DUST Search - Benefits of the PC.

Spademan wrote:

Maken Tosch wrote:

1. You are correct that Sony can ensure quality patches but then again even Sony couldn't stop a bad patch from going through as all of us bear witness to that fact in the previous Dust builds not to mention the delays caused by the Sony QA process for critical bug fixes. Without Sony, this leaves the burden of quality assurance squarely on CCP. But on the plus side, CCP can deploy critical patches much faster without having to deal with the red tape. There is always a trade off.

2. I guess you can forgot about what I said here now that we recently learned UE3 is still being used for Legion.

3. It's possible.

5. I guess you have a point there.

6. Porting is an option if we ever see a PS4 version sometime down the road, but how much company resources does that take to accomplish compared to sticking to the PC? That part I don't know.

The PC's principle benefit over the console is its hardware, no doubt. But as I pointed out before, there might come a time that the consoles will finally match the PC in architecture, power, and flexibility. I have my doubts about the PS4 even with today's advancements in technology, but there is a likelihood now that the next gen console after that might actually finally compete with PCs for once. Who knows?

Let's also not forget that there are new competitors forming such as the Steam Box, Ouya, and others. The Steam Box is of particular interest to me and who knows what Google, Apple, and other tech giants will bring to the market if any of them ever decide to join in on the console market.

Quicker patches would be nice, I just hope CCP has good quality control.

On the last section, I just would like to ask, what do you find interesting about the Steambox?
Don't mean much by it, just curiosity is all.


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Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8317	Posted - 2014.05.04 20:34:00 - [1] - Quote For the record, before anyone here accuses me of being a PC-Master-Race Elitist, I want you to know that I am indifferent to either the console nor the PC. To me, both of them are just computers with one being more flexible (PC) than the other and one being more specialized (console) than the other. Therefore I am NOT a PC elitist and I also have a Wii, PS3, and an X360. I have played a lot of console games including every known Halo game with the exception of Halo 5. Hell, I even remember the days of the Sega Genesis and Dreamcast as well the NES and N64. As for my gaming rig, it's a 7-year-old desktop that can handle Eve Online, Microsoft Flight Simulator, X-Plane, Flight Sim Flight Gear, Half Life 2, Track Nation, and World of Tanks and so far it gave me little in the way of problems other than a failed HDD and a graphics card replacement (which was actually a downgrade in my case). Now that that's out of the way I also want to point out that this is in no way, shape, or form an attempt to belittle the console users. I already feel your pain as I am a console user a well and I also felt bummed out by the initial announcement by CCP at fanfest. What I am about to say is not meant to be a troll nor a means of starting a heated debate. I'll just be telling it like it is. The PC (at least currently) is the only platform that is capable of delivering what CCP was hoping to achieve with Dust. I once thought that maybe the PS3 can achieve this as well but then I said "why am I kidding myself?" Maybe MAG was close to achieving it but even then MAG got shut down as it was too costly to handle and I heard rumors that MAG was suffering many problems long before it was shut down (though I can't confirm that rumor). Many had hoped that Dust will pick up where MAG left off. Well, it seems Dust will pick up where MAG left off, but not on the PS3. MAG's legacy will continue through Dust/Legion on the PC instead. In a way, this is actually a good thing for the MAG legacy and the Dust legacy. Here are some things that the PC offers that you won't get on the PS3 or even the PS4 (maybe the PS5 or PS6, I don't know). ================ 1. CCP no longer needs to rely on a third party to approve any patches or updates and thus cuts out the middleman and expenses. This makes it easier to deliver more complex patches and updates much sooner and on the fly. 2. A chance to use a much better game engine than UE3 since a PC doesn't have any of the hardware restrictions that a console has. This could mean greater compatibility between Dust/Legion, Valkyrie, and Eve Online. In other words, CCP can use its own proprietary game engine in place of the UE3 engine. 3. Allows greater unification between all three games especially with the possibility of one day unifying accounts across all three games especially. Link: http://themittani.com/news/fanfest-2014-ccp-presents Read the topic "HALLDOR FANNAR AND NEW TECHNOLOGY". 4. Direct access to the Singularity Test server in addition to direct access to the Tranquility Live server without having to rely on regional servers. The danger of bricking the PC after connecting to the test server is noticeably less since it can handle unoptimized code better than a console can because a console is primarily meant to play finished, optimized games like CoD, Metal Gear, etc. And as we all saw back in Closed Beta when Dust was once connected to the Singularity Test server, many PS3 got turned into bricks due to the server's unoptimized and unstable nature. Eve Online players on the other hand suffered little to no bricking of their desktops with the exception of what happened in 2011. 5. This makes it easier for CCP to hunt down and track any hackers and cheaters since the game will be more unified with the server and thus the server will see more of what's going on. If CCP can track RMT bot users in Eve, they should have no problem tracking cheaters in Legion. 6. No need to create a new game every time a next-generation console comes out due to the much longer future proofing ability of the PC. Again, this is not meant to belittle console users. I am just telling you the benefits that PCs have over consoles at the moment. The PS4 does look promising in terms of almost catching up with the PC, but even that has its limits for a $400 platform. If or when the the console finally does catch up with the PC, then perhaps the entire Eve Universe can finally come back to the console as I would like it to be. But until then, the PC just happens to be the better option. http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/news/a568488/dust-514-sees-no-planned-updates-scraps-survival-mode-and-vita-app.html#
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8334	Posted - 2014.05.05 07:01:00 - [2] - Quote Bump http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/news/a568488/dust-514-sees-no-planned-updates-scraps-survival-mode-and-vita-app.html#
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8335	Posted - 2014.05.05 07:24:00 - [3] - Quote Quote: 4) Is just utter garabage. One the one hand you said that consoles are just specialized PCS, now they are magical boxes that don't do so well with bad code, were as PCs do just fine with it. News flash, bad code is bad code. CCP burned quite a few motherboards and deleted quite a few boot.inis before on PC. 5) LOL, you really think it will be harder to hack on a PC?? How do you expect anyone to take you seriously when you state something like this. CCP is always 5 steps behind RMT guys, and they only catch the most obvious ones. Just don't use one of the three mining bots avaible on pirate bay and you will be fine. 4. You are right that bad code is bad code. What I'm saying is that a console is just not the right platform to connect with the Test server. I know because I was there when the PS3 was connected to Singularity. It was not pretty and PS3 were bricking at a higher rate back then compared to now. The PC just happens to have more wiggle room which is why PC suffers less than a console. And yes, I do know about the melted graphics cards of 2011 and the boot.ini. 5. You misunderstood what I said. I never said it was going to be harder to hack a PC. Don't put words on my mouth. I said it will be easier to trace hacks via better unification with the server. Hacks will happens eventually. Again, look at CCP's track record when it came to dealing with illegal RMT bot operations in Eve Online. http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/news/a568488/dust-514-sees-no-planned-updates-scraps-survival-mode-and-vita-app.html#
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8335	Posted - 2014.05.05 07:29:00 - [4] - Quote Mary Lilac wrote: 2)I believe they said that they are using UE4. Doesn't matter, just like how you shouldn't build a house on a crap foundation, you shouldn't build a game on crap codebase. Guess what the codebase for dust is? Regardless, it's better than the UE3 that Dust is using right now. http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/news/a568488/dust-514-sees-no-planned-updates-scraps-survival-mode-and-vita-app.html#
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8335	Posted - 2014.05.05 07:32:00 - [5] - Quote Regardless, it doesn't matter what you and I think at this point. The PS3 is living on borrowed time and we all knew from the beginning that Dust was going to be on the PC eventually. http://www.digitalspy.com/gaming/news/a568488/dust-514-sees-no-planned-updates-scraps-survival-mode-and-vita-app.html#
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8493	Posted - 2014.05.11 01:13:00 - [6] - Quote Spademan wrote: 1) I've never really understood how this is a good thing. Genuinely, I don't understand how not having to go through a process to ensure a patch doesn't break the platform it's playing is anything but bad. (I seem to recall an EVE patch some time ago that would prevent a computers ability to boot up) 2) You have a point, but then again they're using the UE3 again, so that's a non-issue. And the logical engine switch would've been UE4, which would've been fine for console. 3) Wouldn't it still be theoretically possible to have one account for all so long as they had a log in not tied to PSN (Like EA Origin, it's a different login) 4) This does have merit. (though one my suggest making a stable server) 5) I don't believe hackers are an issue on consoles (Or at least much less, so it'd balance out) 6) Porting Not saying the PC doesn't have benefits, I'm just not sure you really caught them, bar maybe the test server. 1. You are correct that Sony can ensure quality patches but then again even Sony couldn't stop a bad patch from going through as all of us bear witness to that fact in the previous Dust builds not to mention the delays caused by the Sony QA process for critical bug fixes. Without Sony, this leaves the burden of quality assurance squarely on CCP. But on the plus side, CCP can deploy critical patches much faster without having to deal with the red tape. There is always a trade off. 2. I guess you can forgot about what I said here now that we recently learned UE3 is still being used for Legion. 3. It's possible. 5. I guess you have a point there. 6. Porting is an option if we ever see a PS4 version sometime down the road, but how much company resources does that take to accomplish compared to sticking to the PC? That part I don't know. The PC's principle benefit over the console is its hardware, no doubt. But as I pointed out before, there might come a time that the consoles will finally match the PC in architecture, power, and flexibility. I have my doubts about the PS4 even with today's advancements in technology, but there is a likelihood now that the next gen console after that might actually finally compete with PCs for once. Who knows? Let's also not forget that there are new competitors forming such as the Steam Box, Ouya, and others. The Steam Box is of particular interest to me and who knows what Google, Apple, and other tech giants will bring to the market if any of them ever decide to join in on the console market. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8497	Posted - 2014.05.11 04:15:00 - [7] - Quote Glyd Path wrote: So why bring this up here in Dust514 General forums? Bring it up in a proper place. Surely there is a Legion forum by now or in the sandbox/footwell/crab box or whatever there is here from something that is not Dust. This was before CCP implemented the new legion forum so at the time the practical place to post was in the DUST general discussion. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8499	Posted - 2014.05.11 20:43:00 - [8] - Quote Spademan wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: 1. You are correct that Sony can ensure quality patches but then again even Sony couldn't stop a bad patch from going through as all of us bear witness to that fact in the previous Dust builds not to mention the delays caused by the Sony QA process for critical bug fixes. Without Sony, this leaves the burden of quality assurance squarely on CCP. But on the plus side, CCP can deploy critical patches much faster without having to deal with the red tape. There is always a trade off. 2. I guess you can forgot about what I said here now that we recently learned UE3 is still being used for Legion. 3. It's possible. 5. I guess you have a point there. 6. Porting is an option if we ever see a PS4 version sometime down the road, but how much company resources does that take to accomplish compared to sticking to the PC? That part I don't know. The PC's principle benefit over the console is its hardware, no doubt. But as I pointed out before, there might come a time that the consoles will finally match the PC in architecture, power, and flexibility. I have my doubts about the PS4 even with today's advancements in technology, but there is a likelihood now that the next gen console after that might actually finally compete with PCs for once. Who knows? Let's also not forget that there are new competitors forming such as the Steam Box, Ouya, and others. The Steam Box is of particular interest to me and who knows what Google, Apple, and other tech giants will bring to the market if any of them ever decide to join in on the console market. Quicker patches would be nice, I just hope CCP has good quality control. On the last section, I just would like to ask, what do you find interesting about the Steambox? Don't mean much by it, just curiosity is all. It's new. It's not an Xbox, not a PS, and not a Wii. From what I heard it's also Linux based. Then there are the reports of certain CCP personnel receiving a couple of Steam Boxes for some reason. http://dustsearch.com/thread/133420/page/all On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8501	Posted - 2014.05.11 21:09:00 - [9] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: sorry OP but I don't feel like reading that text wall anyway consoles are necessary if you like any of the first-party games or third-party ones that aren't on PC. unfortunately consoles are a major source, if not THE major source of income for Sony and the like, so this probably won't be changing anytime soon. and the cell phone app games "taking over" just means there'll be more pressure to make handheld consoles, possibly something like a Game Boy with cellular service What do you think of the Steam Box, though? Do you think this is what the console players have been looking for in regards to finally matching up the power of the console with the PCs? On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8505	Posted - 2014.05.12 00:55:00 - [10] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: sorry OP but I don't feel like reading that text wall anyway consoles are necessary if you like any of the first-party games or third-party ones that aren't on PC. unfortunately consoles are a major source, if not THE major source of income for Sony and the like, so this probably won't be changing anytime soon. and the cell phone app games "taking over" just means there'll be more pressure to make handheld consoles, possibly something like a Game Boy with cellular service What do you think of the Steam Box, though? Do you think this is what the console players have been looking for in regards to finally matching up the power of the console with the PCs? http://www.ign.com/wikis/steam/Steam_Machine Looks OK. Like I said though, it's the console-exclusive franchises that mostly draw people to them. If Steam can make it appealing then more power to them. But I haven't really tried Steam because it looks on the surface to be a bunch of decent indie games and ports of games that are already on PSN and Xbox live. I was gonna try Steam to play this game called Rust, but I decided not to. I don't know man, I mean if I had the time to play a ton of games I would but I've found myself lately just sticking to one game until I move onto the next one. I see. No problem. I have a could of friends that usually stick to one game until they finish it. One of them is actually slowly crossing over from the console side to the PC side mainly because of how the console gaming industry has either put him off or that he doesn't find console games that appealing anymore. One of the things that are starting to put ME off is the fact that some games seem to force you to have to get a certain console to use it. Gran Turismo for the PS only, Halo for the Xbox only, Legend of Zelda on the Wii only, etc. If I wanted to try all three, I will have to buy all three consoles. Of course the benefit is that I finally get to try literally every game out there since I really do have all three consoles, but it still irks me to have to make this much of an investment to have fun. I always wonder when will come the day when all I need is just one console and still be able to try all games from other consoles at the same time. I get the feeling I will be living in a retirement home eating jello and playing bingo by the time that happens. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.

Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8515	Posted - 2014.05.12 17:58:00 - [11] - Quote @Buster Well, companies like Nintendo for example have offered Wii users a chance to download arcade games and such like Sonic The Hedgehog (the one from the Sega Genesis era), Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time (N64), etc. on the Wii so I don't have to invest on those weeeeeeeee ooooooold consoles of Yesteryear just to try out a game I feel nostalgic about. Xbox is offering Gold Members monthly offers of Free games like Halo 3, Gears of War, Crackdown, etc. I don't know about Sony. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8516	Posted - 2014.05.12 18:04:00 - [12] - Quote Buster Friently wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: @Buster Well, companies like Nintendo for example have offered Wii users a chance to download arcade games and such like Sonic The Hedgehog (the one from the Sega Genesis era), Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time (N64), etc. on the Wii so I don't have to invest on those weeeeeeeee ooooooold consoles of Yesteryear just to try out a game I feel nostalgic about. Xbox is offering Gold Members monthly offers of Free games like Halo 3, Gears of War, Crackdown, etc. I don't know about Sony. This only covers a small fraction of the missing titles though. True. I doubt anyone would be stupid enough to bring back ET from the Atari. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.