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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1286
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:09:00 -
[1] - Quote
Give up a low or high slot OR your sidearm for a buff to drop uplink and scanner usage?
In another thread, someone was stating that the issue with brick tanking scouts is that they have such an undefined role aside from slaying as they have no inherent bonuses other than to track down enemy targets.
So, if there was another variation on the light frame that took away a H/L slot or a sidearm for a bonus to uplinks and scanners (possibly about half of what the gal and amarr logis get), would you use it?
I feel that the scout's speed lends itself to the use of these two pieces of equipment. It allows them to flank the enemy with uplinks and track the enemy down with the scanner.
Another piece of equipment that could be introduced for scouts would be a Tag/Painter for enemies. It allows a scout to mark an enemy player for a set period of time so that they would be visible to the scout's squad. Number of active tags and length of time tagged would be dependent upon the meta of the equipment.
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
1105
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
Nope, those are logi gear
Join the Channel - CPM1 Candidates - Get to know who's running.
Delt for CPM1
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Venerable Phage
Red Shirts Away Team
94
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:15:00 -
[3] - Quote
Or I could use a headset and tell my entire team where the enemy is. |
Sinboto Simmons
SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance
5425
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
No, no I would not.
Uplinks are Amarr tech, wouldn't make sense for the other races to get bonuses, and as a minja it would disgust me.
Target painter is largely useless with a passive scanner, would be used by commandos and midframes more than us, same for the active scanner.
And bricktanking tryhard scouts are bricktanking tryhard scouts because they want to be bricktanking tryhard scouts, this won't change that.
Sinboto - The True Blood Minja
Forum Warrior level 5
STB-Infantry (Demolition)
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1286
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:19:00 -
[5] - Quote
Mossellia Delt wrote:Nope, those are logi gear
Logi is a variation on a medium suit. This would be a variation on a light suit. Whats your point?
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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ResistanceGTA
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
683
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:21:00 -
[6] - Quote
I feel like the general consensus will be no. Most Scouts fought for that slot increase they got, and fought against losing their sidearm in exchange for the equipment slot.
To make the Uplink one worthwhile, it would really require a decent bonus. Make it only part of the Amarr Logi bonus, spawn speed.
Variants of suits..you're living in the future my friend. We're not there yet.
xSivartx is my Heavy. There are many like him, but he is my own...
So, other Logi's back off, those are my Warpoints!
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1286
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:23:00 -
[7] - Quote
Sinboto Simmons wrote:No, no I would not.
Uplinks are Amarr tech, wouldn't make sense for the other races to get bonuses, and as a minja it would disgust me.
Target painter is largely useless with a passive scanner, would be used by commandos and midframes more than us, same for the active scanner.
And bricktanking tryhard scouts are bricktanking tryhard scouts because they want to be bricktanking tryhard scouts, this won't change that.
So you are saying that scouts should not help the team other than as slayers?
The reason that CCP has had so many issues with balancing suits is that there is not enough difference in the rolls of each frame/class. How exactly are you going to balance them when there is very little diversity in their usage?
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1286
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:26:00 -
[8] - Quote
ResistanceGTA wrote:I feel like the general consensus will be no. Most Scouts fought for that slot increase they got, and fought against losing their sidearm in exchange for the equipment slot.
To make the Uplink one worthwhile, it would really require a decent bonus. Make it only part of the Amarr Logi bonus, spawn speed.
Variants of suits..you're living in the future my friend. We're not there yet.
Games need to constantly evolve to not get boring and dated. Im not asking for this to be something implemented now but rather as an addition in a future release.
Clarification - this is not about changing the current scout. It is about adding an optional variation of the light suit that has bonuses to certain equipment.
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Sinboto Simmons
SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance
5428
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:28:00 -
[9] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:No, no I would not.
Uplinks are Amarr tech, wouldn't make sense for the other races to get bonuses, and as a minja it would disgust me.
Target painter is largely useless with a passive scanner, would be used by commandos and midframes more than us, same for the active scanner.
And bricktanking tryhard scouts are bricktanking tryhard scouts because they want to be bricktanking tryhard scouts, this won't change that. So you are saying that scouts should not help the team other than as slayers? The reason that CCP has had so many issues with balancing suits is that there is not enough difference in the rolls of each frame/class. How exactly are you going to balance them when there is very little diversity in their usage? No one wants the scout to be a slayer, however the points that YOU wish to be implemented are of the logistics class, not the scout.
Sinboto - The True Blood Minja
Forum Warrior level 5
STB-Infantry (Demolition)
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Krom Ganesh
Nos Nothi
1469
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:31:00 -
[10] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Clarification - this is not about changing the current scout. It is about adding an optional variation of the light suit that has bonuses to certain equipment.
I'd rather see a light suit specialization that has 2x light weapons, reduced eHP, no grenade slot, less slots, and bonuses towards snipers and AV. |
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Mossellia Delt
Militaires Sans Jeux
1107
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:37:00 -
[11] - Quote
Scouts should be stealth skirmishers, look at the rogue class in dungeons and dragons
Join the Channel - CPM1 Candidates - Get to know who's running.
Delt for CPM1
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1286
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:40:00 -
[12] - Quote
Sinboto Simmons wrote:Canari Elphus wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:No, no I would not.
Uplinks are Amarr tech, wouldn't make sense for the other races to get bonuses, and as a minja it would disgust me.
Target painter is largely useless with a passive scanner, would be used by commandos and midframes more than us, same for the active scanner.
And bricktanking tryhard scouts are bricktanking tryhard scouts because they want to be bricktanking tryhard scouts, this won't change that. So you are saying that scouts should not help the team other than as slayers? The reason that CCP has had so many issues with balancing suits is that there is not enough difference in the rolls of each frame/class. How exactly are you going to balance them when there is very little diversity in their usage? No one wants the scout to be a slayer, however the points that YOU wish to be implemented are of the logistics class, not the scout.
As state above, this is a variation to the light frame, not a change to the current scouts. Its basically the 'logi' light frame.
Ideally, it would have different equipment (and bonuses) than the medium frame logi supports. I just know that developing new equipment takes a long time so I would rather start with some bonuses to current and work from there.
Possible new equipment - Motion Detectors- deployable equipment that consistantly monitors a certain radius from where deployed. They are sticky like RE's but can only scan a limited distance. Ideally deployed at doorways or choke points.
- Statis Webs - used against vehicles. A scout can get in close on an enemy tank and significantly reduce its speed to allow for friendly tank to take advantage of situation
- Claymores - dont really need an explanation here
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1286
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:42:00 -
[13] - Quote
Mossellia Delt wrote:Scouts should be stealth skirmishers, look at the rogue class in dungeons and dragons
Again... not a change to 'scouts', its an alternative variation to the 'light frame'
reading is fundamental
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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NAV HIV
The Generals General Tso's Alliance
1270
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:44:00 -
[14] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Give up a low or high slot OR your sidearm for a buff to drop uplink and scanner usage?
In another thread, someone was stating that the issue with brick tanking scouts is that they have such an undefined role aside from slaying as they have no inherent bonuses other than to track down enemy targets.
So, if there was another variation on the light frame that took away a H/L slot or a sidearm for a bonus to uplinks and scanners (possibly about half of what the gal and amarr logis get), would you use it?
I feel that the scout's speed lends itself to the use of these two pieces of equipment. It allows them to flank the enemy with uplinks and track the enemy down with the scanner.
Another piece of equipment that could be introduced for scouts would be a Tag/Painter for enemies. It allows a scout to mark an enemy player for a set period of time so that they would be visible to the scout's squad. Number of active tags and length of time tagged would be dependent upon the meta of the equipment.
I can still Fit Proto Links with my ALL My Proto Modules, so i don't think i would like that... I'm a Cal Scout so High Slots are very essential.... And i'm a running, jumping, moving Proto Scanner... So No thank you |
NAV HIV
The Generals General Tso's Alliance
1271
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Posted - 2014.03.28 13:50:00 -
[15] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:No, no I would not.
Uplinks are Amarr tech, wouldn't make sense for the other races to get bonuses, and as a minja it would disgust me.
Target painter is largely useless with a passive scanner, would be used by commandos and midframes more than us, same for the active scanner.
And bricktanking tryhard scouts are bricktanking tryhard scouts because they want to be bricktanking tryhard scouts, this won't change that. So you are saying that scouts should not help the team other than as slayers? The reason that CCP has had so many issues with balancing suits is that there is not enough difference in the rolls of each frame/class. How exactly are you going to balance them when there is very little diversity in their usage?
Diversity Depends on the User, You can use a Assault Suit or a Commando As a Logi support Suit... Don't have to Remove Slots from any other suits. The Scouts have 2 Equipment Slots. Add one more, then Logi suits would be useless... Like i've said before, i can and i have a loadout with proto uplinks on my Fully Cloaked Proto Cal Scout, i have Few with Nanohives, including repping nanohives.... |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust.
2569
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Posted - 2014.03.28 14:00:00 -
[16] - Quote
Not a chance in hell - you want to make a light logi, create a new suit role, don't bastardize scouts.
Dedicated sidearm scout - Watch out for that headshot
Scout community is the nuts
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1287
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Posted - 2014.03.28 14:06:00 -
[17] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Not a chance in hell - you want to make a light logi, create a new suit role, don't bastardize scouts.
Thats exactly what Im trying to do. You would have known that if you had bothered to actually read the thread.
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Sinboto Simmons
SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance
5438
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Posted - 2014.03.28 14:19:00 -
[18] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Django Quik wrote:Not a chance in hell - you want to make a light logi, create a new suit role, don't bastardize scouts. Thats exactly what Im trying to do. You would have known that if you had bothered to actually read the thread. You know what may help with that?
Changing the title of the thread.
Sinboto - The True Blood Minja
Forum Warrior level 5
STB-Infantry (Demolition)
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Canari Elphus
Dirt Nap Squad.
1288
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Posted - 2014.03.28 14:30:00 -
[19] - Quote
Sinboto Simmons wrote:Canari Elphus wrote:Django Quik wrote:Not a chance in hell - you want to make a light logi, create a new suit role, don't bastardize scouts. Thats exactly what Im trying to do. You would have known that if you had bothered to actually read the thread. You know what may help with that? Changing the title of the thread.
I had always had a 'new variation on light suit' as part of the OP and have now tried to make it even clearer for the casual reader.
I dont think changing the title of the thread is needed as it pertains to those who are currently spec'd into scouts/light frames.
Canari Elphus for CPM1
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Asha Starwind
DUST University Ivy League
655
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Posted - 2014.03.28 14:46:00 -
[20] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Give up a low or high slot OR your sidearm on a new light suit variation or 'scout logi'?
In another thread, someone was stating that the issue with brick tanking scouts is that they have such an undefined role aside from slaying as they have no inherent bonuses other than to track down enemy targets.
So, if there was another variation on the light frame that took away a H/L slot or a sidearm for a bonus to certain equipment (new and possibly old), would you use it?
Possible new equipment (taken from later post):
- Motion Detectors- deployable equipment that consistantly monitors a certain radius from where deployed. They are sticky like RE's but can only scan a limited distance. Ideally deployed at doorways or choke points.
- Statis Webs - used against vehicles. A scout can get in close on an enemy tank and significantly reduce its speed to allow for friendly tank to take advantage of situation
- Claymores - dont really need an explanation here
It's not that they don't have a defined role, it that people are confusing the role for class. There are 3 classes in an fps (attack, defense, and support)
Roles are contained within these classes.
Attack Commando Assault Scout
Support Logistics(Medic) Logistics(Supply)
Defense Sentinel
Looking there you clearly see that the roles are defined. Commandos are slower, more tanked, and have a higher damage output than the Assaults and scouts. Scouts are quicker, lesser tanked, and with bonuses to stealth and detection(ewar). Assaults carve out a spot for themselves in between Commandoes and Scouts.
The sandbox nature of this game, allows some overlap and should.
A commando should be able to increase his speed or detection/stealth by forgoing some of his tank or damage.
An assault simply decides whether it wants to be more like a commando or like a scout or have a bit of everything.
Scouts it shouldn't be a problem for scouts to forgo ewar or speed, for speed pushing them closer to an assault.
Mad Bomber - 50% less profile
Return dumbfire to Swarms
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Sarus Rambo
Direct Action Resources
75
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Posted - 2014.03.28 14:48:00 -
[21] - Quote
Canari Elphus wrote:Give up a low or high slot OR your sidearm on a new light suit variation or 'scout logi'?
In another thread, someone was stating that the issue with brick tanking scouts is that they have such an undefined role aside from slaying as they have no inherent bonuses other than to track down enemy targets.
So, if there was another variation on the light frame that took away a H/L slot or a sidearm for a bonus to certain equipment (new and possibly old), would you use it?
Possible new equipment (taken from later post):
- Motion Detectors- deployable equipment that consistantly monitors a certain radius from where deployed. They are sticky like RE's but can only scan a limited distance. Ideally deployed at doorways or choke points.
- Statis Webs - used against vehicles. A scout can get in close on an enemy tank and significantly reduce its speed to allow for friendly tank to take advantage of situation
- Claymores - dont really need an explanation here
This is stupid, we dont need another logi class, or one that can use cloaks a¦á_a¦á
This sums up 75% of the forum posts.
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Krom Ganesh
Nos Nothi
1471
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Posted - 2014.03.28 14:55:00 -
[22] - Quote
Asha Starwind wrote:Looking there you clearly see that the roles are defined. Commandos are slower, more tanked, and have a higher damage output than the Assaults and scouts. Scouts are quicker, lesser tanked, and with bonuses to stealth and detection(ewar). Assaults carve out a spot for themselves in between Commandoes and Scouts.
The problem is that there isn't enough room for Assaults to carve out a spot.
Assaults should of gotten bonuses to weapon damage Scouts as they are now Commandos should of gotten bonuses to maximum ammo pool in addition to their reload bonuses
This would mean each of the attack suits would specialize in a specific area of attacking Scouts - Flanks enemies and attacks from unexpected angles to weaken frontline defenses Assaults - Used to breach defenses and create an opening Commandos - Keeps the breach open with their higher eHP and constant fire after the enemy has killed the initial wave of assaults. This gives the team an opportunity to set up shop (assaults respawn, logis place equipment and add extra firepower, and heavies catch up to the rest of the team to solidify the team's position) and collectively evict the enemy from the area. |
THE SHR3DD3R
THE FOOTCLAN
0
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Posted - 2014.03.28 15:10:00 -
[23] - Quote
FIX ASSAULTS AN LOGIS LEAVE SCOUTS ALONE |
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