps Legion needs the 'limited engagement' concept from Eve, as well. Personally, this whole area of game mechanics is a solved puzzle, so just lift it wholesale from Eve so you can move onto actual problem. That would be great except for one major problem. Eve Online uses point-to-point mechanics. This means that it's almost (if not completely) impossible to accidentally shoot a friendly. Key word being accidental. You have to really be going out of your way to betray someone in that game. Legion on the other hand is NOT a point-to-point game. This means you will accidentally shoot a friendly far more often than you realize. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8832	Posted - 2014.07.02 18:16:00 - [38] - Quote Regis Blackbird wrote: I thought of another one. Will the timers reset upon going back to merc quaters, including the neutral-marked status? If so, it would be a problem if it takes less time than 270 seconds to redeploy. (Not that I'm asking for longer deploy times ) It would be cool if there was some penalty of disconnecting / returning to merc quarters while having "threat" status (like EVE). For example, if you going for the concept of only deploying with a limited number of clones, all of those are lost if you choose to leave while "red flagged". The thing with Eve Online, and this is a good "thing" that Eve has, is that it has a "LOG OFF TIMER" after a player has been involved in a recent aggression. The LOG OFF TIMER lasts about 5 minutes if the aggression involved only an NPC or a suspect act while it increases to 15 minutes if the aggression involved direct PvP with another player. If the player logs off or disconnects during this timer, the ship and its pod will warp out to a safe spot BUT WON'T DISAPPEAR from the system until the timer has worn off EVEN IF the player controlling the ship is no longer connected to it. And since the ship and pod won't cloak, the opponent can still chase him down if he happens to have combat scanners or has a buddy that carries combat scanners so long as the opponent can find him in the allotted time provided by the LOG OFF TIMER. This system didn't exist until the latter half of Eve Online's existence. It was implemented to address the annoying LOGOFFSKI tactic that risk-adversed players would resort to when they realize that a combat situation is not going their way. This system should be implemented into Legion as well. But considering that Legion is a FPS game, the timers will need to be adjusted to better suit the genre and gameplay for the sake of balance. Also, since Legion is a FPS game, mercs would obviously NOT be able to warp off to a safe spot if they disconnect. Their clone will just sit there until it is destroyed. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8836	Posted - 2014.07.03 20:28:00 - [39] - Quote @CCP Wolfman Have you considered the Safety System that Eve Online has? How would you suggest it would work if implemented for Legion? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8863	Posted - 2014.07.12 23:22:00 - [40] - Quote steadyhand amarr wrote: i vote a deployable LOS you can call down or set up as your bank location, so you dont want it right next to the site so you dont get camped but also not to far away that it takes ages to walk to it, im very much for players have as much control over these sorts of things to prevent other players gameing the system This sounds doable especially since CCP released mobile units in Eve Online such as the Mobile Siphon Units, Mobile Depots, and Mobile Tractor Units. Source: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Personal_Deployable_Structures However, there is a disclaimer in Eve regarding these mobile units. Quote: Warning: It's worth remembering that if a Mobile Depot is attacked in a high sec system, the attacker will NOT be punished by Concord! He will only receive a suspect flag On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.

Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8869	Posted - 2014.07.15 03:23:00 - [41] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: So if we added the ability to drift how would like to control it with MKB? I would put it like this assuming you are going straight down. Mouse: Looking around. Has no bearing on which direction you actually fall but it should spring back to center after a moment of not looking around. Keyboard (W & S keys): Drift forward or back during fall at a rate of approximately 1-2 meters for every 10 meters you fall depending on suit type. The heavier the suit, the less you're able to drift due to mass. Keyboard (A & D keys): Drift left or right during fall at same rate as described above. Keyboard (Q & E keys): Rotate left or right during fall. Rate of turn determined by suit type. Alternative: Mouse could be used to rotate left or right during fall. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8925	Posted - 2014.07.28 02:29:00 - [42] - Quote Hawkings Greenback wrote: Any feedback on how the testing went for "sky spawning" and drifting ? How did it look and feel ? I like to know as well. Preferably with a video. Pwetty Pwease with a Chewwy on Top? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8938	Posted - 2014.07.31 18:43:00 - [43] - Quote Vrain Matari wrote: steadyhand amarr wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Testing has gone pretty well. WeGÇÖve added in the drift mechanics and weGÇÖve also created GÇÿorbital drop uplinksGÇÖ so you can make more targeted drops. We did in fact have a playtest yesterday and they do really mix things up. Unlike drop uplinks you donGÇÖt have to put them where you want to spawn. You can put them a way off and then drift to your intended target. This was really exciting for assaulting objectives because you could drop a strike team right on top of them. It made things feel a lot more dynamic as well as just making you feel like a badass! Any chance we can see video or somthing to back this up? Legion has every chance to be awsome but i kinda feel i need to see it before a believe it. This is my poor bait attempt at seeing footage :-P Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: Testing has gone pretty well. WeGÇÖve added in the drift mechanics and weGÇÖve also created GÇÿorbital drop uplinksGÇÖ so you can make more targeted drops. We did in fact have a playtest yesterday and they do really mix things up. Unlike drop uplinks you donGÇÖt have to put them where you want to spawn. You can put them a way off and then drift to your intended target. This was really exciting for assaulting objectives because you could drop a strike team right on top of them. It made things feel a lot more dynamic as well as just making you feel like a badass! Can we have a video? Please? Pretty pretty pretty please with honeyed lamb on top? I'll cut my wrists for all powerful Wolfman - I'll carve your name in my flesh JUST GIVE US A VIDEO PLEASE I NEED MY FIX MAN Imo these are fair requests, reason being that the real question about Legion isn't graphics or game design features, but the basic fps movement, control and environment interaction mechanics. This is the area where CCP failed hardest, basically defeated by the technical difficulties of producing a shooter, let alone one that handles well enough to be a positive and enjoyable experience. This is what everybody in the industry is waiting to see. Failure here killed DUST and will kill Legion. Let's take a peek at the foundations before we spend another handful of years building a house on sand that ends up wasting everyboy's time when it comes down. I know that sounds harsh, but it is entirely reasonable given where we've been and are, again, today. Excellent point. The problem with CCP just posting descriptions of what they did and never showing footage before releasing the updates is that what they say often sounded different from what was actually seen. Let me give you an example: When CCP made an announcement long ago about introducing Commando suits in Dust, the way they were describing the suits during the blogs and interviews made it seem as if you could dual-wield with these suits. But that wasn't the case. CCP meant that you can carry two light weapons but you just couldn't dual-wield with them like you see in games like Halo. It's just that CCP has a poor way of wording things. This is just one of many examples. Therefore a video will help greatly in alleviating any confusion. In fact, CCP MC Peanut once posted a video on YouTube showing the changes made to the HUD. Sadly it was taken down from YouTube for some reason but it helped the community better understand the changes that were expected to come with Legion and further allowed players to properly critique the changes and thus everyone loves CCP MC Peanut for that. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 9026	Posted - 2014.08.11 01:46:00 - [44] - Quote Azri Sarum wrote: New players Are dropped in from orbit in small craft. These craft are compact, carrying the limited number of clones and equipment you choose to bring. The fee for deploying to salvage is really just the cost for this pod. Upon hitting atmo you steer the craft towards your landing zone of choice, using the drop + drift mechanic already being worked on. After landing the pod acts as your personal CRU. Your objective is to salvage what you can, and get it back to your pod. When you are ready to go the pod ditches any extra clones you have (making room for your salvage), you load up and it returns you to orbit. I have to disagree with that last bit there. I don't like it. Generally if you're going in with a pod that doubles as a CRU for the sole purpose of salvaging goods, then the pod would already be fitted to account for that. It's not logical to have the game automatically dump your current payload just for the salvage. I suggest making it only as an option for the player to decide whether or not he/she would want to dump the remainder of the clone pack just for extra room. If a player only has about 100m^3 of cargo space in his pod and his salvage takes up 150m^3, then he will have to make a choice. Dump some clones for the extra 50m^3 or dump 50m^3 worth of salvage in order to fit it into the pod. Choices are important. Alternatively, the single player would invest ahead of time on a pod that has larger capacity with the same amount of clones if he can afford it. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.

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