DUST Search - Are Heavies OP???

lithkul devant wrote:

LEHON Xeon wrote:

VonSpliff wrote:

LEHON Xeon wrote:

Megaman Trigger wrote:

HP wise, the Sentinel is just fine. They are, by design, supposed to be able to survive massive amounts of damage while dishing it out. The description for the suit even says they're the only Drop Suit that can reliably go head-to-head with a tank. No one but another Sentinel should be able to take a Sentinel head-on inside HMG range and be able to win. They don't need a nerf, they just need to be approached with different tactics in a firefight. Engage at range, outside of the HMG's effective range, or in groups, 2v1 or better if you can manage it.

There's one major flaw with that line of thought. In something like a domination match where the objective is in an installation like the Gallente facility, if you get 6-7 guys using sentinels with HMGs and a repper logi, absolutely no one is going to get in there ever. That is broken. Who wants to have matches like that of nothing but a back and forth bout of a bunch of heavies with HMGs or after 6 minutes some guy in a scout suit manages to get in, kills one or two but instantly gets mowed down only for them to respawn in the same location again?

Hmmm who wants to play matches with maxed tanks on both sides. But we do. Tactic tactics tactics. Proto hive and Nade spam is one way to mess with a swarm of heavies. Charged Scr for cover. Adapt or die. Dust 514

Well, tanks can't reach into all areas of buildings. They don't reach and camp underground passageways. In most maps, around an objective, tanks can be avoided somewhere. Like I said, it's real simple, all you have to do is have about 7-8 HMG sentinels, have them camp around the objective in the silo in the Gallente map and have a repper logi or two with triage hives and proto rep tool. 3-4 sentinels watch each side, and with the HMG range out to 40m, all ways in are easily covered.

Grenade spam? Yeah, still kind of effective provided you don't get gunned down immediately if you have to step out to throw.

I don't care really about skirmish matches overall. In there they can't all camp one location. However for domination, it causes a lot of problems based upon the map. Also under your logic I'll say the same thing for scouts that people claim are OP. Use tactics to take out the new scouts then also and "adapt or die" to them, like you said.

I have to disagree with you, while that is a powerful tactic and can indeed block most of it, 2 heavies with forge guns and a logi will punch right through that wall 1 shoting the heavies in front of them and can do it from far enough back. Say at around 40-50m. Another way to destroy the tactic is to use the laser rifle, I know you'd probably laugh at this, but when that sucker gets frying a heavies head they move out of the way damn fast and break rank.

Another tactic I have seen while it being suicidal is to get a scout, load him up with RE's and a cloak, when the heavies are reloading or distracted rush in throw all the RE's down as fast as possible, then even on the death screen just set off all the RE's, that line of Heavies is now dead and probably the logi that was repairing them too.

If even that fails, lure the heavies and enemy team out, by not going in and suiciding, or do a collection of WP using logis till you get an orbital and just blast the point, most the heavies and the logi will probably die, then rush in and clean up what is left.

The problem you are currently trying to portray is where the Sentinel is at the most optimal of what it is supposed to do, with a gun that is made to be heavy supression/able to kill a lot of idiots. A line defender, defending an objective, it would be like complaining that someone with a sniper rifle nailed you at 200 yards away and your RR could not hit them back as hard or fast. The best way to fight a Sentinel or a Sniper is make it where they are out of the comfort zone, where they have to take additional risk in order for getting a payout.(not bringing up the redline issue in this, that is a whole other issue)


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LEHON Xeon Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 423	Posted - 2014.04.12 15:19:00 - [1] - Quote Megaman Trigger wrote: HP wise, the Sentinel is just fine. They are, by design, supposed to be able to survive massive amounts of damage while dishing it out. The description for the suit even says they're the only Drop Suit that can reliably go head-to-head with a tank. No one but another Sentinel should be able to take a Sentinel head-on inside HMG range and be able to win. They don't need a nerf, they just need to be approached with different tactics in a firefight. Engage at range, outside of the HMG's effective range, or in groups, 2v1 or better if you can manage it. There's one major flaw with that line of thought. In something like a domination match where the objective is in an installation like the Gallente facility, if you get 6-7 guys using sentinels with HMGs and a repper logi, absolutely no one is going to get in there ever. That is broken. Who wants to have matches like that of nothing but a back and forth bout of a bunch of heavies with HMGs or after 6 minutes some guy in a scout suit manages to get in, kills one or two but instantly gets mowed down only for them to respawn in the same location again? Always the last person to leave. Always the one cleaning up people's messes.
LEHON Xeon Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 423	Posted - 2014.04.12 15:44:00 - [2] - Quote VonSpliff wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: Megaman Trigger wrote: HP wise, the Sentinel is just fine. They are, by design, supposed to be able to survive massive amounts of damage while dishing it out. The description for the suit even says they're the only Drop Suit that can reliably go head-to-head with a tank. No one but another Sentinel should be able to take a Sentinel head-on inside HMG range and be able to win. They don't need a nerf, they just need to be approached with different tactics in a firefight. Engage at range, outside of the HMG's effective range, or in groups, 2v1 or better if you can manage it. There's one major flaw with that line of thought. In something like a domination match where the objective is in an installation like the Gallente facility, if you get 6-7 guys using sentinels with HMGs and a repper logi, absolutely no one is going to get in there ever. That is broken. Who wants to have matches like that of nothing but a back and forth bout of a bunch of heavies with HMGs or after 6 minutes some guy in a scout suit manages to get in, kills one or two but instantly gets mowed down only for them to respawn in the same location again? Hmmm who wants to play matches with maxed tanks on both sides. But we do. Tactic tactics tactics. Proto hive and Nade spam is one way to mess with a swarm of heavies. Charged Scr for cover. Adapt or die. Dust 514 Well, tanks can't reach into all areas of buildings. They don't reach and camp underground passageways. In most maps, around an objective, tanks can be avoided somewhere. Like I said, it's real simple, all you have to do is have about 7-8 HMG sentinels, have them camp around the objective in the silo in the Gallente map and have a repper logi or two with triage hives and proto rep tool. 3-4 sentinels watch each side, and with the HMG range out to 40m, all ways in are easily covered. Grenade spam? Yeah, still kind of effective provided you don't get gunned down immediately if you have to step out to throw. I don't care really about skirmish matches overall. In there they can't all camp one location. However for domination, it causes a lot of problems based upon the map. Also under your logic I'll say the same thing for scouts that people claim are OP. Use tactics to take out the new scouts then also and "adapt or die" to them, like you said. Always the last person to leave. Always the one cleaning up people's messes.
LEHON Xeon Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 424	Posted - 2014.04.12 21:29:00 - [3] - Quote lithkul devant wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: VonSpliff wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: Megaman Trigger wrote: HP wise, the Sentinel is just fine. They are, by design, supposed to be able to survive massive amounts of damage while dishing it out. The description for the suit even says they're the only Drop Suit that can reliably go head-to-head with a tank. No one but another Sentinel should be able to take a Sentinel head-on inside HMG range and be able to win. They don't need a nerf, they just need to be approached with different tactics in a firefight. Engage at range, outside of the HMG's effective range, or in groups, 2v1 or better if you can manage it. There's one major flaw with that line of thought. In something like a domination match where the objective is in an installation like the Gallente facility, if you get 6-7 guys using sentinels with HMGs and a repper logi, absolutely no one is going to get in there ever. That is broken. Who wants to have matches like that of nothing but a back and forth bout of a bunch of heavies with HMGs or after 6 minutes some guy in a scout suit manages to get in, kills one or two but instantly gets mowed down only for them to respawn in the same location again? Hmmm who wants to play matches with maxed tanks on both sides. But we do. Tactic tactics tactics. Proto hive and Nade spam is one way to mess with a swarm of heavies. Charged Scr for cover. Adapt or die. Dust 514 Well, tanks can't reach into all areas of buildings. They don't reach and camp underground passageways. In most maps, around an objective, tanks can be avoided somewhere. Like I said, it's real simple, all you have to do is have about 7-8 HMG sentinels, have them camp around the objective in the silo in the Gallente map and have a repper logi or two with triage hives and proto rep tool. 3-4 sentinels watch each side, and with the HMG range out to 40m, all ways in are easily covered. Grenade spam? Yeah, still kind of effective provided you don't get gunned down immediately if you have to step out to throw. I don't care really about skirmish matches overall. In there they can't all camp one location. However for domination, it causes a lot of problems based upon the map. Also under your logic I'll say the same thing for scouts that people claim are OP. Use tactics to take out the new scouts then also and "adapt or die" to them, like you said. I have to disagree with you, while that is a powerful tactic and can indeed block most of it, 2 heavies with forge guns and a logi will punch right through that wall 1 shoting the heavies in front of them and can do it from far enough back. Say at around 40-50m. Another way to destroy the tactic is to use the laser rifle, I know you'd probably laugh at this, but when that sucker gets frying a heavies head they move out of the way damn fast and break rank. Another tactic I have seen while it being suicidal is to get a scout, load him up with RE's and a cloak, when the heavies are reloading or distracted rush in throw all the RE's down as fast as possible, then even on the death screen just set off all the RE's, that line of Heavies is now dead and probably the logi that was repairing them too. If even that fails, lure the heavies and enemy team out, by not going in and suiciding, or do a collection of WP using logis till you get an orbital and just blast the point, most the heavies and the logi will probably die, then rush in and clean up what is left. The problem you are currently trying to portray is where the Sentinel is at the most optimal of what it is supposed to do, with a gun that is made to be heavy supression/able to kill a lot of idiots. A line defender, defending an objective, it would be like complaining that someone with a sniper rifle nailed you at 200 yards away and your RR could not hit them back as hard or fast. The best way to fight a Sentinel or a Sniper is make it where they are out of the comfort zone, where they have to take additional risk in order for getting a payout.(not bringing up the redline issue in this, that is a whole other issue) I guess my main issue currently is with the HMG itself more than the suits. That immediate slowdown effect needs to be gotten rid of. People need a chance to be able to get away and out of the way like with every other gun. Always the last person to leave. Always the one cleaning up people's messes.