DUST Search - Change Scout cloak fitting bonus from 15 to 10 %

Ghost Kaisar wrote:

KingBabar wrote:

I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much.

If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons.

I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right.

Not the solution.

I'm having a hard enough time fitting my MK.0 as it is. PG is a constant problem Sad

Real problem is the Gal scouts ability to run pure armor mods with very little drawbacks. They have passive dampening and a cloak, which means that they can tank tank tank without any real problems.

I personally think that they should start making classes of armor and shields.

Light, Medium, and Heavy shielding, with their own fitting requirements and bonuses.

Like Light shields giving small shield amounts, but having a positive effect on regen times

Heavy shields give large amounts, but have a negative effect on regen times.

Med Shields would be the baseline. Decent shielding without penalty or bonus.

Armor would be the same. Light armor has slight movement penalties and costs less. Heavy gives large but imposes large movement penalties.

Just a thought. We can even apply ferro and reactive to the armor to give them more diversity, such as a Light Reactive plate or a Complex Heavy Ferroscale.

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Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 361	Posted - 2014.04.01 14:41:00 - [31] - Quote 10% would be a massive devaluation of the SP investment. Why not make a smaller increase to fitting costs, maybe 1.5% and see if it helps. For me I have to choose between proto weapons or proto defenses or cloak, I can fit any two, but not all 3. There will be bullets. ACR+SMG
Spectral Clone Dust2Dust. Top Men. 2016	Posted - 2014.04.01 14:45:00 - [32] - Quote No. Nerf regular armor plate HP value. Drop it like its hat. I´m a fat scout. Do you even lift bro?
Dauth Jenkins Ultramarine Corp 354	Posted - 2014.04.01 15:47:00 - [33] - Quote Flix Keptick wrote: lol, just lol. Apart from speed and cloak you literally have EVERYTHING over the scout suit. And you want that nerfed? I'm also pretty sure that it's only the gal scout that is giving you problems, why not ask a change to that instead of the entire scout class? Most proto scouts I see have more health than my proto minmatar logi.... It has 400 shields and 100 armour Sees prototompers... Sees blueberries start to snipe... Pulls out commando suit with laser rifle and swarm launcher...
PARKOUR PRACTIONER Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic 1049	Posted - 2014.04.01 16:01:00 - [34] - Quote KingBabar wrote: I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much. If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons. I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right. And protostomping is.... what? Proficiency V in rage and No-Scopes
Crimson ShieId Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 319	Posted - 2014.04.01 16:12:00 - [35] - Quote KingBabar wrote: I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much. If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons. I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right. Why should I, and other scouts who actually play the suit as a scout and not a cloaked light assault, be penalized because some FoTM chasers are abusing the cloak? It's already hard enough to fit kincats and a few shield mods without having my tiny Minmatar power grid reduced further. If CCP do anything to balance the cloak, they need to make them like the Crysis cloaks, where you have to manually deactivate them before shooting or lose all your cloak's energy in the process. Nova Knives are OP! Nerf em before you lose all your proto suits!
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution 194	Posted - 2014.04.01 16:14:00 - [36] - Quote KingBabar wrote: I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much. If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons. I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right. So true, but instead of increasing pg on cloaks, you could put a penalty on plates since they slow movement hence they could also be penalized for adding a cloak. "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 7754	Posted - 2014.04.01 16:27:00 - [37] - Quote NO. First off, to make the cloak even remotely viable in this current build you need to max out the scout dropsuit skill book. Unless you're at least level 4 in scouts, that cloak will be a hindrance. That means it will take more than just 500,000 SP just to use the ARN cloak effectively. You will need at least 2 million SP invested in the suit alone and that's NOT including the SP needed for Dropsuit Engineering and Dropsuit Electronics and other core fitting skills. There is also the fact that the Minmatar Scout is relatively weak in PG compared to the rest of the scout lineup. One more thing, brick tanking a cloaked scout will only make it easier for others to find you. Passive scans from Caldari Scouts can see you and light you up like a Christmas tree even with the cloak activated. Active scanners will also be able to pick you up so that just negates cloaking altogether if you can't hide your brick-tanked scout from scanners. Might as well just ditch the cloak and fit nanohives and REs instead in that case. In order to avoid the scanners, you'll have to ditch the armor mods and slap on some profile dampeners. You'll be weaker than before and become more prone to getting killed by stray bullets but at least you won't be seen by anything other than a Duvolle Focused Active Scanner on a logi or a maxed out precision fit on a Caldari Scout. So... working as intended. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
Yan Darn Science For Death 476	Posted - 2014.04.01 16:32:00 - [38] - Quote KingBabar wrote: @Flix and Happy violentime: Agreed, not the best thought out suggestion I'll admit. I've been using the Gallente scout and I believe the suit is a little OP compared to the other suits. As I see it, it needs all its CPU/PG if I should be able to equip ferroscale plates and end up with a decent tank on it hile still be as fast as the shield suits, so its not an easy issue. Maybe the biggest problem and indeed it has been for so long; basic armor plates are way too good for their fitting cost, if they cost more as they should, this imbalance wouldn't be so bad. It's like once you were blind and now you see. Gal scouts aren't OP - it just has lots of low slots and the most unbalanced mod is a low slot. Along with the current poor state of assaults, this is why you are seeing so many gal/cal scouts. Scouts are the only role with a role bonus to one specific Item - if a lv5 scout+ max fitting skills has trouble with fitting a cloak, what's the point? Cloaks are only really useful to minimise detection chances when flanking etc. As soon as the weapon swap issue changed (ideally to the manual deactivation animation), it's use as direct offensive tool is vastly minimised IMO. If cloaks didn't exist and our role bonus was to ewar/Biotics fitting cost, scouts would be much less appealing to the great unwashed, but alas CCP really want their jazz hands worthy gimmick in here. Luckily, in itself it is balanced enough - it's when you combine anything (that was never intended to have such a high tank) with stacked armour plates that you get imbalance. The Ghost of Bravo
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 7756	Posted - 2014.04.01 17:52:00 - [39] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: KingBabar wrote: I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much. If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons. I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right. So true, but instead of increasing pg on cloaks, you could put a penalty on plates since they slow movement hence they could also be penalized for adding a cloak. Honestly that seems like a great idea and a much better alternative. If I am fitting plates on my suit, shouldn't I be slower since I have more weight imposed on my suit? Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
jerrmy12 kahoalii 829	Posted - 2014.04.01 17:55:00 - [40] - Quote KingBabar wrote: I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much. If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons. I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right. ok enough with the "im bad and cant see cloak so I must qq to get it nerfed" already. Damm people get good. Closed beta vet Tears, sweet delicious tears

Tek Hound Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 182	Posted - 2014.04.01 17:59:00 - [41] - Quote Seriously there nothing wrong with cloak other than the glitches. Anybody QQ about it really needs to l2p.It has to be the weakest cloak ever put into a game and your opponent has like 300hp or less, visible while moving and weapon swap
noob cavman Dirt Nap Squad. 1046	Posted - 2014.04.01 18:02:00 - [42] - Quote The whole shotty/cloak or knives/cloak is a lil bs. The insta switch from cloak to weapon is not a good mechanic at all. Use it to get position on your target is good but too many are simply running around insta gibbing people. Id say a two-three secound deley for you to use any weapon, equipment or grenade after you decloak would cull this rather silly gameplay. I want to be a caveman! Ccp: DENIED YOU DRUNK Gö+GöüGö+ n+¦pâ+(`-ö´)n+ën+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ We are the blue waffle!
mollerz 3134	Posted - 2014.04.01 18:09:00 - [43] - Quote This wasn't even worth consideration. Bad idea. Bad concept. OP gets an F- You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
Takron Nistrom Tinfoil Hatz 283	Posted - 2014.04.01 18:10:00 - [44] - Quote KingBabar wrote: Patrick57 wrote: You could do that, or you could stop brick tanking... I don't. Yes I do have one 869 HP suit that I will try eventually. I mostly run With 560 HP. And I don't see how thats relevant to this discussion either. Nothing you ever say is relevant GÇ£Pulvis et umbra sumus. (We are but dust and shadow.)GÇ¥ GÇò Horace, The Odes of Horace
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution 195	Posted - 2014.04.01 19:38:00 - [45] - Quote ResistanceGTA wrote: My super tanked up Proto Minmatar Scout (350 eHP) does not like this. I don't think the minjas should be penalized for this, rather we're the only scouts that can't brick tank properly because we have the lowest base eHP. The cloaks are the only thing that really save our hides, I wouldn't mind a minor nerf, but it would be too much for Minmatar scouts to have their cloaks nerfed too. "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 4373	Posted - 2014.04.01 19:39:00 - [46] - Quote No. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution 3998	Posted - 2014.04.01 19:52:00 - [47] - Quote KingBabar wrote: I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much. If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons. I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right. Not the solution. I'm having a hard enough time fitting my MK.0 as it is. PG is a constant problem Real problem is the Gal scouts ability to run pure armor mods with very little drawbacks. They have passive dampening and a cloak, which means that they can tank tank tank without any real problems. I personally think that they should start making classes of armor and shields. Light, Medium, and Heavy shielding, with their own fitting requirements and bonuses. Like Light shields giving small shield amounts, but having a positive effect on regen times Heavy shields give large amounts, but have a negative effect on regen times. Med Shields would be the baseline. Decent shielding without penalty or bonus. Armor would be the same. Light armor has slight movement penalties and costs less. Heavy gives large but imposes large movement penalties. Just a thought. We can even apply ferro and reactive to the armor to give them more diversity, such as a Light Reactive plate or a Complex Heavy Ferroscale. I got my cloak and daggers, I'm a very happy Ghost I hack at Mach V
Tek Hound Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 183	Posted - 2014.04.01 20:22:00 - [48] - Quote noob cavman wrote: The whole shotty/cloak or knives/cloak is a lil bs. The insta switch from cloak to weapon is not a good mechanic at all. Use it to get position on your target is good but too many are simply running around insta gibbing people. Id say a two-three secound deley for you to use any weapon, equipment or grenade after you decloak would cull this rather silly gameplay. Why so you can shoot them?If your killed killed by them their goid or your not paying attention.
jerrmy12 kahoalii 831	Posted - 2014.04.01 20:26:00 - [49] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: KingBabar wrote: I think that some sacrifice should be expected when you're putting on the most effective and selfish Equipment there is. Being able to be invisible and shoot People in the back With a shotty is all well and good, but should I be able to put 700-800 HP, proto weapns and a cloak? Its a bit too much. If this change were too be made the sneaky scouts could still do their job, sneaking past "enemy lines", hack and setup uplinks. You can still sneak up on someone and get that "stealth" kill, but you would then be weaker as a combat unit sacrificing some tank or indeed those expensive to fit fancy weapons. I feel the suit I'm using is a little too good. The cloak is cheaper to fit than a decent nanohive, its not right. Not the solution. I'm having a hard enough time fitting my MK.0 as it is. PG is a constant problem Real problem is the Gal scouts ability to run pure armor mods with very little drawbacks. They have passive dampening and a cloak, which means that they can tank tank tank without any real problems. I personally think that they should start making classes of armor and shields. Light, Medium, and Heavy shielding, with their own fitting requirements and bonuses. Like Light shields giving small shield amounts, but having a positive effect on regen times Heavy shields give large amounts, but have a negative effect on regen times. Med Shields would be the baseline. Decent shielding without penalty or bonus. Armor would be the same. Light armor has slight movement penalties and costs less. Heavy gives large but imposes large movement penalties. Just a thought. We can even apply ferro and reactive to the armor to give them more diversity, such as a Light Reactive plate or a Complex Heavy Ferroscale. Oh yes please Shield Energizers and regs would need a alight buff though Closed beta vet Tears, sweet delicious tears
Rusty Shallows 1358	Posted - 2014.04.01 20:57:00 - [50] - Quote KGB Sleep wrote: NO I just had to readjust CPU for explosives to fit right. NO BECAUSE I SAID SO In IWS's thread I suggest considering splitting the CPU/PG reduction benefits. For example if the PG savings were less it would discourage fitting plates and shield extenders, the unfortunate side effect hitting Kin-Cats too. However the EWAR savings could then be kept the same. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>

ThePrinceOfNigeria Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 427	Posted - 2014.04.01 20:58:00 - [51] - Quote "FU and FU Dust community, you're mostly a bunch of moronic carebear crybabies. Get good." Ironic signature is Ironic...
mollerz 3137	Posted - 2014.04.01 21:04:00 - [52] - Quote So what if Gal scouts can brick tank. That is obviously part of their role. it isn't a problem. A gal scout, more than any other scout, is made for being alone deep behind enemy lines. Seems like their role is spot on. CCP did a really good job. You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
DTOracle BlackWater Liquidations INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 260	Posted - 2014.04.01 22:06:00 - [53] - Quote No!!! My Min scout can barely rock a cloak & a Adv weapon as is. Everyone is complaining about brick tanked scouts w/ cloaks, which are Amarr & Gal scouts, what about the rest of us. Besides the best scouts I have faced post 1.8 don't brick tank. It might take sometime to learn to walk again without your crutch(damage mods). Just keep practicing.
Tek Hound Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 183	Posted - 2014.04.01 22:14:00 - [54] - Quote So how long does a scout out in the open live?Yea.. just answer that and STFU!
Flix Keptick Red Star. EoN. 3507	Posted - 2014.04.04 12:37:00 - [55] - Quote I have to agree with the armor plate argument (not the nerf scout fitting one). a std armor plate is 5x easier to fit than a complex shield extender for 1.5x the hp (lol). I get that shields regen faster but this is still a MASSIVE difference. The community is the worst thing that ever happened to this game Caldari Scout // specialized tank destroyer
KingBabar The Rainbow Effect Negative-Feedback 2126	Posted - 2014.04.04 14:30:00 - [56] - Quote Takron Nistrom wrote: KingBabar wrote: Patrick57 wrote: You could do that, or you could stop brick tanking... I don't. Yes I do have one 869 HP suit that I will try eventually. I mostly run With 560 HP. And I don't see how thats relevant to this discussion either. Nothing you ever say is relevant Keep nursing that bitterness, savor it and enjoy the flavor! FU and FU Dust community, you're mostly a bunch of moronic carebear crybabies. Get good.


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