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D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1857
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Posted - 2014.04.15 17:09:00 -
[1] - Quote
say that to the inviso-scouts. scouts are positional masters. since scouts have lower profiles and speed. and any races scout can do this. so, no. minmatar ARENOT the masters of position. when you compair them to the same suits of the same teir, their speed is marginal at best. however, since assault suits and heavies are desinged to brawl, their is an issue. the speed is nice, but not enough to give a significant advantage.
scouts = speed
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D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1857
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:42:00 -
[2] - Quote
Atiim wrote:As I've said a few moments ago, the only problems with Minmatar suits is the fact that speed tanking is negated by the sprinting glitch and snare effects (which just about everyone agrees is a problem), and the fact that it has a lower shield regen rate than the Caldari, while claiming to be the hit-and-run race.
Fix these issues, and you'll see vast, non-gamebreaking improvements.
This exactly. Little more speed and better recovery stats. This is not gamebreaking, and its not alot to ask.
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D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1857
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Posted - 2014.04.15 18:46:00 -
[3] - Quote
Joseph Ridgeson wrote:Couldn't you play another racial dropsuit the same way and be nearly as effective? You are talking about a style of play that is not really exclusive to the Minmatar, namely flank and sneak attack. I am not Minmatar and I play flanky when not in a vehicle.
^^this.
If it requiera greater skill to play minmatar as the op said. then playing another race will make you all the more effective.
Essentially the op is saying to play minmatar you have to just better than the enemy. But Isnt that a generic goal by default of any race?
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D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1857
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:00:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:D legendary hero wrote:say that to the inviso-scouts. scouts are positional masters. since scouts have lower profiles and speed. and any races scout can do this. so, no. minmatar ARENOT the masters of position. when you compair them to the same suits of the same teir, their speed is marginal at best. however, since assault suits and heavies are desinged to brawl, their is an issue. the speed is nice, but not enough to give a significant advantage.
scouts = speed
not all assaults and heavys are designed to brawl... only amaar and gallente are. caldari is perimiter control, they excel at creating, maintaining and advancing a battle line through range and use of cover to regen shields. sure you have sort of a point, scouts of any race are great at positional advantage, but minmatar as an entire race is. meaning only minmatar have a positional advantage logi, only minmatar have a positional advantage assault, only minmatar have all those other boxes checked in ADDITION to scout. in order to get the same speed advantage as minmatar you have to give up your suits other advantages, and even then it will lose out. that "marginal at best" advantage gives me a minmatar assault that runs at 8.77m/s while a caldari suit cant get that high or higher without giving up its advantages, making it worse if it trys to acomplish the same thing. i can tell that your one of those types that trys to brawl with minmatar suits... and that completly and tottaly explains your opinion. as someone who hates the brawling playstyle and prefers something a little more unorthadox there is no suit that performs better then minmatar. If speed isnt giving you enough of an advantage, your simply not using your speed correctly. i ******* outrun scouts.
Have you noticed that the description on allsentinels are the same?
I have been advancing increasing the reatorative abilities of minmatar to aid them in hit and run. They cnt really do this.
Again, you must understand that movement apeed and run apeed are not the same thing. Movement soeed atays the same regardless of how many kincats you have. Right now minmatar have a movement speed that is .3 m/s higher than Valente and caldari. The fastest thing in this game are bullets and with low ehp, loa recovery and margonal speed you cannot win engagements.
You are correct that positioning and timing play key roles in taking out enemies. However these are tactics. Your op simply reenforced that to play minmatar you kust be a better player than your opponenta. But, if you have to be better than them to Qin youbwould be more effective in a caldari or galente suit.
As far as the suits and their design goes we both know what scouts, assaults, and heavies are designed for. They Each have inique qualities.
Ir heavies
Galente rep and tank.
Amar tank
Caldari shield recharge and have long range weaponry.
Lorewise minmatar are supposed to be close range fighters (Valente are close range too). The minmatar sentinel is not fast ebough to keep up with m+Źdium frames, nor does it have high regen. So what does it do?
What positioning is a heavy doing against a faster m+Źdium frame? Especailly with poor passives?
Comparing suits you can See the inequality.
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D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1858
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
Ghosts Chance wrote:Monkey MAC wrote:By definition of the suit you just gave I would call it a brawler (personally), but you are right the Minmatar suits and respective weaponry is all about the controllig the engagement. If a Minmatar is engaging you chances are your already dead, you just don't know it yet.
However that's not to say the Minnie suits couldn't do wih a facelift. We need a better slot layout, 4/4 would be perfect, also a buff to either shield regen or regulation would be nice, especially since they gave BOTH to caldari if anything regen is the more minmatar of the two as minmatar is more capable of stalling for time to wait out the delay wheras caldari is more focused on that permiter and holding ground by using cover and never letting thier shields drop using cover to wait out the 2-3 seconds to regain shields then popping out from cover to shoot again keeping constant pressure on. you can make a minmatar suit have some really good regen however in that 5th high slot (assault) to compensate without losing out too much (costs you a low slot for cpu mod in the worse case) i really really like the minmatar suit how it is, and any changes are more likely to make it at caldari clone and worse at what its currently good at. the problem we face right now isnt with the suit, its with the current tactics and metagame or rather the lack of tactics and metagame. this causes people to use all suits in roughly the same ways becuase EHP and zerg tactics are the simplest easyest to understand and easyest to use stratagies.
Player skill and suit design are teo different things.
If you are simply better than another player you can win with almost anything. But if they have relatively decent skill compared to yours and a better suit you May lose alot of engagements.
Speed balances with stamina.
Ehp balances with regen.
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D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1858
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Posted - 2014.04.15 19:25:00 -
[6] - Quote
Korvin Lomont wrote:Ghosts Chance wrote:Minmatar are KINGS of positional advantage.
i chose where i fight
i chose when i fight
i chose where your standing
i chose where im standing
i choose to shoot you in the back and run when you turn around, only to start shooting you in the back again from a different direction. If i sence the fight is going bad, i ******* run for it. If you are farming my blues... i farm you farming my blues.
Minmatar are the best suit for controlling an engaement, from positions to flanks, to manuvering to disengageing a bad fight minmatar control it all.
As minmatar if you end up in a bad fight its because you screwed up not because the suit underperformed. It has a very high skill cap mostly due to its lower EHP and the fact that its proper use relies heavily on the tactical planning of the user.
"But anything minmatar can do X can do better!"
nope, that speed and now that staminma regeneration is absolutly KEY to positional advantage, maintaining .5-1.5m/s advantage over an oposing force is HUGE. other suits have to expend alot of their suits other resources to compair and at that point they lose all the other advantages their native suit brings to the table in exchange, leaving minmatar with the advantage still.
Positional advantage is a complicated mistriss with a REALLY high margin of error, its no easy mode but when you start using it to your advantage you start to figure out that only minmatar can truly live up to your standards.
dont get into a stand up firefight, lose and then call minmatar underpowered... its not the suit its you. you picked a bad fight, you stayed to long, you commited to soon, you screwed it up. Minmatar suits (assault especially) rely on your ability to manuver and position yourself relative to your oponents, they excel in gaining and maintaining positional advantage and losing a fight in the suit is usually becuase you picked a bad position, failed to move where or when you should have, or alowed yourself to get outflanked and overrun. all of wich arnt the suits fault... its yours.
Its not a brawling suit, dont treat it like one and you wont be disapointed.
Yeah I know how powerfull these suits are but the majority here thinks evrything should play the same with tons of HP etc.  No creativity in playstyles...so they start whining that suit x has noot 1000hp and is UP because of that...
the problem is that other suits have 10000eho and can stil do my job better.
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