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Free Beers
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Posted - 2014.04.14 15:33:00 -
[1] - Quote
so turn pc back into an isk sink? Sorry man, i have lost money on half the pc matches i played in (we won them too) but my 250k suits or ADS will run me 2-3-4 mill and I hate to think what tankers make.
Lastly, if you take away the isk what you have is a bunch of players with tons of isk and no chance for newer groups (or vets coming back like WTF did) to compete.
lets face it PC 1.0 is trash and ccp foxfour should feel bad. You're on CPM tell ccp to get this **** **** design out of the game.
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
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Posted - 2014.04.14 15:44:00 -
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HowDidThatTaste wrote:While this is an interesting concept, let play it out a few months.
1 st question after you take a district could you sell the clones off it and abandon the district?
It would seem to encourage more corps to just no show battles why put the effort into holding it if you know you might loose.
Only fight against corps you know you could beat and not take on the tougher corps, would kinda be like the corp battles of old
Many many no shows and people ducking fights.
Taste I advocated for passive is to be gone months ago until i realized it doesn't make the game better it just punishes corps and players. I tried many of time to come up with different ways to make it better but gave up. PC 1.0 is a piece of **** and needs to go.
What you said is right if you cant win or could lose why fight you just lose isk. So we go back to grinding isk in pubs to fight in PC like we did back in open beta remember?
Sorry kane the idea is dead and you need to let it go. You dont have to save ccp from themselves because they designed a ******* **** game mode not you.
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
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Posted - 2014.04.14 16:07:00 -
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ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:as it stands pc generated isk is going to die anyway once eve pilots are able to claim the land and start paying us to take it for them. i think its best to get that ball rolling now so when it does happen we dont have a huge change and a lot of rage.
what ccp needs to do is take all of M.H districts back and create a contract system with actual isk rewards in it for a win.
it should be made by dummy corps until eve players can take over and the contracts put at different values so mercs can choose which ones to fight. obviously different sides of the contracts would be different values so as to get players fighting for the best ones.
this needs to be done as it will bring a bit off balance and put all of the reward in the battles won and not in the passive isk gained.
give us a new stats on the leaderboard for contracts won and loss
when eve pilots finally put contracts out for us they can see who is the better bet for them
Adam thats to many assumptions CCP has only said the idea of PC 2.0 is completely different than the existing design, but thats all (per ccp lockingbro)
I have always advocated for mercs working for and with eve groups to do good stuff in new eden. Kane it just trying to find something to improve pc 1.0 till pc 2.0 comes. To me him trying to improve pc no means there is no pc 2.0 coming anytime soon.
Still no passive isk is worse than passive isk. We had that in open beta and you had to grind pub isk to play in PC. Most poeple just burnt out and stopped
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
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Posted - 2014.04.14 16:12:00 -
[4] - Quote
Leonid Tybalt wrote:Kain Spero wrote:The only issue is you only collect the payment when you win your fights and if you can't win your fights you end up with nothing. It's funny how the figurehead of the most notorious district locking group in Molden Heath starts talking about having to "fight" for your land. 
You do realize that kane runs ERA right? Not NS or AE or the other BIG corps at the time. The only corp that was actually attacking districts during the lock out? ERA history
You kids really believe whatever you make up in your head?
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
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Posted - 2014.04.14 16:20:00 -
[5] - Quote
ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:Free Beers wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:as it stands pc generated isk is going to die anyway once eve pilots are able to claim the land and start paying us to take it for them. i think its best to get that ball rolling now so when it does happen we dont have a huge change and a lot of rage.
what ccp needs to do is take all of M.H districts back and create a contract system with actual isk rewards in it for a win.
it should be made by dummy corps until eve players can take over and the contracts put at different values so mercs can choose which ones to fight. obviously different sides of the contracts would be different values so as to get players fighting for the best ones.
this needs to be done as it will bring a bit off balance and put all of the reward in the battles won and not in the passive isk gained.
give us a new stats on the leaderboard for contracts won and loss
when eve pilots finally put contracts out for us they can see who is the better bet for them Adam thats to many assumptions CCP has only said the idea of PC 2.0 is completely different than the existing design, but thats all (per ccp lockingbro) I have always advocated for mercs working for and with eve groups to do good stuff in new eden. Kane it just trying to find something to improve pc 1.0 till pc 2.0 comes. To me him trying to improve pc no means there is no pc 2.0 coming anytime soon. Still no passive isk is worse than passive isk. We had that in open beta and you had to grind pub isk to play in PC. Most poeple just burnt out and stopped oh ok.. simple then. pay mercs who win in clones. they generate clone packs to the owning corp. these clone packs should then be allowed to be traded with other mercs. this way no passive isk however isk already in game is being transferred about. no passive isk but supply of clones would generate income and also allow others to attack the suppliers. everyone wins.
CCP put in clones because there was an old rule that dust couldn't use any existing eve resources (dust can't negatively effect eve economy) with intention of dust of selling them to eve. It was terrible because what you fight with is your only income. So CCP built in fight OR make isk. I can't begin to tell you how many times i want to punch ccp foxfour (Not literally I love foxy its just a figure of speech MR Banhammer) It was just a terrible idea to begin with.
That said, I highly doubt there will be dust mercs selling clones going forward. The clone production and use for fighting works okay right now. CCP needs to come up with another way to bring isk into PC for mercs. Trying to do both with 1 thing is terrible idea.
/rant
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
Imperfects
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2303
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Posted - 2014.04.14 16:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
Ares 514 wrote:Kain Spero wrote:The Robot Devil wrote:Maybe for a while the reward should just be having your corp's name on the deed until something better is worked out. Let the ownership just be bragging rights or some other thing that doesn't discourage players from playing. I will think more about it but it is a very difficult situation. The potential problem I see is this change goes in and then we end up with no one wanting land. I'm not sure if prestige is enough. Well, we've had it pumping ISK out forever, I'd rather try the other side of the coin and see what happens.
We have had the other side of it in open beta when there was no isk from PC (you actually had to pay it). If only winning a match gives you isk its bad. Not to mention most isk rewards dont cover the cost of what you lost. Tankers would be screwed and so would ADS pilots. I fly ADS and use 250k suits in PC and have lost isk in 4 of the last 8 I played in.
My concern is the vast majority if people just want to punish the PC corps for farming and can't see that passive isk only thing going right now. The issue is not passive isk its economies of scale in which a small group of players can hold many districts. This is how players are becoming rich. I would rather this be addressed and leave the isk out of it for now.
Its hard to focus on whats really wrong with PC when the whole lot is a piece of ****.
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
Imperfects
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Posted - 2014.04.14 16:53:00 -
[7] - Quote
Outlaw OneZero wrote:How about remove clone costs from the equation completely?
Attack contract costs 16 Million. This money goes into the payout pool. Defender wins, every merc gets 1 mil + 25% value of all equipment destroyed in match. Attacker wins, they get their money back + 25% value. No show results in automatic win for defender.
Defending your land earns you money, successful attacks earn a small amount of money and put you closer to ownership.
Wouldn't work. The numbers are to low to make pc worth fighting. Plus attacking an winning has to be more valuable then not fighting at all. YOU have to have motivation to HOLD districts is where that breaks down.
A lot of these suggestions are trying to solve 1 small problem and not realizing the PC as a whole is quiet complex in nature.
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
Imperfects
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2309
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Posted - 2014.04.14 20:44:00 -
[8] - Quote
Outlaw OneZero wrote:Free Beers wrote:Outlaw OneZero wrote:How about remove clone costs from the equation completely?
Attack contract costs 16 Million. This money goes into the payout pool. Defender wins, every merc gets 1 mil + 25% value of all equipment destroyed in match. Attacker wins, they get their money back + 25% value. No show results in automatic win for defender.
Defending your land earns you money, successful attacks earn a small amount of money and put you closer to ownership. Wouldn't work. The numbers are to low to make pc worth fighting. Plus attacking an winning has to be more valuable then not fighting at all. YOU have to have motivation to HOLD districts is where that breaks down. A lot of these suggestions are trying to solve 1 small problem and not realizing the PC as a whole is quiet complex in nature. The overall concept still stands, now we are starting to argue about the details. So up the contract price to 32 Million, increase payout of destroyed equipment. A point can be found where it is cheap enough for most corps to work up an attack contract and the payout is high enough to reward a win on either side. It would be nice to see a dynamic that would lead to significant decisions about what equipment to field too. I personally would like to see successful attacks being nearly zero gain isk wise. Defending would be where you would make your money. But holding territory without any activity would be minimal or no gain.
You have missed the point outlaw. If attacking gives none but defending is where its at then what drives conflict? PC and the design that goes with it is very complex. Right now holding a district is worth the most so thats what people want to do. If you change it to defending then PC stays the same we have now.
Like i said before its economies of scale and the very very low player population to add to it. There are very few people that run PC these days( just like eve)
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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Free Beers
Imperfects
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Posted - 2014.04.15 15:29:00 -
[9] - Quote
lDocHollidayl wrote:Free Beers wrote:Leonid Tybalt wrote:Kain Spero wrote:The only issue is you only collect the payment when you win your fights and if you can't win your fights you end up with nothing. It's funny how the figurehead of the most notorious district locking group in Molden Heath starts talking about having to "fight" for your land. You do realize that kane runs ERA right? Not NS or AE or the other BIG corps at the time. The only corp that was actually attacking districts during the lock out? ERA historyYou kids really believe whatever you make up in your head? OH MY... eh the puppet is back. Every corp in PC abused locking save 1 or 2 that were slaughtered quickly...and AE who did it very last. Your strings were locking early and often.
When ERA started with 3 districts they were locked up tight back when it started back in january. The continued to lock their districts like everyone else. I dont see how that makes kane the leader of the most notorious district locking group in Molden Heath. Pretty sure NS and AE. had quite a few more districts that where locked under their belt and farmed a lot more isk than ERA. Which would make them a bit more notorious to me. Thats just me and everyone can have their opinion regardless how poor it is.
I just not a fan of hypocrites and tell it like it is Doc. You, my friend are just a bitter kane hater that is just seeing what he wants to see in my words.
Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
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