Scouts doesn't need to drain speed they can fit speed into theirs slots unless they want to become mech scouts.

And pointing health is 1 point for everyone when you get 0 Shield/Armor so the vampire skills will never go beyond 1 and armor doesn't count either as health...

.....do you know what Nosferatu's are?

So since Amarr are vampires in EVE, I have an idea for a nosferatu for DUST.

The module would be a nosferatu, but since we don't have capacitor, instead of draining energy, it would drain health and replenish your own. Basically you would lock onto an enemy and be able to drain the victims health to replenish your own, but akin to EVE, you will not be able to drain the victim's health lower than your own health.

The Amarr Scout could get a bonus to this perhaps 3% to drain speed.

So since Amarr are vampires in EVE, I have an idea for a nosferatu for DUST.

The module would be a nosferatu, but since we don't have capacitor, instead of draining energy, it would drain health and replenish your own. Basically you would lock onto an enemy and be able to drain the victims health to replenish your own, but akin to EVE, you will not be able to drain the victim's health lower than your own health.

The Amarr Scout could get a bonus to this perhaps 3% to drain speed.

No, I'm sorry but energy vamps steal energy, not shields or armor.

He obviously doesn't

Am trying to see the logic to the topic about putting a Nosferatu module.

Answer with a question sound as an excuse that you don't really know how to make it fit...

As short answer this is equal to a respec topic.

Am trying to see the logic to the topic about putting a Nosferatu module.

Answer with a question sound as an excuse that you don't really know how to make it fit...

As short answer this is equal to a respec topic.

And shields are made of what exactly?

BOOM.

Don't call it a Nosferatu, but create an equipment item that drains the target's shields while replenishing the user's shield up to the point where both are equal. It could have a description which refers back to EVE and mentions that it's based on the same tech as the Nosferatu.

We have things that kill shields far more effectively than anti-rep tools, they're called guns and flux grenades.

Am trying to see the logic to the topic about putting a Nosferatu module.

Answer with a question sound as an excuse that you don't really know how to make it fit...

As short answer this is equal to a respec topic.

And how many things do we have that help us rep our shields when they're still on regen delay?

Here, I'll list them for you:

-

Yep, that's all of them.

You seen my thread. I know you did

It's fixing something that isn't broken and doesn't need addressing. I'd rather see remote shield reppers or modified repair tools that are weighted towards shields but also rep small amounts of armor, rather than bastardized 'energy vampires'.

There are a couple ways to make it work but the best way is to introduce cap to Dust

Other E-War and how it could apply
Stasis Webs - pretty self explanatory though probably more useful as an AV assist
Tracking Disruptors - when activated, the target loses Aim Assist (can get into using scripts later)
Sensor Damps - reduces the scan precision of target. Would be great for sneaking up on an enemy or especially for vehicles. Easy to get behind tanks with RE's
Target Breakers - this would probably be more of a emp burst which cancels out everyones tacnet and scan precision within a given area

Target painter - this one would be tougher but would probably be used for vehicle versus vehicle on a new turret type.

There are others but not sure how they would play into Dust. Things like jammers, ECCM, scramblers etc

So since Amarr are vampires in EVE, I have an idea for a nosferatu for DUST.

The module would be a nosferatu, but since we don't have capacitor, instead of draining energy, it would drain health and replenish your own. Basically you would lock onto an enemy and be able to drain the victims health to replenish your own, but akin to EVE, you will not be able to drain the victim's health lower than your own health.

The Amarr Scout could get a bonus to this perhaps 3% to drain speed.

It's not fixing something that isn't broken. It's suggesting a way to bring something interesting and cool from EVE into a form where it would make sense and work in DUST.

If asking for new and interesting content is "fixing what isn't broken" then you're a hypocrite for wanting new repair tools or variants. We should also stop requesting webifiers, MTACs, etc. and nobody's allowed to say that adding capacitors to vehicles would be a good idea. This is all "fixing what isn't broken", according to you.

Stasis web maybe but could be more reworked.
-The tracking Disruptors there are bugs that can do that and better like disabling your weapon, besides ii choose to disable it i feel it more annoying.
-Sensor Damps There are bonus for that and the invisible cloak that can suit better for vampires.
-Target Painter there was a discuss for that just like the Sensor Damps and there was none confirmation about trying to make it happen.
Target Breakers think in the QQers it will be like the "Cloaks are OP".

If they want vampires mudules maybe a reflex one becuase a lot of them doesn't know how to dodge.

And i want my Stake HMG.

But it doesn't make sense, or work. I'm all for creating things that have a clearly defined and useful role - this idea doesn't. If I want someone dead I shoot them, If I want shields back I take cover, I don't try to stand there while someone is shooting me trying to open the equipment wheel to select a non-useful piece of equipment, lock the target while they're still shooting me just so I can drain their shields and maybe hope they have enough shield for the amount I'm stealing to keep me alive until they run out of bullets so I can switch back to an actual weapon and kill them.

If suits or vehicles had capacitor, capacitor warfare devices might be useful. But this piece of equipment(? is it supposed to be a weapon?) doesn't fill any real clearly defined useful role.

A shield repper fills a clear role - you use it to help out shield based teammates. A drop uplink fills a clear role - a new mobile deployable spawn point. A scanner fills a clear role - you use it to get advanced intel on suits you cannot see. A stasis webifier that slowed down enemy vehicles massively would fill a clear and useful role - a support tool that helps enable squadmates to apply damage to vehicles. This 'energy vampire' is a confused little device, it doesn't fill any clear role or (as described) any niche that really serves a purpose. An energy vampire that reduced repair rates and module active times on vehicles while it was used would be a useful piece of equipment.

When designing a prospective piece of equipment it should be very, very clear of purpose and fill a niche in a unique and purposeful way.

It's called getting behind someone bro.

But it doesn't make sense, or work. I'm all for creating things that have a clearly defined and useful role - this idea doesn't. If I want someone dead I shoot them, If I want shields back I take cover, I don't try to stand there while someone is shooting me trying to open the equipment wheel to select a non-useful piece of equipment, lock the target while they're still shooting me just so I can drain their shields and maybe hope they have enough shield for the amount I'm stealing to keep me alive until they run out of bullets so I can switch back to an actual weapon and kill them.

If suits or vehicles had capacitor, capacitor warfare devices might be useful. But this piece of equipment(? is it supposed to be a weapon?) doesn't fill any real clearly defined useful role.

A shield repper fills a clear role - you use it to help out shield based teammates. A drop uplink fills a clear role - a new mobile deployable spawn point. A scanner fills a clear role - you use it to get advanced intel on suits you cannot see. A stasis webifier that slowed down enemy vehicles massively would fill a clear and useful role - a support tool that helps enable squadmates to apply damage to vehicles. This 'energy vampire' is a confused little device, it doesn't fill any clear role or (as described) any niche that really serves a purpose.

When designing a prospective piece of equipment it should be very, very clear of purpose and fill a niche in a unique and purposeful way.

I want to spend a lot of time defending a bad piece of equipment

I refuse to bother actually arguing againsy valid points, so I edit your post to try and make you sound stupid.

Hahaha, no, bad equipment is bad. I like how you really really tried to make situations where it might be useful but unless it's providing 400-800hp/s it won't be - and those are average numbers for how much damage various weapons do per second, with the upper end belonging to the HMG that cal heavy is likely to be packing and he can shoot that for longer than 1 second.

Plain and simple it's a very, very poorly thought out idea that tries to shoehorn something awesome from eve into dust, where it would be less than awesome. There is *no* situation that you can describe where this would be more useful than simply shooting the ****ing enemy in front of you, except potentially against vehicles, where it might still suck if it works as you've described it.

Can I get sparkly skin and rock hard abs to go with this?

But it does work if you make it vehicle versus vehicle if cap was introduced where vehicle mods drained it.

Tank vs Tank battle. Tank A nos' Tank B which drains down its cap. This means that Tank A can run its Hardeners/Reppers longer while Tank B can only do it for a shorter period of time. Or, a Logi DS drains Tank B while providing remote reps or remote shield boosts to Tank A.

This isnt something that will be immediately implemented but does give some good thought to how warfare can play out on larger maps with more players on the map. Having tank squads on large maps would become a thing and would necessitate the need for something like a Logi DS and EWar

wah wah wah, my points were refuted, I'm just going to call names and try to justify shoehorning things

I'm surprised you're not named NarutoKenshinInuyashaIchigo, you seem to like shoehorning things that much. I like energy vampires in eve - they fill an awesome role, I don't like things that are awesome being turned into steaming piles of crap just so they can be shoehorned into other things where they don't fit. Until there's a role for them to fill or a niche where they'll be awesome and worth using (and despite trying to portray them as being worth using, they aren't) we don't need them.

This 'vampire' is not an idea worth the time spent to read about it, let alone the time spent to try convincing someone who thinks it's a steaming pile that 'really it's a good idea!'. It serves no purpose and fills no role that's useful.

Don't believe what a terrible romance novelist tells you. Those are fairies, not vampires. Real vampires don't sparkle.


The thread was proposing a weaponised version of the Nosferatu which reduces enemy health (I've suggested as a more reasonable option to only reduce shields) and NOT cap warfare, which both people you've quoted have acknowledged as something different.

This is still a form of EWAR, but it's a more directly damaging EWAR option rather than the stealth/scanning, webifiers and cap warfare you see in EVE.

^I'm done, have fun playing with your steaming pile. This discussion is pointless because your 'great idea' (aka. piece of crap) won't ever make it into game.

^I'm done, have fun playing with your steaming pile. This discussion is pointless because your 'great idea' (aka. piece of crap) won't ever make it into game.

inb4 squad of amarr vampires ganging up on heavies

So, let me get your thought process straight.

1. Fail to understand a concept. Deny its validity with "I don't get it" as the only reason why you think it's a bad idea.
2. Refuse to even try and understand the concept when it's explained in a different way, and continue to argue that it's bad without any grounds to do so.
3. Start abusing the quote system for ad hominem attacks instead of trying to defend your position, while claiming that someone who's actually reasoning things out and responding to your points directly is doing what you yourself have just done.
4. Instead of going back on topic when given an opportunity and having your ad hominem treated as a joke instead of an insult, you not only make another ad hominem attack, but turn accusations of offensive behaviour against someone who actually has valid grounds to make that claim against you instead.
5. Instead of trying to reason things out or continue to defend your position against your not-easily-offended opponent in this discussion, you ragequit the thread and claim that this idea will never make it into the game just because you still haven't bothered to try and understand how it could be useful and interesting.

Then I would have to side with the opposition to it as the idea stands right now.

The main issues I have with a shield/armor/ehp vamp are that it would have to be an active module to begin with and would need to be AOE to not run into issues of clunkiness with lock/activation versus just shooting the guy in the first place. It would then need to be powerful enough to justify its use which, agian, is direct competition for just using a weapon.

The only real way that drains/vamps would work is in the case of vehicles which have a much longer engagement time than infantry. An infantry battle lasts a handful of seconds at most which would make some sort of drain hard to balance between being useful and extremely overpowered.

I like that people are trying to adapt EWAR ideas to Dust but I just dont think it would work well enough in this case.

THANK YOU!

This is a well-reasoned argument against the idea.

The mechanics as currently proposed are a pretty rough idea, to be sure.

While discussing this, I've been thinking about ways in which some kind of shield siphoning item could work in DUST.

The most obvious option - if you're assuming infantry - is an equipment item like a Repair Tool. You hold the trigger and just have to swipe your crosshair over an enemy to lock and start draining their shields. A suit with low shield HP like a Gallente Assault could use something like this against a shield-tanked Caldari Heavy suit as a way to bridge the HP gap between the two suits, but only if the drain rate was at least 75% of the DPS of the enemy's weapon. Against a Heavy running HMG, that would mean something like 800 HP/s shield drain, which would basically result in both the Heavy and the Assault losing all their shields in a matter of seconds, and probably let a small amount of damage through onto the Assault while doing so.

Another option - which would be great as a Gallente weapon, would be to use the Grenade slot for a deployable shield siphon drone that drains HP from nearby enemy shields and pours a reduced amount of that energy into its user. This would work well because it's a shield-focused weapon, which Gallente are good at thanks to their experience fighting Caldari, and because Drones are one of Gallente's specialties. Also, by not getting in the way of shooting, it allows for the device to be much less powerful while still remaining useful. It would also be possible to have a similar system scaled up to work with vehicles. Something like this could also have potential as an area denial weapon if it was capable of targeting multiple opponents in range, because that would simultaneously strengthen the user and weaken any attackers when they get into close quarters.

A deployable shield siphon equipment item could also work. Place it down and it takes shields SLOWLY from enemies in the area while projecting the HP into nearby friendly units. It could be set up so it only works when there are both friendly and enemy units in the radius, or it could siphon HP from enemies whenever they're in range, but only replenish the shields of a friendly unit who's in range while an enemy is being drained. As with the previous proposal, this would be useful without needing to be as powerful as a handheld option, but without being as much of a Gallente-specific concept.

Regardless of if this is implemented or how, I think it's an interesting idea and one that's well worth discussing. Not many online games have anything like this (there was a "drain" ability in a couple of the Transformers games made by High Moon Studios, but that's the only recent example I can think of).

1 & 2) I understood it. I pointed that it was useless, unnecessary, contrived and shoehorned in manners that don't make sense. There are plenty of reasons why it's bad.
3) You started the mudslinging first bud, and you refuse to concede any ground as to why it might be ****ing terrible with your 'well you could vamp scouts or heavies and out-rep their 400-800 dps weapons!'
4) I've been on topic for quite some time, especially when pointing out that it doesn't fill any role and that maybe if it was altered to be used against vehicles and reduce module times / rep amounts it *might* be useful
5) Me choosing to walk away from a 'discussion' that is going in circles doesn't mean you've 'won' it, especially when you're re-treading ad-hominem, belligerence, bad ideas and misunderstanding.

I understand quite well what your item is 'supposed' to do, that's why I've said it's worthless - to be of *use* it would have to bring in more hp than an opponent is reasonably able to dps down, which puts the numbers somewhere in the 400-1000 hp/s ballpark, which is an absurd number. You essentially want a device that makes you unkillable and you have enough time to switch to in a hectic firefight to use.

I want you to answer some questions, because I'm tired of trying to tell you why it's a bad idea, I'll have you do that yourself:

My issue with the repair tool esque version is that I just dont think the merc would survive long enough to actually be able to use it.
- Time it takes to switch from weapon to the vamp unit
- Time it takes to lock on and activate unit
- Time it takes to start receiving benefit of unit
- Time it takes to switch back to weapon to engage enemy

This process seems way to involved for a situation that is usually over and done with in the space of 2-3 seconds. The merc would proabably be dead towards the end of the second step.

My concern of the deployable equipment type is how to avoid the chances for spamming it in cqc areas around objectives to the point that it becomes game breaking. Even if only one merc could deploy it at a time, you have 6, 6, and 4 deployed around 3 objectives and it becomes a ridiculous sway in the favor of the defending team. It also means that the more people that are pushing, the greater the benefit for the defenders. I just have the feeling that this would be incredibly abused.