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Laz Ulian Sol
The Solecism of Limitation
209
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Posted - 2014.04.12 00:25:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'm trying to figure out the best way to counter highly dampened gallente scout players and I keep falling short. I'm not sure what the best way is to actually detect one of these players and I think it's simply because the math won't allow for it.
I'll show you what I've worked out and maybe the community can help me correct my issues or suggest something I haven't thought of. Before I continue, I should mention I used whole percentages for stacking penalties and rounded at the end of the "db" calculations. Percentages used for stacking penalties were 100%, 86%, 57%, and 28%. Also I'm assuming maximum levels for the skills involved.
Most important, if my math is wrong please tell me why it is wrong and I will attempt to correct it. I based the calculations on past understandings of how skills are multiplied and the order in which they are worked on. I'm assuming that cloaks are added at the end. I am already aware that because I'm not using precise stacking penalty percentages that my values have some error.
All values may be plus or minus 1db as a general estimated cover of the error caused by rounding and using whole percentages.
Dampening:
Any scout with passive dampening
35 x .9 = 31.5
Gallente: 35 x .9 x .75 = 23.63
Any scout with 1 dampener
35 x .9 x .75 = 23.63
Gallente: 35 x .9 x .75 x .75 = 17.72
Any scout with 2 dampeners
35 x .9 x .75 x .785 = 18.55
Gallente: 35 x .9 x .75 x .75 x .785 = 13.91
Any scout with 1 dampener and cloak active
35 x .9 x .75 x .75 = 17.72
Gallente: 35 x .9 x .75 x .75 x .75= 13.29
Any scout with 2 dampeners and cloak active
35 x .9 x .75 x .785 x .75 = 13.91
Gallente: 35 x .9 x .75 x .75 x .785 x .75 = 10.43
Precision:
Gallente logi with focused scanner
20 x .75 = 15
Any scout with passive precision
40 x .9 = 36
Caldari: 40 x .9 x .75 = 27
Any scout with 1 precision mod
40 x .9 x .8 = 28.8
Caldari: 40 x .9 x .75 x .8 = 21.6
Any scout with 2 precision mods
40 x .9 x .8 x .828 = 23.85
Caldari: 40 x .9 x .75 x .8 x .828 = 17.88
A couple scouts with 3 precision mods
40 x .9 x .8 x .828 x .886 = 21.13
Caldari: 40 x .9 x .75 x .8 x .828 x .886 = 15.85
A couple scouts with 4 precision mods
40 x .9 x .8 x .828 x .886 x .944 = 19.95
Caldari: 40 x .9 x .75 x .8 x .828 x .886 x .944 = 14.96
Since caldari and gallente are the current in game leaders in precision and dampening I'm going to draw conclusions with these suits as the focus.
With passives alone a caldari suit will not detect a gallente suit.
With 1 precision mod a caldari suit will detect a passive gallente suit.
With 2 precision mods a caldari suit will detect a gallente suit with 1 dampener.
A caldari suit will not detect a gallente suit with 2 or more dampeners.
A caldari suit will not detect a gallente suit with 1 cloak and 1 or more dampeners.
A caldari suit will not detect any suit with 1 cloak and 2 or more dampeners.
Of course that's if all you are equipping is precision mods.
I guess I could just use my eyes. Lol.
CCP never gave the Imperfects a private match after winning the testers tournament.
CCP never gave us SP Rollover.
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Laz Ulian Sol
The Solecism of Limitation
210
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Posted - 2014.04.12 02:03:00 -
[2] - Quote
Chunky Munkey wrote:I don't think a dampened scout should be so easily countered. They gave up either mobility or a huge amount of health for that advantage.
Yes, they give up a lot for dampening but I find it worrying that there is no counter for a fully dampened gallente scout. Why can't a caldari scout give up everything to find a gallente scout also?
But as it stands the amount of precision required to defeat dampening is way too high.
CCP never gave the Imperfects a private match after winning the testers tournament.
CCP never gave us SP Rollover.
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Laz Ulian Sol
The Solecism of Limitation
212
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Posted - 2014.04.12 03:00:00 -
[3] - Quote
I should probably make it clear that I'm not complaining about cloaks and not being able to see them. I'm concerned with not being able to defeat their dampening. I've been fine with not being able to just scan left and right anymore I think that's fine I just don't like mechanics in a game designed around having counters that don't actually have a counter.
Of course I'll use my eyes (but why is it the only option?)
CCP never gave the Imperfects a private match after winning the testers tournament.
CCP never gave us SP Rollover.
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Laz Ulian Sol
The Solecism of Limitation
218
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Posted - 2014.04.12 04:47:00 -
[4] - Quote
calisk galern wrote:Laz Ulian Sol wrote:
Of course I'll use my eyes (but why is it the only option?)
because they are OP. nerf eyes then we'll talk about buffing scanners. (( seriously you want to buff passive scanner, aka the wall hack. ))
I don't want to buff scanning, I mostly want an e-war rebalance. I can compromise with dampening trumping scanning but why is the jump on modules so ridiculous? Also, are scouts meant to be the premier e-war role or is it for all the suits? The whole system just seems misshapen.
CCP never gave the Imperfects a private match after winning the testers tournament.
CCP never gave us SP Rollover.
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Laz Ulian Sol
The Solecism of Limitation
220
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Posted - 2014.04.12 04:57:00 -
[5] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Laz Ulian Sol wrote:a Lot of Math....
Truth:
I guess I could just use my eyes. Lol. Because if Scan precision was stronger than Dampening, there wouldnt be ANY REASON at all to run a scout that is not a Caldari one.You see:Caldari scout, even while NOT able to scan a Gallente Scout (and not all of them,most are tanked, dont even run a profile dampener anyways) you can scan ANY OTHER SUIT IN THE GAME.The Gallente Scout dampening only helps him vs other scouts and A.Scanners, since any other suit wont see a scout regardless of what race scout it is....
To be honest I don't like the fact that a caldari scout can scan just about everything either. It would be nice if they'd get the balance into a place where one or two modules can tip things around. This whole business of devoting slots to achieve enough dampening and precision is more of a suit focus rather than a suit option.
CCP never gave the Imperfects a private match after winning the testers tournament.
CCP never gave us SP Rollover.
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